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Schiller explains lack of optical drive in new iMacs
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Oct 26, 2012, 01:22 PM
 
Following on the heels of Apple's latest device unveilings, the company's marketing head, Phil Schiller, has explained the reasoning behind omitting an optical drive in the latest iMacs. In an interview with Time, he noted that optical drives and rotating hard disks are among the aging technologies that are "holding us back" and represent "anchors on where we want to go."

Removing the optical drives from MacBooks was viewed as a necessary transition to significantly reduce the thickness and weight for the portable devices. Making the same move with desktop computers may frustrate some users who find the optical drive's usefulness a higher priority than overall machine thinness, but Schiller suggests DVD burners are on the way out as content distribution continues to shift toward digital. "In general, it's a good idea to remove these rotating medias from our computers and other devices," he said. "They have inherent issues - they're mechanical and sometimes break, they use power and are large." The executive further suggests that one popular standard that requires an optical drive, Blu-ray, is a "complex and not-great technology" that comes with "issues unrelated to the actual quality of the movie." On the subject of netbooks, Schiller defended Apple's lack of interest in the once popular segment. "The iPad became our answer to the $500 computer," he said. "Time has proved us right on that point. And now 100 million people agree that the iPad is a great computer." Apple did address the market for a compact notebook computer with the 11-inch MacBook Air, however the device still offers a full-size keyboard and a $999 price tag that makes it more of an ultraportable than a netbook.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 01:33 PM
 
Like who didn't see this coming?

I disagree with Phil on Blu-ray. The quality of movies I've seen has been quite spectacular.
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Oct 26, 2012, 01:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by msuper69 View Post
Like who didn't see this coming?
I disagree with Phil on Blu-ray. The quality of movies I've seen has been quite spectacular.
Given that Phil explicitly didn't say anything about Blu-ray movie quality, I find it hard to agree that your opinion is in disagreement with his.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 01:57 PM
 
And, next he's going to say that all of us content creators don't need a new mac pro either. Apple is forgetting two things:
1) not everyone has fiber connections and huge bandwidth
2) Some of us actually create large files all the time- and need to distribute it.

The lack of Firewire on the iMac is more telling.Thanks Phil- do you ever actually come out and look at how users work?
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Oct 26, 2012, 02:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by David Esrati View Post
The lack of Firewire on the iMac is more telling.Thanks Phil- do you ever actually come out and look at how users work?
That isn't really fair.

For one: Yes, he obviously does. That's why these machines have Thunderbolt.

For another: Nobody who *needs* Firewire will have any problems with a dongle extension on the end of all the gear and cables lying around the studio anyway. Yeah, it's thirty dollars. So?
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 02:20 PM
 
Apple just wants to own your data. They want to be able to get more money from you putting your files on iCloud, where they can also see what your storing and what programs your using. Its funny he mentions things failing, but look how hard it is to open a Mac these days and upgrade or fix something. The new Mac's are not made to be fixed, they want you to gamble with Apple Care. Its a huge money maker for them, as any insurance is. I feel solid state drives are being kept at a high price by the industry as a hole as well.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 02:21 PM
 
For the subset of users that need an optical drive, there is the $79 option from Apple to put one there. Heck, you could velcro it to the back of the machine so it's even in the same place that you're used to!

FireWire is a dying technology. Thunderbolt is far superior in performance. If you still absolutely need Firewire, there is a nice compact adaptor that you can plug into the back of the machine and you've got FireWire back. Since the vast majority of users never use FireWire, this makes much more sense.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 02:22 PM
 
Originally Posted by msuper69 View Post
Like who didn't see this coming?

I disagree with Phil on Blu-ray. The quality of movies I've seen has been quite spectacular.
He agrees with you. The format is disqualified by issues NOT related to image quality.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 02:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by happykarma View Post
Apple just wants to own your data. They want to be able to get more money from you putting your files on iCloud
Oops, they forgot to charge me -- or any of the 190 million other people on iCloud. Joke's on them!

Or ... could it be that you are talking completely out of your ... um, tinfoil hat?


I feel solid state drives are being kept at a high price by the industry as a hole as well.
A "hole," huh? Okay, well now that we've assessed your education level, we can assign your comment the credibility it deserves.
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Oct 26, 2012, 02:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by happykarma View Post
I feel solid state drives are being kept at a high price by the industry as a hole as well.
I feel you haven't taken the time to check whether reality agrees with the bumpy insides of your sphincter, whence you apparently glean your feelings. SSD prices have dropped by double-digit percentages within the last eight weeks or so.

