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urrl5201 · Apr 7, 2003, 09:03 PM

Here is my web page complete with a few interesting facts such as emulated CPU speed with Virtual PC using Windows 2000

http://homepage.mac.com/bhardy3/PhotoAlbum34.html

AssassyN · Apr 7, 2003, 09:57 PM

Sweetness!

Congrats & nice pics!

Lt_Core · Apr 7, 2003, 10:22 PM

I'm getting my PB 17" tomorrow. I'm going to install VPC 6 also. How did you run those Virtual PC benchmarks? Thanks!

macndave · Apr 7, 2003, 10:32 PM

Originally posted by Lt_Core:
I'm getting my PB 17" tomorrow. I'm going to install VPC 6 also. How did you run those Virtual PC benchmarks? Thanks!

I would be interested in a step-by-step process for identifying the VPC emulated CPU speed as well. I am runing VPC 6 on a PowerBook 800 and I think it is as fast as my PII 500 at work.

urrl5201 · Apr 8, 2003, 04:40 AM

Go to

My Computer/Control Panel/Administrative Tools/Computer Management/System Information/System Summary

Be sure to move the vertical line spacer to the right (at the top of the Value column) so the column will be wide enough to view all information of your Processor. Good luck.

I received a private message inquiring whether or not it would be a good idea to trade up from a 15" Ghz Ti to the 17". I can only say it depends on what amount you can get for the Ti if you sell it, and how important OS9 is to you. For example, Diskwarrior no longer works on my 17" and although they say an OSX version is in the works, still, the Plus Optimizer software is not included in that version. Bummer. I would rather not use Norton due to a past catastrophy while using it on my 667 DVI.
I guess also you would have to really ask yourself do you really need the 17" or do you simply want it. The 15" Ti is a great machine, and if you have no damaged pixels you are gambling on a pixel free 17". I have one white pixel on the edge of my 17" LCD although I never notice it except during a black screen. Still, I really love this thing. It's even cooler and quieter than my 667 DVI, which was supposed to be arguably the coolest and quietest Ti ever made.

icruise · Apr 8, 2003, 05:06 AM

Do you know if the information listed in the System summary is actually related to the performance of VPC, or is it just something that VPC feeds to windows as the speed of the emulated "processor"? My 12" shows a 533mhz speed, which is 133mhz lower than your score. The 12" is an 867mhz G4, while the 17" is 1ghz, so that's exactly the same difference, but in reality the 17" with its L3 cache should have a bigger performance advantage than the difference megahertz speed alone. So I'm thinking that these are ballpark figures at best, probably just derived from the clockspeed of the powerbook's processor.

I'd be interested to hear what other people's scores are (especially for G3s or slow G4s).

cambro · Apr 8, 2003, 10:11 AM

urrl5201:

Dude, set your iTunes visuals to use OpenGL. You should be getting way more than 30 fps. (I assume you turned off, the default cap at 30 fps option?).

I get >50 (max about 65) fps in full screen visuals on my Ti Ghz. But, for some reason, OpenGL isn't turned on by default. Enabling it makes all the difference in the world.

GeekyJeff · Apr 8, 2003, 10:39 AM

Originally posted by cambro:
urrl5201:

Dude, set your iTunes visuals to use OpenGL. You should be getting way more than 30 fps. (I assume you turned off, the default cap at 30 fps option?).

I get >50 (max about 65) fps in full screen visuals on my Ti Ghz. But, for some reason, OpenGL isn't turned on by default. Enabling it makes all the difference in the world.

How do you enable this?

urrl5201 · Apr 8, 2003, 10:40 AM

Thanks cambro, I did not even know there was such an option. I can't seem to find it.

cambro · Apr 8, 2003, 10:45 AM

Originally posted by urrl5201:
Thanks cambro, I did not even know there was such an option. I can't seem to find it.

Yeah, it is a bit tricky and completely non-intuitive...
First turn full screen visuals off. Then turn them on and they should appear within the iTunes window. When (and only when) you turn them on in this way can you see and access the option button in the upper right of the iTunes window (formally the browse button). Click it to see the options for iTunes visuals (why they just don't put these in preferences is totally beyond me).

I leave mine capped at 30 fps usually, but definitely enable OpenGL.

Karim · Apr 8, 2003, 10:51 AM

Originally posted by Icruise:
Do you know if the information listed in the System summary is actually related to the performance of VPC, or is it just something that VPC feeds to windows as the speed of the emulated "processor"? My 12" shows a 533mhz speed, which is 133mhz lower than your score. The 12" is an 867mhz G4, while the 17" is 1ghz, so that's exactly the same difference, but in reality the 17" with its L3 cache should have a bigger performance advantage than the difference megahertz speed alone. So I'm thinking that these are ballpark figures at best, probably just derived from the clockspeed of the powerbook's processor.

