[hsvgoku]

Hi guys and gals. Firstly i would like to say hi and i found out about this website from the Macguide. I can say that its a really good mag to read as i found out alot of things about apple. This is my second apple product which i bought where my last one was in 1997. Only used it for one year and decided to get back to Apple with the Powerbook which i really yearns for so long. Anyway, i am in a dilemma either to get the 1Ghz 15.2" or the 17". I have placed an order for the 15.2" but as i was reading through the website, the 15.2" has the norm airport card installed. Can i opt that out and change it to the airport extreme card instead? I like the 17" but it will be too big(screen) for me. What do you guys reckon?

Thanks in advance.

Haz

[Eug]

The 15" cannot use Airport Extreme. (It can work with an AE base station, but only at nomral Airport speeds.)

I saw the 17" in the store yesterday. It is a beautiful machine of course, but it is FAR too big for my tastes.

By the way, it was hard to say in the store for sure, but I'd give the 15" the edge when comparing the screen quality of the 15" vs. the 17".

[hsvgoku]

Thanks for the prompt response. So you reckon i should go for the 15" ? If the airport extreme is not a huge difference in transferring files/ surfing the internet, then i guess its not too hard to make a choice.

[Eug]

For web surfing it's irrelevant, since the normal Airport is already many times faster than even the fastest home broadband connection speeds. However, for transferring files, AE will be much faster. (I'd like to have AE with my TiBook, but fortunately I don't need the AE speeds often. When I do want to transfer huge files, I just use Ethernet.)

The other feature of the 17" people like is BlueTooth. Also, the 15" for sure does not burn DVD-RW. The firmware in the SuperDrive prevents it. However, there are reports that the 17" does support DVD-RW burning sometimes (unreliably).

[hsvgoku]

Ok. But for bluetooth, i can use the bluetooth adapter with no dramas at all as its small. About the DVD-RW with the superdrive, i thought you can do it??? I was told you can coz if you can't then i see no point going for the superdrive.

[PBAddict]

If you can wait a couple of months, Apple should have updated the 15 inch, which should include Airport extreme.

[JakBeatZ]

If you can wait, I'd wait for the 15" AlBooks which should be released sometime soon. The AlBooks are just so much more well built than the TiBooks. They look better, feel better and are much more sturdy. I played with a 15" and a 17" side by side. The 15" flexes and twists where the 17", considering it's size is rock solid.

It's up to you, but I'd definetly wait it out for an AlBook to come out in the size you want rather than settle for a TiBook. Al is the next big thing, IMO.

[cwasko]

Originally posted by hsvgoku:
Ok. But for bluetooth, i can use the bluetooth adapter with no dramas at all as its small. About the DVD-RW with the superdrive, i thought you can do it??? I was told you can coz if you can't then i see no point going for the superdrive.

In both the 15" and 17" burning DVD-RW is UNsupported. Yes, some people have claimed to be able to burn DVD-RW's in their 17", but I wouldn't count on it being reliable. If this is an absolute must for you to have, then you should save yourself the extra bucks. Also, you cannot configure the 17" to have anything but the DVD-R drive, so if you opt to get the 17", you're going to get the DVD-R drive.

[hsvgoku]

Thats really cool. Do you have any idea when?

[Eug]

The point of the SuperDrive is for DVD-R. DVD-RW would be nice, but it's unsupported. Personally, I think if you're gonna spend that kind of money, you should get the SuperDrive. Even if you KNOW you're never gonna use iDVD 3 (which is awesome), DVD-R for data is great.

I don't see the 15.4" AluBook SHIPPING until late summer.

[hsvgoku]

Ok. I guess i am all set now to get the 15.2'. When u say next summer, when is that ?2004 ?

[JakBeatZ]

Originally posted by hsvgoku:
Ok. I guess i am all set now to get the 15.2'. When u say next summer, when is that ?2004 ?

I think he meant Summer/2003. I think something will be announced on or before WWDC in June.

Hopefully Jobs & Co. will have learned from their 17"AlBook major fluckups and either a) give realistic ship dates b) keep customers well informed if they can't meet (a) c) have them ready for shipment upon announcment.

[hsvgoku]

What is AlBooks? Is there any info on the web where i can find out more info about this?

[seanyepez]

Originally posted by hsvgoku:
What is AlBooks? Is there any info on the web where i can find out more info about this?