Chas_m probed you and took you apart on the rest.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 02:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
He agrees with you. The format is disqualified by issues NOT related to image quality.
This is similar to someone like Sony not making a CD player in lu of continuing to make casette players "because CDs aren't as durable". The fact is CDs are durable *enough*, what matters is the sound quality.

To that point, consumers want 1080p movies without the MPEG artifact litter all over. Apple should deliver. Every other consumer electronics company is onboard with Bluray despite all the garbage that comes along with the standard. The alternative is not having top-tier quality consumer video playback. Apple is alone here.

iTunes movie rentals are quite bad, quality wise, compared to Bluray movies. They are also not as good a value as you can get with Netflix and RedBox, per movie cost wise. If I can rent and play a higher quality movie at a lower cost on the competitors equipment that itself costs less, any excuse Phil gives is really moot.

The issues Phil is probably talking about are DRM and patent related. Bluray patents pose an extremely similar problem as the H.264 patents that Apple is already dealing with. The only other thing Phil could be talking about as far as I can tell is the size/energy/reliability of 'spinning media'. Discounting Apple's obsessive overengineering with regard to size and seamlessness, and the fact that this is a desktop where energy usage is not as important, Apple really needs to come up with a better solution or work with the industry on a better alternative for Phil's comments to be taken seriously.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 03:00 PM
 
Originally Posted by chas_m View Post
Oops, they forgot to charge me -- or any of the 190 million other people on iCloud. Joke's on them!
Or ... could it be that you are talking completely out of your ... um, tinfoil hat?
Apparently you don't understand the concept of monetizing. He didn't say Apple was making money from you by charging you to store your files. They're making money on you by the fact of your usage of iCloud.

Think Google. You know, how people all hate google now because they're trying to gather all this information on you to use it to make money? Yeah, that's what Apple is working on doing.

Or do you think them coming out with a me-too ad-service was just because they wanted better advertising on-line?
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 03:04 PM
 
Originally Posted by cosmotic View Post
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
He agrees with you. The format is disqualified by issues NOT related to image quality.
This is similar to someone like Sony not making a CD player in lu of continuing to make casette players "because CDs aren't as durable". The fact is CDs are durable *enough*, what matters is the sound quality.
No, it is not.

In fact, it isn't AT ALL.

Blu-Ray is not an option because it is encumbered with stupid, complex encryption requirements and licensing issues which make it expensive and complicated to support.

Expecting Apple to include Blu-Ray support is like expecting them to support vinyl: There are excellent reasons for wanting the medium, and it will remain alive and desirable to a niche market for a long time, but asking for full first-party support is just completely orthogonal to the way the market is moving.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 03:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by NewsPoster View Post
Phil Schiller, has explained the reasoning behind omitting an optical drive in the latest iMacs.
Um, his answer is smoke and mirrors. The truth is obvious. "We at Apple are guided by Steve Jobs' main philosophy: People want everything to be thinner. That's it. The old iMac was disgusting. It was like an inch wide. It was boxy and ugly. The new iMac is thin, and thin is beautiful.

The executive further suggests that one popular standard that requires an optical drive, Blu-ray, is a "complex and not-great technology" that comes with "issues unrelated to the actual quality of the movie."
Man, who knew. I feel sorry for all those idiots out there, with their computers and dvd players and game consoles and all those other devices that include Blu-Ray devices. I don't keep up, but apparently they do nothing but drive their users to endless frustration.

I mean, it can't be that Apple is ignoring blu-ray because it competes with their itunes video store and apple tv products. Nah, Apple would never let competition be a decision on their product designs.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 03:08 PM
 
Originally Posted by testudo View Post
Think Google. You know, how people all hate google now because they're trying to gather all this information on you to use it to make money? Yeah, that's what Apple is working on doing.
From watching both companies, it seems fairly clear that Google's and Apple's business models and motives for collecting data are complete opposites:

Apple profiles me to see how I tick, and then sell me an $800 device that ticks exactly the way I do.

Google profiles me to see how I tick, and then sell me to another company that thinks they need to pay for access to people like me.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 03:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by testudo View Post
The executive further suggests that one popular standard that requires an optical drive, Blu-ray, is a "complex and not-great technology" that comes with "issues unrelated to the actual quality of the movie."
Man, who knew. I feel sorry for all those idiots out there, with their computers and dvd players and game consoles and all those other devices that include Blu-Ray devices. I don't keep up, but apparently they do nothing but drive their users to endless frustration.

