[akrap35]

I've already purchased four 128MB PC100 Dimms with a ATA133 EDIE card and a 7200RPM-80GB-Segate. I've also got my hands on a ATI Raedon 9200 Mac edition video card. The only thing I have left to upgrade would be the processor and since I've heard against going the G4 Sonnet route due to the lowering of the bus speed to 66Mhz I've hit an impass.

I won't be using may applications that require the velocity engine on the G4's but I will be using Garageband which I've heard doesn't work well with G3. I guess my question just boils down to would lower preformance in Garageband be offset by the G3 Powerlogix 1.1ghz ZFI supeior preformance in everything else? Would I really notice that much of a difference if I went with the G4 Sonnect instead?

[zacharydz]

I'm not sure if that machine is going to be powerful enough to satisfactorily run GarageBand. I have a sawtooth with a 1.4 Ghz G4, 1.38 GB of RAM, and a 8Mb cache HD, and I can only do about 1 instrument real time (forget the correct term for garageband).

[OreoCookie]

Garageband does need a lot of cpu horsepower to playback certain instruments in real-time. For normal applications, a G3 upgraded BW G3 will be faster than one with a G4. But I feel your machine will be barely able to run Garageband in either case. If you have that specific app in mind, you might want to think about investing money into a new computer.

[Mac Hammer Fan]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie

Garageband does need a lot of cpu horsepower to playback certain instruments in real-time. For normal applications, a G3 upgraded BW G3 will be faster than one with a G4. But I feel your machine will be barely able to run Garageband in either case. If you have that specific app in mind, you might want to think about investing money into a new computer.

Read this and think twice before you upgrade with Powerlogix.
Sonnet, OWC and Daystar have much better reviews.
However, their upgrades seem not as fast. (and Sonnet G4 1 Ghz reduces the bus speed)
http://forums.macnn.com/65/mac-desktops/290839/problems-with-a-powerlogix-1ghz-zif/
And read the www.xlr8yourmac.com database (search for Powerlogix) if you are still not convinced...
http://forums.xlr8yourmac.com/cpureview.lasso

[akrap35]

Well, from the benches I've seen located here. http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/G3CARDS/G...ew/index3.html

A G4 1GHZ Sonnet upgrade can run 7 instruments. Granted I also swaped the 4 128MB dimms for 4 256MB dimms to get my total up to 1GB. I've read many guides and reviews where people claim upgrading the B&W's actually turn out pretty well. Granted I had to spend a pretty penny for the upgrades but it still comes out cheaper for me than buying a new mac. I'm trying to get a G4 Digital Audio barebones out of the surplus shop at the university(UK) where I work but so far that's has happend. I think I'm going to go ahead and go with either the 700MHZ,800MHZ or 1000MHZ G4 Sonnet upgrade it all really depends on what I can come up with for the proccessor upgrade.

[OreoCookie]

Do a search in these forums. Consensus seems to be that the G3 upgrades are for most intents and purposes actually faster than G4 upgrades.

Also, the number of tracks garageband can play depends crucially on the complexity of the instrument. There are some benchmarks which use particularly complex Garageband instruments: a dual 1 GHz MDD G4 can only play 6 tracks simultaneously. A friend of mine had problems with four on a 1 GHz PowerBook G4. I really doubt you can run 7 instruments on your upgraded Mac later on.

[chris v]

Save your pennies and get something newer, if you want to run audio. Seriously. Garage Band chokes on my Daughter's 800 MZ iMac G4, and is barely acceptable on my Powerbook 1.25 G4.

Logic Express might be a better choice if you can afford it, as it's more highly optimized than Garage Band.

Whatever you get, you'd really do best to get something with SATA for the hard drive, and dual processors.

[akrap35]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie

Do a search in these forums. Consensus seems to be that the G3 upgrades are for most intents and purposes actually faster than G4 upgrades.

Also, the number of tracks garageband can play depends crucially on the complexity of the instrument. There are some benchmarks which use particularly complex Garageband instruments: a dual 1 GHz MDD G4 can only play 6 tracks simultaneously. A friend of mine had problems with four on a 1 GHz PowerBook G4. I really doubt you can run 7 instruments on your upgraded Mac later on.

When I play I rarely use any effects and if I was going to I would use stomp boxes. I record all my bass parts clean and vocals as well. I want Garageband mainly for the mixing/editing portion. Maybe a few after effects here and there. I'm still leaning toward the G4 due it's better theoritcal preformance with garageband and iLife.

