[JustinD]

This is regarding Apple's new Pro Speakers - the $60 versions of the ones that came with the Cube.

I went down to J & R Computer World (NYC) yesterday, and saw they were putting out these speakers just before closing. In excitement, I hopped on over, grabbed one off the shelf, and while checking out the picture of them on the box, a salesman comes up to me and says "Yup, just got those in. Same ones that come with the Cube, only using the speaker port and not USB." So I said "Yup, they're pretty neat" and proceeded to shell out $60 for them.

So here I am at work, rearranging my entire desk to hook them up to my PowerMac G4 AGP. I drop the wire under my desk, get down on my knees to plug it in, and - the plug wont go into the speaker port.

So I get out from under the dark desk, and look at the plug. Then I compare it to the plug on my headphones. Forever, the audio jacks on Macs have been standard 1/8" - the plug on the Pro Speakers is a lot smaller and has a funny metal jacket around the base.

Of course, upon reading the teeny tiny apple label on the bottom of the box, in microscopic letters, it says "requires Apple Speaker Minijack port".

My job requires me to be on top of every single new Apple development, and I NEVER knew the NEW G4s had an "Apple Speaker Minijack". I mean, when was the last time a PAIR OF COMPUTER SPEAKERS had SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS???

To make a long story short, I can't use Apple's new $60 speakers with my work G4 AGP, my home G4 500Mhz Dual Processor, my Pismo, wither of my 2 iMacs, or my Titanium that still hasn't shipped.

A lot of people, including me, were upset about Apple's decision to make their new monitors use the proprietary ADC connector. There are advantages to it - the single cable is wonderful - but those WANTING to shell out another $1000 for a second 15" Studio Display LCD were out of luck, as were those wanting to use the new monitors on 'older' machines. But doing the same thing (the proprietary connector) with a PAIR OF SPEAKERS is just unacceptable. Totally unacceptable. And I can't think of a reason why they did that. Was it so only MAC users could use the speakers? Well, I have 6 Macs and can't use them. Was it do only NEW Macs could use them? Well, not even 6 months ago I spent a LOAD on a new DP PowerMac G4, and I can't use them.

So, now I'm returning them, and Apple loses my $60. (along with the $1000 that would have been spent on a second Studio Display, had they used standard ports.)

This just ruins my day.

-- Justin D'Onofrio

[jbell]

JustinD,

As posted on Apple's TIL: http://til.info.apple.com/techinfo.nsf/artnum/n25236

"The Apple Pro Speakers cannot be used with any computer that does not have an Apple Speaker sound output port. As of 2001-01, the only computer with this port is the Power Mac G4 (Digital Audio) computer"

Apple had to make this a proprietary restriction because the sound output port is used as a power source just as being done for the USB version. Otherwise, you'll blow your speakers out. However, it's possible that there may a 3rd party to come up with a convertor in the near future to work with old spec G4s.

About the 15" Apple Studio Display LCD, the price has been dropped to $799.



[This message has been edited by jbell (edited 02-01-2001).]

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Well, I feel your pain, but you AREN'T on top of any hardware announcements, I'm afraid.

If you'd even bothered to look at the speakers on Apple's web site, or at their TIL, or even at the news after the MacWorld you'd know that the new Macs have a different sound system, and the new speakers will only work with the new G4s.

This has been documented several times....I was considering getting some for my iMac before I went on Apple's web site and found out exactly what they could be used with.....

Always check the requirements on the box.........

Hint...buy the Cinema Display anyway. You like it better than the speakers, trust me......


greg

------------------
Though the day's been
really long
I still feel I'm close to
nowhere....

[Castor]

I understand that it is a frustrating experience. However, once the mouse was proprietary too. If no one would have strayed off the beaten path, we all would be using command line interfaces on beige boxes. I for one think that Apple has created a great cable interface for displays. As for the info on the speakers' box, I think it is pretty clear, inside the box first thing on top is a leaflet indicating that the 2001 speaker port is necessary (picture). But, don't get me wrong it's a pity for you.

[Cipher13]

I totally agree with you. Absolutely. Apple shot themselves again.
The speakers wouldn't have worked anyway though - they require the amp inside the new G4's...

EDIT: Dammit... I hit reply when there were no posts here
Oh well thats what you get when you leave the reply window open for an hour

Cipher13

[This message has been edited by Cipher13 (edited 02-01-2001).]

[olePigeon]

People have been saying Apple has shot themself in the foot since the iMac. "Oh, the iMac won't sell. It looks like a toy and doesn't have a floppy disk drive." Then it turns out to be the number one selling PC in history!

They made USB and Firewire a standard after being told it wouldn't fly because of ADB and serial.

Come on. Speakers and displays that don't require AC adapters and extra cords? It's simplicity and elegance. I think Apple is doing a great job, albight a little fast. Give it a few months and PCs will jump on the bandwagon as usual and start sellin a Gateway with one power cord, but ships with a cordless monitor and speakers.

[satchmo]

Has anyone ever asked Steve Jobs why Apple comes out with proprietary audio jacks or video connectors? Okay, he hopes to get new buyers to get everything "Apple" but what about the millions of G4 owners that he's losing out on?

