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besson3c · Apr 17, 2007, 05:54 PM

I know there is a rule about threads about other members, but hear me out... substitute Rob for other ban evaders if you want, part of this will still apply...

Firstly, it seems like it is primarily Rob that has difficulty conversing with people without offending them, so why is it our job to be careful about offending him and thus treat him differently than we would other members?

You've said in the past that bans don't work... Fine, block his IP with your firewall. If he gets a new IP, block that IP. Keep doing this - it should take you far less time to add his specific IP (not his subnet IP, his specific IP) to your ruleset than it would for him to acquire an IP. I'm not talking about a vBulletin software IP block, I'm talking about a firewall block - don't even provide him with feedback via vBulletin, don't even tell him you will be doing this, just do it. It is the feedback that keeps him motivated, I'm willing to bet.

Just keep doing this and he'll grow tired of trying to acquire new IPs all the time. Like I said, it will be far more work for him than it would be for you. You could give several mods writable access to the firewall rules, automatically test them, and reload them every x minutes via a crontab providing the ruleset is valid. Put them under revision control so that you can tell who changed them last. Your problem will be solved.

mac128k-1984 · Apr 17, 2007, 06:05 PM

I don't know all of the history with Rob but it seems to me that he IS treated differently then other members. He seems to regularly flout the rules while others who do similar are disciplined. I'm not trying to gang up on Rob as much as question why do the Mods and Admins so noticeably treat him differently then regular members.

Doofy · Apr 17, 2007, 06:28 PM

Or better yet, unban Rob and ban Bessie - I'm tired of his inane, irrelevant, unamusing crap in every thread.

besson3c · Apr 17, 2007, 06:36 PM

Originally Posted by Doofy

Or better yet, unban Rob and ban Bessie - I'm tired of his inane, irrelevant, unamusing crap in every thread.

One man's irrelevant crap is another man's treasure. As far as my irrelevant, unamusing crap goes, it is very treasure like...

P.S. are the Police Academy movies popular in the UK?

Atheist · Apr 17, 2007, 06:39 PM

Who is Rob?

Kevin · Apr 17, 2007, 07:17 PM

Before rob got unbanned I was at the head of the list to let him back in. Hoping he learned his lesson. I never hated Rob.

But not long after he got unbanned was he back to his old Rob ways. I am not sure if Rob has the ability to be self aware of his own actions.

Either way there is some serious issues going on there that no one on MacNN can help him with.

A very rare thread were me and besson agree.

Mastrap · Apr 17, 2007, 10:04 PM

Originally Posted by besson3c

I know there is a rule about threads about other members

So quit it. You're berating Rob for breaking the rules whilst breaking them yourself? Tell me, how does that work? Logic, do you speak it?

And frankly, bollox. There's a bunch of people on here who think it's funny to bait Rob - Railroader, that brassplayerdude come to mind, Kevin at times - and Rob is sometimes dense enough to react, although he's getting better at ignoring the baiters.

I enjoy reading his rants, a lot more than your childish poop jokes. Leave him alone already.

besson3c · Apr 17, 2007, 10:16 PM

Originally Posted by Mastrap

So quit it. You're berating Rob for breaking the rules whilst breaking them yourself? Tell me, how does that work? Logic, do you speak it?

I don't really care what his fate is actually... I just don't think it is fair that we have to put kid gloves on when dealing with him.

I don't bait him myself, he can post what he wants, I don't care. I agree that people bait him. However, I've actually been told by a mod in the past to not engage him in an argument. At the time, I fulfilled this request, but now that I think about this more and see that others are being punished by reacting to him, I'm having second thoughts here.

He says strong things, he should expect strong reactions, and should be able to restrain ourselves and not go off half cocked and become aggressive and obnoxious when people react. If he can't hold it together, not our problem.

Railroader · Apr 17, 2007, 10:22 PM

Originally Posted by Mastrap

So quit it. You're berating Rob for breaking the rules whilst breaking them yourself? Tell me, how does that work? Logic, do you speak it?

True.

Originally Posted by Mastrap

And frankly, bollox. There's a bunch of people on here who think it's funny to bait Rob - Railroader, ... and Rob is sometimes dense enough to react, although he's getting better at ignoring the baiters.

Lie. Lie.

Originally Posted by Mastrap

I enjoy reading his rants, a lot more than your childish poop jokes. Leave him alone already.

I Just barely agree with you on this one.

Kevin · 05:27 AM

Originally Posted by Mastrap

And frankly, bollox. There's a bunch of people on here who think it's funny to bait Rob - Railroader, that brassplayerdude come to mind, Kevin at times - and Rob is sometimes dense enough to react, although he's getting better at ignoring the baiters.

