[Superchicken]

OK, I'm planning on getting a 40 gig hard drive, so I think that should be able to run linux (unless I'm tottaly mistaken).
I'm planning on running OS X and OS 9 jointly on one partition, of about 25 gigs, have another copy of OS 9, and possibly X, although prolly not now, on a smaller 5 gig partition, and a 10 gig one for Linux, probably Yellow Dog... cause that seems to be the one people use and like.. correct?

I'll be running it on a 333Mhz iMac, Rev D.
Right now I've got 160 megs of RAM, but intend to be dumping the 32 meg chip I've got in here in favor of a 256 chip, by the end of the summer.

Is this unreasonable?

OK, now I've NEVER used disk utility or anything like that before. so right now, I'm wondering a few things.

Will I need to have only one partition for linux?
is 5 gigs enough, or much more than enough?
Will I be able to use files from one partition in another parition?
IE, grab a graphic from one and pull it into another?

How exactly would I swich OSs inside of YDL? And can you swich as easy as in OS X just selecting start up disk?

hmmm, yeah, I think that's about it. My main concerns are, I'm planning on encoding my CDs as better quality MP3s, so I'm wondering if I'd need to encode them on both partitions or not.
And... yeah remember I've never used Linux before, and I'm not... well OK I am fairly geeky, but I'm that geeky before linux kind of kid

I think that's about all I need to know, and feel free to give me some pointers
thanks a ton

[KaptainKaya]

Partition:
Make 3 Partitions, using OS 9 Disk Utility.
#1 Unallocated for linux
#2 Mac OS Standard for OS 9.x (NOT Extended, since you want to be able to use Mac on Linux)
#3 Mac OS Extended for OS X

5 gigs for Linux will be plenty, the installer typically installs about 1.5-2 gigs for system stuff, depending on what you configure.

If you want to switch from linus to the mac os, just restart. You'll be prompted with a black screen w/white text, asking you which OS to start in. Usually, its (l) for linux, (m) for Mac OS 9, and (x) for Mac OS X. Depending on what you defaulted the computer to start with, you'll want to pay attention to this screen because after so many seconds of waiting, it will automatically start up in the OS you chose. I have my computer set up to start in YDL, but you can pick any of the 3 after installation of YDL.

The reason OS 9 has to be installed on a Standard partition is Mac on Linux. I haven't used it yet, but I'm sure you can drag files off the OS 9 desktop and place them in the linux directory.

Hope that helps!

[Superchicken]

OK someone just old me that OS X needs to be on the first 8 gigs, and they sounded like they were saying OS X can't use more than 8 gigs on the first partition, that sounds really stupid to me, so I dono if they might not really be saying stuff that good or whatever.

But OK, acctually right now I'm leaning more to just 30 gigs OS 9 X, and 10 gigs Linux. OK, oh and I also see Mandrake also runs on PPC.
Might that be better for me?
Remember I'm a first time Mac user

[KaptainKaya]

Who the hell told you that? The only machines that need OS X on the first 8 gigs are the original beige G3's, as far as a I know. I have a 40GB drive set up as follows:

10GB Unallocated (YDL 2.2)
1GB Standard (OS 9.2.2, used only to install classic games like The Sims, and other stuff)
26GB Extended (OS X 10.1.5)

I know, the math only adds up to 37GB, but after formatting the drive, it came out to be about 37.5GB.

I've tried Mandrake, but I went back to YDL because YDL doesn't wipe the whole drive...sad but it happend. To me, setting up YDL was a lot easier.

Also, if you decide to go with YDL, they have a great support list that you can subscribe to.

Cheers.

[Superchicken]

OK, then my main questions at this point would be, I'm going to be trying to do this upgrade within a few hours. Becuase I'm gona be using the network at school, to transfer my files that I can't live without, IE, a certian control pannel that makes 9 work soo much more like I like, my internet preffernces (I have no idea what my settings should be again, I did the installation of them like 2 years ago, and have no desire to try again) some graphics files, and junk.
Anyway, just wondering for partitioning it, I think I know what to do for installing it all, But I'm not tottally sure.
I'm thinking I should start up with the CD, and the new drive in. HOld down C of course
Try to use disk utility to partition the drive, then install on the area that I want to be OS 9, then update that to X, correct?
And then after I get home I can take the 5 gigs or whatever, and install Linux on it, correct?

And I guess my last question would be.