I mean, it can't be that Apple is ignoring blu-ray because it competes with their itunes video store and apple tv products. Nah, Apple would never let competition be a decision on their product designs.
That's certainly part of it, of course. There is also the whole licensing/encryption crap as well.
But I think the biggest part of it is that optical drives inherently SUCK, much more so than hard drives.

But I can assure you that the number of users this drives "to endless frustration" is approximately the size of the population of a mid-sized asylum on the outskirts of Baltimore.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 04:02 PM
 
I'm glad to see more people getting on the BluRay band wagon. I thought I was a lone voice in the wilderness. There is nothing out there that Apple can do on an Internet connection that matches the quality of Blu-ray. I also distribute files to client every day on optical discs. I can give them files up to 25 GB for less than a dollar in media. I can give them files on DVD for less than the cost of a postage stamp around $.20. Anybody who believes that media should cost more to distribute in their business model obviously doesn't run a business. Optical is only going away and Apples mind and in Apple fanboy's minds optical is here to stay for the rest of society.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 05:31 PM
 
Seriously, in a desktop... a BluRay drive is expected, but still not even an option for those that are obviously willing to pay. crApple really knows how to manipulate the market, try to force their wishes upon customers and let users down as usual. What next??

I am not at all surprised. Ample sized SSDs and flash still aren't cheap enough, so these antics are unjustified. This is just an experiment... what can the market tolerate??... with money in the bank, I bet they would rather sacrifice a bit to make their version of computing a reality... listening to users is no longer an option; the gorilla is too big to be wrestled with or influenced (so they think)....

One more time: FLAC for cryTunes anyone??? Horton hears not a soul it seems.... sadly
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 06:02 PM
 
Do you people really think there's a huge population of people who want to watch bluray movies sitting at a desk instead of in their living room on a big tv with a bluray player?

And do you people really think that the majority of people are burning discs and giving them to people?

Get serious. You are the minority. There are third party solutions for you.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 06:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by hayesk View Post
Do you people really think there's a huge population of people who want to watch bluray movies sitting at a desk instead of in their living room on a big tv with a bluray player?
And do you people really think that the majority of people are burning discs and giving them to people?
Get serious. You are the minority. There are third party solutions for you.
I see bluray as an archival format... not just an entertainment solution. In fact, I have only used bluray formats for archival use. Am I still the minority for my purpose??
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 06:08 PM
 
"holding us back" ? "anchor" ?

from what? I understand in the case of old legacy ports, like what they did when they introduced the iMac, or replacing the BIOS by EFI, but I don't get what is the drawback from having an optical drive? Like most people I know, I watch DVD on my computer, and I burn CDs to listen in my car. I know things are supposed to be 100% digital but what's the hurry? Nobody asked for an ultra thin desktop.. It's ok to make sacrifices for things like cellphones or tablets, but it's unnecessary in the case of desktop that are not meant to be lifted or moved. Now it's even impossible to upgrade ram in the smaller version... this is getting too far!
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 06:11 PM
 
people buy desktops because they want flexibility. removing options that people use is not flexibility. i am surprised that he is addressing this issue so soon after the announcement of the new imacs. he must really be catching some flak. there will be even more once these things are in the stores. apple would like for people to do away with hard media because they have a financial interest in their itunes store selling people downloads. only time will tell if this hurts them or not. does anyone remember "rip, mix, burn"? by the way, blu-ray is doing very well these days. even in this economy.


customer to salesman: $1300? does it have a blu-ray burner?
salesman to customer: no, it doesn't even play cd's or dvd's.
customer to salesman: i've got to go pick up my son at school. i'll be back later.
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Oct 26, 2012, 06:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by gooser View Post
people buy desktops because they want flexibility. removing options that people use is not flexibility. i am surprised that he is addressing this issue so soon after the announcement of the new imacs. he must really be catching some flak. there will be even more once these things are in the stores. apple would like for people to do away with hard media because they have a financial interest in their itunes store selling people downloads. only time will tell if this hurts them or not. does anyone remember "rip, mix, burn"? by the way, blu-ray is doing very well these days. even in this economy.
customer to salesman: $1300? does it have a blu-ray burner?
salesman to customer: no, it doesn't even play cd's or dvd'ss.
customer to salesman: i've got to go pick up my son at school. i'll be back later.
Salesman to Customer: You can spend another $100 USD to get that functionality. Sound good?