[agregov]

Originally posted by JustinD:
My job requires me to be on top of every single new Apple development, and I NEVER knew the NEW G4s had an "Apple Speaker Minijack". I mean, when was the last time a PAIR OF COMPUTER SPEAKERS had SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS???
-- Justin D'Onofrio[/B]

Yikes! I just ordered these speakers from the Apple Store a few days ago for my (as yet to receive) Powerbook G4. I assumed that they were USB. I guess we know what happens when we assume... ;-)

I too am pretty much a Mac expert but this is a good lesson to ALWAYS CHECK THE FINE PRINT. Even us in the know can get bitten!

Anyway, I thought folks might like to know my process for returning the speakers to the Apple Store. They were shipped a day or two ago so I haven't even seen them yet but I thought I should call Apple right away to try to get a RMA#. I was expecting to hear, "sorry, it's not our fault that you didn't read the system requirements" message and thus get stuck with a pair of speakers I can't use. However, I was quite pleasantly surprised when they immediately issued me a RMA#. The one they did say was to make sure I return the item with the box unopened. So, sounds like Apple might not be totally unreasonable about returns assuming they are made immediately after you receive the item (my guess within 10 days) and the merchandise is essentially untouched. Yeah, you should be able to return anything with 30 days (like with Dell). But this is definitely better than nothing.

Cheers. AG

[Milio]

They should have just OEMed the new Mac SoundBlaster, or even licensed the chips and put them on the motherboard.

Proprietary audio connectors, removal of standard sound-in port. What are they doing over there in Cupertino? Something's up, and it seems to be all about screwing the consumer.

[jbell]

Originally posted by Milio:
Proprietary audio connectors, removal of standard sound-in port. What are they doing over there in Cupertino? Something's up, and it seems to be all about screwing the consumer.

A company that wants to be innovative has to start somewhere to set new standards. Firewire is excellent example. The idea behind the proprietary audio connectors is to eliminate external power sources and power cords; otherwise, we wouldn't have the simplicity and clean look. IMO, I think it would have been better for Apple to provide both standard and proprietary audio connectors and ports as a compromise.

[skonesam]

Has anyone had a problem with Apple Pro Speakers and a G4 733-- specifically, the speakers cutting out?

Apple has a TIL on it, but resetting the PRAM has thus far been unsuccessful. Could it be a firmware problem, an OS problem, or a hardware problem?

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

-skone

[tr]

Originally posted by JustinD:
<STRONG>

To make a long story short, I can't use Apple's new $60 speakers with my work G4 AGP, my home G4 500Mhz Dual Processor, my Pismo, wither of my 2 iMacs, or my Titanium that still hasn't shipped.

</STRONG>

actually, you could still use the speakers, if you shelled out more money: http://www.griffintechnology.com/audio/pwrwave.html

"The PowerWave is fully outfitted with RCA and 1/8" audio input and output connectors, a built in USB hub, an Apple Pro speaker connector and standard hi-fi speaker connectors."


actually doesn't seem like such a bad product...


tr

[jeffs7364]

Hmmm. My DP800 Quicksilver has *both* a standard headphone jack and the apple speaker jack. It also supports USB audio (like the rest of the pack.) I think the only computers that don't give you a choice are the non-quicksilver digital audio macs.

I personally like not having that many cables (esp. power) lying around. My set-up looks fairly clean with the noticable exception of my non-apple speakers that have 1 power and two connection cables. If I had to buy speakers now they'd most likely be the apple pro's just for the cable issue alone. I had soundsticks but didn't like the USB audio sound quality much either.

[Mac Zealot]

sk, this is a very old topic to rehash, but interesting as well. I have the pro speakers on my DP800 setup, and in order to help you, I'll need to ask a few things:

What os is the 733 running?
graphite or quicksilver?

Ok, now, if your speakers are cutting out a lot, I suggest you unplug them, flex the plug a little (cord leading into it) and plug in FIRMLY as you can again, keep trying until you hear something (have something playing)

It can either be the speaker jack, speaker plug (most likely), or a defective amplifier.

BTW: One of the cool observations is that all the newer macs have On-Boot USB drivers, which means that you can in fact hear the chime on USB speakers at boot.

Interesting isn't it? They started doing this with the cube.

[ 02-28-2002: Message edited by: Mac Zealot ]

[hyperizer]

Originally posted by jeffs7364:
<STRONG>Hmmm. My DP800 Quicksilver has *both* a standard headphone jack and the apple speaker jack.... I think the only computers that don't give you a choice are the non-quicksilver digital audio macs.</STRONG>

The "non-Quicksilver" digital audio G4s also have both a headphone jack and the Apple Speaker Minijack. Basically, when Apple introduced the digital audio machines in Jan. 2001 they removed the analogue mic input port and added the new speaker minijack.

