[mbperk]

Will Apple ever release another PDA like the Newton? I have a Sony Clie, and I just bought my first apple a Powerbook G4 Ti, and I would prefer a Apple PDA.

Thanks

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Peace, Mitchell

[This message has been edited by mbperk (edited 02-07-2001).]

[Scott_H]

Only Jobs knows.

[satchmo]

My wish has been to see that "sixth" piece of the matrix to be filled with an Apple PDA.
However, I've resigned to the fact that after the Newton failure, that Jobs would rather leave that segment to Palm.

Perhaps an Apple branded PDA with Palm OS, but never an Apple OS PDA again.

[Paul Guyot]

Which Newton failure?

I'd better say that while Jobs is at the head of Apple, there will be no NewtonOS based PDA. Just because NewtonOS is a product from Sculley's era. Besides, it is the proof that Apple was able to make a preemptive multi-tasking, modern, object oriented OS (even more advanced than MacOS X) and therefore didn't need NeXT.

Paul

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Newton Evangelist and developer:
http://www.kallisys.com/newton/

[TimmyDee51]

Well said Paul!

My Newton hasn't failed me yet.

[IEEE1394]

Mine has

[TimmyDee51]

What model is it? If it is a 2000 or later, you can send it into Apple and they will repair *everything* for a flat $180. I've even heard of them just sending you a new one instead of replacing the old one. The Newton Cage (www.chuma.org/newton) has info on how to get your Newton repaired, I think.

[Paul Guyot]

Indeed, I got two upgraded MP2000 repaired by Apple. However, it took three months. But Apple sent two brand new MP2100.

BTW, the flat fee is for any model, and only in North America. It's 180 USD or 180 CAD depending on the country to have it repaired. If you are in Europe, ECPRC doesn't ask a flat fee but you pay on the basis of what is replaced. Having a motherboard of a UMP2000 and a screen replaced costs around 600 GBP.

Besides, David Watson can repair some of the common problems of the Newtons. You may want to check his website <http://www.kc.net/~drnewton>.

Paul

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Newton Evangelist and developer:
http://www.kallisys.com/newton/

[Uncertain]

Has everyone forgotten that Palm actually got their start writting Graffiti for the original Newton?

Kind of like how Apple helped out that little network company, a long time ago with AppleLink, what were they called...oh yeah, America Online.

Apple's influence in the industry always gets overlooked. Newton was a failure? Well, look at what it caused. PDA's are no longer vertical market niche products. Everyone and there mom has one. Thanks to Apple throwing the first punch!

[This message has been edited by Uncertain (edited 02-19-2001).]

[SupahCoolX]

Saying the Newton was a failure is a matter of perspective. From a sales/marketing point of view, it didn't do so well. However, from the tech/innovation point of view, it is a monumental and very influential piece of computing history. As for future Apple PDAs, it's uncertain. I don't think it would be in Apple's best interest to release it's own PDA. The market is flooded with "me toos" now, dominated bigtime by the PalmOS, and simply has no room for another (which many will balk at becuase it has an Apple logo on it). I think that if Apple releases a PDA, it will not be a PDA as we know it. It will have to tread some new ground and offer things previously unseen in the market to have a shot at being successful. Of course, I could be totally wrong and Steve has a Color screen, 3oz, $199 Newton in his pocket ready to show us at Macworld Tokyo this week

[satchmo]

As Supah says, failure is a matter of perspective.
My use of the word is definitely based on sales and market acceptance.
I have the original MP100 and while I don't use it anymore, it certainly did the job and was ahead of it's time.
The 2100 was and is still better than alot of what's out there.

But one cannot deny that the Newton did not take off like the Palm Pilot has.

My hope is that a slate like device will be introduced in Tokyo and we'll all have that portable PDA from Apple we've been long waiting for.

[IEEE1394]

I've taken another thought on this subject: what if Apple were to release an operating system for the Palm?

[Paul Guyot]

Why would they get out some old OS they made in the 90's? Because it has preemptive multithreading, protected memory, a very good virtual memory, a complete object oriented architecture, a really innovative data storage mechanism & so on? In a nutshell, because it is better than the current OS they have?
No, it is impossible as their current OS is the best ever (that's what they say on their website - what?, you don't believe them?).