(hears the crickets...)
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 06:34 PM
 
I work with a ton of macs (mostly iMacs) on a daily basis. And hundreds of users. Yesterday was the first time in 3 years that anyone asked for a blank CD. So my anecdotal evidence suggests that fewer and fewer people are using optical media in their everyday tasks.

Of course, at home I have a Mac Pro with a Blu-Ray drive, so I'm not the average user myself. But I understand the trend.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 07:02 PM
 
.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 07:21 PM
 
Leave it to some of you guys and all machines would still ship with floppies.
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Oct 26, 2012, 08:03 PM
 
It is disappointing that apple Still does not Include a BluRay Drive. I have added one to my MacPro and Actually enjoy watching BluRays on it as well thanks to Mac Bluray Player. That said things on the PC world are a little different. Yes you can purchase a computer with a built in BluRay drive however, Microsoft like Apple does not support BluRay playback NATIVELY (ie.. their own player). You must purchase a software player (which is usually bundled). Finally there is one available on the Mac (BluRay Player) but it is from a third party software company.

My biggest concern is the next MacPro. Although I'm for a new case and a smaller tower, I'm not for loosing the functionality of that computer. I use both of my optical drives and all four hard drives that are in it. I'm waiting to see what apple will release next year but if it's not up to par, I will have to find a way to get a refurbished Mac pro from the current release.

I hope they don't forget that a Pro is a professional machine. I would actually like to see them include the option to bundle a BluRay drive with this machine. Final Cut will author a BluRay now and I want to see Apple support it better. the thing is all the DRM requirements of BluRay also apply to the m4v movies from iTunes so DRM shouldn't be the issue anymore. Competition with iTunes might be part of it but I think it has something to do with Apple/Micorsoft not wanting to pay Sony for the Licesne codes that decode the DRM of BluRay. That plus the fact that it's always changing and has to be updated. Apple and Microsoft have decided not to include a player.

It's not as though Apple is dissing Optical all together as they still include DVD Player/ iDVD and an external optical drive. I think they are just saying that not as many people are using it enough to justify it being built in. This may be true. Most of my rentals come from iTunes or Amazon/Netfilx streaming. It's good enough to watch a movie once and there are no more physical stores available for renting in my area. I'd rather stream it on amazon than wait for Netflix to send it to me. Just my 2 Cents.
     
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Oct 26, 2012, 08:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by blahblahbber View Post
Seriously, in a desktop... a BluRay drive is expected, but still not even an option for those that are obviously willing to pay. crApple really knows how to manipulate the market, try to force their wishes upon customers and let users down as usual.
Get a USB drive. What's the big deal?
     
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Oct 27, 2012, 01:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by blahblahbber View Post
One more time: FLAC for cryTunes anyone??? Horton hears not a soul it seems.... sadly
Ten years ago, iTunes played FLAC just fine with the appropriate QuickTime codec installed. Has it stopped doing so? (I have no idea; I converted all my FLAC files to Apple Lossless years ago using XLD...)
     
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Oct 27, 2012, 01:20 AM
 
Originally Posted by webraider View Post

It's not as though Apple is dissing Optical all together as they still include DVD Player/ iDVD and an external optical drive. I think they are just saying that not as many people are using it enough to justify it being built in.
iDVD hasn't come with new macs for several years now.
     
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Oct 27, 2012, 08:49 AM
 
You guys are nuts. I took the optical drive out of my MacBook Pro last Christmas, haven't used it since. The HDD I put in it's place is much better for me.

Also it's a desktop, it's not as if having an external DVD burner is that hard, put the thing on the little stand bellow or right beside it. If anything it's more ergonomic than the old version. Also for repairability, optical drives fail ALL THE TIME, especially the slot loading ones Apple was using. Out of the four computers I've owned, I had two optical drives fail and I'm sure this one would have if I hadn't taken it out. It's a lousy technology and prone to breaking.

Also Apple doesn't support Blu Ray because Sony are dicks and Apple knows it. It would cost Apple extra to license it, when they already provide solutions for HD content through iTunes as well as by partnering with Netflix. Also, not having Blu Ray isn't stopping anyone from getting a Mac.
     