Can a program in linux find my MP3s on another part of the hard drive and play them from there, or can they only use the ones in the partition the files are in? Because I really dont' feel like having two coppies of every CD I want to listen to.

Thanks for all your help.

If anyone could please tell me any funny things the installer might ask me for, that'd be great. Remember 17 year old, Linux TOTTAL newbie, the closest I've come is seeing Gnome run at someone's house, and saying "wow that looks a lot like windows"
haha

But the way, I also heard of a program called Lindose, would that run on YDL?

I'm Guessing no since there's the whole PPC thing.
But... anyway, is there a lot of Open source tittles that have ben ported to PPC compatable?
I'm mainly doing this for GIMP, and any word proccessors and MP3s and browsers I can find.

[KaptainKaya]

You are correct on the partition and installation scheme. Remember that you can start up from the CD of YDL to automatically boot into it.

The only 'cryptic' messages you will come accross during installation are at the beginning. When you get to the screen about which drive to select and format, make sure you select the unallocated one...read through the list to be safe.

Second, in this order, create 3 partitions on the Unallocated partition (believe me, thats how its stated in the manual). The first should be 10 megs (10M is what you will enter), and that is for the linux boot loader. Second, 128 megs (128M) for the SWAP drive (virtual memory manager), and last, use the rest (Max button will work) for the Root directory).

After you get all 3 made, hit save and it will then formate the drive properly, taking you to the next screen asking which installation to choose. Read through and select the best one (I use the Home/Office setup).

Once done, it will ask a series of questions, similar to the Setup Assistant in OS X. Remember, keep the password for Root and you (the admin) different. Choose the best setting for monitors from the list, and also choose graphic login so that you can choose between GNOME and KDE window manager when you login. Basically, thats all there is to know really.

About MP3's, sadly, you may have to add them to the linux drive as wel as the Mac drive. Mac on Linux isn't exactly crash proof from what I've read, and its best not to transfer files from that or link to files on that drive.

Lindows is x86 only sadly, but don't worry, once you get into linux and get a lot setup, there are sites with different themes for KDE..a lot more customization than X right now

Cheers.

[Superchicken]

hah cool OK.
Oh and, you mentioned something about a CD? Is that much better than just using a downloaded version?
Cause I saw you could download it, is there a really good reason that I should get the CD, and if so where can I pick up a copy?

And, I thought I read somewhere that you can't partition a partition. So will I then need to have OS X and 9 on the first one, then creat three smaller ones at the same time?

[KaptainKaya]

Oh no, you misunderstood Create 3 partitions, Unallocated, Standard, and Extended. When you're ready to install Linux, the installer will then format the Unallocated one into 3 'segments'..shoulda been more specific huh?

You can download the .ISO version and burn it to a CD, or you could also download from the net...both are free, and I have no experience with downloading from the net.

Cheers.

[Superchicken]

OK, think I got this.

hehe

Create an extended for OS 9 and X, one of OS 9, and one for Linux.

that's what you're saying right?

By the way, is there any way to like erase everything on a partition then reinstall stuff on it? Or does that require dumping a whole hard drive?

[KaptainKaya]

If you wipe the linux partition, the only way to recover the space is to wipe the whole drive clean and reinstall everything.

You're right about the partitions, you'll do fine with the installation

[Superchicken]

hah good
But, not neccicarly reformating it. If for example certain system files screwed up in one of my partitions. Could I transfer the files to another and delete everything but like the files that format it or wahtever? Then do a CLEAN install over it?

[Jeff Binder]

You can wipe one partition and re-initialize it without affecting the other partitions. You can also leave part of your drive unpartitioned and create partitions later.

Also, why are you planning to put a second OS 9 install together with OS X? It's generally better to keep the two separate, and you really don't need a different OS 9 system to use for Classic. I had 2 OS 9 installs once (one for general use, one for Classic), and it ended up just becoming a pain with no real advantage. I almost never ended up booting into OS 9, and the two systems ended up having different sets of extensions installed.

Finally, you can run Mac on Linux from an extended partition, even though Linux can't read that partition. You can create an extra small HFS partition that Mac OS, Mac on Linux and Linux can all read to swap files.

[Superchicken]

OK, uhh here's my little plan... mainly for ripping off trial downloads
Have a small partition with about two-5 gigs of Space, and wipe it every month, so I can run things like new versions of Fireworks and what not
I know it's sneaky, but I'm a student, with no Job

And can linux and Mac OS 9, not find files on eachother? I really don't want to have to do something like use a Zip drive to transfer data back and forth.

