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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > iPhone, iPad & iPod > movies from dvd's to an ipod

movies from dvd's to an ipod (Page 2)
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Oct 23, 2005, 02:25 PM
 
I read somewhere that videos with a resolution bigger than that of the iPod look worse than 320 x 240 resolution videos when viewed on the iPod's screen, because the iPod has to resize them. I guess the person who said this said that they were less sharp. Has anyone done a comparison? While it might be nice to have bigger resolution videos for use with the TV out or for viewing on the computer, etc, I wouldn't want to have them look bad on the iPod's screen.
     
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Oct 23, 2005, 02:27 PM
 
I'm using Handbrake, the newest version 0.7.0-beta3, to rip Strangers With Candy - Season One and it's running just fine on my iBook 1.42/1GB. I am using 2-pass encoding at 320X240 and it's taking around 35-45 minutes per episode and averaging around 23.55 fps. Not bad and much better than any other solution I have seen yet. It makes your rip ready to add into iTunes then right on to your iPod and the audio and video quality is excellent!
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Oct 23, 2005, 05:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by Icruise
I read somewhere that videos with a resolution bigger than that of the iPod look worse than 320 x 240 resolution videos when viewed on the iPod's screen, because the iPod has to resize them. I guess the person who said this said that they were less sharp. Has anyone done a comparison? While it might be nice to have bigger resolution videos for use with the TV out or for viewing on the computer, etc, I wouldn't want to have them look bad on the iPod's screen.
I believe it could be the case. If the encoder does the work of reducing your videos down to 320x240, then the results should be bettter (especially with 2-pass). But if iPod has to do the downsampling, perhaps its decoder chip isn't as good because it has to do this on-the-fly. If the video was already optimized for 320x240 then the iPod decoder chip wouldn't have to work so hard and maybe start losing fps.

For me, it is a small price to pay.......
     
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Oct 23, 2005, 05:54 PM
 
I've ripped several DVDs (yes, ones I own) down to my iPod.
About 15 minutes to rip a typical DVD to the HD via Mac The Ripper on a Pioneer DVR-108.
Dual-pass encoding with HandBrake at 400Kbps, 320 pixels wide, runs about 150 fps on my DP 2.5GHz G5 (I'm doing Batman Begins now, and its running at 157 fps). Say about 18 minutes for 1st pass, 15 for second. HandBrake's encoder crunches both processors at near 100%
The resulting mp4 files play without modification on the iPod. Works great.
     
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Oct 24, 2005, 12:10 AM
 
there's no point in doing 2pass encoding if you're gonna rip at 320x240 and play on the ipod video, its a waste of time...
     
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Oct 24, 2005, 01:13 AM
 
I'm not so sure. I know I said above that there wasn't much difference between one and two-pass encoding, but after doing some more tests, I can see that the one-pass encodes sometimes exhibits some clear pixelation when scenes change. Not always, but often enough to be annoying. It just lasts for a fraction of a second -- sort of a blurring effect. I haven't tested it on my iPod (which is currently en route from Memphis TN) but I imagine that it would be noticeable on the iPod screen as well.
     
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Oct 24, 2005, 11:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by nycdunz
there's no point in doing 2pass encoding if you're gonna rip at 320x240 and play on the ipod video, its a waste of time...
I was actually able to see less false-contouring between color shades on 2-pass encoding vs. 1-pass. But yes, overall probably makes little difference. My machine is fast enough, however, that the bit of extra time (maybe an extra 15-20 minutes) doesn't bother me at all. I'd use single pass if I were encoding at a high bit rate (768k), but at 400-450k, I'll do a double pass. Can't hurt.
     
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Oct 24, 2005, 03:04 PM
 
I'd hate to rain on this lovely parade, but ripping DVD's is most certainly NOT LEGAL. Even if you own said movie. Circumventing the security on a DVD (yes, kids, there's security) is against the law.

I know that's not going to stop most of you, and that's fine. But people do deserve to know the truth.
     
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Oct 24, 2005, 03:21 PM
 
Given the way the law is at the moment, you are correct, but don't think for a second that I'm going to lose any sleep over copying a DVD that I own for my own private use.