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Oct 27, 2012, 02:19 PM
 
The problem isn't that Apple isn't including a drive, it's that they've eliminated the drive without reducing the price to reflect that you now get less "stuff" built in. In fact, the price for the low-end model is actually higher than the previous generation's low end.

(Yes, I know. The new iMacs are more powerful than the previous generation. So what? Time has passed since the previous generation was designed. If they can't offer a better CPU at the same price, then they're doing something seriously wrong.)

If they had knocked the price down a bit, then this would actually be something of a selling point: "we aren't giving you a built-in drive because we refuse to do Blu-ray, so the choice is up to you whether to get a third party Blu-ray drive, or get our basic DVD/CD drive, or get nothing and save some cash". But it isn't because they decided not to roll that way.
     
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Oct 28, 2012, 07:52 AM
 
I think the major problem with the new iMac may come when people actually go into an Apple Store to buy it.

Apple are waaay, overselling the thinness of this thing. Yes the edges are 5mm thick, but so what, it's a desktop, who cares (within certain levels). It certainly looks jaw dropping in the photos and from them I think it would be reasonable to conclude that the whole mac is that thin. Certainly a more casual consumer than a typical nn board member would be justified in thinking that. However once they get into a store and see that actually it has a big fat butt on it. I'm not sure that apple are managing expectations well here.

The new fusion drive sounds cool. However if you nix that the new form factor imposes the need to replace the old 1TB 3.5 in 7200 drive with a far more weedy 5400 laptop drive. I'm sure the fusion drive will make up for the performance drop in rotating drives, but at the base level I think the whole machine will feel far more sluggish. The faster spin speed of the older drives has a large impact on OS responsiveness and of course file open times.
     
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Oct 28, 2012, 10:12 AM
 
There are some concerns I have about the new design that have little to do with the lack of BluRay or FW.

FireWire is a completely obsoleted technology. USB 3.0 and Thunderbolt both supercede FireWire 800 in speed and flexibility - USB 3.0 being backward-compatible with pretty much every USB device ever, and ThunderBolt providing additional functionality (video out as well as data I/O), significantly faster bandwidth, and better power options - up to ten watts (I'm guessing 5V/2A). It's just time to move on from FW, guys. Its benefits over USB (more current, higher sustained data throughput) are irrelevant with the new technologies out there.

WRT BluRay, is anyone really that surprised? Apple's never been interested in the technology. There are plenty of people who still prefer it over dipping into their monthly bandwidth pool, plenty of people who don't have super high-speed Internet available to them, and plenty of people who need optical media for archival purposes. Those people were never Apple's target market. It's disappointing but unsurprising.

And for those saying "who watches movies on their computer", keep in mind that a lot of people want to use the Mac Mini as an HTPC, the 27" iMac makes an excellent computer/TV combo for a bedroom or office or kitchen when combined with a USB TV tuner card, and there are a lot of college students who prefer having one machine to do everything in a tiny dorm room.

All that said, what I want to see:

How long a "Fusion Drive" (aka hybrid hard drive, which is not unique to Apple although they are putting a lot more solid-state storage in versus older generation drives that use the solid-state portion just for caching data) will last compared to traditional hard drives and how expensive they will be to replace on out-of-warranty machines. Additionally, can dual-booting users who want to use Windows or Linux benefit at all from the drive?

Cooling - faster CPUs = more heat. Does the iMac use a desktop CPU or is it using a mobile CPU? How well does the new, thinner iMac dissipate heat? I noticed it has a much bigger cooling grille on the back, which will help, but other iMacs do get hot as balls when they're running full-force.

How serviceable are these things going to be? I really hate that Apple is turning their hardware into a disposable commodity, especially given how much it costs. It makes them easier to repair on the tech side, but it also makes them much more expensive for out-of-warranty repairs - an OOW non-unibody MacBook repair could be pretty cheap if it was just the inverter board or DC in-board or something. A unibody machine cost a lot more, since everything is integrated. I'm very interested to see iFixIt's take-apart for the new iMac. I'm hoping it won't be to the point that any hardware failure means a complete machine replacement. They may be able to claim that it's fully recyclable, but how much does it cost to recycle? How much time? How much of the recycling process requires complex procedures or chemicals? A lot of recyclable stuff isn't actually recycled - it's too costly and inefficient to do so, so "recycling" doesn't mean much.
     