"AlBook" is an abbreviation for the 12- and 17-inch PowerBooks.

[seanyepez]

I believe the 15-inch PowerBook will be updated in July after WWDC.

[MusicalTone]

I believe the 15-inch PowerBook will be updated in September when the new processors are announced.

[seanyepez]

The new processors will be announced in June.

[Mohammed Al-Sabah]

if u can wait .. then wait for the Al 15 rather then get the Ti15 why get somthing when u know its gonna change i made that mistake when i got my Ti 15ghz got it one month before the 17 showed up got mab but oo well.. so i say wait for Al15 or go for the Al17

[hsvgoku]

Ok Al 15 /17 is the powerbook so what is Ti?

[CheesePuff]

Originally posted by seanyepez:
The new processors will be announced in June.

How do you know? That's just pure speculation because of WWDC.

[MusicalTone]

Sure, new processor may be annnounced in June but wont be shipping for several months after. My guess is September at the earliest in a PB, but who knows. May well be into 2004. A lot of people seem to take it as read that a) next 15" will be 15.4 b) next 15" will be Alu instead of Ti on absolutely no evidence.

My advice, what do you need now? Decide and go out and buy it. There will always be a better model down the road, sometime....

[RGB]

Originally posted by hsvgoku:
Ok Al 15 /17 is the powerbook so what is Ti?

Ti refers to Titanium, the material of the current 15" PowerBook. Al is the symble for Aluminum, the material of the 12" and 17" PowerBooks. It is expected that within the next few months, the 15" titanium model will be upgraded with a new aluminum enclosure, as well as a few other features like Airport Extreme and builtin Bluetooth like the current Aluminum models have.

[Mohammed Al-Sabah]

i still say wait for Al 15 or go with the 17 Ti wont look as good when the whole line is upgraded to Al

[hsvgoku]

So the titanium casing is not as good as an Aluminium casing?

[RGB]

Originally posted by hsvgoku:
So the titanium casing is not as good as an Aluminium casing?

The new Aluminum cases feel a lot more durable than the Titanium casing of the 15". Past generations of the 15" model have reported peeling paint and succeptability to scratches. The new Aluminum cases so far have not had these problems, and overall feel a LOT more solid.

[chrisutley]

There are third party solutions that will work with the Airport Extreme Base station and TiBook, and I would guess that they will get better reception since they go in the PC slot instead of the internal Airport slot.

Originally posted by Eug:
The 15" cannot use Airport Extreme. (It can work with an AE base station, but only at nomral Airport speeds.)

I saw the 17" in the store yesterday. It is a beautiful machine of course, but it is FAR too big for my tastes.

By the way, it was hard to say in the store for sure, but I'd give the 15" the edge when comparing the screen quality of the 15" vs. the 17".

[hsvgoku]

Thanks for all the help guys. Now i know the difference betweeen the Al and Ti. Now i am in a dilemma whether to change it to a Al 17" from a Ti 15". I guess since they are changing the whole batch to Al then i might as well go for the Al 17".

[RGB]

Originally posted by hsvgoku:
Thanks for all the help guys. Now i know the difference betweeen the Al and Ti. Now i am in a dilemma whether to change it to a Al 17" from a Ti 15". I guess since they are changing the whole batch to Al then i might as well go for the Al 17".

That's what I'm doing. Just realize that you'll probably be waiting for a few months for it.

[hsvgoku]

Originally posted by RGB:
That's what I'm doing. Just realize that you'll probably be waiting for a few months for it.

The Al 17" isn't out yet? I thought they are as the have a price of NZ$8266 here.

[emilioch]

Originally posted by hsvgoku:
The Al 17" isn't out yet? I thought they are as the have a price of NZ$8266 here.

That´s how I feel after buying the Ti15 even after I read all about the scratches and the painting peeling and the marks in the screen.
That is, the keyboard keys on both the TiBooks and the iBooks tend to mark the screen as there is not enough space between them. Then if your hands were oily some marks will appear on the screen.

Anyway, if you can wait 1-2 months for the new rumored new Al15 PowerBooks then wait by all means. If not, go for the 17. Airport Extreme is the nest big thing along with Firewire800. The only thing holding me for selling my Ti15 is that the new PowerBooks are a bit short on the VRAM: 64MB does not cut it anymore. I want 128MB of VRAM to play Doom3 (which is said to require 128MB of VRAM as a minimum).