Also remember that this information is just as useful for non-copyrighted works such as DVDs you create with iDVD.
     
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Oct 25, 2005, 07:41 AM
 
well, here's a couple of articles about making movies on your iPod. I just wanted to include it in this post to help the rest of us learn more about movie-making...

Playlist
http://playlistmag.com/weblogs/ipodb...sons/index.php

iLounge:
http://ilounge.com/index.php/article...-not-so-clear/
     
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Oct 25, 2005, 07:55 AM
 
I haven't found this information anywhere yet:

If I've got a movie on the iPod at 640 x 360 resolution (say) - I realise the ipod resizes to 320 x 180... HOWEVER, if viewed on a tv screen, I wonder if the resolution remains at 640 x 360.. Any ideas? Or should I always size my files to 320 x 240
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Oct 25, 2005, 09:42 PM
 
Here is a post I just wrote on the Ars Technica forums:

The iPod is actually a much more competent video player than Apple says it is. I just used Handbrake (on the Mac) to rip a DVD to MPEG4 at 720 x 304 resolution, 1300kbps and it plays fine on the iPod. This is approaching DVD quality, and it does look better on the iPod than the same video with a width of 340 and a lower bitrate.

There isn't actually a 480 x 480 res maximum for MPEG video as Apple says. It's actually a limit on the total number of pixels that the iPod can display (230,400, since 480 x 480 is 230,400). This means that any aspect ratio that's under 230,400 should work (720 x 304 comes to 218,880 so it fits).

I've played widescreen videos with bitrates of up to 2500kbps with no problem. If you go that high with fullscreen video you can run into "tearing" issues with video, but the ones I've tried have still played on the iPod.

These high res/bitrate videos look very good when played on the computer and pretty good when played on a TV. It's not as sharp as a DVD if you look at it from 2-3 feet away, but from a normal viewing distance it might be indistinguishable from DVD (although it won't be anamorphic, so it will look "wider" on widescreen TVs than an anamorphic DVD would). Obviously, these will be significantly bigger in terms of files size (the movie I mention above is 1.18GB).

If you're watching things exclusively on the iPod it might not be worth using such high resolution, but if you want to create a video library that will still be useful with future higher-resolution devices, or if you want to view your videos on the computer or on a TV often, it seems to work well.

The only thing I don't know is what effect higher res/bitrate videos will have on battery life. It might require a lot more disk access, thus reducing battery life. I don't know.
     
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Oct 25, 2005, 10:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by Icruise
There isn't actually a 480 x 480 res maximum for MPEG video as Apple says. It's actually a limit on the total number of pixels that the iPod can display (230,400, since 480 x 480 is 230,400). This means that any aspect ratio that's under 230,400 should work (720 x 304 comes to 218,880 so it fits).

I've played widescreen videos with bitrates of up to 2500kbps with no problem. If you go that high with fullscreen video you can run into "tearing" issues with video, but the ones I've tried have still played on the iPod.
The iPod screen only has 76,800 pixels (320x240). You can play higher resolution video, but it won't do anything for you, and the iPod will scale it down to fit on the screen (which sometimes looks worse than properly sized video.
Video tearing issues doesn't sound like "no problem" to me.
     
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Oct 25, 2005, 10:43 PM
 
I mentioned the "tearing" issue only affects some full screen video with higher res/bitrate. It does not affect all higher res/higher bitrate files. You just have to know what settings to use. The widescreen movie I mentioned above does not exhibit video tearing *at all* and looks better than the low res/low bitrate version on the iPods screen (yes, I did multiple encodes and compared them).
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 03:59 AM
 
For more info on the Ars Technica forum and Icruise's post, visit:

The Ars Technica guide to iPod videos:
http://arstechnica.com/guides/tweaks/ipod-video.ars

The Ars Technica forum post that Icruise is referring to:
http://episteme.arstechnica.com/grou...m/361000995731


Originally Posted by Icruise
Here is a post I just wrote on the Ars Technica forums:

