[mitchell_pgh]

Considering all of the hype around OfflineRT, my mind started thinking... At 40min. of high quality video = 1GB, a $300 80GB Firewire HD could hold something like 40 movies.

Is OfflineRT going to be VHS < OfflineRT < DVD?

[Nebagakid]

what is the common DivX codec like?

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
<STRONG>Considering all of the hype around OfflineRT, my mind started thinking... At 40min. of high quality video = 1GB, a $300 80GB Firewire HD could hold something like 40 movies.

Is OfflineRT going to be VHS &lt; OfflineRT &lt; DVD?</STRONG>

Um... 40minutes of high quality Divx can take like 250megs. You could fit 160 divx's in the same space on that 80gig drive you speak of.

arn

[mitchell_pgh]

yah, but many DivX flake out and drop video audio synch... perhaps this won't do that EVER. Plus it should be of a higher quality then DivX. Then again, I can't wait to see MPEG4 included in QuickTime

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
<STRONG>yah, but many DivX flake out and drop video audio synch... perhaps this won't do that EVER. Plus it should be of a higher quality then DivX. Then again, I can't wait to see MPEG4 included in QuickTime </STRONG>

You're just speculating at this point... of note, Apple does not claim this to be anything more than what it is - a temporary format to edit it.

As for Divx's flaking out or droping sync - that's more a symptom of the lack of proper decoders for the Mac than a fault in the compression format itself. Though the latest version of http://divx.jamby.net does remarkably well under OS X

That being said, OfflineRT unlikely to provide better compression than other solutions which don't require the ability to do non-linear editing. Trying to do NLE on MPEG2 or DIVX would be a difficult due to the compression methods involved. But then again - that's not what they were designed for.

You could also consider http://www.3ivx.com as a divx alternative.

arn

[pdot]

Divx works really well for low res clips b/c you don't get as much distortion (like blockiness) as you do in Sorenson and (eew!) Cinepak. However, even with larger clips, I've seen many files where people sacrifice frame rate to keep file size small. Not a problem with Divx, but with the people doing encoding. Wait, this doesn't really apply to this topic does it? Oh well.

I like 3ivx. It's the best low cost codec for Apple right now. Actually, it may be the best codec for the Mac right now. Still, you can't but hope for MPEG-4. I didn't want to give in to using 3ivx b/c I wanted more compatibility (meaning I don't want to have to tell people to go d/l the codec), but MPEG4 is taking so long, I had no choice.

[mitchell_pgh]

The noise around Apple indicates that the next version of quicktime will have MPEG4 included... Think, iMovie to MPEG4

[a holck]

OfflineRT is a low quality photojpeg codec at quater resolution, specs wich are sub videocd quality, and not comparable to divx.

[SirCastor]

Originally posted by a holck:
<STRONG>OfflineRT is a low quality photojpeg codec at quater resolution, specs wich are sub videocd quality, and not comparable to divx.</STRONG>

But high enough quality for editing, I realize editing can be done on low-qual, but what about color correction? (Which is one of the boasting features of FCP3) That doesn't seem to make much sense. It has to be pretty good quality..

[MM-o4]

Sorry if this is a stooopid question but just so I set right on this.
*offline RT is purely for editing not for export to camera*
So after doing your editing to get a full quality rendered file you still need the 'DV' compressed files on you harddrive. So you have your 'OfflineRT' files purely for the editing and duplicates of them in 'DV' format for the export?

thanks

MM-o4

[Metzen]

Avid Cinema did the exact same thing for the Performa 6400 (Video Editing edition). The quality was about the same as 2nd Generation video (VCR -&gt; VCR), some ghosting around people, etc when using the hardware decoder in the card. It really wasn't all that bad at 320x240 resolution. Exact same amount of space was taken up by the compression algorithm Avid used (JPEG) and Apple.

Avid's specs on the compression was 320x240, little over a megabyte a second (1.05Mb/sec?) JPEG compression set to 75 (high quality) thousands of colors. My guess is Apple's compression OfflineRT format will be striking similar.

This is nothing new, I've been doing it for years with the Avid Cinema card. Unfortunately, it stopped working with OS9, G3 Upgrade cards and HFS+ harddisks.

HFS+ would equal crappy sound (scratchy muffled)
400Mhz Sonnet Upgrade ensured video would lose sync with sound (during playback using the Avid Cinema hardware. It was possible to ensure that the hardware card wasn't being used by making sure the movie was not being played at either 320x240 or 640x480. This allowed for sync, but dropped frames pretty often and sporadically).
OS9 equalled loss of the use of inputting anything from Avid Cinema (but other software solutions worked, like Strata/Avid VideoShop. The only catch was ensuring that the compression was set exactly right (see above).

Avid stopped supporting the card at OS 8 because of the lack of installed hardware (and the move to USB input only Avid Cinema). Oh well. It was a great card. But after all the loss of support, I bought a DV. I love my DV. iMovie works for me.

[Metzen]

Interestingly enough, Apple's PhotoJPEG codec is going to do about 2/3 the space the old Avid Cinema codec took (about 25min/Gigabyte) vs 40min/Gb with OfflineRT. The difference? Higher compression, whereas the Avid Codec did 1Meg/sec, OfflineRT is going to do 660Kb/sec. Obviously technology doesn't stand still, so I wonder if the OfflineRT codec is going to be of a higher quality then Avid's.

[Metzen]

Sorry for the multiple posts, but yes, a dual 400Mhz G4 will do Realtime editing. Check requirements:

Macintosh computer with a 300-MHz
or faster PowerPC G3 or G4
processor and built-in FireWire
--500-MHz or faster single or dual
processor Power Mac G4 or PowerBook
G4 required for G4 realtime effects

[Metzen]

Introducing the musical hard disk
Collaborating on a project? If you need to carry three or four hours worth of footage with you to and from a shared computer, here's a nifty solution: store your footage in OfflineRT format on your iPod's 5GB hard disk, and carry your part of the project around with you in your shirt pocket.

And as for the question on how to use the OfflineRT codec, it sounds like you simply plug away, editing, etc. then when your finished you'll reconnect to the camcorder, tape, etc. and you'll be automatically given the high quality DV format. From there the RT editing comes to play and transforms all your RT editing work into the DV format. Though you'll probably need to rerender all the transition footage.

You can capture and transcode DV footage to OfflineRT using a simple FireWire connection. The first native offline format available for DV, (it can also be used by editors working with standard definition or high definition formats) OfflineRT is perfect for editing on the run, providing over 40 minutes of video per gigabyte of hard disk space. This means you can carry around massive amounts of timecode-accurate video — storing more than 24 hours worth of footage on a PowerBook G4's 48GB internal hard drive — that you can reconnect to the original source material whenever you're ready, without having to resort to special external storage solutions

[ 12-17-2001: Message edited by: Metzen ]