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krux` · 05:39 PM

All this talk on people waiting to buy G5 Powerbook's and dates scrambled back and forth, doesnt anyone remember how long it took the G4 processor to make it to powerbooks from desktops? If anyone has seen the heat sink on the G5 knows that thing throws off a absurd amount of heat, so it doesnt seem feasable or reasonable to assume the G5 powerbook will be anytime soon

fraeone · Oct 26, 2003, 12:42 PM

Yeah I have to agree with you. 8 fans + that monster heatsink = lots of engineering left to do to get it in a PB.

SEkker · Oct 26, 2003, 01:01 PM

I'm not so sure. If IBM can move the G5 to the new manufacturing process, then the heat on a 1.4-1.6 GHz G5 chip would work well in a PB.

The meaning of the G4 iBooks is clear -- Apple has committed the purchase of a certain number of Motorola chips BEFORE it can move to an all G5 lineup. That was the price for Motorola to release Apple from its contract to enable the IBM switch.

I think the new iBooks are a terrific value; they're going to eat into some of Apple's profit margin, but Apple needed to do something to fight off the low-end Centrino machines.

xylon · Oct 26, 2003, 01:52 PM

Originally posted by krux`:
All this talk on people waiting to buy G5 Powerbook's and dates scrambled back and forth, doesnt anyone remember how long it took the G4 processor to make it to powerbooks from desktops? If anyone has seen the heat sink on the G5 knows that thing throws off a absurd amount of heat, so it doesnt seem feasable or reasonable to assume the G5 powerbook will be anytime soon

I agree with the idea that we won't be seeing a G5 PowerBook for a while, but I think the heat issue is less of a problem than you're making it out to be. The desktop is designed from the ground up to accomadate heat issues so that Apple's engineers can push the G5 processor. It's been stated here on these forums that the power output of the G5 processor is much less than that of the G4, so it's putting out less heat.

However, I still think we won't be seeing a G5 PB for a while for various reasons. I'm still hoping I'm wrong though.

Ti X · Oct 26, 2003, 02:19 PM

I almost think that the PowerBook will follow the same roadmap as the PowerMac line. Meaning that we will see a dual G4 PowerBook and then a single G5 and then a dual G5 or a single G5 and dual G5 at the same time. Apple needs to generate as much revenue as possible from each platform and the way to get the most longevity is to follow the same roadmap as the PowerMac. But, that is not to say that I wouldn't jump up and down like a school kid if they announce a G5 PowerBook in January.

Link · Oct 26, 2003, 02:24 PM

The following was a public service announcement to sell more pathetic 12", lemon 15", and humongous 17" powerbooks.

Come on. Get real. It will happen someday and your g4 powerbook will be left in the dust. Let it rest already you can't fight evolution

If you buy now, buy now. 6 months down the road something new will be out and you'll want it. I frankly don't care if it's a G6 powerbook because I probably won't be able to afford it but really now people.

Besides things point out this.

1. Year of the laptop ends at MWSF
2. The G5 tower design is made for DUAL processors to run COLD and silent at speeds of 3-4GHZ.
3. 90nm processors soon

4. If they were able to fit a 1ghz in the powerbook they can do anything roflmao

spitty27 · Oct 26, 2003, 02:27 PM

take a look at this article
p.s: sorry for cross posting a different forum

click here

nobitacu · Oct 26, 2003, 04:31 PM

They can make it work. Everyone knows that IBM is not going to use the same chip that was used right now on the Powermac. They won't be able to keep the heat down if they do. I think that IBM is already at works at redesigning the chip just for laptop uses, which than they will address the heat issue. As for the dual cpu Powerbooks, there is no way this will happen on a laptop. At least, I don't see it happening. If they can't get dual to work on a G4, how are they going to do a dual G5?

Ming

Ryan1524 · Oct 26, 2003, 06:55 PM

the back of the Dual G5 was really hot when i put my hand on it. and that's hot air, not from touching the heatsink. with a huge fan for each and that big a a heatsink, and STILL air with that high a tempertature, i don't think it'll be in a PB anytime soon. unless it's a mobile version of it that works ina very different way.

milhous · Oct 26, 2003, 08:46 PM

I think water-cooling technology in future portables are imminent. Heatsinks alone won't cut it anymore.

krux` · Oct 26, 2003, 10:52 PM

The post wasnt intended to point out that it could be done, i already stated that they could, however stating that the huge gap between release of G4 on Towers, then a while after apple saying that the g4 processor cant be sufficently cooled when put into a powerbook. i Agree with most of you and your comments, the G5 will most likly make its crossing over to the powerbook, but to reiterate, it will take a Long time and theres no rreason to hold off on buying a powerbook g4 in awaiting a g5 because this new line of G4 laptops like somone just said, needs to get its maximum revenue before moving on.

Scooterboy · Oct 27, 2003, 12:29 AM

One of the major obstacles facing PowerBook engineers is the intense heat emitted by the PowerPC G5 processor. (While a single G4 PowerPC 7457 processor pulls around around 7.5 watts at 1GHz, a single PowerPC 970 G5 requires approximately 18W at 1.2GHz.) To help combat the problem, sources say the company is experimenting with liquid cooling systems in early prototypes of the portables.

I beleive 18W at 1.2 GHz for the G5 is comparable to the MPC7455 that was in the 1GHz TiBook and is in the 1 GHz iBook G4. So a PowerBook G5 1.2 GHz would be hot, but only as hot as the 1 GHz TiBook.