Are there any dual cpu upgrades for the G3 Powermacs? I may have a sata drive laying around here. But the EDIE drive I bought was a very nice drive. I can't rember the specs now but it was ATA 133 - 72000RPM and 8MB cache. I have been working with windows based PCs for along time now and I personally don't notice that much of an improvment from ATA133 to ATA150. This could be different in Mac's, but I dont' know because I'm a complete noob when it comes to Mac's. I have some OS experience but that was in gradeschool.

[Mac Hammer Fan]

Originally Posted by kuys

When I play I rarely use any effects and if I was going to I would use stomp boxes. I record all my bass parts clean and vocals as well. I want Garageband mainly for the mixing/editing portion. Maybe a few after effects here and there. I'm still leaning toward the G4 due it's better theoritcal preformance with garageband and iLife.

Are there any dual cpu upgrades for the G3 Powermacs? I may have a sata drive laying around here. But the EDIE drive I bought was a very nice drive. I can't rember the specs now but it was ATA 133 - 72000RPM and 8MB cache. I have been working with windows based PCs for along time now and I personally don't notice that much of an improvment from ATA133 to ATA150. This could be different in Mac's, but I dont' know because I'm a complete noob when it comes to Mac's. I have some OS experience but that was in gradeschool.

Unfortunately, there are no dual G4 CPU upgrades for G3 PowerMacs. There have been some in the past, but now they are sold out. And ther were only 2 x 500 MHz as far as I can remember.
Best solution is to buy a real Dual AGP G4 Tower in this case or a Mac Mini.
Don't waste your money on upgrading a G3 with slow PCI video.
Even an 1.1 Ghz Powerlogix (if it is not defective ) can't run Garageband very well and doesn't run some applications at all, such as iDVD (see reviews) and the Sonnet G4 1 Ghz' speed is reduced by the slow bus speed and slower cache.

[Lateralus]

I don't remember there ever being a Dual-CPU upgrade for the Power Mac G3s.

[Mac Hammer Fan]

Originally Posted by Lateralus

I don't remember there ever being a Dual-CPU upgrade for the Power Mac G3s.

Here's the link;
http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/G4CARDS/X..._G4_500MP.html

[OreoCookie]

Originally Posted by kuys

When I play I rarely use any effects and if I was going to I would use stomp boxes. I record all my bass parts clean and vocals as well. I want Garageband mainly for the mixing/editing portion. Maybe a few after effects here and there. I'm still leaning toward the G4 due it's better theoritcal preformance with garageband and iLife.

It's not for effects, just complex instruments. I hate to repeat myself, but I think you will only be able to run Garageband barely with your system.

Originally Posted by kuys

Are there any dual cpu upgrades for the G3 Powermacs?.

None are sold now nor do they make sense for someone in your situation. Instead buying a Mac mini or a used G4 tower are by far the more sensible options.

Originally Posted by kuys

I may have a sata drive laying around here. But the EDIE drive I bought was a very nice drive. I can't rember the specs now but it was ATA 133 - 72000RPM and 8MB cache. I have been working with windows based PCs for along time now and I personally don't notice that much of an improvment from ATA133 to ATA150. This could be different in Mac's, but I dont' know because I'm a complete noob when it comes to Mac's. I have some OS experience but that was in gradeschool.

No, for your machine and your applications, it wouldn't make a difference. Especially if you have a small 80 GB drive.

[©öñFü$íóÑ]

intel-Mac Mini is the way to go, imho...... but since you've upgraded your computer by that much (omg).... well, i guess if you're content with whatever performance you get out of Garageband after upgrading, well, congrats to ya.

if not, well... i hate to say it, but it's best to keep in mind that if you want to primarily run software that'll be made 4-5 years from now (the B&W G3 is about that many years old already), it's best to just get a new machine, altogether.

however, if you just want to run your older apps faster or with more stability, and only occassionally run 1 or 2 of the newest apps, then it just makes sense to upgrade..... especially if all your peripherals work well with the current machine setup.

[OreoCookie]

Originally Posted by ©öñFü$íóÑ

intel-Mac Mini is the way to go, imho...... but since you've upgraded your computer by that much (omg).... well, i guess if you're content with whatever performance you get out of Garageband after upgrading, well, congrats to ya.

Plus you get iLife for free, another 79 reasons not to upgrade. I think might be the best option available.

[akrap35]

I've decided to not purchase a major cpu upgrade and just give this G3 to my girlfriend to use while I piece together a G4 Upgrade. I found a G4 700MHZ Sonnet that I'm going to drop in for around $89. I've only actually spent around $300 on upgrades for the B&W so far.

I really don't want a mac mini and the power mac g5's are too much. What would be the best G4 barebones to buy for a base? Digital audio with the 133 bus speed? Any suggestions are welcome. Remember I'm looking for something that will run Garageband well. I was thinking of actually just building a Intel based system and installing OSX on it, and I'm not a big intel fan. I've haven't really fleshed out that idea yet but I'm comparing prices right now. I'd much rather go for the True G4 upgrade just for nostalgia's sake.

