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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Consumer Hardware & Components > Japanese Input: Newton vs. Visor

Japanese Input: Newton vs. Visor
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interactive_civilian
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Mar 11, 2001, 02:48 PM
 
*warning: PDA newbie alert*

Hey all,
I'm looking to buy my first PDA in the very near future. However, I really don't know very much about them, and the research I have done myself still leaves many unanswered questions.

Anyway, here is what I need my PDA to be able to do: recognize handwritten kanji input, and at the very least return the "on" and "kun" pronunciations, and at the most (and preferably) alse return an English definition. Also, individual kanji would be great, but being able to input words with multiple kanji would be even better.

The purpose is because I may be moving to Japan in a few months, and my Japanese isn't as strong as it should be (especially reading anything more than the kana). A device that can fulfil this function quickly would incredibly convenient and useful. My vision is to be able to be walking down the street, see a sign that I am unable to read (or an ad or anything else), input it into my PDA, and get a definition.

So, I have been looking for things to do this, and here is what I have found so far that may be useful to me.
For the Newton:
nJIM - The Newton Japanese Input Method. The english documentation to this is pretty slim, so I am not completely sure if this will fulfil or help fulfil my needs.
Izumi - From what I can make of it, this seems a lot closer to what I am looking for. However, it does not appear to handle direct handwritten kanji input. And I don't know if it gives defintions.

For the Visor(PalmOS):
KanjiPad - This is a PalmOS port of the *nix Japanese HWR program Kanjipad. It seems to pretty much do exactly what I am looking for. However, I don't know how well it works. Does it store the J-E dictionary on the PDA, or does it need to be hooked up to a computer to be used (the page said something about synching some of the files). How much memory is needed to store a J-E kanji dictionary? At least on that holds the definitions for the 1945 jouyou kanji?

Ok, so it seems the Visor has what I want. But I am still not sure because I have no idea about PDAs. I have been told great things about the Newton (such as superior HWR) and it has features that I like (PC card expandability, connecting to my mac over ethernet w/ the proper PC card, rechargeable, made by Apple so it has that Apple "feel"). Also, I have seen Newton MP2100s w/ 32MB flash card for under $400 and I have seen ethernet PC Cards, such as those by 3com for very cheap.

However, the Visor seems to have its niceties too. Smaller form factor, plugs into my G4 right out of the box via USB, also expandable (using the springboard stuff), etc. I can get one brand new w/ a 16MB flash card for ~$350.

So, what do you all think? How much memory do I need to accomplish my goal here? Where can a newbie learn more about this sort of thing? Does anyone know of any more software solutions that would help me accomplish this?

Also, I need to keep in mind MacOS X compatability. I'm guessing that neither of these devices will be OS X ready by the 24th, but which has a greater chance of being supported sooner (or does accessing a Newton over ethernet make OS X compatability as easy as networking to another machine?).

I greatly appreciate any help that you all can offer.

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"It's your music. Burn it on a Mac. Dig?" - George Clinton
     
TimmyDee51
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Mar 12, 2001, 12:20 AM
 
I can't really speak to the Japanese recognition specifically, but check out www.unna.org and sift through the files there. Also, the Newton would be a better purchase overall. I have a 2100 and it is amazing. I'm not kidding -- it's light years ahead of its time. Plus, in your situation, it has the speed going for it (162 MHz StrongARM compared to the Palm OS 33 MHz (if that?) Dragonball). That would make any recognition that much snappier.
     
interactive_civilian
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Mar 12, 2001, 01:14 PM
 
Originally posted by TimmyDee51:
I can't really speak to the Japanese recognition specifically, but check out www.unna.org and sift through the files there. Also, the Newton would be a better purchase overall. I have a 2100 and it is amazing. I'm not kidding -- it's light years ahead of its time. Plus, in your situation, it has the speed going for it (162 MHz StrongARM compared to the Palm OS 33 MHz (if that?) Dragonball). That would make any recognition that much snappier.
Thanks for the link, although, I've been to http://www.unna.org, and a search of the site/archives for "Japanese" brings up one or two references to nJIM. I have still yet to find the functionality that I need.

Right now, it is looking like I'll have to lean towards the Visor. Unless...

Anyone know anything about trying to port KanjiPad to Newton? It is open source software under the GPL.I'm not a programmer, so I don't have much of a clue of how easy or difficult it would be.Any ideas? (I'll edit this later and post a link to the KanjiPad for *nix homepage).

Obviously, hardware-wise I am biased towards the Newton a bit, but without the functionality that I need, I probably won't buy one.

Any more ideas? Anyone else have any resources that a PDA newbie can look to for some general information as well as some of the more technical info that I am looking for? Your help is greatly appreciated.Also, I'll keep looking, and if anyone is interested, I'll continue to post more info as I find it.

cheers!

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"It's your music. Burn it on a Mac. Dig?" - George Clinton
     
TimmyDee51
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Mar 13, 2001, 05:42 PM
 
I can't answer that but try posting on the Newton boards at Smaller.com and then try joining the NewtonTalk mailing list at www.planetnewton.com . There are tons of developers on the list and they should be able to help you out.
     
Paul Guyot
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Mar 16, 2001, 05:33 AM
 
nJIM is a module used to convert romanjis to kanas/kanjis. It is used with other software: http://www.murata.sip.or.jp/~tmurai/...tjapanese.html

Izumi recognizes katakanas (well sort of for a couple of them) and allows you to input kanjis/kanas.

There is also Radicals by Sean Luke which allows you to enter the kanjis by radical.

The portability of KanjiPad actually depends on the sources of KanjiPad itself.

There is an English/Japanese dictionary for the Newton which gives you kun and on pronunciations as well as an English definition: http://www.ryoohki.net/~sam/newtjdic.html

Paul

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Newton Evangelist and developer:
http://www.kallisys.com/newton/
     
   
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