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hldan · Apr 22, 2005, 12:53 AM

Looks like the new PowerMacs are soon around the corner. Hopefully we will be suprised at 3Ghz. I want a new one! Let's keep our fingers crossed.
http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPL....3.1.3.0.0.1.0

chris v · Apr 22, 2005, 06:42 AM

About damn time. Considering the reports of supply exceeding demand, this has to be a sign of a refresh next week.

Big Mac · Apr 22, 2005, 07:03 AM

Apple's got to have a 3GHz part hidden away, right? It will be interesting to see how the company spins it if the best it can do is 200MHz.

hldan · Apr 22, 2005, 09:39 AM

Yeah, I can't say that they are completely wrong but the rumor sights are never exact so I am gong to keep my hopes up for 3Ghz. I would hate to see Apple gives a cheezy 2.7Ghz up from the 2.5 dualie. On the other Intel does these modest increments as well. Every new Intel processor has gotten a 200Mhz upgrade from the previous.
If Apple doesn't deliver a much higher clock speed model then it better be a much more efficient processor if they want to keep sales going and a much better graphics card.

dav · Apr 22, 2005, 10:45 AM

3ghz would be nice, but i'm guessing they'll quietly introduce the minor bump next week.

power142 · Apr 22, 2005, 01:32 PM

Adding only 200MHz but with an additional core would be quite nice though

Big Mac · Apr 22, 2005, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by power142

Adding only 200MHz but with an additional core would be quite nice though

Yeah, but dual core is pretty darn unlikely, according to what we've heard. . .

BZ · Apr 22, 2005, 02:37 PM

I know I must be kidding myself, but I just can't see Apple releasing 2.7Ghz G5s as the top end. That would be such a bummer update a year after they couldn't get to 3Ghz.

The only way it makes sense is if they drop the price of the top end down under $2500, raise the RAM, a better video card.

BZ

osxisfun · Apr 22, 2005, 02:43 PM

wouldn't dual cores warrent a bigger press splash?

If they come out next tues...

Loren_ · Apr 22, 2005, 02:55 PM

Well the rumor is that Apple will release a quad 2.5 Ghz machine with a liquid helium cooled core.

badtz · Apr 22, 2005, 06:18 PM

processor speeds isn't my main concern @ all.

I'm more concerned about new technologies!

PCIe, Dual Layer DVD+-RW (or BluRay, lol I doubt it), 3 HD spaces, etc.

chris v · Apr 22, 2005, 07:08 PM

Originally Posted by Loren_

Well the rumor is that Apple will release a quad 2.5 Ghz machine with a liquid helium cooled core.

Right, Mr. Meador.

GSixZero · Apr 22, 2005, 07:21 PM

Here's my prediction:
Single 2.0 512 RAM, 80GB HD, GeForce 5200, $1499
Dual 2.0, 512 RAM, 160GB HD, ATI Radeon 9600 XT $1999
Dual 2.5, 512 RAM, 160GB HD, ATI Radeon 9600 XT $2499
Quad 3.0, 1 GB RAM, 250GB HD, ATI Radeon 9600 XT $3299

testudo · Apr 22, 2005, 07:48 PM

Originally Posted by badtz

processor speeds isn't my main concern @ all.

I'm more concerned about new technologies!

PCIe, Dual Layer DVD+-RW (or BluRay, lol I doubt it), 3 HD spaces, etc.

Here! Here! 3GHz might allow apple to save a little face, but after a year if all they can do is bump RAM, bump the video card (the default for a pro machine, except high-end, is that nVidia 5200?????), drop the price a little, it will be a huge disappointment, and I think cause for even yet another stock price plunge. Refreshes to the line are fine for the first 6 months, even OK for the first year, but we've been looking at the current PowerMac line for 2 years now.

Of course, its only the computer industry. Its not like they make big technological advances monthly in this sector.

