[benz]

does the RT5e just support IDE drives while the RTX-400 support SATA drives up to 4x1T?

[benz]

hi, finally we get a " two 3.2GHz quad core, 4 T storage, 4g ram mac pro and RAID card" as our server, but question is :
if i set RAID 5 using all 4 drives ( each 1T), then usable storage space for my data will be as mentioned before : (4-1)x1T = 3T.
but in this configuration, are there any "spare drive" in the computer so that if any one drive fails and will be automatically replace it, or there 'll be no spare drive in the mac pro and i need to replace the failed drive with a new one ASAP even though 1drive cannot be used to store data as from above calculation?

thanks

[OreoCookie]

There is one spare drive (which accounts for the 1 TB in capacity you cannot use). If one drive fails, you should replace it immediately, though.

[benz]

thanks for prompt reply,
sorry but one more question :
says, if all drives in RAID 5 in above configuration are working perfectly smooth and full in storage, and i need to replace 3 new drives, then what 'll happen to my startup volume,e.g. macOS, and relevant softwares? as all these are also stored in the 3 drives that i ve been using ......., do i need to reinstall the whole lots of softwares and macOS again ? or can i copy those files to the " spare drive" before replacing the 3 used ones ?

thanks again

[OreoCookie]

If you want to add different drives, this will break your RAID5, unless you want to restore your system config.

So you cannot replace more than one drive, but even if you replace it with a larger drive, you cannot use the additional capacity in any way. If you remove three drive, then your startup volume (which resides on all 4 disks) won't work any longer and your data is lost unless you pop the old drives back in.

[ninahagen]

I would install one of the 1TB drives, the one you use as you RAID5 backup/rebuild volume, in second opitical bay, connected with a wire harness to a PCIe Card.

Serial Attached SCSI Adapter - ExpressSAS H308 | ATTO Technology

Then I would put a Western digital 150GB Raptor in Bay 1, exclusively for system software & apps.

In bays 2~4 you'd have your main RAID volume.

Hope that helps.

Nina

[mduell]

You don't need a SAS card to put a 1TB drive in the optical bay; in fact, it doesn't help to have one. Just plug the 1TB drive into one of the extra SATA ports on the logic board.

[ninahagen]

Originally Posted by mduell 

Just plug the 1TB drive into one of the extra SATA ports on the logic board.

Oops, thanks Mark that was the wrong link. Here is the right one, for a harness to connect SATA:

NewerTech� eSATA Extender Cable

With this harness, you can connect 6 SATA drives.

How about:

Optical Drive Bay: 150GB Raptor system drive: Only files & apps
Bays 1~4: 4 x 1TB HDs as your main RAID volume
External: 1 x 1TB HD as your RAID5 Rebuild/backup volume

Nina

[benz]

hi, are there any suggestion for an external RAID storage solution for a mac book pro ?
preferably SATA drives ( so need eSATA in a mac book pro and a PCI express card as well), RAID 5, with available storage of ~2T space, as i would like this as a server in addition to the "macpro" config. mentioned above,
well, some mentioned about wiebetech RT5e, but seems it support IDE drive only but not SATA drives.

thanks

[ninahagen]

How did you solve your previous RAID 5 + Mac Pro issue?

[OreoCookie]

The harddrive interface doesn't have an impact on the speed of the RAID.

[SierraDragon]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie 

The harddrive interface doesn't have an impact on the speed of the RAID.

But what we care about is overall speed/throughput, and for that the interface is very important.

-Allen Wicks

[mduell]

Originally Posted by benz 

hi, are there any suggestion for an external RAID storage solution for a mac book pro ?
preferably SATA drives ( so need eSATA in a mac book pro and a PCI express card as well), RAID 5, with available storage of ~2T space, as i would like this as a server in addition to the "macpro" config. mentioned above,
well, some mentioned about wiebetech RT5e, but seems it support IDE drive only but not SATA drives.

Since you only need 2TB, may I suggest RAID01? It allows for much cheaper enclosures and you come out ahead on price even with the extra drive.

I like the Newegg.com - AMS DS-2340SES eSATA VENUS T4S External Enclosure - Retail, although the 5 drive model is only another $50 and allows for a hot spare disk. You'll need to buy a Port Multiplier capable ExpressCard to go with it.

[benz]

"How did you solve your previous RAID 5 + Mac Pro issue?" ---------------

Our mac pro config. is " two 3.2GHz quad core, 4 T storage, 4g ram mac pro and RAID card. " i.e. Jan. 2008 version, i intend to use the fastest CPU available and use all four hard drives bay in mac pro, with the RAID card ( it's an option item), i choose RAID 5 with no spare disc, turn out 2.3T available storage, and also need to create a boot up volume for mac OS, i set it for 100Gb. so there are 2 volumes in the RAID set, i for mac OS and necessary software, and another volume is for data storage, well, the setting is not very difficult, just follow the instruction in " RAID utility" , but need time to build the RAID set, ~6hrs. it works very well. i have chosen using up all 4 drives for RAID set , so leaving none for spare drive, ..
but the new issue is that we want more secure data management for data, so besides disc backup ( we are tired of this), we plan to build another " cheap" server, as we get one more macbook pro here, so plan to connect with external HD RAID set , place it another building other than the mac pro server, use "autorouting" in OsiriX, then once we back up data to mac pro server, it automatically transfer data to the " new server" .
thanks for above advice, i have seen the "Newegg.com - AMS DS-2340SES eSATA VENUS T4S External Enclosure - Retail", but seems just RAID 0, 1, cooling may be issues especially the HDs, and also installation issues as from the user comments in the websites provided" ...

