[prezmcmahon]

I got a call from a customer today, who told me his story about a Verizon business rep telling him he can get the iPhone from them tomorrow for $250.

iPhone Coming to Verizon on 11/20/2007 | McMahonWeb

[analogika]

No.

[icruise]

It's fine to link to your web site in your signature, but 2 of your 3 posts consist of links to your blog, which we do not encourage here. They are considered spam.

And no, I don't think the iPhone is going to Verizon anytime soon.

[prezmcmahon]

Sorry, I just figured it was easier than retyping it. There is no benefit in me "spamming". No ads on my site, etc. Just my personal blog.

For the person saying "No", you may very well be right. The guy who called to tell me his conversation wouldn't lie about the conversation. The verizon rep is either telling the truth, confused, or lying.

[icruise]

Well, I'm not saying that he's lying, but customer service reps in general, and Verizon reps in particular, have a habit of being wrong or even just making stuff up, usually in an attempt to get you to go with or stay with their service. And in this particular case, I think the chances of a Verizon rep knowing something that nobody in the tech world knows are very small indeed. Apple is such a secretive company that there's no way a CSR person would know about something like this.

[prezmcmahon]

I can't disagree with any of that. To put it to the test, they are calling Verizon first thing tomorrow to try and place an order, to see what happens. They are going to call me back when they know more.

[Cold Warrior]

it has to be crap, and you're doing a disservice to your blog by publishing it.

[stevesnj]

I thought Apple and AT&T work in exclusivity? I would think this would break a binding agreement wouldn't it?

[icruise]

Yes, that's the major reason for thinking there's nothing to this.

[imitchellg5]

Everyone watch, the iPhone is announced for Verizon tomorrow. I'd laugh. I wouldn't call it impossible since Apple's original choice for the iPhone was Verizon.

[prezmcmahon]

I post a conversation with a customer who talked with a Verizon rep about the iPhone, and further point out that I have no way to verify. I'm not exactly sure how it hurts my blog. It's a rumor, and I don't make anything more out of it. I could see it as a negative if I claimed I had some contact or insider from Verizon telling me directly that this was happening and it wasn't.

[cube-dude]

Originally Posted by imitchellg5 

Apple's original choice for the iPhone was Verizon.

Verizon is my first choice for the iPhone too. Craptacular AT&T - and patience - is why I don't have an iPhone yet.

[prezmcmahon]

So, how long does the Apple-AT&T exclusivity last? 2 years?

[imitchellg5]

Originally Posted by cube-dude 

Verizon is my first choice for the iPhone too. Craptacular AT&T - and patience - is why I don't have an iPhone yet.

Yeah, mine too. Especially since I already have Verizon. I think one issue was that almost all of Verizon's phones are 3G. It wouldn't look to good for one of their most expensive phones to not have 3G. But, what the heck, I don't care

[EndlessMac]

What they could be talking about is the LG Voyager which is an iPhone copy cat. They've been showing commercials for it around here so I'm sure the release date is pretty soon.

The whole exclusive deal with AT&T and selective countries was a bad idea IMO since there are people other than AT&T customers who want iPhones. If they can't buy iPhones then they will be itching to buy something similar.

[slugslugslug]

Originally Posted by prezmcmahon 

So, how long does the Apple-AT&T exclusivity last? 2 years?

All the rumors I heard around launch time were saying 5 years.

[C.A.T.S. CEO]

Its the Voyager that is coming out, its a iPhone knock off and I'm pretty sure that the VZ rep was lying.

[butterfly0fdoom]

AT&T has a 5-year lock on iPhones.

That said, we don't know for sure if Verizon was Apple's first choice, especially since Apple hasn't commented. As O2's people have implied, Apple pretty much picks the larger carriers and talks to them and sees who they want to strike a deal with. Apple may have called up Verizon first, but I highly doubt that means anything.