[OreoCookie]

Originally Posted by kuys

I really don't want a mac mini and the power mac g5's are too much. What would be the best G4 barebones to buy for a base? Digital audio with the 133 bus speed? Any suggestions are welcome. Remember I'm looking for something that will run Garageband well. I was thinking of actually just building a Intel-based system and installing OSX on it, and I'm not a big intel fan. I've haven't really fleshed out that idea yet but I'm comparing prices right now. I'd much rather go for the True G4 upgrade just for nostalgia's sake.

Just a piece of advice, most of us (including me) had to learn the hard way: take all costs into consideration. You said, you've spent over $300 on upgrades for the BW G3, which would have been closer to $400 if you had taken the cpu upgrade you originally wanted to put in. Add 79 squids for iLife and you end up with the money you could almost get a mini for -- which would have been faster than the upgraded BW G3.

All I'm trying to say is that you should consider all the costs of a particular setup and the real-world performance you can expect from that configuration. And be nostalgic only if you can/want to afford it

[akrap35]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie

Just a piece of advice, most of us (including me) had to learn the hard way: take all costs into consideration. You said, you've spent over $300 on upgrades for the BW G3, which would have been closer to $400 if you had taken the cpu upgrade you originally wanted to put in. Add 79 squids for iLife and you end up with the money you could almost get a mini for -- which would have been faster than the upgraded BW G3.

All I'm trying to say is that you should consider all the costs of a particular setup and the real-world performance you can expect from that configuration. And be nostalgic only if you can/want to afford it

I apreciate the advice but again I'll pass on the mac mini. If you have anything relevant to say about the G4 base system to buy please let me know. Same goes with the IntelMac clone capable of running OSX well. Otherwise I can do with out the buy this buy that advice when it comes to buying a mac mini or Imac neither fit what I want to do. I plan on buying the G4 in pieces and building it myself. I plan on really putting some money into it. I've been looking at the Digital Audio G4 and since it's AGP I have many more options when it comes to video cards. With the mac mini and iMac it's useless. And since you can't buy a G5 in peices I don't want to go that route. I've been looking at the dual 1.8ghz sonnet CPU upgrade and the full possible 1.5GB of ram. I'll also add a SATA controller and a few SATA drives. I don't see how that system though it will cost me a little bit should run Garageband and most all other OSX apps well, no?

[chris v]

You'd spend more doing all that than you'd spend on a refurbed dual 1.8 G5. And it wouldn't work as well. but whatever floats your boat.

The B&W G3 is a complete waste of time though, for any sort of serious audio work.

[Mac Hammer Fan]

Originally Posted by chris v

You'd spend more doing all that than you'd spend on a refurbed dual 1.8 G5. And it wouldn't work as well. but whatever floats your boat.

The B&W G3 is a complete waste of time though, for any sort of serious audio work.

I can confirm this, I have a Dual G5 1.8 and it is great for audio.
When I wanted to upgrade my old G3, it was only for some basic DTP and internet.
But even when you compare it to the new low end macs, it was a complete waste of money.
This Dual G5 was even a lot faster than a Dual G4 1.25, which I didn't keep long because of the noisy fans.
And this G4 Dual 1.25 was already much faster than my brother's Sawtooth G4 AGP 400 upgraded with a 1.2 Ghz Sonnet card.

[akrap35]

Originally Posted by chris v

You'd spend more doing all that than you'd spend on a refurbed dual 1.8 G5. And it wouldn't work as well. but whatever floats your boat.

The B&W G3 is a complete waste of time though, for any sort of serious audio work.

Really and links on the Refurbished G5's?

I'm going to just use the B&W for basic stuff and besides I have many other older based systems that can use both the 9200 and PC100 ram I bought so I don't really consider it a loss.

[akrap35]

Originally Posted by Mac Hammer Fan

I can confirm this, I have a Dual G5 1.8 and it is great for audio.
When I wanted to upgrade my old G3, it was only for some basic DTP and internet.
But even when you compare it to the new low end macs, it was a complete waste of money.
This Dual G5 was even a lot faster than a Dual G4 1.25, which I didn't keep long because of the noisy fans.
And this G4 Dual 1.25 was already much faster than my brother's Sawtooth G4 AGP 400 upgraded with a 1.2 Ghz Sonnet card.

Looks like I'm going with a Refurbed G5. Any relevent links to the aforementioned would be great.

[chris v]

Originally Posted by kuys

Looks like I'm going with a Refurbed G5. Any relevent links to the aforementioned would be great.

Just keep your eye on this page. Different models come and go daily.