The iPod is actually a much more competent video player than Apple says it is. I just used Handbrake (on the Mac) to rip a DVD to MPEG4 at 720 x 304 resolution, 1300kbps and it plays fine on the iPod. This is approaching DVD quality, and it does look better on the iPod than the same video with a width of 340 and a lower bitrate.
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 09:00 AM
 
i have had great success getting MPEG4 videos running on the iPod. No problems there with handbrake, ffmpeg, or any other encoding software. H264 is just a pain in the butt.
I have tried making H.264 files using both Handbrake and FFMPEG (which i believe uses mencoder) and the video files never will transfer to the iPod. all of the specs are within the supported range of the iPod. it just refuses to play it. if i make a H264 in quicktime it works just fine. i dont want to have to convert something from a DVD then convert it again when there are utilities out there that should work just fine with a single encode.
since all of the settings are inline with the iPod specs...could it be something as simple as apple is locking out video files not created with Quicktime Pro by checking the meta creator data? has anyone checked that? i am just completely stumped...and so is the rest of the web seems like...as to why the iPod won't play anything but Quicktime created H.264 files. it just seems that all the programs that work use Quicktime as the encoding engine. none of the ffmpeg/x264/mencoder based stuff seems to work. all i can think of its either a lockout of non quicktime created content or apple's H264 uses some setting that the others either don't support or don't use by default which needs to be adjusted.
( Last edited by dwishbone; Oct 26, 2005 at 09:35 AM. )
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Oct 26, 2005, 10:23 AM
 
Handbrake...MPEG4...M4V...480x368...SUCCESS!
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 01:24 PM
 
The handbrake forum suggests that the official release makes Main profile h.264 mpeg-4 movies. The iPod won't play Main profile h.264, only Baseline profile.

There have been people tweaking the source code to make it into baseline profile h.264 mpeg-4 movies. Check out the Handbrake forums as someone posted a link to download the "modified" version of the program with Baseline encoding capabilities. They've reported success with this version:

http://handbrake.m0k.org/forum/viewt...r=asc&start=75

This is not the official released version but just a modification provided by folks who have modified it. I'd expect an official update soon....
( Last edited by wilsonng; Oct 26, 2005 at 07:16 PM. )
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 01:31 PM
 
nice. downloaded and will try it once i get home. are there ways to switch from main to baselin in something like FFMPEG?
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Oct 26, 2005, 02:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by noreturn
I'd hate to rain on this lovely parade, but ripping DVD's is most certainly NOT LEGAL. Even if you own said movie. Circumventing the security on a DVD (yes, kids, there's security) is against the law.

I know that's not going to stop most of you, and that's fine. But people do deserve to know the truth.
Yes, we know...

But with the MPAA going after peer-to-peer movie pirates, I don't think they are really going to care if I put a DVD I've paid for on my iPod at one-quarter fidelity.

I never pirate software, music, or movies, but I will move content I've purchased from device to device without (moral) guilt.
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 03:00 PM
 
I did some battery testing last night by watching the entire 720 x 304 video I mention above (2 hours) and then watched a couple of 25 minute TV shows. I didn't start with a full battery (I had listened to some music beforehand) but I still had some battery power left after all of it. It looks like the higher res/bitrate files have no appreciable affect on battery life.
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 03:53 PM
 
Just got done doing a test RIP of a DVD I have, my settings were...

Handbrake 0.7.0-b3
MP4
Bitrate (kbps): 1000
320x240
Single Pass Encoding

Doing the same test chapters with the bitrate at 400 and dual pass encoding now to see if it fixes a few bugs in the video and audio...
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Oct 26, 2005, 03:54 PM
 
1000kbps is kind of overkill for that resolution. You can probably get by with 400.
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 07:21 PM
 
Originally Posted by dwishbone
nice. downloaded and will try it once i get home. are there ways to switch from main to baselin in something like FFMPEG?

Theres doesn't appear to be a user interface to switch from baseline to main profile in this unofficial download. I guess when it gets incorporated in the next official release, it will have that user option.

If you want Main profile, use the 0.7b3 version. If you want Baseline profile, use the non-official version.