So what exactly would I need to do to let mac OS 9 and Linux interact?

And one of the main reasons I'm still keeping OS 9 for more than Classic is... I need it, it's zippy even on a 333Mhz. OS X is like a slug on my machine. Once I get an iForce upgrade or something then I'll be happy to run it.. but until then... sigh...

[Jeff Binder]

Well, you can use the same OS 9 system by itself and as Classic.

Anyway, to share files between Mac and Linux, you'll need an HFS partition. They'll both be able to read this. OS X can't read Linux partitions, and Linux can't read HFS+ partitions.

[Northform]

I just wanted to post my thoughts on the discussion here.

It doesn't matter what order the partitions are in. People are constantly saying that certain setups are best, but its all the same.

Linux can mount Mac OS Standard partitions (It does so at /mnt/macos) so that would probably be the best place to rip you music to.

160 RAM and 333MHz is plenty for Linux.

No version of the Mac OS can read Linux partitions. Linux can only read Mac OS Standard partitions. The best way to share files would be to use the Mac OS Standard partition.

The 8gig comment was because some iMacs (ones that came with 4 and 6gig drives I believe) had to have X installed on the first partition and that partition had to be less than 8gigs. Check Apple's support site. I don't think it applies to the rev. Ds

Mandrake would probably be harder to set up for you. The PPC port isn't as Mac specific as YDL and certain points can cause some confusion if not taken in the context of an OS meant for PCs. YDL automates more of the process. The installer doesn't have the pretty graphics, but it is easier. Remember that for YDL this is their entire business rather than simply a curiosity.

Lindows isn't out yet and a preview version costs $99. It only runs on x86 since its whole thing is running windows programs which are only compiled for x86. 99.9% of Windows apps don't work on it. In short this is a product that may never come to pass.

There are plenty of PPC titles for Linux and if they're open source, but don't have a PPC binary you can create one from source very easily. I think you'll find tha even installing binaries in Linux will be way beyond the capabilities of a newbie with no UNIX experence. Luckily most distros come with a full suite of apps that they automaticly install (Including GIMP and Mozilla).

Make sure that you don't choose the server install option of YDL since this is meant for servers and will leave you without a GUI (No XWindows/KDE/Gnome).

The CD that everyone is talking about is the iso image that you can download from their server. You need to burn the image to a CD using a CD writer. You can install from the internet, but even over a highspeed connection that will take a long time and during that time you won't be able to use the computer. You can purchase CDs direct or from one of their resellers if you don't have a CD-R drive (it didn't come with your computer).

Apple's partitioning software doesn't allow you to change the partition map without distroying the entire drive, but the one in the YDL setup will. All you would have to do is to delete the partition you no longer want and then format the free space. The free space cannot be combined into an already exhisting partition.

You should probably do this on a day where you aren't so constrained by time. What you could do is install the drive, create a Mac OS Standard and Mac OS Extended partition and leave some unallocated space. Install the Mac OSs and then wait until you have some time (maybe the next day) to try installing Linux. That way you have a functioning computer regardless of the linux situation.

When you install Linux let it automaticly partition the unused space rather than doing it manually. Then if something goes bad in the Linux installation you can just reboot from the CD and delete the partitions and start over or Boot into the Mac OS and forget about it.

With Linux on your computer DO NOT switch from X to 9 or 9 to X using the startup disk control pannel/system pref. This will change your primary boot device in OpenFirmware from the Linux bootloader which allows you to choose between the three to either X or 9 (whichever you selected) and making Linux boot again will be a real chore if you don't know what your doing (poking around openfirmware changing the bootdevice - OF doesn't use neat words like Linux and such and was never meant to be used by users).

That's all that comes to mind right now.

[rambo47]

If you're thinking of adding an additional hard drive to a PowerMac there is another option, although a bit expensive. You can get an 80 GB 7200 RPM ATA/100 hard drive with YDL 2.2 pre-installed <a href="http://www.terrasoftsolutions.com/store/purchase.phtml?products" target="_blank">HERE</a> under Yellow Dog Linux. At almost $290 before shipping it seems steep. If you were to price a new copy of YDL 2.2 ($30) and a new 80 GB hard drive from Western Digital ($150 at CompUSA) You would save $140 by doing it yourself. But the idea of YDL it's own hard drive is kind of neat.

<small>[ 06-16-2002, 10:56 AM: Message edited by: rambo47 ]</small>