Oh please Mastrap. You paint him out to be a victim that falls for our evilness!

That's hardly any relation to reality. If Rob is getting any ribbing, it's only because of his OWN actions.

He has shown has hasn't changed a bit. He still personally attacks people. Then blames them for his actions. He has no understanding of personal responsibility. His very actions here prove that (I'm not banned unless I choose to be!)

And no, it's not because people were baiting him. Rob doesn't NEED baited.

He has been nothing but condescending and hateful towards me since being unbanned. Kinda rude again since I was one of the main ones instigating his ban removal.

We learn from out mistakes. I wont make that one again.

I've known Rob probably longer than anyone here. I used to take up for him when he got banned over at neons.org for pulling the same crud. Before he started showing up here.

They kept him banned somehow....

JonoMarshall · Apr 18, 2007, 05:28 AM

Oh dear, it's like "Reality MacNN".

(Hardcore MacNNers passing rants back and forth doesn't make for a very healthy forum IMHO?!)

Doofy · Apr 18, 2007, 05:31 AM

Originally Posted by JonoMarshall

Oh dear, it's like "Reality MacNN".

(Hardcore MacNNers passing rants back and forth doesn't make for a very healthy forum IMHO?!)

Shut yer mouth, n00b!

Mastrap · Apr 18, 2007, 05:50 AM

Originally Posted by Railroader

Lie. Lie.

If I could be bothered, I could find you a number of examples. You got banned for baiting Rob, so give it a rest. Ever since Rob posted that picture of your daughter, which of course was off limits, you've had it in for him.

JonoMarshall · Apr 18, 2007, 06:09 AM

<---- consider me officially 'owned' and 'pwned'

(...you really have sunk my battleship as it were, umm, yes.)

*bows out*

Person Man · Apr 18, 2007, 07:21 AM

Originally Posted by besson3c

You've said in the past that bans don't work... Fine, block his IP with your firewall. If he gets a new IP, block that IP. Keep doing this - it should take you far less time to add his specific IP (not his subnet IP, his specific IP) to your ruleset than it would for him to acquire an IP. I'm not talking about a vBulletin software IP block, I'm talking about a firewall block - don't even provide him with feedback via vBulletin, don't even tell him you will be doing this, just do it. It is the feedback that keeps him motivated, I'm willing to bet.

And what about Joe MacNN, who has the misfortune of being on the same ISP as Rob, and gets assigned one of the banned IP addresses??

Repeat after me. IP. Bans. Do. Not. Work.

Dakarʒ · Apr 18, 2007, 07:21 AM

If he's pissing off as many people as marden was, send him packing for good.

Person Man · Apr 18, 2007, 07:29 AM

Originally Posted by Dakarʒ

If he's pissing off as many people as marden was, send him packing for good.

I would have been happy if Marden was restricted to posting only in the Political lounge, where 90% of his threads belonged.

Dakarʒ · Apr 18, 2007, 07:45 AM

In comparison to what happened when he was banned from the PL, sure, but that doesn't change the fact that when he was in the PL at certain points he wasn't debating so much as taunting and dodging.

besson3c · 07:54 AM

Originally Posted by Person Man

And what about Joe MacNN, who has the misfortune of being on the same ISP as Rob, and gets assigned one of the banned IP addresses??

Repeat after me. IP. Bans. Do. Not. Work.

Extremely unlikely. They could build into the system expiration of old IP addresses if this was really a concern though.

IP bans could work, if executed in an effective way. They certainly seem more effective than nickname based bans...

mac128k-1984 · Apr 18, 2007, 07:49 AM

Originally Posted by Person Man

I would have been happy if Marden was restricted to posting only in the Political lounge, where 90% of his threads belonged.

I thought he was banned?

Kevin · Apr 18, 2007, 07:59 AM

Originally Posted by Mastrap

If I could be bothered, I could find you a number of examples. You got banned for baiting Rob, so give it a rest. Ever since Rob posted that picture of your daughter, which of course was off limits, you've had it in for him.

Yes we know, Rob gets treated badly by people he attacks. Imagine that.

I would think if Rob would want people to stop, he would stop attacking first.

You'd be amazed how well it would work.

besson3c · Apr 18, 2007, 08:15 AM

Originally Posted by Mastrap

If I could be bothered, I could find you a number of examples. You got banned for baiting Rob, so give it a rest. Ever since Rob posted that picture of your daughter, which of course was off limits, you've had it in for him.