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Oct 28, 2012, 10:22 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
Ten years ago, iTunes played FLAC just fine with the appropriate QuickTime codec installed. Has it stopped doing so? (I have no idea; I converted all my FLAC files to Apple Lossless years ago using XLD...)
yes, it has...
     
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Oct 28, 2012, 10:24 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Get a USB drive. What's the big deal?
Meaning, get less for your money; how is this acceptable? I mean, components are getting cheaper to make.... all we need is a staged "disaster" to inflate the prices, and maybe crApple is just getting prepared and covering their bases... Do we need an episode like the Thailand HDDs?
     
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Oct 28, 2012, 10:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by shifuimam View Post
FireWire is a completely obsoleted technology. USB 3.0 and Thunderbolt both supercede FireWire 800 in speed and flexibility - USB 3.0 being backward-compatible with pretty much every USB device ever, and ThunderBolt providing additional functionality (video out as well as data I/O), significantly faster bandwidth, and better power options - up to ten watts (I'm guessing 5V/2A). It's just time to move on from FW, guys. Its benefits over USB (more current, higher sustained data throughput) are irrelevant with the new technologies out there.
Thunderbolt is the first viable successor, indeed.

And since breaking out Thunderbolt for Firewire backwards-compatibility is trivial, nobody with half a brain and a real need for what Firewire offers is crying.
     
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Oct 28, 2012, 10:46 AM
 
Originally Posted by blahblahbber View Post
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
Ten years ago, iTunes played FLAC just fine with the appropriate QuickTime codec installed. Has it stopped doing so? (I have no idea; I converted all my FLAC files to Apple Lossless years ago using XLD...)
yes, it has...
Well, if XiphQT has stopped working, thankfully there's the option of converting to ALE with XLD. Painless, zero downsides as far as use on Macs and iPods is concerned.
     
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Oct 28, 2012, 11:14 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Get a USB drive. What's the big deal?
Apparently you are on the Obama "raise the debt sealing plan". The issue is price. I can put 25 gig of date on a BluRay disc for 90¢. Please tell me where I can find a 25 gig jump drive for 90¢ and I'll be all over it!
     
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Oct 28, 2012, 11:20 PM
 
Originally Posted by chefpastry View Post
Leave it to some of you guys and all machines would still ship with floppies.
No... you obviously don't understand why the floppy (and ZIP) drives went away. Those technologies had reached their storage ceiling. Optical continues to expand. It has gone from 800 megabytes of storage on a CD to 4 gigabytes on a DVD to 25 gigabytes on BluRay to 50 gigabytes on dual layer BluRay and 500 gigabyte BluRay are already functioning in prototype. The only thing holding back BluRay in Apple computers is Apples attitude. BluRay is working just fine on Window and LINUX.
     
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Oct 28, 2012, 11:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by Brad Bradley View Post
No... you obviously don't understand why the floppy (and ZIP) drives went away. Those technologies had reached their storage ceiling. Optical continues to expand. It has gone from 800 megabytes of storage on a CD to 4 gigabytes on a DVD to 25 gigabytes on BluRay to 50 gigabytes on dual layer BluRay and 500 gigabyte BluRay are already functioning in prototype. The only thing holding back BluRay in Apple computers is Apples attitude. BluRay is working just fine on Window and LINUX.
Excellent comeback.... I have the BD-XL 100GB disc... crApple fanboys are naive and believe anything their master tells them.
     
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Oct 29, 2012, 12:09 AM
 
Yes, master.
     
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Oct 29, 2012, 01:07 AM
 
Originally Posted by Brad Bradley View Post

Apparently you are on the Obama "raise the debt sealing plan". The issue is price. I can put 25 gig of date on a BluRay disc for 90¢. Please tell me where I can find a 25 gig jump drive for 90¢ and I'll be all over it!
http://www.newegg.com/External-CD-DVD-Blu-Ray-Drives/SubCategory/ID-420
     
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Oct 29, 2012, 01:11 AM
 
Originally Posted by Brad Bradley View Post

No... you obviously don't understand why the floppy (and ZIP) drives went away. Those technologies had reached their storage ceiling. Optical continues to expand. It has gone from 800 megabytes of storage on a CD to 4 gigabytes on a DVD to 25 gigabytes on BluRay to 50 gigabytes on dual layer BluRay and 500 gigabyte BluRay are already functioning in prototype. The only thing holding back BluRay in Apple computers is Apples attitude. BluRay is working just fine on Window and LINUX.
http://www.newegg.com/External-CD-DVD-Blu-Ray-Drives/SubCategory/ID-420

There are some tradeoffs for thin, obviously. Just get an external USB Bluray or DVD player/burner and call it a day, what's the big deal?
     