[DigitalEl]

Originally Posted by butterflyOfdoom

That said, we don't know for sure if Verizon was Apple's first choice, especially since Apple hasn't commented.

I thought it was Verizon themselves who confirmed that Apple approached them first... And that they declined, not wanting to give Apple the kind of control Steve Jobs was demanding (and eventually got from AT&Tingular).

As for the rumor at the heart of this silly thread, EndlessMac is right. The rep was undoubtedly talking about Verizon's "iPhone killah," the LG Voyager.

[Big Mac]

That's cute how they stole the look of several of Apple's icons.

[CorpITGuy]

Fugly++;

[butterfly0fdoom]

Originally Posted by DigitalEl 

I thought it was Verizon themselves who confirmed that Apple approached them first... And that they declined, not wanting to give Apple the kind of control Steve Jobs was demanding (and eventually got from AT&Tingular).

Yeah, but does that mean Verizon was Apple's first choice? Verizon was the largest at the time. I doubt Steve Jobs was much interested in dealing with the carrier most known for imposing their really lame interface on most of their phones and for using a standard that would require the manufacture of two different kinds of iPhones.

[imitchellg5]

Originally Posted by Big Mac 

That's cute how they stole the look of several of Apple's icons.

Did you expect creativity?

[DigitalEl]

Originally Posted by butterflyOfdoom

Yeah, but does that mean Verizon was Apple's first choice? Verizon was the largest at the time. I doubt Steve Jobs was much interested in dealing with the carrier most known for imposing their really lame interface on most of their phones and for using a standard that would require the manufacture of two different kinds of iPhones.

I see your point. I guess we don't really know if VZW was APPL's first choice or just one of the carriers approached.

As for Verizon's standardized interface, giving that up would undoubtedly be a sticking point. Tell ya what though, I would love my iPhone even more if it were on Verizon's rock-solid, high-speed 3G network.

We finally gave up on AT&T as our only phone service and are now paying X-dollars a month for a home phone. I'd hate to have to stand in my backyard with my iPhone juuuuust so in order to get 1 bar for a 911 call in an emergency. AT&T is the absolute WORST in Phoenix's western suburbs.

[CorpITGuy]

DigitalEl, that sucks. Did you try any of the repeaters out there? Sorry to hear about your troubles.

My entire family used to be on Sprint but I only had coverage in my backyard. I can't tell you how much time I spent being eaten alive by mosquitos during the summer or standing in the snow during the winter in order to talk on the phone. I feel your pain.

[Cold Warrior]

Originally Posted by nstehle 

DigitalEl, that sucks. Did you try any of the repeaters out there? Sorry to hear about your troubles.

My entire family used to be on Sprint but I only had coverage in my backyard. I can't tell you how much time I spent being eaten alive by mosquitos during the summer or standing in the snow during the winter in order to talk on the phone. I feel your pain.

Another unhappy sprint customer here. Gone waay downhill since they bought Nextel and have completely botched it all.

[::maroma::]

I like all of that screen real estate wasted for a giant reminder that you are on the "SHORTCUT MENU".

I guess they want to make sure you know the blatantly obvious.

Mmmmm, crappy interface design....

[DigitalEl]

Originally Posted by nstehle

Did you try any of the repeaters out there?

Nah. Thoase are expensive, so I'll suffer for now. I keep hoping a new cell site will dramatically improve things. Funny thing is, there's a high school football stadium with a cell site on its light poles .9481 miles from my house*. At the stadium, I have full bars. At my house, less than a mile away, I have zero most of the time... Sometimes one. I thought towers had more range than that. Are they directional? Is the cell site blasting its goodness AWAY from me, perhaps?

The whole AT&T thing is a major buzzkill on the whole iPhone thing and people here at work see the blood drain from my face when I can't enthusiastically recommend the device for that reason. It just doesn't work in my part of town.
__________
*Exact measurement possible with the 911 center maps here at work.

