[masugu]

Can someone tell me if we could possibly get a 2nd CD drive in the new G5s???

This is what I am holding out for...that and faster speeds!

[Eug]

Why don't you just spend $40 on a Firewire case?

[masugu]

Originally posted by Eug:
Why don't you just spend $40 on a Firewire case?

Because it's a kludge...

[Big Mac]

There is a second disk drive bay in the G5, but I'm assuming you mean you want additional drive bays; I agree with you. Considering the fact that the G4 had the capacity for four disks (correct me if I'm wrong) as well as two optical drives, I'm hoping that the G5 will gain additional expansion capability in short order. You would certainly expect the G5 to have more expandability than it currently does, given its greater height. The rumors about Rev b don't make it sound too likely, unfortunately...

[The Placid Casual]

The lack of expandability and room for more than 1 Optical drive is what has put me off buying one...

Apple really need to sorts it, but why do I think that they won't.

[Mediaman_12]

I don't think we will ever see a second optical drive bay in the current G5 case. Adding a second drive would require a radical redesign of the current internal layout and cooling system.
By contrast the G4 case always had the 'possibility' as was seen by the people who 'hacked' a second drive in starting way back with the G3 smurf cases.

[Cadaver]

Have you actually looked inside a G5 case? Not much room in there for a second drive, despite the general size of the case.

Even the lower heat profiles of the 90nm chips wont really help since substantially increasing the clock speed takes away the benefit of the new chip running cooler...

Adding a second drive would require a complete case redesign, something very expensive and unlikely to happen. Apple clearly doesn't think that most people want or need a second internal drive. While I'm not trying to be an Apple Apologist, they must have studied this problem with focus groups or something similar and come to the conclusion that its not fiscally worth while to design a case with two optical bays.

Don't let the lack of a second bay dissuade you from buying a G5. The machine is so much more responsive and fluid than any other Mac to date. OS X was made for the G5. Imagine a world where the wonderful Mac OS X user interface was just as quick and responsive as the horridly ugly and antiquated Windows UI. That's what my 2x2 G5 is like.

Plus, a FireWire case isn't that much of a kludge. Here's a great example:

A buddy of mine, one of the IT guys at work, has a G5 and a 20" cinema display. His machine sits under the desk, off to the left. A bit of a lean to get to the optical tray of the SuperDrive. He's got a second, 52x burner in a nice slim FireWire case, sitting directly underneath the space between the legs of the cinema display on his desk. A rewritable drive at his fingertips while the main machine is comfortably out of the way. It's really a slick setup like that.

[Rev-O]

Originally posted by Cadaver:

A buddy of mine, one of the IT guys at work, has a G5 and a 20" cinema display. His machine sits under the desk, off to the left.

Sacrilege! Putting a G5 out of sight! Almost put mine under my desk at home and then thought, not only did this computer cost me 3 grand, it's beautiful! It's sitting on top of the damn desk!

[masugu]

Originally posted by Cadaver:
Have you actually looked inside a G5 case? Not much room in there for a second drive, despite the general size of the case.

Even the lower heat profiles of the 90nm chips wont really help since substantially increasing the clock speed takes away the benefit of the new chip running cooler...

Adding a second drive would require a complete case redesign, something very expensive and unlikely to happen. Apple clearly doesn't think that most people want or need a second internal drive. While I'm not trying to be an Apple Apologist, they must have studied this problem with focus groups or something similar and come to the conclusion that its not fiscally worth while to design a case with two optical bays.

Don't let the lack of a second bay dissuade you from buying a G5. The machine is so much more responsive and fluid than any other Mac to date. OS X was made for the G5. Imagine a world where the wonderful Mac OS X user interface was just as quick and responsive as the horridly ugly and antiquated Windows UI. That's what my 2x2 G5 is like.

Plus, a FireWire case isn't that much of a kludge. Here's a great example:

A buddy of mine, one of the IT guys at work, has a G5 and a 20" cinema display. His machine sits under the desk, off to the left. A bit of a lean to get to the optical tray of the SuperDrive. He's got a second, 52x burner in a nice slim FireWire case, sitting directly underneath the space between the legs of the cinema display on his desk. A rewritable drive at his fingertips while the main machine is comfortably out of the way. It's really a slick setup like that.

I have looked under the hood of a G5 to be sure.

I do see your point...I was just hoping Apple would have a redesigned enclosure in the wings. Surely the compaction / shrink of the Next Gen G5 silicon will (eventually) run cooler etc. and not require nine fans and the dimensions of Carnegie Hall to circulate air???

Must say I love my Dell for making copies of musical CDs for use in the car - without having to do the 2-step drill of parking the music on the HD...just copy like a floppy...

I guess an extermal FW drive will have to do. Pity someone does not copy the Swiss cheese AL design of a G5 and make an aesthetically pleasing peripheral

So I will notice some percievable differences in OS performance from my 1GHz TI PB, eh?

[Zoom]

Originally posted by The Placid Casual:
The lack of expandability and room for more than 1 Optical drive is what has put me off buying one...