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Oct 29, 2012, 01:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by blahblahbber View Post
Meaning, get less for your money; how is this acceptable? I mean, components are getting cheaper to make.... all we need is a staged "disaster" to inflate the prices, and maybe crApple is just getting prepared and covering their bases... Do we need an episode like the Thailand HDDs?
Are you and Badkosh the same person? You two are the only ones I know that insist on consistently misspelling things you don't like, seemingly thinking you are being clever. I've lost track of how many times you've written "crApple", don't you think this is a little juvenile? And no, I'm not an Apple apologist.
     
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Oct 29, 2012, 07:27 AM
 
"In general, it’s a good idea to remove these rotating medias from our computers and other devices," he said. "They have inherent issues — they’re mechanical and sometimes break, they use power and are large."
Sounds like a great case for a portable machine, not a desktop. *I* didn't ask for a thinner iMac. And thank you for not dropping the price sans the optical drive. So tell me, Phil- are you saying that the components that Apple selected to put into it's computers were such poor quality that it was just a better idea not to have them? Or is this just another BS excuse to try to "iPadify" all of your products? Stop patting yourselves on the backs and start listening to your customers.

They aren't the same company they were 10 years ago.
     
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Oct 29, 2012, 08:06 AM
 
@ besson3c... I'm sorry... I miss understood your comment on USB drive. I thought you meant such as a stick or thumb drive which will never match the media price of optical. I do have a USB optical drive that I have to pack around with my new macbook now. Not the optimal setup on a supposed to portable machine.
     
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Oct 29, 2012, 09:07 AM
 
This reminds me of all the people that screamed bloody murder when Apple dropped ADP and Floppy disks back in 1998. My optical drive on my Macbook Pro broke during the Apple Care period and I was not bothered to get it fixed because I never used it. I was going to pull it out and put a second hard drive in there.

I own 350 DVDs, and the last time I put one in a drive of any kind, computer, home DVD player was maybe a year ago and before that probably another year. Almost all my movie watching comes from Netflix and Torrents today.

Last time I burned a CD/DVD for any reason, a Windows XP Disk maybe a year ago. My linux installer was saved to a flash memory stick.

Transporting large files. USB Thumb Drive all the way. Stopped burning data to blank DVDs a long time ago. If its small enough to fit on a CD I send it via the net. If its bigger then that Flash memory.

So if the whole sale cost for Apple is $35.00 a optical drive and less then 5% of customers really really need it, i mean enough for them to go purchase a external then Apple is saving at least 50 million a quarter in not including the component.

Its not about some conspiracy to force you to icloud. Those that need it are going to get externals. Just most of us don't need it. And those that think they do often don't really either they just don't like change.
Blandine Bureau 1940 - 2011
Missed 2012 by 3 days, RIP Grandma :-(
     
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Oct 29, 2012, 10:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by Grendelmon View Post

Sounds like a great case for a portable machine, not a desktop. *I* didn't ask for a thinner iMac. And thank you for not dropping the price sans the optical drive. So tell me, Phil- are you saying that the components that Apple selected to put into it's computers were such poor quality that it was just a better idea not to have them? Or is this just another BS excuse to try to "iPadify" all of your products? Stop patting yourselves on the backs and start listening to your customers.
They aren't the same company they were 10 years ago.
It would have been nice if they dropped the price, but a DVD burner bought at these volumes probably costs Apple no more than $20, so meh...

I don't really understand the sex appeal behind a thin iMac myself, but for different reasons. I'd want more upgradeable, user-serviceable components, otherwise I don't really see the point of a Desktop for myself personally, unless I wanted a much larger screen, I guess, and I didn't want it to be external to my device?
     
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Oct 29, 2012, 10:51 AM
 
Originally Posted by Athens View Post
This reminds me of all the people that screamed bloody murder when Apple dropped ADP and
I own 350 DVDs, and the last time I put one in a drive of any kind, computer, home DVD player was maybe a year ago and before that probably another year. Almost all my movie watching comes from Netflix and Torrents today.
I bet by the time you want to use your media, it will be damaged, time flies, and at times, you need to convert those archives. Question really is: Are you willing to pay extra for your external superdrive from crApple? $100 USD?? That my friend is a joke.
     
 
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