[Cold Warrior]

yes, almost all cell towers are actually 3-4 directional panels, unless it's set up to cover a specific area (like the stadium), in which case a tower may have just one or two directional panels.

[AppleJockey]

think about it
if this were the case dont you think Verizon would b screaming it from every corner?

[butterfly0fdoom]

After they bashed it? Dunno, man.

[pt123]

Originally Posted by Big Mac 

That's cute how they stole the look of several of Apple's icons.

Which icon? Alarm clock? Music note? Envelope? I didn't know Apple originated these icons.

[::maroma::]

I would say the only icon that looks very similar is the Calendar icon. The rest don't really look anything like Apple's. Probably because all of the iPhone icons are in a rounded cornered square, while these aren't. Having all the icons in their own square makes the interface look a lot cleaner IMO.

[83caddy16v]

The Voyager is in Verizon stores now. I played with a unit that was not fully operational ("come back on Black Friday and we'll have several demo units available")

All-in-all, I see it as a more "practical" iPhone without the gee-whiz factor. It may be just enough for Verizon subscribers to hang-on into next year for a 3G iPhone v2. Its "OK" but I didn't walk away with the "WOW, this is cool" like I did with the iPhone... but then maybe I'm jaded :o)

For folks not looking for "cool" factor of the iPhone, and some of its very useful features, like the large screen. The stereo bluetooth and 3G are nice. I couldn't use the HTML web browser to see how it works, nor if you can zoom in to read actual pages. With the clamshell flipped open, the screen is even smaller. The physical keyboard isn't bad.

What is interesting is that Verizon has a "check list" comparison paper and several of the checks are missing - Verizon claims that these features are NOT on the iPhone: email, wi-fi music downloads, web browsing... there were one or two others but when I confronted her she said that was "an early draft" - yeah! They are really going after the iPhone with it.

I was told pricing was $399 with a $50 rebate and a 2yr contract. $419 without a contract. The "new every two" can also be applied to lower the cost of the phone another $50 or $100. I recommend Verizon customers check it out if you are on the fence.

[83caddy16v]

Originally Posted by butterfly0fdoom 

Yeah, but does that mean Verizon was Apple's first choice? Verizon was the largest at the time. I doubt Steve Jobs was much interested in dealing with the carrier most known for imposing their really lame interface on most of their phones and for using a standard that would require the manufacture of two different kinds of iPhones.

FWIW, Apple also approached Sprint but Apple wanted too money/revenue sharing. A shame, as I was looking to the $20/mo employee voice/data plan with a Sprint iPhone.

[butterfly0fdoom]

A friend and I checked out Verizon's new flagship line (Circuit City had functional units, but the Voyager was hidden away behind the counter; the employee offered to let me try it out). The most "wow" and appealing one IMO was the Juke. The Venus is a great example of a waste of touch-screen technology and rather shows why regular phones should just use buttons; the Chocolate's more appealing. The Voyager also lacked any wow factor. Who'd want to type on the screen when there's already a keyboard on the inside? Honestly, what's the point? I wouldn't ditch my iPhone for it at all. It's just an enV with a touchscreen. AKA Nothing really special.

[JohnnyFive]

sure, verizon is dumping CDMA for GSM for their 4g network but that won't happen with the iphone as the iphone itself isn't even 3g. that should've been your first clue that the guy is lying.

that and what many posters have said: at&t has a multi-year exclusive with apple.

[Cold Warrior]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFive 

sure, verizon is dumping CDMA for GSM for their 4g network

What? GSM is a completely different technology than CDMA. It'd require Verizon to put up new hardware on every single tower they own, unless they have some kind of software solution that works with their current hardware. Plus they're rendering all their CDMA customers' phones inoperable, unless they plan on having CDMA and GSM -- in which case their bandwidth is instantly halved.

