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Coffee1970 · Oct 15, 2006, 08:54 PM

Hello, and thanks for reading.

Have a PC...an HP 4.0ghz Celeron with 512MB, etc, etc.

Want to get a Mac, most likely a PowerMac G4, because of cost and upgrading if need be in the future.

Will be taking graphics classes...do not know if they use macs or not, but we all know that many in the industry do, so would like to get one and play around with Adobe, etc, etc.

Will buy from eBay.....what to get?

Dual 500's are cheap.
Dual 800 little higher
933 or 1ghz can be had for under 400

What do I need to look for in terms of graphics cards?

Should I just get a G4 and upgrade little at a time when money is available?

How about a super cheapo Sawtooth G4 400?

Want to run Tiger as well...not worried about Leopard yet! :o)

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks, Brian.

mduell · Oct 15, 2006, 09:04 PM

You have a PC that doesn't exist. Interesting. Anyway, moving right along.

Seriously, how about a Mac mini? As soons Photoshop goes native (late this year or early next) it will be faster than most (all?) of the G4 upgrades. Grab a big Firewire drive for storage and scratch.
I just don't see the need for a big pro tower that old.

Coffee1970 · Oct 15, 2006, 09:16 PM

Whooops! Typing in the dark again, ugh!

3GHZ Celeron.

Mac Mini...thought about...but graphics could suck, no upgrading anything either.

Also, will not buy new versions of these programs...cost way too much...just want to use older versions I buy used.

want to spend as little as possible starting off...Money is TIGHT

brokenjago · Oct 15, 2006, 09:27 PM

You have older versions of Photoshop for the Macintosh?

Oh, that you buy used. Right.

discotronic · Oct 15, 2006, 09:36 PM

Originally Posted by brokenjago

You have older versions of Photoshop for the Macintosh?

Oh, that you buy used. Right.

You shouldn't make assumptions about people. Not everybody needs to buy new software and not everybody pirates software.

mduell · Oct 15, 2006, 09:39 PM

Originally Posted by Coffee1970

Whooops! Typing in the dark again, ugh!

3GHZ Celeron.

Mac Mini...thought about...but graphics could suck, no upgrading anything either.

Also, will not buy new versions of these programs...cost way too much...just want to use older versions I buy used.

want to spend as little as possible starting off...Money is TIGHT

Photoshop doesn't use the graphics card; GMA950 is fine for Photoshop. Aside from the graphics card, all of the usually upgradable items are there: CPU, RAM, hard disk, and optical disk.
The older versions will still run pretty well in Rosetta. And you can usually get a pretty good student discount on the Adobe apps.

If you need to, buy a used or refurb G4 mini instead of Intel. The CPU isn't upgradeable, but for the price of a decent G4 upgrade you can buy the whole Core Duo Mac mini in the future.

jamil5454 · Oct 15, 2006, 10:06 PM

Originally Posted by Coffee1970

Whooops! Typing in the dark again, ugh!

3GHZ Celeron.

Mac Mini...thought about...but graphics could suck, no upgrading anything either.

Also, will not buy new versions of these programs...cost way too much...just want to use older versions I buy used.

want to spend as little as possible starting off...Money is TIGHT

If I were you, I'd stick with the PC for a while until you have more funds to spend on a Mac + CS3 when it's released. All of the Adobe apps are pretty much exactly the same on a PC as they are on a Mac, so you'll still learn the software while saving your money at the same time. A 3Ghz Celeron isn't that bad for the older versions of the Adobe apps, and 512MB will work but ideally you should upgrade to at least a gig or more.

CS3 should be out within 8 months, if not sooner, and Leopard will be out around the same time if not earlier. That will be the perfect time to get a Mac for graphics work.

idyll · Oct 16, 2006, 03:33 AM

No reason to go Mac yet, stick with the PC.. Save a bit more loot and get a Mac later. Programs are pretty much the same and you won't be lost on a Mac if you need to use one at school or anything

Coffee1970 · Oct 16, 2006, 05:50 AM

I always thought that the Mac was the industry standard for graphics people, but maybe not so much anymore? I bought my HP instead of the mac mini at the time because, get this....

HP Celeron, 512MB, 140GB HD, LIghtscribe/DVD burner, media card reader
$399.00

If you buy the HP printer and 17" monitor to go with it...everything costs $379.00!!!

I know, I know...I saved 20.00 and got the printer and monitor for free, weird huh?
Best Buy was having a big sale...too goofy to pass up. Works well, but the graphics stink.

I have not yet go the adobe programs or anything yet, thought could buy used off eBay or something...yeah, I know you can get these pirated. Nice to buy full legal versions though, some pride goes along with it that you support a good company.