The new low power 7457 G4 in the PowerBooks explain why PowerBooks are now cooler.

Scooterboy · Oct 27, 2003, 01:21 AM

Also remember that IBM fabs the G5 on a 130 nanometer process, but is soon (maybe March '04) moving the G5 over to a 90 nanometer fab. The die shrink will lower heat dissipation while increasing core speed.

Where is Eug when we need him? He really understands this stuff and is great at providing lucid explantations to us lay-people.

acadian · Oct 27, 2003, 01:49 AM

Still think we'll se a dual G4 powerbook before the G5.

ngrundy · Oct 27, 2003, 02:24 AM

Originally posted by Link:
The following was a public service announcement to sell more pathetic 12", lemon 15", and humongous 17" powerbooks.

Come on. Get real. It will happen someday and your g4 powerbook will be left in the dust. Let it rest already you can't fight evolution

Left in the dust like those still clutching onto Lombard and Pismo laptops like grim death and pouring hundreds if not thousands into upgrade upon upgrade into them instead of just fessing up and buying a new damm machine?
</RANT>

The Placid Casual · Oct 27, 2003, 02:53 AM

It will be at least a year before we see the G5 Powerbook...

There are lots and lots of reasons why if people just use their minds.

Scooterboy · Oct 27, 2003, 10:47 AM

Originally posted by acadian:
Still think we'll se a dual G4 powerbook before the G5.

Why would you think that? Dual processors would emit double the heat of a single CPU, and would cost Apple twice as much for the processors for each dualie PowerBook.

shatten22 · Oct 27, 2003, 11:22 AM

i think it's just simple business logic: where will apple take the powerbooks (and ibooks) in the next twelve months?

The powerbooks have one mhz upgrade left in them - they top out at 1.4ghz. Past sales figures have shown Apple that they need to be refreshing their computer lines on a regular basis. An upgrade every eight months just isn't going to cut it.

The powerbooks will get another refresh in Spring. Then I say look for the new 17" G5 powerbook to debut in late August, actual shipping in November. Then the other pbooks will get some G5 love in January (shipping early March).

-geoff

Scooterboy · Oct 27, 2003, 11:51 AM

I'll even go so far as to say 17" PowerBook G5 in March/April with the rest of the PowerBooks going G5 by 4th Quarter 2004. The earlier dates match up with IBM's .09 micron PPC 970 release.

That will leave the iBooks to go to the newest G4 in 4th Quarter 2003 and give Apple time to buy up their agreed numbers of Motorola G4 chips before switching entirely to IBM.

elvis2000 · Oct 27, 2003, 11:56 AM

Originally posted by nobitacu:
They can make it work. Everyone knows that IBM is not going to use the same chip that was used right now on the Powermac. They won't be able to keep the heat down if they do. I think that IBM is already at works at redesigning the chip just for laptop uses, which than they will address the heat issue. As for the dual cpu Powerbooks, there is no way this will happen on a laptop. At least, I don't see it happening. If they can't get dual to work on a G4, how are they going to do a dual G5?

Ming

2004 Macs:
Desktops: G5 and dual G5 (2GHZ+)
PowerMac: New IBM "G4", (1.33 - 2GHZ)
iBook/iMac/eMac: Moto G4s up to 1GHZ

Once the G5 is ready for Powerbooks, the IBM "g4" will move to the consumer lines.

acadian · Oct 27, 2003, 12:23 PM

I've always found that O'Grady has come pretty close to the mark on PB predictions over the years;

Can the PowerBook G5 be far behind? Sources say yes, the PBG5 is at least a year away. A dual-processor PBG4 will come first, possibly next spring or summer.

Daniel Bayer · Oct 27, 2003, 01:33 PM

A Gee five would be nice but quite frankly, I am very happy with the performance of my Super-17'r.

If it comes out next year, I would be suprised.

With the upgrades of Panther and a 7200 rpm drive...this thing screams.

Happily X-Benching 128's.

Powaqqatsi · Oct 27, 2003, 01:33 PM

Originally posted by elvis2000:
2004 Macs:
Desktops: G5 and dual G5 (2GHZ+)
PowerMac: New IBM "G4", (1.33 - 2GHZ)
iBook/iMac/eMac: Moto G4s up to 1GHZ

Once the G5 is ready for Powerbooks, the IBM "g4" will move to the consumer lines.

G4 PowerMacs ?

You mean:

G5 PowerMac
IBM G4 iMac/eMac
MOTO G4 iBook
MOTO G4 PowerBook and maybe later on the IBM G4 or a possible shift to G5

Scooterboy · Oct 27, 2003, 02:35 PM

IBM doesn't make G4's. Motorola does. If Apple used a 750xx chip and called it a G4, the PC and tech sites would be outing it in no time. PPC 750xx is G3. PPC 74xx is G4. PPC 970 is G5.

IBM is soon manufacturing G5's on 0.09 micron fab, and is heavy into R&D to manufacure at .065 micron fab. I can see G5 accross the board, with the .13 fabbed CPU's in iMacs and maybe eMacs, the .09 fabbed G5's in PowerBooks and PowerMacs, and later, .065 micron fabbed G5's in PowerBooks and PowerMacs allowing .09 micron fabbed G5's in iBooks.
The future is coming. I really don't see Apple using Motorola G4's once they finish buying from Motorola the number of CPU's they have agreed to buy (to release them from the AIM contract and go fully IBM). By 2005 all Macs may be G5 powered, and maybe the PowerMac will be G6 (IBM PPC 980). IBM is ahead of schedule.