[JohnnyFive]

Originally Posted by Cold Warrior 

What? GSM is a completely different technology than CDMA. It'd require Verizon to put up new hardware on every single tower they own, unless they have some kind of software solution that works with their current hardware. Plus they're rendering all their CDMA customers' phones inoperable, unless they plan on having CDMA and GSM -- in which case their bandwidth is instantly halved.

this article should explain it.

the next-gen 4g technology that verizon is adopting is based on GSM. how are they going to implement it? i can't even guess.

[butterfly0fdoom]

And with Verizon jumping ship to LTE, that leaves Sprint on CDMA and who knows what Alltel's plan is.

In the case of GSM phones, they have separate GSM and UTMS/HSDPA radios. I guess Verizon could probably request phones that have LTE and EV-DO radios until they finish transitioning, at which they'd have to start a timeline for dismantling the EV-DO network (although given how hard it's been for AT&T to get rid of their TDMA users.... have fun, Verizon!).

[Cold Warrior]

Interesting. I wonder if Verizon is going to move to SIM cards, and if the worldwide plan for most GSM providers is to move to LTE.

[TyPod]

I wish the iPhone would come to Verizon...

[butterfly0fdoom]

IIRC, the GSM Association decided that LTE would be the replacement. So I'd assume that all GSM-based carriers are moving to LTE (whereas WiMax seems to be the CDMA replacement).

[kugino]

Originally Posted by TyPod 

I wish the iPhone would come to Verizon...

i don't. they'd turn off most of the great features anyway...

[giggs11]

Originally Posted by Cold Warrior 

Interesting. I wonder if Verizon is going to move to SIM cards, and if the worldwide plan for most GSM providers is to move to LTE.

LTE isn't expected to go commercial until at least 2010 though.

I do love the people who act as if getting the iPhone to work on Verizon is as easy as flipping the magic "iPhone switch" down at the Verizon home office. I doubt we'll see a CDMA iPhone anytime before 2009.

[analogika]

Considering that nobody uses CDMA, I doubt it will *ever* happen.

[CharlesS]

Originally Posted by analogika 

Considering that nobody uses CDMA

You mean other than most of the countries in North America, South America, Australia, and Asia?

[analogika]

Okay. Euro-perspective, sorry.

Three options:

a) Build a quad-band GSM phone that covers all of the above, AND Africa and Europe.

b) Build two different models for two different markets.

c) Build in a CDMA chip at extra cost, weight, bulk, and battery power.

Or am I missing something vital?

[CharlesS]

Originally Posted by analogika 

a) Build a quad-band GSM phone that covers all of the above, AND Africa and Europe.

Well, that wouldn't go over too well in Asia, considering that neither Japan nor South Korea has any GSM coverage at all AFAIK - it's all CDMA and WCDMA. China has some GSM coverage, but if I understand correctly they've been in the process of migrating to CDMA for some time now, so a GSM-only phone is somewhat of a losing proposition in Asia. There are also huge regions of the US where GSM is not available, due to CDMA being the technology in more widespread use. I'm not sure what the relative popularities of GSM and CDMA are in the rest of the world (including Africa, apparently - a Google search seems to have indicated that it is in use in a bunch of countries there too - it's only Europe that doesn't use it at all), but I'd bet there are a few other similar situations here and there.

b) Build two different models for two different markets.

This is the best option, and is what most of the other cell phone manufacturers do.

[butterfly0fdoom]

Actually, China has GSM support (given that their unwritten policy is to offer unlocked cellphones, and the fact that two mainland carriers are interested in carrying the iPhone...). But they're trying to implement their own proprietary 3G technology as opposed to HSDPA or EV-DO. Japan has some GSM towers, IIRC; Vodafone tried to compete there and used GSM phones, but I think they've given up, and I don't know if those towers still exist. GSM is generally more widely used, though, AFAIK.

As for building two models for different markets, it's possible, but I don't think both CDMA and GSM iPhones would be offered simultaneously in the US.