I am looking for wiebetech RT5/ RT5e,as suggsted by moderator, but one basic question to ask:
RT5 just support IDE drive, so shall i choose SATA drives if possible instead? what's dfference between the two?
also as i plan to connect the extrenal RAID set to "mac book pro", i tried a PCI express card for eSATA, but seems not very stable indeed, but for USB transfer it's more stable, any view on this ( eSATA in MAC BOOK PRO?)
or " USB/FW, RAID 5 set/ SATA drives/ macbook pro" a better option than eSATA?

thanks a lot for all advices provided
benz

[OreoCookie]

The difference between PATA (=IDE) and SATA drives is just the interface of the drive, the harddrive is the same. IDE drives are not slower than their SATA version, but IDE drives are getting rare.

Connecting the RAID via USB is pointless, really, really pointless, you'd have to use eSATA to get speeds that justify your investment in a RAID.

[benz]

why is it pointless to use RAID in USB? is it because RAID will further slow down the data transfer rate ?

yes, i plan to use eSATA in mac book pro, but mine (unitek express Card/34mm) in mac book pro seems not very stable, any suggestion? what about Caldigit FASTA -1ex express card?

well, will the IDE drives totally fade off/ difficult to find 2-3yrs later?

benz

[ninahagen]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie 

The difference between PATA (=IDE) and SATA drives is just the interface of the drive, the harddrive is the same. IDE drives are not slower than their SATA version, but IDE drives are getting rare.

Connecting the RAID via USB is pointless, really, really pointless, you'd have to use eSATA to get speeds that justify your investment in a RAID.

Would a PCIe card attached to the RAID give decent results in a Macbook Pro?

[OreoCookie]

If you use a PCIe adapter, all harddrives work at native speed, there'll be no difference if you were to plug it into a Mac Pro, unless the transfer rate exceeds 250 MB/s (which is the limit of PCIe cards on notebooks).

@benz
No, it won't be slower because of the RAID, it'll be slow, because it's USB 2.0. Plus, you cannot have volumes larger than 2 TB with USB 2.0. (That's why there are two different RT5 models, the one with less connections doesn't have this limit as it doesn't have to be compatible with USB 2.0.) Come to think of it, the 2 TB restriction is probably a serious for you.

[ninahagen]

[quote=OreoCookie;3622055]If you use a PCIe adapter, all harddrives work at native speed, there'll be no difference if you were to plug it into a Mac Pro, unless the transfer rate exceeds 250 MB/s (which is the limit of PCIe cards on notebooks).

That was enlightening... thanks.

— So, couldn't this route work as a solution for benz? (PCIe card + external RAID array?

— Also, the increasing rarity of IDE drives would be enough to scare me off the RT5e.

[OreoCookie]

Yes, in principle it'll work on any system with eSATA connectors. You're also right that many large-capacity drives are released only with SATA interface. However, the successor to the RT5e has a SCSI interface.

[SierraDragon]

Originally Posted by benz 

why is it pointless to use RAID in USB? is it because RAID will further slow down the data transfer rate ?

No, it is because USB on Macs is awful, a total bottleneck even for a slow single hard drive. You need eSATA or at least FW800 connection to take real advantage of the throughput benefits of RAID0 arrays. USB 2 has no appropriate usage in Mac hard drive connections if speed matters at all. USB is OK for off-hours slow backup only, but even then buying USB is usually inappropriate because IMO drives should be capable of multiple uses, not just for overnight backup.

Not too that "RAID" means redundant array of independent drives and there are many different RAID configurations, each with radically different performance. "RAID" by itself without descriptive suffix like RAID0, RAID0+1, RAID5, RAID10, etc. is usually incomplete.

-Allen Wicks

[benz]

well, i search in the internet that eSATA external storage systems with RAID 5 for mac book pro is uncommon or very expensive otherwise. one product i see is Caldigit S2vr duo, which claim support eSATA with FASTA-1ex pcie card,

even the S2VR duo just support RAID 0 or 1,

Wiebetech RT5 can support USB, FW or eSATA but only IDE drives
while RT5e just support eSATA though use SATA drives,
moreover, the reseller of wiebetech here in HK seems ignorant and knows nothing about the product and post sale support to the customer, that really scare me !!!!

once again, i am bit worried about the eSATA PCIe card in mac book pro, as mine not very reliable but not sure whether it 's issue of the PCIe card, or the cheap eSATA 2.5inch HD enclosure ?!!

benz

benz