[Brendonshire]

Originally posted by agregov
:
<STRONG>
Anyway, I thought folks might like to know my process for returning the speakers to the Apple Store. They were shipped a day or two ago so I haven't even seen them yet but I thought I should call Apple right away to try to get a RMA#. I was expecting to hear, "sorry, it's not our fault that you didn't read the system requirements" message and thus get stuck with a pair of speakers I can't use. However, I was quite pleasantly surprised when they immediately issued me a RMA#. The one they did say was to make sure I return the item with the box unopened. So, sounds like Apple might not be totally unreasonable about returns assuming they are made immediately after you receive the item (my guess within 10 days) and the merchandise is essentially untouched. Yeah, you should be able to return anything with 30 days (like with Dell). But this is definitely better than nothing.

</STRONG>

Always pay with a credit card, and they WILL take back anything no matter what. Just call Apple and if they say no, call your credit card company, you get their number each month Now just send back the merchandise and Apple can haggle with VISA or others. If you send it back, or return it, VISA guarantees it for the first 30 days. Forget Apple they can say what they want, but in the end, VISA won't charge you for it and they won't pay Apple either. So you have 30 days, Apple has just made you think that you did not.

Ty

[mikerally]

Ugh, for God sake guys, what a bunch of whiners.

Look, the Apple Digital Audio Speakers are for Digital Audio PowerMacs (e.g. any mac on a 133mhz bus, 466, 533, 667, 733, 867, 933, 1Ghz etc) or for the brand new flat panel iMacs.

They are only for the latest desktops, they won't work with any laptops.

Granted, these speakers can't be used on any Mac, but Apple has and always given you a standard headphone jack for you to connect any other type of speaker, so you have a choice, buy another speaker, give the fricken 3rd party people a chance before they stop making accessories all together!

The only thing that I am a little disgruntled about is the removal of a line/mic-in.

[angelmb]

I think you must buy the harman/kardon SoundSticks, no comparison. They are USB, working great with my Pismo and my G3 B&W, (Mac OS 9 and Mac OS X).

Regards.

[Bodhi]

My job requires me to be on top of every single new Apple development, and I NEVER knew the NEW G4s had an "Apple Speaker Minijack". I mean, when was the last time a PAIR OF COMPUTER SPEAKERS had SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS???

Looks like you have been out of the loop for about a year now....

[DaedalusDX]

I have a Quicksilver 733, and earlier last semester i was shopping for a pair of speakers for my computer.

I considered a whole bunch of options. My computer has the Apple digital audio out, so the Pro Speakers was an option, but the review here on MacNN didn't fare well for the Pro Speakers at all.
http://reviews.macnn.com/reviews/pro...speakers.phtml

The pro speakers by themselves got only 2 stars. I went into a store and listened to a pair, and i was really surprised how easily they started to distort. Plus, there was really no bass to speak about. MacNN recommended getting the Harmon Kardon USB iSub on top of the Pro Speakers as a supplement, bringing the price to $160.

MacNN also compared that setup to the Soundsticks and generally they favored the soundsticks... $199 for the soundsticks.

But there is one thing that irks me about both of the configurations, the USB Soundsticks and the Pro Speakers with the USB iSub. The reliance on USB for the interface. Automatically, the bandwidth of USB is limited, so though the signal is digital, i was skeptical on the quality of it when it came to the other end; how "compressed'" would it sound through the USB speaker algorithm.

Not only that, but having the audio ride along with USB means increased load on the CPU. It happens that way for every USB peripheral, speakers especially because of the constant demand. So i'd have questionable quality along with slower system performance altogether because its using USB.

Plus, those speakers could ONLY be used on that computer. I couldn't plug in my MD player directly to the Soundsticks or my stereo.

So what did i decide to do? MacNN also did an earlier review of a set of Monsoon Flat Panel speakers. The iM-700s to be precise. They fared well against the Soundsticks, and cost $30 less.

So I went online and did a search for Monsoon speakers. I found the speaker ABOVE the iM-700, the MM-1000, for just $130, plus $20 shipping. I made my decision.

The MM-1000s are fine speakers. They of course use the standard audio mini-plug, but they do it really well. Its amazing the clarity of the sound from these panel speakers. In terms of styling, they may not be clear bubbles like the HK Soundsticks, but they've got their own style. Sleek black. Real thin speakers, and a sub that is not bad for a set of computer speakers.

I did alot of research and listening to get my speakers, and I made the right decision. I got something for $160 that i feel is much better than a $199 investment in Soundsticks. I invite anyone looking to getting speakers for their G4 or any Mac, for that matter, to seriously consider Monsoons. You will be surprised.

[kstevens]

Sorry, but I love my soundsticks. I see absolutely no degradation in system performance when using them and they sound great. I have used them on an iMac 400, 600 and currently on my G4 867 desktop. they also look excellent sitting next to my 17" apple LCD display.


Ken

[cube-dude]

Off to the Peripherals forum . . .

Those of you having trouble with the Pro speakers not working properly - (no stereo sound, popping, etc.) - it's due to the speaker jack not popping in properly...

The collar hits up against the metal clip/ tab in the G4 Pro speaker socket and stops it going all the way in.

Try moving it down slightly using a small screwdriver WITH THE POWER OFF - or with your nail, so the collar rides over the metal clip... as it should.

Jon