Salsa · Apr 22, 2005, 08:36 PM

Originally Posted by testudo

Here! Here! 3GHz might allow apple to save a little face, but after a year if all they can do is bump RAM, bump the video card (the default for a pro machine, except high-end, is that nVidia 5200?????), drop the price a little, it will be a huge disappointment, and I think cause for even yet another stock price plunge. Refreshes to the line are fine for the first 6 months, even OK for the first year, but we've been looking at the current PowerMac line for 2 years now.

Of course, its only the computer industry. Its not like they make big technological advances monthly in this sector.

I agree that an 8% speed bump would be a big disappointment after waiting so long for an update. I think a typical bump would be closer to 20% and it would come after only six months. We've been waiting a year now, so we should have two speed bumps.

On the other hand, I'm not sure the stock price would tank on the announcement. The rumors of a disappointing announcement appear to already be factored in the stock price and was probably a factor in the recent stock price tumbles.

If IBM doesn't have a 3GHz chip, then Apple can't use it, but what I don't understand is why doesn't Apple just throw more chips into the high end machine and make it a quad 2.7, or whatever.

Eriamjh · Apr 22, 2005, 09:10 PM

I would just be happy if the dual 2.7s help drop the price of new or refurbed dual 2.5s closer to $1999. I'd buy one of those...

spatterson · Apr 22, 2005, 11:04 PM

And how about a CD/DVD burner that can burn labels?

jtwiskowski · Apr 23, 2005, 02:41 AM

Originally Posted by spatterson

And how about a CD/DVD burner that can burn labels?

What do you think this is ... WINDOWS???

lol

It is just funny that we are all demanding more power, and you come along with ... "maybe they will let us print stickers for our blank media."

paulc · Apr 23, 2005, 08:20 AM

I find it highly ironic that they seem to be devoting a lot of resources into high-end, pro, expensive software. Yet the machines that one must have to run this stuff seems to be somewhat languishing. Notice how far down PowerMac sales were amidst all the good new last week?

We've been talking dual core for quite a while now, but those other guys started talking much later and are delivering the goods now. And remember, it's going to be 2 years since a 3G part was promised if they don't bump them to 3G soon.

I'd actually be very happy to see it stay at 2.7G IF they use the 970GX, the chip that supposedly runs a lot cooler (and thus wouldn't need the liquid cooling apparatus).

I had targeted this next bump for a new machine... but if they are the same-old, same-old (i.e. no PCIe, no cooler running chips, no standard ATi X800-XT) it seems they bloody well gotta drop the prices.

Commodus · Apr 23, 2005, 09:43 AM

Methinks the impending update is mainly to tide people over until the 970MP is truly ready. After all, Apple Expo Paris is roughly 6 months away.

paulc · Apr 23, 2005, 09:55 AM

That's essentially my disappointment... that this "bump" is merely a "tide-over." 970MP and 970GX I believe haven't even been "officially announced" by IBM. Which is why I speculated price drops.

One issue there is that when really new machines comes out, will pricing raise? i.e. a dual 2.7 priced at 2800... does it go back up to 3 grand when a machine with some new technology emerges?

hldan · Apr 23, 2005, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by jtwiskowski

What do you think this is ... WINDOWS???

lol

It is just funny that we are all demanding more power, and you come along with ... "maybe they will let us print stickers for our blank media."

I don't think that was a Windows type of request. Lacie makes a fantastic external dual layer DVD burner with lightscribe for Macintosh. This is the area where I have to say that Apple lags is the DVD burners. The PowerMacs were the first in the industry to incorporate DVD burning in a home computer and it wasn't even thought of for Windows machines until 2 years later. Now Windows computers have built-in DVD burners with far more capabilities than the even the PowerMacs.
Apple needs a dual layer burner in the PowerMacs and the lightscribe technology would be very welcome.(Although I think HP has a patent on that technology). The dual layer feature is just a slight waste at this point of any computer since it will cost more than buying an actual DVD to fully use this feature but Apple needs to give these extras for the consumer.
Another thing the PowerMacs need are much larger HD's. I was at CompUSA last week and there were 2 Sony Vaio desktops, one with a 320GB HD and one with 500GB (2x250GB) installed from the factory probably for the media center features.
I know it's overkill to have that much but to the consumer it's a real eye grabber.
Apple's computers would sell a lot more if they incorporate cheaper components that really won't make a difference like cheaper ram and cheaper hard drives and possibly cheaper motherboards.
OSX and Unix would still perform beautifully with lower cost components.

hldan · Apr 23, 2005, 12:15 PM

Originally Posted by paulc

That's essentially my disappointment... that this "bump" is merely a "tide-over." 970MP and 970GX I believe haven't even been "officially announced" by IBM. Which is why I speculated price drops.