Railroader has it out for me too, I suppose he is just the kind of guy that wears his grudges on his sleeve and makes these sort of conscious decisions to not forgive or to seek some sort of internet revenge or something.

Not trying to get into it with Railroader here, just suggesting that this simply appears to be the way he is in general.

Like I said, I don't care what Rob's fate is in here, I'm not bothered by him posting here. I just know that he has been banned a number of times, and that at least at these times the mods felt they had no technical means to keep him out of here. So, I was trying to be helpful... The idea that we need to put on kid gloves to deal with him in here is based on the premise that we are helpless against his existence here. I don't believe that this is the case, so therefore I don't think this is a fair expectation.

Dakarʒ · Apr 18, 2007, 08:16 AM

Acting like you know everything about everything doesn't endear you to people either.

besson3c · Apr 18, 2007, 08:17 AM

Originally Posted by Dakarʒ

Acting like you know everything about everything doesn't endear you to people either.

Who is that addressed towards?

Dakarʒ · Apr 18, 2007, 08:22 AM

No one. But I'm speaking in reference to cash.

Edit: Actually that was Kevin's post.

Kevin · 08:56 AM

Originally Posted by besson3c

Railroader has it out for me too, I suppose he is just the kind of guy that wears his grudges on his sleeve and makes these sort of conscious decisions to not forgive or to seek some sort of internet revenge or something.

Ok you say that above.. .

Then you say...

Not trying to get into it with Railroader here, just suggesting that this simply appears to be the way he is in general.

That would be like me shooting someone with a gun, then saying "Now I am not trying to kill anyone here.... "

Not to mention that you hold your own set of grudges besson.

We ALL do. If someone in here treats you badly and makes an effort to talk **** to you in most all threads he or she takes place in, you will have a grudge against that person for doing so.

The only problem really comes into play when a person like Rob has a habit of making "friends" this way. If you are going to keep him unbanned knowing he is going to be this way, those he attacks shouldn't be punished for taking up for themselves.

Too many people in here have been banned because of Rob's taunting.

Yes we are all responsible for our actions. But when people that normally have never been in trouble, or been banned get banned because of their involvement with Rob, I think it's a shame.

If you can't keep him banned, just unban him and tell him he can't complain about any abuse he receives because of his forum attitude.

Chuckit · Apr 18, 2007, 09:03 AM

Rob complains that he gets banned because of other people's harassment. Other people complain that they get banned because of Rob's harassment. Sounds like equal treatment to me.

Kevin · Apr 18, 2007, 09:14 AM

Originally Posted by Chuckit

Rob complains that he gets banned because of other people's harassment. Other people complain that they get banned because of Rob's harassment. Sounds like equal treatment to me.

I'll clear it up for you.

Rob harasses Dick. (Having no clue he is doing it, or wont admit he was doing it)
Dick harasses Rob back.
Rob then harasses them even more.
Rob gets banned.
Rob makes thread saying it wasn't fair cause Dick said something to him too!

The point is, if Rob would quit attacking people people would have no reason to take up for themselves/Attack back.

If someone in the forum has a history of doing such a thing in the forum time and time again like Rob has, you either get rid of him for good, or let him stay and tell him he can't complain how he is treated.

Chuckit · Apr 18, 2007, 09:21 AM

People often treat Rob poorly whether or not he was already treating them poorly. Even the mods have said people seem to like baiting Rob.

mac128k-1984 · Apr 18, 2007, 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by Chuckit

Rob complains that he gets banned because of other people's harassment. Other people complain that they get banned because of Rob's harassment. Sounds like equal treatment to me.

The problem was that Rob wasn't getting banned (until now). Other members were getting banned or chastised for doing so much less and it the mods were letting Rob run rampart.

It wasn't until the skirmish with Alex did both get banned. The sad part of it is, Alex took his medicine but Rob did what he always does, he created a new id and posted a thread whining about his unfair treatment.

Gossamer · Apr 18, 2007, 09:22 AM

But those people don't have problems with anyone else on the boards. He's a catalyst.

Kevin · Apr 18, 2007, 09:23 AM

Originally Posted by Dakarʒ

Edit: Actually that was Kevin's post.

What was?

Originally Posted by Chuckit

People often treat Rob poorly whether or not he was already treating them poorly.

The only people that *I* have seen attack rob are people he has treated poorly in the past. Even went over-board.

Even the mods have said people seem to like baiting Rob.

The mods have said people do bait rob. Yes they do. No one is arguing that.

Rob acts like it happens in a vacuum. When it's his own actions that cause it.

So while the mods might say yes, he too gets picked on, I am betting they agree with me as to WHY it happens.