I'd be interested to hear what other people's scores are (especially for G3s or slow G4s).

As you suspected it is actually BS that VPC feeds to your guest OS.

I have run benchmarks on my 17" with 1GB ram and WINXP on VPC6.01. The speed equates to a PIII at around 350-400mhz.

Check out a benchmark I ran:
http://www.kkinvestments.com/other/vpcperf.gif

urrl5201 · Apr 8, 2003, 10:56 AM

I do know the emulated speed varies and is not a fixed number; sometimes it goes as low as 663 Mhz and as high as 667 Mhz. So I can't say for sure.

urrl5201 · Apr 8, 2003, 11:16 AM

Thanks for the tip cambro. The frame rates alternate between 60 and 66 with spikes as high as 75, but this is with a small screen. I do not know what size screen you are using. At full screen it spends more time alternating between 60 and 63 than anything else. Anyone else getting these numbers to verify?

GeekyJeff · Apr 8, 2003, 12:01 PM

Originally posted by cambro:
Yeah, it is a bit tricky and completely non-intuitive...
First turn full screen visuals off. Then turn them on and they should appear within the iTunes window. When (and only when) you turn them on in this way can you see and access the option button in the upper right of the iTunes window (formally the browse button). Click it to see the options for iTunes visuals (why they just don't put these in preferences is totally beyond me).

I leave mine capped at 30 fps usually, but definitely enable OpenGL.

Thanks. Those tricky little bas*****. I didn't even notice that option button before.

cambro · Apr 8, 2003, 12:18 PM

Glad you got it working.
I posted feedback in the iTunes section concerning this. Specifically, I suggested putting the visuals preference pane in with all of the other iTunes preferences. You should do the same if you have a minute.

Go here ! (link is to Apple's Feedback site).

Kenneth · Apr 8, 2003, 01:47 PM

Originally posted by Karim:
As you suspected it is actually BS that VPC feeds to your guest OS.

I have run benchmarks on my 17" with 1GB ram and WINXP on VPC6.01. The speed equates to a PIII at around 350-400mhz.

Check out a benchmark I ran:
http://www.kkinvestments.com/other/vpcperf.gif

Which software you used to run the benchmark? I would like to try it on my DP 1.25Ghz PowerMac as well.

Meanwhile, under the System Summary.. it shows "x86 Family 6 Model 8 Stepping 4 ConnectixCPU ~1674 Mhz"

Some software shown that the CPU is a Pentium Pro. Funny.

urrl5201 · Apr 8, 2003, 04:58 PM

I just posted some temporary pics on my webpage until I can go to my brightly lit job and get better pics. You will see the LCD frame cushions from Radtech.com attached to my 17". They seem to be working as far as opening and closing the 17" but I must do some transporting to see if the marks from the LCD return on the edge of the hand rest. I do feel a sharp, protruding edge on the left edge of the LCD frame. Apple should have de-burred the LCD before assembly. To be fair Radtech does not have the 17" cushions out yet. These cushions are for the Ti or the iBook.

http://homepage.mac.com/bhardy3/PhotoAlbum34.html

I would have preferred the cushions to be smaller, firmer and dome-like, but thats just me I guess. Maybe this will be the type Radtech supplies in the future for the 17"

RooneyX · 08:26 AM

Originally posted by macndave:
I would be interested in a step-by-step process for identifying the VPC emulated CPU speed as well. I am runing VPC 6 on a PowerBook 800 and I think it is as fast as my PII 500 at work.

That must be a screwed up PII (you also mean PIII). I run VPC6 w/Windows 2000 on a Ti-800 and I'd say its about the same speed in general use as Pentium 100. I can say that after using and upgrading 100s of PCs over the years. Without GUI acceleration forget about comparing VPC to any real PC.

VPC says the Ti-800 is as fast as PIII-533 (if one existed). That's pretty damn funny, even funnier if people believe it.

RooneyX · Apr 9, 2003, 03:41 PM

Confirmed. The CPU speeds reported by the emulated OSes have no basis. Windows 2000 reports a G4-800 as 533Mhz. Open BSD reports the same CPU as a 303Mhz 686. Considering BSD runs so fast you would image the CPU to be rated higher in Open BSD than Windows would.

urrl5201 · Apr 9, 2003, 06:03 PM

I have updated the webpage with better pics of the Radtech cushions. Only two seem to keep the LCD frame marks away. Time will tell. The top seems a bit more flush with the bottom when closed also.

http://homepage.mac.com/bhardy3/PhotoAlbum34.html