One issue there is that when really new machines comes out, will pricing raise? i.e. a dual 2.7 priced at 2800... does it go back up to 3 grand when a machine with some new technology emerges?

Actually new features and faster machines always get a price drop to attract customers. In year 2003 Rev A 17" Powerbook 1Ghz, 1x Superdrive, USB1.1 and 60Gb HD was $3299 U.S.

Now 2005 Rev D 17" Powerbook ships with 1.67Ghz 8x Superdrive USB 2.0 Bluetooth 2.0 100GB 5400RPM HD and 128MB GPU and it drives the 30" cinema display all for $2699.

spatterson · Apr 23, 2005, 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by jtwiskowski

What do you think this is ... WINDOWS???

lol

It is just funny that we are all demanding more power, and you come along with ... "maybe they will let us print stickers for our blank media."

Well being that I am a Graphics Design student, and am constantly burning DVD's and CD's for my projects... I would like to see Apple incorporate the lightscribe technology, just to make my work look for professional. Apple has always incorporated new technologies before other PC manufactures, and this is one area that they are lagging in.

osxisfun · Apr 23, 2005, 01:21 PM

i might have been drunk at the time but i swear i read that as part of the hp ipod deal , apple got the rights to add hp's lightscribe type tech to apple products...

its been a while so i do not know why it has not happened yet. maybe steve is saving it for the BIG g5 upgrade.

but then again, i might have been drunk.

testudo · Apr 23, 2005, 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by Commodus

Methinks the impending update is mainly to tide people over until the 970MP is truly ready. After all, Apple Expo Paris is roughly 6 months away.

Well, at least Apple won't have to worry about any types of production problems, because the only ones buying these computers will be those who HAVE to or NEED to buy one. Apple just doesn't seem to have any intelligence anymore about what people want/expect in computers. It seems to me that, in their mind, they feel that they need to wait to add any new features to their computers until they come up with the whole next chips to use. So, until IBM can get some dual-core chips into production, or some cooler running next-gen G5s (sorry, I don't keep up with all the chip-crap names like 970FX or what-not to know what IBM has up its sleeves), Apple is content to sit with their current computer line-up, maybe slapping in more memory or a slightly faster chip and saying "Look, we've got a new computer!". At least they had excuses with the G4s they had (FSB bottlenecks, that kind of thing). I mean, what's the hold-up on PCI-Express? You can get a $600 Dell system with a PCI-express slot, and with Apple, well, first you need to spend $1500 just to get a mac with a video slot.

Here's an idea, Apple. If you can't get better chips from IBM, then at least upgrade the rest of the computer with CURRENT technology to give people a reason to buy them. Because all you're doing now is giving them reason to wait even longer.

Then again, my guess is Apple knows that they are completely inept at this (20 years of making overpriced/underpowered/low-featured computers!), and why they've announced that they no longer will be breaking out their sales numbers by product. THey don't want the analysts to know they're selling only 40,000 powermacs next quarter.

OK, enough ranting. Guess my frustration is growing because I finally got the money and nearly the time to buy a new mac, and all I'm seeing is basically getting the same computer that was available two years ago (OK, its cheaper, but that's about it).