Now, we could imagine (will I be able to say it without rolling on the floor?) NeXTSTEP 5^W^WMacOS X on a Palm. Mmoouuuaarrrfff! It doesn't run on my G3 (not enough ram), and you want it to run on a DragonBall???

Paul

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Newton Evangelist and developer:
http://www.kallisys.com/newton/

[WL2100]

How about Palms running OS 4.0 on a StrongARM 206 Mhz chip? Would that support Mac OS X in a Palm-sized toy...uhhh I meant unix...(darn) I really meant unit! Nahhhhh, not enough everything to support Mac OS uniX.

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!ooW ÷)

[Joel]

Originally posted by satchmo:
But one cannot deny that the Newton did not take off like the Palm Pilot has.

Is this really a surprise though? It seems to me that the reason Palms are so prolific is due to their affordability (i.e., less than $300). Newton MP 2000's sold for (I think) $1000 originally and the MP2100's dropped down to $799 near the end. I'm not too up on these things, but it seems like if Apple were to retool the MP2100 with a few updates and a better sync program, they could probably get away with selling it for roughly the same price as the more expensive Palm Pilots. A quick check at outpost.com shows that a Palm VIIx sells for $399 (before a $100 rebate). That's just $400 less than the MP2100 sold for nearly three years ago (am I right on that time frame?).

All that said, I doubt Apple will make a new PDA or retool the Newton any time in the near future. I was just pointing out that I think the only reason why the Newton didn't hit it off when it was released because it was too much, too soon with too high a price tag. Now, I think it would be accepted rather well as long as syncing was made at least as good, if not better, than it is with the Palm. Just my two cents.

-Joel

[scaught]

and the size of the newton in comparison to the palm probably led to its demise. the newton borders on sub-notebook size while the palm will fit in the front pocket of yr pants.

scott

[SupahCoolX]

I agree that size was the Newton's biggest reason for market failure (though price was a pretty big issue back then, too). When I went to buy a PDA a few months ago, I REALLY wanted a Newton. Then I realized that I'd basically need to have some kind of backpack or case with me the whole time, and if I was going to carry that around, I could have gotten a PowerBook 2400 (which is more versatile). Then, I saw a little Handspring Visor: fits in my pocket, no case needed, no back pain, no kicking myself in the arse for not getting a full-featured computer (in the PB2400) for the same size. If there were a Newton even half the size of the, say, 2000/2100 model, then I would grab it in a heartbeat.

[TimmyDee51]

Being a Newton owner, I can say that the size was one of the Newtons greatest successes. Now that I have used a 2000, I don't think I could stand the small screen of a Palm or a Visor. Plus, when you think about it, people who carry PDAs often have some sort of carrying case with them, be that a briefcase, backpack, or messenger type bag. I almost always do and don't find it a problem. Even if it was smaller, I don't think I would want to stick it in my pocket and risk damaging it. I think the Newton was too ahead of its time.

[kiskiboy]

If Apple really wants to be the leader in the digital revolution/"the digital hub" it makes perfect sense that they will have a PDA, maybe PDA/remote control/Cell Phone all in one device, all tied into your Mac.

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I want an Apple PDA!!

[SupahCoolX]

Kiskiboy: Don't forget MP3 playback and roll of builtin dental floss, too. It does everything!

[tullamore]

I agree that Newton WAS a success. I had a Newton 120 and the handwriting recognition on that PDA 6 years ago is still BETTER than anything out there. I sold my Newton for a HP 620LX with WindowsCE PE because it had color. I wish I had the newton still, there was so manything you could do with it. Of course it would no longer connect to my G4 or PBG4 so a new one would be nice. My brother has the MP2000 which was a much nice machine with the 180MHz strongarm and backlighting. Apple went through some tough times then dropping the Newton, Cyberdog, and OpenDoc. I think they would have kept their technologies if they could have. (They should have invented the TiBook earlier :-) )

[SupahCoolX]

Tullamore: you could have gotten a USB/Serial adaptor to connect the Newton to a current Mac. I think they run about $30. Oh well, at least someone else out there is enjoying that Newt.