I'm just glad to see the little disclaimer on the iPod page stating "future support for more video formats." Hopefully they'll also put Advanced Simple Profile and Main profile as well.
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 08:06 PM
 
i just finished my first encode with the unofficial baseline version of handbrake. it worked like a charm and looks fantastic.
its one i encoded in MPEG4 already so i can do a side by side comparison. the H.264 (via handbrake) doesnt take that much longer to encode than MPEG4. maybe about 25% longer (Quicktime is sloooooow). anyway, the H.264 looks much sharper at the same settings. and the iPod it is nearly flawless. i encoded the video at 500kbps. it scales rather nicely and doesnt really get that muddy look until you go full screen, and even then it doesnt look nearly as bad as MPEG4. so in short...use handbrake and H.264. you will be very very happy with how your DVDs look on the iPod...and even the computer.
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Oct 26, 2005, 09:51 PM
 
The non-official version of Handbrake mentioned above also has support for queueing, which is definitely a welcome addition. I was confused by the way it treats each pass in a 2-pass encode as a separate task at first though.
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 10:10 PM
 
Has anyone tried two-pass h.264 encoding on the iPod yet? If so, how's the quality/file size?
     
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Oct 26, 2005, 11:11 PM
 
thanks a lot for that unofficial handbrake! now my videos will transfer to the ipod no problems with h.264!
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 01:24 AM
 
Are there any issues using 160 VBR AAC? Would it be playable with an iPod video. I know I can play VBR AAC in the iPod and iPod videos are capped at 160 VBR AAC.

I was using mAC3dec to encode the audio at 160 VBR AAC. I thought that the VBR option would be nice to have. But I'm just not sure if the iPod video can play movies with 160 VBR AAC.

Still waiting for the iPod video to come to my doorsteps so I don't have it to test a QuickTime movie with 160 VBR AAC.

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Oct 27, 2005, 02:02 AM
 
hey guys, what would be optimal settings to use under handbrake, would 400kbps for video, 128kbps/48000 be fine, 1 pass encoding? i want to be sure i rip these correctly the first time, i would hate to go back and redo everything again...

so what would the best settings be under handbrake for?
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 09:21 AM
 
i use 500 kbps, 48000, 160, 29.97 fps, 320 x (240 or appropriate), 2 pass.
they looks absolutely great. file sizes range for me so far from about 450 to a little over 600 depending on the length of the movie. these videos look great on the computer and pretty much flawless on the iPod.
the settings in the above post would work just fine, but i like that little bit of extra quality.
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Oct 27, 2005, 03:45 PM
 
Defintly use 2 pass encodeing, I did a few test runs of single pass, and there are some moemnts that looks all pixely. With the same movie and 2-pass it looks perfect.

Anyone having problems with the audio skipping some or is it me? Are you guys ripping right fomr the dvd or toast images?

Latest Settings for me:

Video:
2 pass
320x240
400 kpbs

Audio: (Even Bumped Up wants to seem to blip on occasion)
48000 hz
160 kbps
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Oct 27, 2005, 04:08 PM
 
Originally Posted by IFLY2HIGH
Defintly use 2 pass encodeing, I did a few test runs of single pass, and there are some moemnts that looks all pixely. With the same movie and 2-pass it looks perfect.

Anyone having problems with the audio skipping some or is it me? Are you guys ripping right fomr the dvd or toast images?

Latest Settings for me:

Video:
2 pass
320x240
400 kpbs

Audio: (Even Bumped Up wants to seem to blip on occasion)
48000 hz
160 kbps
No audio blips here. Doing conversion from a Video_TS folder ripped to the HD via Mac The Ripper.
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 05:04 PM
 
You might actually want to reduce the audio bitrate if you're getting blips. It might be that the iPod can't keep up with it for some reason. I've never had any problem with audio though. I ususually use 22050/64kbps and haven't noticed any quality problems (I do a lot of TV shows which don't really benefit from higher bitrates).
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 05:42 PM
 
Okay did a rip from the dvd directly instad of having it on the HD and that's not the problem.

My movies that I converted over in quicktime to iPod format are also 44100, 128 bits and they play just fine. Maybee it's my computer? Dual 1ghz QS? Not fast enough or is it plenty. I'm not running any apps or using it during encoding...
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Oct 27, 2005, 05:50 PM
 
Speed of the computer would only affect the time it takes to convert, not the quality of the converted files. I don't know what your problem is, unless it's something about the DVD itself.
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 05:56 PM
 
I had a rock audio CD that looked and played fine but when I ripped it to iTunes on multiple computers, it also had "static". I looked at the CD.... No holes but it did like a bit translucent.