[seanyepez]

Originally posted by CheesePuff:
How do you know? That's just pure speculation because of WWDC.

It's not pure speculation. I've been right in the past, and I will be right in the future. Let's just say I'm good at guessing.

[Westfoto]

Originally posted by seanyepez:
It's not pure speculation. I've been right in the past, and I will be right in the future. Let's just say I'm good at guessing.

The problem here is that Apple is never shipping right out the gate with new products. They are always weeks or months out.

There will always be something better around the corner.

Get the 15" if that is the SIZE you want.

West

[wanderlust]

As long as you're on the banks of the river, you'll just be watching all the boat pilots having fun driving their boats down the river. In other words, there will ALWAYS be the next greatest model. At some point you just have to take the plunge or you'll be waiting your lifetime for it.

After using the TiBook for over two years, then getting the 17" AlBook, I can't recommend that you stay away from the 15" TiBook in its current form enough. Don't get me wrong, there is plenty of good things to say about it, but compared to the new designs, there simply is no comparison. Apple learned a lot from that design and they have now come into their own, in my humble opinion. I've stated this before, using a 17" lap top has not been difficult or unwieldy in any form. In fact, now that I'm using this size, I seem to feel this is the size laptops SHOULD be, if you get my meaning. And I'm not a big guy either.

And put it this way, if you decide to go with the 17", you won't be kicking yourself later saying, "Damn, I shoulda gotten the 15"."

If you're going to go with a 15" screen, wait for the redesign, or chances are you WILL be kicking yourself saying either, "damn, I shoulda gotten the 17" " or "damn, I shoulda waited." Believe me, although I liked the Ti - I'd give it a 6 on a scale of 1 to 10, there are SERIOUS fowl-tasting design flaws in the 15" in its current iteration (mainly the hinges - shame on the guy who wasted everyones time and money on those pieces of crap...they belonged on a pc), and I ate them all.

In contrast, I honestly give the 17" a 10. And perhaps if the 15" came out with the same caste and features as the BigAl I'd give it a well-deserved high score as well.

The only benefits I see of you getting the 15" now (as opposed to the 17" now) would be:
1. It's cheaper. But if cost is not a factor, then this point is mute.
2. It's smaller. But like I said, you won't be saying "this thing sucks, it's just way too big. I can't do any work on this huge, gorgeous screen". So unless you're mini-me, this too is a mute point.
3. You're a glutton for punishment and really dig hearing "I told you so" many, many times.

The benefits of getting the 17" now:
1. It's a better design. Not just a little better. Way better.
2. It has all of the newest technology built in, including AE, Bluetooth, FW 800, Gigabit ethernet
3. Faster hard drive ATA/100 as opposed to the ATA/66
4. All the ogling you get when you whip this puppy out (if you don't like attention, don't use this thing in public, at least for the next several months) and the drooling your mac friends will present you with. Believe me, I'm a little uncomfortable showing off what I have, but it really makes for a great conversation piece. But don't buy it on these merits alone.
5. DVD-R and DVD-RW. I've done it. It works.
6. Better sounding speakers
7. Side slots instead of the tedious behind the screen, under the freakin' flap ports (Oh, but that's another 'better design issue').
8. Glowing keys. Like to work in low-light? I do. And this goes beyond just the cool factor. It's actually useful.
9. Better PCI slot. I use this a lot and it's better implemented than the 15". Oh, yet another 'better design issue'.
10. Audio in.
11. Ability to connect to a Studio Display natively without a pricey third-party adaptor
12. Better screen resolution: 1440x900 as opposed to 1280x854.

Okay, I'll stop. But isn't this alone worth $500? Because that's the price difference. Not much when you're putting down that kind of scratch and you're planning on using it enough. I thought it was.

All I have to say about the 15" is DON"T DO IT!!! You will regret it. Especially when you presently have other, vastly superior options.

You can tell, I put a lot of thought into this purchase. I hope my rambling will help you with yours.

[wilsonX]

except that the new 15's will be out at the end of may...just my guess...

[wanderlust]

[Karim]

Originally posted by seanyepez:
It's not pure speculation. I've been right in the past, and I will be right in the future. Let's just say I'm good at guessing.

You may want to add that you have been wrong before also. Remember the "no new powerbooks in Jan 2003" comments you made in November-December last year.

Speculation invites flame wars unless you qualify yourself.