Thanks everyone, gave me something to think on.
Brian.

webmonkie · Oct 16, 2006, 06:16 AM

I would also recommend a Mac Mini.

The best Monitor you can afford (maybe a 17-Inch dell).
Then dump all your money into memory (the more the better).

In a side note. I just got back into school after a 6 years hiatus and I was surprise to see the new iMac 2GHz machine replacing the G5 2GHz desktops. I guess from a budget point of view the iMac's give you more for your money.

PowerPc = Pwnage · Oct 16, 2006, 09:25 AM

My School uses mac minis for photoshop Cs2 (core duo) and maxed out ram! It still runs slower than my powerbook! If you want top performance for photoshop now, get something with powerpc. Apps that use rosetta are slower because they are not native.

polendo · Oct 16, 2006, 10:47 AM

I would keep the PC, besides that HP most probably has a PCIE slot for graphics upgrading (in case you are still interested in replacing you current graphics). Sincerely, I think your Celeron in terms of speed is fast under Windows XP. Regarding the software (either pc or mac) check with your school if you get a good price from them.

If you still believe you could be better off under OSX, I would definetly buy something with Intel. Those G4's IMHO do not have too much future left in regards of compatibility & support with new software for OSX.

brokenjago · Oct 16, 2006, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by discotronic

You shouldn't make assumptions about people. Not everybody needs to buy new software and not everybody pirates software.

I wasn't making any assumptions. I just thought it odd that someone who had used PCs his entire life had a copy of Photoshop for Macintosh lying around. Obviously he didn't, and I corrected my post.

I think you're the one making assumptions here.

olePigeon · Oct 16, 2006, 02:08 PM

If you're taking a Graphic Design class, it's almost certain they'll have at least a few Macs. While Windows has made leaps and bounds in graphic design, it's still a very Mac-centric industry. You'll even occasionally find printers who will only deal with files generated on a Mac. In any event, I would wager your campus has at least 1 Mac lab you can use.

I think the advice given is sound. Hold onto you PC until CS3 comes out.

However, 8 months seems like a long time (especially since your Design class will be over by then), so if you're anxious to give it a whirl, here're my suggestions:

1. Keep it under $200, don't spend any real money, especially if you're going to be buying an Intel Mac later on with CS3. Check eBay and Craig's List.

2. Anything with a G4, put lots of RAM in it. It doesn't have to be super fast if it's a G4. AltiVec is your friend on PowerPC based Macs, Photoshop will fly on pretty much any G4 Mac.

3. A QuartzExtreme capable video card. You can probably find a low-end one fore cheap. This is mostly just for OS X so it doesn't hog your precious CPU cycles for Photoshop.

I would recommend any AGP based "Graphite" G4 tower. I see the lower-end versions regularly on eBay for under $100. I think it'd be fine just to get your feet wet. Dual CPUs would be very handy in this situation, but remember, keep it cheap.

OT: Not to mention that whatever you buy your G4 for, 8 months later, you can probably re-sell it on eBay for that same price.

Macs are very good at retaining resale value.

MattJeff · Oct 16, 2006, 02:54 PM

wow i have a 800mhz imac w/ 512 and it runs photoshop(not cs2)well.
And 3Ghz is not fast w/ photoshop???

i say if your looking at price then mac mini and new photoshop, fo sho(and a dell Display, 20 inchr). you wont regret it. a tower is a waste, if you buy an old one its slow, if you buy it new and its one mother of a price.

Coffee1970 · Oct 17, 2006, 05:06 AM

Thank ya, thank ya very much
(in a bad Elvis voice)

bleee · Oct 17, 2006, 03:20 PM

Originally Posted by PowerPc = Pwnage

My School uses mac minis for photoshop Cs2 (core duo) and maxed out ram! It still runs slower than my powerbook! If you want top performance for photoshop now, get something with powerpc. Apps that use rosetta are slower because they are not native.

The thing that kills the mini is the extremely slow harddrive and the crappy video card but its more the harddrive.

PowerPc = Pwnage · Oct 17, 2006, 04:09 PM

When you use photoshop, the only time you are accessing the hard drive is opening it and saving your work, right? Not actually editing it, which is still slow.

olePigeon · Oct 17, 2006, 04:41 PM

Originally Posted by PowerPc = Pwnage

When you use photoshop, the only time you are accessing the hard drive is opening it and saving your work, right? Not actually editing it, which is still slow.

You'll want to have as much memory as you can to avoid swapping on the HDD. Unfortunately, I think one of the longest gripes about Photoshop is that it can only use 2GBs of RAM. I think CS2 is now 4GBs of RAM. Anyway, the only time the HDD comes in is your scratch disk or if you run out of RAM.

Moderator · Oct 21, 2006, 05:48 PM

You want my Dual 1GHz G4 mirror door, check the marketplace