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mephit · Feb 5, 2007, 12:01 PM

I have a 1Ghz, single processor G4 MDD (FW800 model) with 1 GB of RAM that won't boot if it's been off for more than about half an hour. It chimes and then brings up the flashing question-mark like it can't find it's internal HD. If I boot to the OSX 10.3 install CD, it shows no ATA bus at all in Disk Utility. The only solution that's so far worked is to leave the machine on with it's flashing icon for about half an hour and then restart. This seems to always work and it then boots fine. I've been having this problem for months, but it's getting longer and longer that I have to leave it warming up before it will boot to the internal drive. Originally it only took about 5 minutes. Once it boots properly, the machine is solid as a rock and never crashes.

I've reset the PRAM and the PMU, I've checked that the ATA cables are seated properly and Disk Utility lists no problems for the drive once the computer remembers it has a drive. The motherboard was replaced under warranty right after we bought the machine but except that and the added RAM, the machine is vanilla.

This is a mission critical machine for our production workflow, so I'd prefer not to have a week or more of it being offsite for repairs, but I'd like to get this fixed if I can since I'm worried it heralds more serious problems down the road. Does anyone have any suggestions? Thanks!

seanc · Feb 5, 2007, 02:38 PM

Keep that drive BACKED UP. To me, it sounds like the drive could be failing, perhaps the motor is taking longer and longer to spin up? I don't know but thats my 2p.

Sherman Homan · Feb 5, 2007, 02:55 PM

The fact that the boot CD doesn't see anything on the ATA bus is really not good. New hard drives aren't that expensive, I would get ready for a melt down...!

BigBadBiologist · Feb 5, 2007, 03:50 PM

Just to confirm it isn't the IDE bus, swap around the primary and secondary channels and see if the problem still happens the same way.

mephit · Feb 6, 2007, 12:10 AM

I can hear the HD spin up as usual when the machine powers up, whether it boots properly or not, so I don't think it's the HD motor. I'm worried that it's the IDE controller failing. I'll try switching the drive to the free connector on the cable, though.

BigBadBiologist · Feb 6, 2007, 12:52 PM

I mean, try plugging the IDE cable going to the CD into the harddrive's IDE channel and vice versa, not just moving the harddrive to the other spot on the cable. Swap channels, not master/slave positions.

mephit · Feb 6, 2007, 03:53 PM

Sorry, my brain went fubar there for a bit. Of course it would require switching to the second controller to eliminate the first controller as a variable. D'Oh! I'll see what happens when I get the time to take the machine down. Things have gotten busy again.

mephit · Feb 26, 2007, 10:57 AM

Well, I finally got the chance to switch the drive to the second ATA controller (there are actually three in this machine). I switched from the primary ATA-100 channel to the secondary ATA-66 channel. No change. It takes forever to boot up at first, and then is rock solid once booted. I've had it running for a week on the second controller. I'm inclined to think that it's the HD, except that DiskWarrior and Disk Utility say there are no problems with the drive and S.M.A.R.T. reports the drive functioning properly. Any other thoughts?

BigBadBiologist · Feb 26, 2007, 11:32 AM

You could try another drive and see if you still have the issue.

mephit · Feb 26, 2007, 11:42 AM

Oh, and I forgot to mention, the machine is set to sleep the drive when possible but the drive spins up fine when woken.

TimmyDee51 · Feb 26, 2007, 01:46 PM

Have you tried zapping the PRAM? Give that a shot. There's two ways to get it done.

1. Hold Apple-Option-P-R when booting. Let the chime sound a few times just to be safe.

2. Hold Apple-Option-O-F when booting. Then type "reset-nvram" and return, then "reset-all" and return.

Also hitting the CUDA/PMU reset on the logic board may help.

mephit · Mar 1, 2007, 10:21 AM

Well, I found an unused 60GB ATA-100 Seagate in an unlabeled box on my supply shelf. Not sure why it was there. I know it came out of one of the PC machines because it had data and two partitions on it. Installed it, wiped it, zeroed it and loaded OSX. Boots fine. In fact, I can't get it to see the other drive at all now. I reset the CUDA again while I was in the case, and I've zapped PRAM again. Looks like the old drive has failed. Now the only problem is, I can't get to the backup of the old drive because the new install of OSX is refusing to see the file server on which the backup resides! Grrr... If it's not one thing, it's another.

Sherman Homan · Mar 1, 2007, 10:27 AM

Do you have the Cable Select, Master or Slave pins in the right places on both drives?

mephit · Mar 1, 2007, 12:53 PM

They are both set to Master/Single Drive and each is on it's own channel.

mephit · Mar 1, 2007, 12:54 PM

Oh, and each is at the master position of their respective channel's cable.

Sherman Homan · Mar 1, 2007, 01:05 PM

Ah, well. It was worth a look.

Waragainstsleep · Mar 1, 2007, 02:07 PM

Maybe if you disconnect the new drive, let it sit on the flashing ? for its required half hour, then reconnect the new drive and see if the old one shows.

mephit · Mar 2, 2007, 10:44 AM

Just for fun, I put both drives on the ATA-100 channel with the old drive as slave and the current drive as master. Still won't see the old drive. I think it's really toast. At least I got to the backup finally. Of course, I'd forgotten to back some things up. D'oh! Oh, well. No one's fault but my own.