I went to the CD shop and bought a new copy and that one worked perfectly.

Sometimes the DVD may be defective just enough to show glitches.

Related to the audio problem, anybody know if 160 VBR AAC would work without glitches in an iPod movie?

I was also looking at Handbrake to make mp4s. In the mpeg 4 video option, there is XVID and FFMPEG. Are these just different algorithms to make mpeg-4 videos and would they make mpeg-4 compliant videos?

Thanks
( Last edited by wilsonng; Oct 27, 2005 at 06:14 PM. )
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 06:14 PM
 
I'll have to try some other DVD's. I've been using the same two DVD's from the same company, kayaking video, and they both persit on audio skips. I checked the source after a rip and it has it so, duh, the iPod will play it as well so I'm taking it it's the quality of the rip and or problem with the DVD's encoding.
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Oct 27, 2005, 06:20 PM
 
Originally Posted by wilsonng
I was also looking at Handbrake to make mp4s. In the mpeg 4 video option, there is XVID and FFMPEG. Are these just different algorithms to make mpeg-4 videos and would they make mpeg-4 compliant videos?
I haven't tried the XVID option, but FFMPEG works fine in the iPod.
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 07:37 PM
 
Now, since h264 video compression eats processor usage, does that mean less battery life?

BTW, a two-pass, 30 minute h.264 video at 500kbps with 160kb audio took about two hours on my dual 500mhz G4.
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 09:53 PM
 
Here's a step by step site that has everything put together that we've been talking about. So witch one of you guys did it, very nice instructions with pictures.
- Eric
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 10:42 PM
 
Is Handbrake with H.264 as good as Quicktime Pro at conversion?

Daniel.
     
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Oct 27, 2005, 10:54 PM
 
In terms of quality? I'm not sure, since I've never had the patience to do much with the Quicktime encoder. But it's very good quality, certainly. It's also a heck of a lot faster and more customizable than the Quicktime encoder.
     
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Oct 28, 2005, 02:38 AM
 
Originally Posted by Brien
Now, since h264 video compression eats processor usage, does that mean less battery life?

BTW, a two-pass, 30 minute h.264 video at 500kbps with 160kb audio took about two hours on my dual 500mhz G4.
h.264 video decoding and encoding takes up more processor horsepower than mpeg-4. That's probably why Apple capped the h.264 requirements at 320x240 and mpeg-4 requirements at 480x480.
     
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Oct 28, 2005, 12:03 PM
 
So it is a definite:
Use Handbrake (more specifically, the modified version) over the Quicktime Pro option to convert to iPod?

I did some videos using Quicktime Pro last night and while some worked like a charm, most dropped the audio and successful or not they took an hour a piece on my Powerbook 17-inch 1.0GHz / 1GB. And yeah, I only have USB 1.1 so tranferring my music collection took several hours
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Oct 28, 2005, 12:46 PM
 
My audio problem looks like it was the DVD's themselves. I ripped another complete DVD and it sounded just fine.
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Oct 30, 2005, 06:21 PM
 
Okay, those DVD's with the 5 channel audio, do we really need to encode them for the iPod, or can we cut down to just 2 channel audio? Would it save on file sizes?
- Eric
     
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Oct 30, 2005, 06:41 PM
 
I'm pretty sure that Handbrake converts 5 channel audio to stereo.
     
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Oct 31, 2005, 10:53 AM
 
I am using the modified version of Handbrake over Quicktime Pro now and it is so much faster and versatile (thanks guys for the link and the information)!

I have one issue though and it is a small one.

Anyone else not getting a preview image for their files made this way? I have a 1.0GHz 17-inch Powerbook so the graphical view of the videos gets a little laggy anyway so I use the plain list view, but I would like to see the video icon image anyway, every one in a while.

Is this because it is an mpg and not an h.264?

Like I said, no big deal to me, but I am curious.
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Oct 31, 2005, 12:14 PM
 
Does nothing show up for the preview at all? All of my files show previews in iTunes.
     
 
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