AKA Rob creates his own drama.

Originally Posted by Gossamer

But those people don't have problems with anyone else on the boards. He's a catalyst.

Exactly. That is why I said it was a shame that those people got banned that normally have never gotten into trouble.

Rob has the ability to sometimes bring the worst out in people because he himself has no "filter" He will attempt to find something that means something to you, and then attack it and you. Then say "I am not attacking anyone, I am just offering my opinion..."

mac128k-1984 · Apr 18, 2007, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by Chuckit

People often treat Rob poorly whether or not he was already treating them poorly. Even the mods have said people seem to like baiting Rob.

I can only speak for myself and I wasn't baiting him but he'd come and crap on threads or belittle my posts or belittle myself. I have since decided to do what he does so perhaps people who are baiting him are tired of him dumping on them so they're giving him the same medicine.

mac128k-1984 · Apr 18, 2007, 09:27 AM

Unfortunately I think DH is going to come into this thread at some point and lock with the statement no threads about members and not deal with the issue.

The mods/admins seem unable/unwilling to really deal with him and this situation. To a degree I can understand since they are after all volunteers and they only have a finite amount of time to manage the whole board never mind babysit one member who seems intent on disrupting other threads and members.

Dakarʒ · Apr 18, 2007, 09:28 AM

Originally Posted by mac128k-1984

so they're giving him the same medicine.

Bingo. Don't dish it out of you can't take it in.

Railroader · Apr 18, 2007, 10:24 AM

Originally Posted by Mastrap

If I could be bothered, I could find you a number of examples. You got banned for baiting Rob, so give it a rest. Ever since Rob posted that picture of your daughter, which of course was off limits, you've had it in for him.

If you could be bothered, you realize that was a long time ago. About 3 years ago. And If you'll be bothered, you'll note that I have been cordial to him and replying to him in a respectful manner lately.

But nah, you can't be bothered so instead you either spread FUD or lie.

Mastrap · Apr 18, 2007, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by Railroader

If you could be bothered, you realize that was a long time ago. About 3 years ago. And If you'll be bothered, you'll note that I have been cordial to him and replying to him in a respectful manner lately.

But nah, you can't be bothered so instead you either spread FUD or lie.

Watch your language. You know I don't lie.

I have no beef with either you or Rob and I certainly don't take sides. I just call it how I see it. You can feel free to disagree with me but accusing me of lying is just plain rude.

Gossamer · Apr 18, 2007, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by Railroader

If you could be bothered, you realize that was a long time ago. About 3 years ago. And If you'll be bothered, you'll note that I have been cordial to him and replying to him in a respectful manner lately.

But nah, you can't be bothered so instead you either spread FUD or lie.

Like the thread not too long ago where you went right back to calling him Robbie P? Yeah, real cordial.

Railroader · Apr 18, 2007, 10:40 AM

Originally Posted by mac128k-1984

Unfortunately I think DH is going to come into this thread at some point and lock with the statement no threads about members and not deal with the issue.

The mods/admins seem unable/unwilling to really deal with him and this situation. To a degree I can understand since they are after all volunteers and they only have a finite amount of time to manage the whole board never mind babysit one member who seems intent on disrupting other threads and members.

Actually, I imagine the mods forums is full for long threads about centerchannel68 and the people he has problems with.

Railroader · Apr 18, 2007, 10:41 AM

Originally Posted by Gossamer

Like the thread not too long ago where you went right back to calling him Robbie P? Yeah, real cordial.

It was right after he had posted it himself in a link to his deviantart page. I pointed that out to him. And I did it twice and stopped right away.

And since then, I have been extremely cordial with him.

Note, I had no part in this recent ban.

Mastrap · Apr 18, 2007, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by Gossamer

Like the thread not too long ago where you went right back to calling him Robbie P? Yeah, real cordial.

You know, it's a slow morning, so I did go through the trouble of looking this up. And surprise:

Originally Posted by Railroader

Mar 30, 2007, 05:18 AM
....
I haven't used you're first and last name in this thread, robbie p..

I think my case is resting.

Railroader · Apr 18, 2007, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by Mastrap

Watch your language. You know I don't lie.

I have no beef with either you or Rob and I certainly don't take sides. I just call it how I see it. You can feel free to disagree with me but accusing me of lying is just plain rude.

Then you are forgetting some very important facts here.

Demonhood · Apr 18, 2007, 10:48 AM

besson, we've already tried half of your suggestions from you original post, to little effect. the rest are simply too time consuming.

and no threads about members, unicorns, or furries.