I was sure the new enclosure would have a spot for a second drive bay. Jesus, it's so tall, I can't believe they couldn't accomodate it. I find it amazing that Apple couldn't work this out.

And I also find it amazing that on a pro machine it wouldn't be an option. Pros need to be able to customize their setup and having a second optical drive has got be to fairly common. My personal reason is that I want a DVD burner AND and CR burner, and the CD burn speeds on the Superdrives are just too slow. Plus, copying a CD is such a pain with a single drive.

I'm glad they put the USB and FW ports on the front, that was long overdue, but I want one more thing: I want a generic panel where we can put other things: extra USB/FW, media reader slots, hell flashing lights... whatever. Having a spot for an extra drive with open up this option, too (though it would be hard to find an aluminum face plate).

My personal feeling is that Apple is so strict about design and how the damn thing looks that it simply won't allow customization. Same thing with the Mac OS X GUI. No one can do it better than them, so why even allow it? It's pure Steve.

But now that you mention it, I actually do kinda like the idea of putting an extra CD drive under the flat panel monitor. That's the one thing I love about my Mom's eMac (over my G4) - that drive is just so handy! I'd like to have all the above-mentioned stuff right there. As pretty as the tower is, I keep it under my desk and out of the way. It would be great to relocate the drive bay and extra ports to right under a 20" cinema display!

I think that's what I'm going to do. I'm in the market for a new G5 and LCD display. I'm just waiting for the new G5's and displays to come out.

[masugu]

Originally posted by Zoom:
I was sure the new enclosure would have a spot for a second drive bay. Jesus, it's so tall, I can't believe they couldn't accomodate it. I find it amazing that Apple couldn't work this out.

And I also find it amazing that on a pro machine it wouldn't be an option. Pros need to be able to customize their setup and having a second optical drive has got be to fairly common. My personal reason is that I want a DVD burner AND and CR burner, and the CD burn speeds on the Superdrives are just too slow. Plus, copying a CD is such a pain with a single drive.

I'm glad they put the USB and FW ports on the front, that was long overdue, but I want one more thing: I want a generic panel where we can put other things: extra USB/FW, media reader slots, hell flashing lights... whatever. Having a spot for an extra drive with open up this option, too (though it would be hard to find an aluminum face plate).

My personal feeling is that Apple is so strict about design and how the damn thing looks that it simply won't allow customization. Same thing with the Mac OS X GUI. No one can do it better than them, so why even allow it? It's pure Steve.

But now that you mention it, I actually do kinda like the idea of putting an extra CD drive under the flat panel monitor. That's the one thing I love about my Mom's eMac (over my G4) - that drive is just so handy! I'd like to have all the above-mentioned stuff right there. As pretty as the tower is, I keep it under my desk and out of the way. It would be great to relocate the drive bay and extra ports to right under a 20" cinema display!

I think that's what I'm going to do. I'm in the market for a new G5 and LCD display. I'm just waiting for the new G5's and displays to come out.

Well, I am waiting for G5s...but I just bought a 20 " Display. Please, Steve, don't make the new displays THAT much cooler or CHEAPER!!!

[Vader’s Pinch of Death]

Originally posted by The Placid Casual:
The lack of expandability and room for more than 1 Optical drive is what has put me off buying one...

That is silly. I mean look at the inside of the damn G5's, they are packed as it is. Get a firewire burner and get on with life.

[masugu]

Originally posted by Vader’s Pinch of Death:
That is silly. I mean look at the inside of the damn G5's, they are packed as it is. Get a firewire burner and get on with life.

Umm...yes. I see how packed the inside of the G5 is.

But if the Pee Cee folks can fit this basic capability into their machines, shouldn't Apple be able to figure it out? Come on St. Ive...

[The Placid Casual]

Originally posted by Vader’s Pinch of Death:
That is silly. I mean look at the inside of the damn G5's, they are packed as it is. Get a firewire burner and get on with life.

Ok, so I spend £3000 on a machine speced to meet my needs.

I then have to buy an extra CD-RW burner and firwire enclosure!?!

And then have to keep buying firewire devices that sprawl across my desk everytime I want a new drive or card reader?

Ummm, not appetising.

[Big Mac]

I'm still firmly backing the expansion camp on this one. As others have pointed out, ugly PC cases come loaded with tons of bays. Granted, they're far louder than the G5, but isn't it possible that Apple could be a tad more accommodating? We're not asking for the world here. Perhaps the answer is to make the G5 even taller than it is now!

[CIA]

Anyway to stick a slim slot load drive above or below the superdrive? A few snip snips of the mesh, and bam, 2nd optical drive.

[starman]

I gotta say that having an external firewire case is the fugliest thing you can add to your system. I have a PC with a DVD-ROM and a DVD burner and I'd love to have that on my Mac. Adding a Firewire case adds cost, an extra power plug, and one more device to dust off. It's annoying.