[wallinbl]

Originally posted by wilsonX:
except that the new 15's will be out at the end of may...just my guess...

You have Murphy's Law on your side. I'm buying a 15" in about two weeks, which means that they will be updated shortly after that.

[threestain]

But I would equally say that the 15" is still damn good. Basically get the best you can afford when you can afford it!

[RGB]

I gave in to the dirt cheap pricing of the 15" Ti from my mom's school, and ordered a 1GHz model. It should arrive within a few weeks. I'll be pissed when the 15" Al comes out, especially if it comes out before mid summer, but I just couldn't pass up the deal I had.

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by wanderlust:

1. It's cheaper. But if cost is not a factor, then this point is mute.
2. It's smaller. But like I said, you won't be saying "this thing sucks, it's just way too big. I can't do any work on this huge, gorgeous screen". So unless you're mini-me, this too is a mute point.

The point is moot. MOOT, not mute, not deaf, not blind.

I'm Norwegian and I'm anal about the english language. I wish more native speakers were to.

[- - e r i k - -]

[wallinbl]

Originally posted by - - e r i k - -:
The point is moot. MOOT, not mute, not deaf, not blind.

I'm Norwegian and I'm anal about the english language. I wish more native speakers were to.

I don't think mute has anything to do with blindness. I do know a person who uses the phrase 'moot point' in speech and pronounces it 'mute', which is the opposite of the common problem.

Most Americans (I am American) do not care about proper English. The simple fact that they conveyed their point is good enough for them.

[Crusoe]

Best bet is to set a deadline when you need a new powerbook. If something new isn't out by then go with what you've found best suits your needs.

I don't need a new PB (want one) but will be back stateside in early June, if the new 15"ers are out by then I'll buy one, otherwise I'll be waiting for the AL 15" and new revs to the AL 12" and 17"s before deciding.

Ideally it would be nice if they released all 3 models with IBM 970 chips at WWDC. Ideally for me would be a June1 availability date for the new 15"ers.

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by wallinbl:
Most Americans (I am American) do not care about proper English. The simple fact that they conveyed their point is good enough for them.

Well you get your point across better if it's presented professionally. Never underestimate the power of presentation.

[wanderlust]

Originally posted by - - e r i k - -:
The point is moot. MOOT, not mute, not deaf, not blind.

I'm Norwegian and I'm anal about the english language. I wish more native speakers were to.

Ah, yes indeed! Thank you for the correction. I too am a bit anal about the English language and I really should have known better. However, because I write as much as I do, I do tend to write quickly and still make plenty of mistakes, though that's no excuse. In fact, most of the time I run the system spell checker on my messages before posting, which is certainly more than I can say for most folks. It only takes a few seconds.

There are plenty of mistakes, a huge number in fact, that crop up in BBs. (The misuse of there, their and they're is an epidemic). No one can correct them all, I stopped correcting, but if you want to, more power to you! There should be better English teachers as native English speakers (namely Americans, of which I am one) are inadequately taught in schools.

And by the way, --- e r i k --- you misspelled "too" at the end of your sentence. Touche.

[ae86_16v]

Originally posted by Crusoe:
Best bet is to set a deadline when you need a new powerbook. If something new isn't out by then go with what you've found best suits your needs.

I don't need a new PB (want one) but will be back stateside in early June, if the new 15"ers are out by then I'll buy one, otherwise I'll be waiting for the AL 15" and new revs to the AL 12" and 17"s before deciding.

Ideally it would be nice if they released all 3 models with IBM 970 chips at WWDC. Ideally for me would be a June1 availability date for the new 15"ers.

I highly doubt that they'll release the 970 on the PB that soon.

Man you guys think that they'll upgrade the 17" soon? I mean it was announced in Jan, but didn't actually get to people until April. So will it be 6 months from Jan or 6 months from April?

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally posted by wanderlust:
And by the way, --- e r i k --- you misspelled "too" at the end of your sentence. Touche.

LOL. Note that I edited the post (and the smiley below). It was late and I'd hope someone would catch that. Silly joke really.

[wilsonX]

Originally posted by wallinbl:
You have Murphy's Law on your side. I'm buying a 15" in about two weeks, which means that they will be updated shortly after that.

LOL. I just bought a 17inch! So for the same reason, they are definitely coming out soon. (and just watch, they will have a faster processor in them too...)