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You are here: MacNN Forums > Enthusiast Zone > Classic Macs and Mac OS > Why do I have so many problems with OS9?

Why do I have so many problems with OS9?
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Mac Elite
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Naperville, IL
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Jan 1, 2000, 01:02 PM
 
I've been using macs for many years and whenever a new system update comes out, I always perform a clean install and have no major problems. However, with OS9, I perform a clean install just fine... BUT the problem is that when I start using it, applications crash over and over like there is no tomorrow with memory type errors. Then eventually, my computer just freezes. I have a new iMac DV with 192 megs of RAM. I already alocate more than the standard amount (default) RAM to my commonly used applications. Please, if anyone can help, I'd really like to get OS9 working on my computer.. Right now, I reverted back to 8.6 for the iMacDV. I've heard of people having problems with OS9 and was wondering if those were the same problems that I'm having. If anyone has any idea what the deal is, I'd really like to know!

Thanks in advance, lets see if we can get this machine operating better!

Mike
2009 MacMini 2.0 C2D 4GB (3,1) - Needs update!
11" MBA (2010 1.6GHz C2D)
iPhone 4 / iPad!
Hooked on Apple since the IIGS
     
hmr
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Jan 1, 2000, 04:34 PM
 
I reformatted my hard drive and after that I Mac OS 9 has been ... allright.
     
Grizzled Veteran
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Jan 1, 2000, 09:03 PM
 
OS9 installs some new ATi library's, and keeps some of the older ones...This is a problem. I suggets installing macos9, and then installing OpenGL 1.1.2 This solved a lot of my crashes and such.

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-See Yea!
     
newsmac
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Jan 1, 2000, 09:17 PM
 
I did a regular install of OS 9 as soon as I got it. Was ok for while, then started having freezes, then crashes, so I then did a clean install, and it went better longer, but eventually, some problems reappeared. So I reformatted my hard drive, and havent had any problems for over a month now. Still have my fingers crossed though. Hope you get your working right soon. It is a super OS when everything works as it is supposed to. Good luck
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
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Jan 2, 2000, 12:13 AM
 
MikeD,

I was having this same problem with my Rev. C iMac, and then on my girlfriend's iMac DV. I, too, have been using and even supporting Macs for many years now, so I was loath to call Apple tech support. But, try as I might, I couldn't make my machine stable (as for my girlfriend, she's a new Mac user, so I just dropped her back to 8.6 so she can use AOL, and she's perfectly happy).

So, with my tail between my legs, I called Apple tech support. The guy I spoke with was very cool and helped me immensely. He told me that the two main issues with Type 2 and similar memory-related errors under OS 9 are a) a virus or b) bad add-in RAM.

I couldn't imagine either one of these things afflicting me since I've had my 128MB add-in for almost a year, and it's been running without a hitch, and also, I've never, in all my years of using a Mac, acquired a virus. But I took his advice and dropped my iMac back to the 32MB it shipped with in order to see if the problems went away. They didn't. So, my next step was to download the beta version of the Virex 6.1 control panel and scan for virii. Lo and behold!, my problem turned out to be a virus that had infected several of the installers for my main utilities and control panels and such (i.e. SETI@Home, DockManager Lite, etc.). After cleaning out this pesky virus (don't remember which one), all my problems went away, and my trusty iMac has been running like a champ for the last two months with OS 9.

Turns out that the virus came from an installer I downloaded from Artec USA. I wanted to check out the drivers for the scanner my girlfriend had just bought, so I downloaded the StuffIt archive file. Turns out, just a day or two later, I read on MacNN that this file, hosted at artecusa.com, was, in fact, infected with a virus. The .hqx file was fine, and the driver files themselves were fine, but the .sea file which contained the driver files was infected. This is how I acquired the virus.

My advice to you: pop open the RAM/AirPort Card access panel on the bottom of your iMac DV, and remove all but the factory-installed RAM. See if this improves anything. If you see an improvement, your next step is to arrange to either return or exchange the add-in RAM. If this method fails, go to http://www.nai.com (Network Associates, the makers of Virex), grab the latest beta of the Virex 6.1 control panel, and scan your hard drive, any CD's you may have burned containing installers, and/or any other media where you may store installers for software you like to keep around.

I bet one of these two things will ferret out the problem. I wish you the best of luck.

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Number41

[This message has been edited by Number41 (edited 01-02-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Number41 (edited 01-02-2000).]
Number41
     
daddim
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Jan 2, 2000, 03:16 AM
 
I am using a brand new, shipped from Apple G4 and have noted a number of nasty problems.

1: When I used to dial out initially with the internal modem, I would hear the modem call through my Mac's speakers. This has been disabled mysteriously.

2: The "Browse The Internet" alias quit working. It would open Netscape's Navigator's splash screen and then Navigator would abort.

3: I am getting occasional error codes from White Pine's CU-SeeMe -- but the application keeps working. This is White Pine's _latest_ build (004) and they have verified that it is supposed to work with Mac OS 9.

4: Microsoft Excel version 5 is apparently broken with OS 9. I can open Excel files but I cannot use cut and paste because that appears to use Microsoft's OLE and that seems to have a major problem. I don't _want_ to upgrade to Microsoft's Office '98 (which is not Y2K Compliant) because I know Office 4.2.1 (which I learned before I owned my first Mac). Microsoft Word version 6.0.1 does work, unless I try to use OLE (I don't).