But then again, if Apple were to add that to the G5, what does the "Eject" key do now? Bay 1 or bay 2? How to you eject bay 2? It's like the single-button-mouse issue for optical drives.

Mike

[scottiB]

Originally posted by Zoom:
I was sure the new enclosure would have a spot for a second drive bay. Jesus, it's so tall, I can't believe they couldn't accomodate it. I find it amazing that Apple couldn't work this out.

I'm sure Apple could've added a second optical drive, if they deemed it a priority. A second optical drive and a third and fourth hard drive bays weren't, though; they were trumped by the desire for very quiet running. Start cramming two more hard drives (even SATA drives) and a second optical, will create a louder machine by decreasing airflow in their respective cooling zones.

I have a DP800 with 4x120 drives, the SuperDrive, a Zip250, and 3 PCI slots filled. It's as if a hair dryer is on low continuously. The G5 2x2 with 2, 250GB drives at my friend's is whisper quiet, and, other than the anachronistic Zip, has more storage capacity than mine (and less need for my PCI cards since one's a RAID, the other a FW800).

When I was ripping my CD collection into iTunes, I wanted faster read times than the SuperDrive could provide, so I bought a FW burner--thinking I'd use it to burn faster CDs, too. Once the importing was done, I've hardly used the thing, deferring to the SuperDrive to write CDs--of which I don't do a lot, usually DVDs for archiving and my iPod for music.

Leading to....

Must say I love my Dell for making copies of musical CDs for use in the car - without having to do the 2-step drill of parking the music on the HD...just copy like a floppy...

Apple's POV is if you're using iTunes to manage your music, you'll want to have the music on your drive, anyway. Or you'll download it to your iPod (or brand new iPod mini, only $249 at apple.com).

I gotta say that having an external firewire case is the fugliest thing you can add to your system.

It ain't pretty, but mine's away from my G4 on a shelf with my other FW gizmos. I connect them via a FireWire hub. My desktop is clean, well clean of peripherals, anyway.

[The Placid Casual]

Originally posted by starman:
But then again, if Apple were to add that to the G5, what does the "Eject" key do now? Bay 1 or bay 2? How to you eject bay 2? It's like the single-button-mouse issue for optical drives.

Mike

When I had 2 drives in my MDD machine, you could hold 'option' and eject and you could then select which bay ejected. Also, with a second drive in there, you had an eject icon in the top menu that allowed you to choose which disk to eject...

Wasn't perfect, but sorted the issue.

I'm still for hardware eject buttons... but then again I do feel like a luddite sometimes!

[Zoom]

Quiet is good, but expansion is more important. I mean, if Apple wanted to REALLY make it quiet, they could just leave out the processors entirely!

Seriously, that can't be an argument for not allowing expandability. These towers are huge and I've seen much smaller PCs with extra drive bays, internal and external. Look at all the open space inside the G5. Couldn't they put the two G5s in line or on top of each other? Somehow, they need to stack things up a little more. There's a LOT of open space inside that cabinet. I'm sure there are all sorts of technical reasons why this would be difficult, but I expect Apple to solve these problems for the money they demand. Hell, they could create a cube Mac, surely they could shrink the G5 case - or have more expandability - or BOTH!

Then look at the handles. Yeah, they look nice, but they waste a LOT of space (the overall outer dimensions are much greater than the inner dimensions). I'd rather have spring-loaded, fold-out handles and have a shorter case or an extra optical drive bay or both.

And if Apple's gonna be a "digital hub", they need to build in media reader slots, right on the front.

Actually, I'd rather see those slots on the display - much easier to access. Either way, they should be there.

I love Apple products, I love their design, and I do think there's a place for artistic flair and dedication to quiet machines... but not at the expense of functionality. I expect Apple to have both, in spades.

[scottiB]

Originally posted by Zoom:
Quiet is good, but expansion is more important. I mean, if Apple wanted to REALLY make it quiet, they could just leave out the processors entirely!

Granted, but the tower is much quieter than any PC tower/workstation I've ever heard (Boxx, SGI, Mac)--and it's very welcome to me. After working on my friend's G5, working at home as become much more irritating (though I can't justify a new G5 right now solely for that reason).

Seriously, that can't be an argument for not allowing expandability.

Sure it can--not just one you buy into.

The engineering and design priorities that Apple chose with the G5 are ones either with which I agree or don't impact me that much because I have more than enough storage and own tons of peripherals (FW CD-Rs, card readers, etc.). I like that I own these things that aren't tethered to a machine, that I can migrate them easily to a new Mac (be it tower or laptop); it provides me more flexibility at the loss of shelf space, though. It's my trade-off.

This is not to say that others' concerns aren't valid to them: starman's desire for dual-DVD readable drives is one I can appreciate but would never need--as far as I can imagine.

[DeathToWindows]

just get a lacie d2... it sort of matches the g5

[masugu]

Originally posted by DeathToWindows:
just get a lacie d2... it sort of matches the g5

Any recommendations on a matching CD ROM unit...That is what I would want for making quick CD copies...