Al G · Apr 23, 2005, 05:45 PM

The same as Apple is at the mercy of IBM for their CPUs, they're at the mercy of the GPU makers for Mac versions of PCI-express video cards. If ATI and Nvidia don't have them ready for the Mac, they don't have them ready. No one is going to buy a Mac with PCI-express if there are no video cards to put in it.

askunk · Apr 23, 2005, 08:21 PM

http://www.apple.com.au/promo/lacie_lightscribe/

askunk · Apr 23, 2005, 08:23 PM

According to the link above, Lightscribe is already implemented in MacOS:

System Requirements :
Mac
Hardware: Power Mac G4 500 Mhz; 256MB RAM
Single Layer recording: Mac OS 9.1 and 10.1.2 or later
Double Layer recording: 10.2.3 or later
LightScribe Printing: 10.3.2 or later

the_glassman · Apr 23, 2005, 09:26 PM

Don't you need some kind of software to use Litescribe? As far as I know there isn't any for OS X.

testudo · Apr 23, 2005, 09:53 PM

Originally Posted by Al G

The same as Apple is at the mercy of IBM for their CPUs, they're at the mercy of the GPU makers for Mac versions of PCI-express video cards. If ATI and Nvidia don't have them ready for the Mac, they don't have them ready. No one is going to buy a Mac with PCI-express if there are no video cards to put in it.

PCI Express cards exist. They don't need to re-invent the wheel, they just need to manufacture drivers and perhaps some updated firmware for the freakin' things, although I'm pretty sure the firmware is platform independent. And if Apple wants PCI-Express video cards and drivers, they just have to order them, for crying out loud. I'm not talking about the lack of 3rd-party cards for mac (which there are, compared to the PC offerings), but OEM cards. You really think either company is going to say "No" to an order of some 200,000 video cards?

VisorMan · Apr 23, 2005, 09:55 PM

how much is g5 right now?

hldan · Apr 24, 2005, 01:09 AM

Originally Posted by askunk

According to the link above, Lightscribe is already implemented in MacOS:

System Requirements :
Mac
Hardware: Power Mac G4 500 Mhz; 256MB RAM
Single Layer recording: Mac OS 9.1 and 10.1.2 or later
Double Layer recording: 10.2.3 or later
LightScribe Printing: 10.3.2 or later

Um, huh? that link is for the Lacie external Dual layer DVD burner with Lightscribe and the Lightsribe will only work in 10.3.2 or later. The burner is made to be used with the Macintosh. The lightcribe technology won't work inside the Mac using the Superdrive.

finchna · Apr 24, 2005, 05:17 PM

Originally Posted by the_glassman

Don't you need some kind of software to use Litescribe? As far as I know there isn't any for OS X.

I own one of the drives--they do have OSX softare. The link below will get you to LaCie's site infomation related to the drives--you can see the Mac requirements there.

Click here for lightscribe information

DeathMan · Apr 24, 2005, 09:25 PM

those light scribe things seem gimmicky to me. I'd just as soon turn in a blank (for school) or make my own label in color.

hldan · Apr 24, 2005, 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by DeathMan

those light scribe things seem gimmicky to me. I'd just as soon turn in a blank (for school) or make my own label in color.

It would be nice for Apple build the lightscribe burner into the PowerMac. The only problem is you have to buy specific media to use it so it may be better just to make labels from paper.

Al G · Apr 25, 2005, 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by testudo

PCI Express cards exist. They don't need to re-invent the wheel, they just need to manufacture drivers and perhaps some updated firmware for the freakin' things, although I'm pretty sure the firmware is platform independent. And if Apple wants PCI-Express video cards and drivers, they just have to order them, for crying out loud. I'm not talking about the lack of 3rd-party cards for mac (which there are, compared to the PC offerings), but OEM cards. You really think either company is going to say "No" to an order of some 200,000 video cards?

AGP and PCI video cards have never been platform independent so why would you expect PCI-e cards to be?

They won't say no to a large order, but it takes time to develop and test firmware and drivers and they might say "We'll get around to it after we're done with our order of 10 times that many cards for the PC."

If making firmware and drivers for Mac video cards were easy and profitable then everybody would be doing it. But there's a reason why there are no Mac video cards from Xtasy, Sapphire, Gainward, Leadtek, etc.