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One question about the Networking forum
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Nov 8, 2006, 09:44 PM
 
Why is it listed under "Other Topics"? Shouldn't it be listed under "Hardware Troubleshooting and Discussion"?

A lot of new users don't see the Networking Forum from looking at the Peripherals forum earlier.
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Nov 8, 2006, 10:47 PM
 
Networking is only half about the hardware. Networking itself is an etherial, abstract concept that involves a complex logical structure over a relatively simple physical one.

tooki
     
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Nov 8, 2006, 11:27 PM
 
Originally Posted by tooki View Post
Networking is only half about the hardware. Networking itself is an etherial, abstract concept that involves a complex logical structure over a relatively simple physical one.

tooki
See, that's why I have a dicken's of a time setting up networks. I can't think on that there etherial plane.
     
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Nov 9, 2006, 03:21 PM
 
Originally Posted by tooki View Post
involves a complex logical structure over a relatively simple physical one.
LOL

I'm just reminded of all the sh!tty WLAN routers that never worked like they should, needed constant rebooting and power cycling. I got rid of them all, too much PITA.

-t
     
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Nov 9, 2006, 08:04 PM
 
Yep. It's ridiculous how shabby so much consumer networking gear is. What annoys me about it even more is that there's nothing wrong with the hardware, usually. It's just crappy, crappy firmware written by green associate's degree CS grads in India, probably without even having the benefit of a sample piece of hardware to test on. (Well, I don't know that. But it sure feels like it!)

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Nov 9, 2006, 08:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by tooki View Post
Networking is only half about the hardware. Networking itself is an etherial, abstract concept that involves a complex logical structure over a relatively simple physical one.

tooki
how is that a good rationale for organzing forums? GUI is exactly what you described networking as, yet it belongs under "software—troubleshooting and discussion". networking is just as much a hardware topic as peripherals and modification. it doesn't belong in "other topics," when all the remaning topics have to do with content creation (AV, art and design, and web development).

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Nov 10, 2006, 10:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by rjenkinson View Post
how is that a good rationale for organzing forums? GUI is exactly what you described networking as, yet it belongs under "software—troubleshooting and discussion". .
Last time I checked, GUI is 100% software and 0% hardware.

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Nov 10, 2006, 06:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by what_the_heck View Post
Last time I checked, GUI is 100% software and 0% hardware.

-t
yes, the point being his criteria are flawed.

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Nov 10, 2006, 07:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by rjenkinson View Post
yes, the point being his criteria are flawed.
No, the point being your comparison was flawed.

What is the relatively simple physical structure of GUI ?
Don't tell me that NO physical structure = simple. That's not what tooki meant.

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Nov 10, 2006, 08:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by what_the_heck View Post
No, the point being your comparison was flawed.

What is the relatively simple physical structure of GUI ?
Don't tell me that NO physical structure = simple. That's not what tooki meant.

-t
you need to re-read what i posted. the simply physical structure of the GUI is the mouse and display, while the abstract logical aspect is the desktop metaphor. tooki's definition is flawed because it can also describe GUI-related topics, yet the GUI forum is not listed under hardware like networking is. networking is hardware, plain and simple. the opinion that there is "an etherial, abstract concept that involves a complex logical structure over a relatively simple physical one" doesn't change that and is a very poor basis for organizing forums.

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Nov 10, 2006, 09:59 PM
 
Um, ok, whatever. Take a basic logic class. I didn't say that my explanation was why it belonged in Special Topics. My explanation explained why it isn't a hardware topic and isn't a software topic. Note that contrary to your claim, Networking is NOT filed under Hardware, it's under Special Topics. Why? Because it's not purely hardware.

The fact is, I didn't come up with the original arrangement -- but for Networking to be a "special topic" does make sense to me, since it is neither a purely hardware issue, nor a purely software one.

The GUI Customization forum (which is NOT about GUI design in general, ONLY about skinning Macs!!) belongs in software since all Mac skinning is done in software only. None of the stuff in the GUI Customization forum involves hardware modification, nor, for that matter, any fundamental changes to the GUI. It's just about changing the colors of stuff on the screen, for the most part!

Regardless, you're trying to split hairs just to be argumentative, and I'll have no more part of that. I suggest you follow the mantra of "pick your battles" and save your complaints for when you have a real problem.

tooki
     
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Nov 10, 2006, 10:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by tooki View Post
Um, ok, whatever. Take a basic logic class. I didn't say that my explanation was why it belonged in Special Topics. My explanation explained why it isn't a hardware topic and isn't a software topic. Note that contrary to your claim, Networking is NOT filed under Hardware, it's under Special Topics. Why? Because it's not purely hardware.
i did not claim that the networking forum is filed under hardware. re-read my posts to check that. i took issue with your description of networking. re-read my posts to check that too. starting your post with "i didn't say that my explanation was..." and then incorrectly paraphrasing my argument is wasteful.

Regardless, you're trying to split hairs just to be argumentative, and I'll have no more part of that. I suggest you follow the mantra of "pick your battles" and save your complaints for when you have a real problem.
no, i'm not trying to split hairs and i don't need your advice. i'm disagreeing with your post for reasons on my own. if you don't like those reasons, that's fine. but suggesting that i'm splitting hairs, that i need to follow a mantra of picking appropriate battles or perhaps, most insulting of all, saving my compaints for when i have a "real" problem is just a little ridiculous when 1) i'm replying to a post 2) about a problem 3) in the feedback forum. obviously, i see it as a real problem if i've taken the time to post in the appropriate forum.

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Nov 10, 2006, 11:08 PM
 
?!!?

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Nov 11, 2006, 12:31 AM
 
rjenkinson,

I don't get your issues. Chill out, dude.

-t
     
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Nov 11, 2006, 10:54 AM
 
Originally Posted by rjenkinson View Post
i did not claim that the networking forum is filed under hardware. re-read my posts to check that. i took issue with your description of networking. re-read my posts to check that too. starting your post with "i didn't say that my explanation was..." and then incorrectly paraphrasing my argument is wasteful.
You said
...yet the GUI forum is not listed under hardware like networking is.
But Networking isn't listed under hardware.

As for your belief that Networking should be under hardware: as I originally stated, the physical (=hardware) side of networking is simple. Very simple. It's the logical part (which is sorta software, but usually configured in the networking gear, not in the Mac) that is complex, and it's the logical part that causes the bulk of difficulty for users. Since it's not primarily a hardware topic, and it's not primarily a software topic (since it's not really about software that runs on the computer, for the most part), yet is a topic deserving of its own forum, it goes in Other Topics. We have Other Topics precisely because of topics that don't fit into Hardware or Software.

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