5: Ircle (version 3.0.4) cannot be used to send a video window. What happens is the video application starts to consume all of the memory on your system until another application running in the background (like the Finder or the control strip) dies with an Error 11. When you press the "Reset" button, it hangs worse with a "bus error." Onno Tiljit, the author of Ircle, knows about this and I'm not sure what his solution will be. Apple blindsided him on this nasty OS change. He says it has something to do with new Quicktime features that hook into the OS.

I do not think that I should have to reformat my hard disk in order to make this computer work. After all, Apple formatted it in the first place with OS 9 installed!
     
scott
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Jan 2, 2000, 04:25 AM
 
I'm going to restate the obvious, since it is so often overlooked.

If you're having crashes, start by ditching third-party extensions and control panels. In my experience, Kaleidscope, RAM Doubler, and Speed Doubler are among the most risky to run. While the products themselves are quite innovative, and the developers quite resourceful, these extensions twist and bend the Mac OS in unpredictable ways.

What happens is that application developers (Adobe, Macromedia, MetaCreations, Microsoft) expect the Mac OS to behave in a certain way when they call Mac OS APIs supplied by Apple. When extensions and/or control panels are installed, they "patch" the functionality of the Mac OS, replacing Apple's functions with the custom functions written by Greg Landwebber, Connectix, etc.

Since it's quite difficult to test every combination of extensions and applications, seemingly random crashes can occur in situations where the custom code collides with applications expecting default behavior. This is a bit of oversimplification, but I believe the basic idea is accurate.

I have a remarkably stable machine -- Blue/G3 running Mac OS 9. In fact, the only time I can remember having to reboot my machine in the last two months is after using RealPlayer (guaranteed crash everytime). I don't use very few third party extensions. Feel free to try stuff like Kaleidoscope and RAM/Speed Doubler out, but if you experience crashes, try taking them out first.

- Scott


[This message has been edited by scott (edited 01-02-2000).]
     
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Jan 2, 2000, 05:56 AM
 
Well... I too a quite a Mac savvy person... and all I can say is

"I feel your pain"

I have done the ATI/GL driver update, updated all of my apps so they are OS 9 savvy, and I have slimmed down my macs plug-ins.... and my g3 is still a P.O.S.

Personally I feel that OS 9's guard pages still need some work.
"Wait, these aren't my lamps. These lamps have feet. This must not be my apartment. I'd better get a new apartment."
-SpaceGhost
     
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Jan 2, 2000, 01:36 PM
 
To daddim:

You wrote:
"I do not think that I should have to reformat my hard disk in order to make this computer work. After all, Apple formatted it in the first place with OS 9 installed!"

While in theory, one might think this is a reasonable statement, in actual practice, nothing could be further from the truth.

First Rule of Setting Up a New Computer: Take the machine out of the box, verify that you have backups of all installers for apps and such included on the HD (on CD), REFORMAT THE DRIVE, and reinstall the OS from scratch! Never, I repeat *NEVER* trust a factory format or factory installation of the OS. This rule applies to every kind of machine, be it Mac, Windoze, UN*X, what have you.

If you leave the factory-installed OS in place, you're asking for trouble. Period. My Rev. C iMac crashed 5 times within the first hour out of the box, as did my girlfriend's iMac DV.

You have to keep in mind that, at the factory, hard drives are formatted and the OS installed by some method of mass duplication. This is not the most ideal way of ensuring stability. Plus, many times the manufacturer will install extra "value-added" software at the factory which, often, are things you won't use, and may cause instability no matter how they're installed.

My advice to you: back up any important files and software, do a low-level format, and reinstall the Mac OS from scratch on a totally clean disk. This is the only reliable way to ensure that you've got a clean, functioning install of the OS.

Best of luck!

------------------
Number41

[This message has been edited by Number41 (edited 01-02-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Number41 (edited 01-02-2000).]
Number41
     
Grizzled Veteran
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Location: Pasadena, CA USA
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Jan 2, 2000, 10:13 PM
 
I highly agree with you. The very forst thing I do with a new Mac is to low-level the hard drive(s).
All Macs include the "Restore" CD that makes it a snap to re-image your Mac after the reformat. Low-level (or zeroing) a drive will allow any bad blocks to be mapped out. Given that all hard drives are now massed-produced ata very high rate (hence the low price) I doubt anything other than the simple initialization is done prior to the software being loaded.
I have had so very few troubles with everything from Yosemite G3's to iMac DVs to G4s that I am am sure this will weed out many initial problems for people.

Scott

PS - I know this is above what a computer novice should be expected to do, but it's the reality of living in the high-tech world.
     
MikeD  (op)
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Jan 3, 2000, 02:26 PM
 
thanks everyone for your help. What I'm going to do:
1. check for virus
2. wait for CDR drive to backup TONS of stuff.
3. reformat HD and install OS9 and all updates.

Hopefully this works!

Mike
2009 MacMini 2.0 C2D 4GB (3,1) - Needs update!
11" MBA (2010 1.6GHz C2D)
iPhone 4 / iPad!
Hooked on Apple since the IIGS
     
joeaux
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Jan 3, 2000, 03:21 PM
 
Agree with Number41 100%. I did the ole 'take out of box, reformat and reinstall' on every Mac I've ever owned. I got OS9 on the iBook but upgraded my iMac (figured I'd give upgrading without reformatting a try). As far as the iBook. No problems. Runs like a clock. And the iMac. It's great using the upgrade to OS9 from OS8.6. Remember. When a new Mac comes out of the box, it could have been sitting around for quite a while and the nasty 'cosmic rays' could have zapped the hard drive (whooo...), Always reinstall on a new machine!
-joe-


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iMac (Lime 266 OS 9), iBook (Tangerine 300 OS 9), SE/30 (Platinum 16 OS 7.5.5)
     
   
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