[silentfeet]

Hello,
I have a 1gig/867 mHz Powerbook G4 that has a loose/broken plastic USB guide. Have AppleCare. Sent unit in for repair. Repair tech says problem caused by "accidental damage", and that AppleCare will not cover fix.
The cost to fix problem: $900. Advised Repair to return unit to me.
Question: Do I have any viable options, or am I essentially S.O.L.? All constructive advice welcome. Thank you.

Silentfeet

[rag on a muffin]

is it still functional? if so, who cares. could you snap a pic?

[silentfeet]

Originally posted by rag on a muffin:
is it still functional? if so, who cares. could you snap a pic?

Dear Rag On A Muffin,

Yes, it is still functional provided that great care is taken to properly align the USB guide, and then carefully slide the USB plug onto it. However, I do not know how reliable this method will be over time. Sorry, I cannot snap a pic as the unit has not yet been returned, but I assure you, this unit has not been abused which is why I am so puzzled by this repair ticket. Thanks for your input.

[rag on a muffin]

oh, so you havent broken it? i would argue to them. i did with my old lemon ibook G4, and they fixed a part that they said i messed with (i didnt even know wht the heck the parts were).

id say that would be your best bet.

i didnt realize it was edit: *not* just cosmetic.

[silentfeet]

Originally posted by rag on a muffin:
oh, so you havent broken it? i would argue to them. i did with my old lemon ibook G4, and they fixed a part that they said i messed with (i didnt even know wht the heck the parts were).

id say that would be your best bet.

i didnt realize it was edit: *not* just cosmetic.

Dear Rag On A Muffin,,

The person I talked with was a line level contact person who was very sweet, and, very firm in her explanation that the tech found the damage to be "accidental," and that nothing else could (or would) be done w/o paying the $900 fee. Furthermore, the contact person apologized more than once, however, I understood the person's statements to be nothing more than towing the Company line–like reading a mimiographed response in automaton fashion. So, with that in mind, I had wondered if there existed a court of last resort somewhere where I could plead my case, or was this a summary execution accompanied with an apology from the officer in charge of the firing squad, so to speak. I thought perhaps there might be someone out there who might know how best to proceed (or not). Thanks for your input.

[rag on a muffin]

well, most of the time apple will try to cover themselves with excuses like "im not authorized to do it" or "it was obvious that you did it" when in fact they are just covering. the only thing the low level people cant do is replace your machine. once a low level guy tried to completely cover up a repair they did, saying it was nonexistent.

as long as you know you didnt do it, they have no right to push those charges on you.

PS. dont be swayed by kindness, if worst comes to worst, ask to speak with their manager.

[kafoochy]

This is a tough situation. The USB guide (assuming we're thinking about the same thing) doesn't exactly look easy to break, even if you push/pull straight down on a plugged in USB cable. It sounds like you talked to a technician, or first tier people, one of the first you talk to you when you call AppleCare?

My second question is if the USB Guide is actually broken/about to fall off or just loose? I'm thinking that you could try and say that it was plastic fatigue or something. It can't hurt to try and complain. Call Apple Customer Relations however. The tech people can basically tell you if something needs to be repaired or not and if the person who looked at the computer said it was user-error. There is little room for arguing. There may be some wiggle room with the customer relations people.

You can find the number for customer relations here: http://www.apple.com/contact/phone_contacts.html

I'm sorry that this happened. Unfortunately something like this requires the whole motherboard to be replaced. Apple does try to prevent things like this from happening. They realized years ago that the most common user-damage was people tripping or pulling the power cable out and they now have the power plug on a seperate logic board that is less expensive to replace. Good luck and argue that it wasn't your fault!

[wuzup101]

It sucks that they need to replace the whole logic board for something like that. I would have thought that they could have atleast sured it up in some way... maybe solder or whatnot. I'm not an expert when it comes to fixing peripherals... but I would think there would be some way... heck... epoxy might work (not that i'm suggesting you do this obviously... just saying). Good luck getting it fixed... shoddy workmanship should be repaired at no cost to you... assuming you didn't damage it yourself!

[silentfeet]

Originally posted by rag on a muffin:

as long as you know you didnt do it, they have no right to push those charges on you.

PS. dont be swayed by kindness, if worst comes to worst, ask to speak with their manager. [/B]

Dear Rag On A Muffin,

Thanks so much for your input. I will call and argue my case with a mgr. I honestly cannot say that I am not responsible for the problem, I can honestly say that I do not know how, or what I did to cause it. I will let you know what fix , if any, I achieved with Apple on this matter. Thanks again for your comments.

[silentfeet]

Originally posted by kafoochy:

It sounds like you talked to a technician, or first tier people, one of the first you talk to you when you call AppleCare?

My second question is if the USB Guide is actually broken/about to fall off or just loose?[/B]

_contacts.html[/url]

Dear Kafoochy,

This person was someone I was transferred to by AppleCare, and the second person I spoke with. Still, I am sure this person was a line level customer contact person. Regarding the USB guide, I don't know if it is completely broken because I didn't try to pull it out. The USB port still works when I moved the guide back to its original position, so maybe I will just have to live with it. Its hard to believe that the repair of a piece of plastic requires the replacement of the whole motherboard. At $900, that is one expensive piece of plastic. Seems like a flimsy design to me. Thanks very much for your input, and referral to CustomerCare. I will avail myself of it, and I will let you know what corrective action, if any, was taken to remedy this problem. Thanks again for your concern.

[silentfeet]

Originally posted by wuzup101:
It sucks that they need to replace the whole logic board for something like that.[/QUOTE]

Dear Wuzup,
Yes, I too would have thought this extreme considering we are talking about a piece of plastic, not metal. Seems a flimsey design problem, at best. I will try to contact CustomerCare and see if they will help. I will let you know if I was successful in this attempt to avoid shelling out $900–which I'm not going to do no matter what. Thanks for your comment.

[kafoochy]

Originally posted by silentfeet:
Originally posted by kafoochy:
_contacts.html[/url]

Dear Kafoochy,

This person was someone I was transferred to by AppleCare, and the second person I spoke with. Still, I am sure this person was a line level customer contact person. Regarding the USB guide, I don't know if it is completely broken because I didn't try to pull it out. The USB port still works when I moved the guide back to its original position, so maybe I will just have to live with it. Its hard to believe that the repair of a piece of plastic requires the replacement of the whole motherboard. At $900, that is one expensive piece of plastic. Seems like a flimsy design to me. Thanks very much for your input, and referral to CustomerCare. I will avail myself of it, and I will let you know what corrective action, if any, was taken to remedy this problem. Thanks again for your concern.

Good luck! I wouldn't say it is necessarily a flimsy design, it's the same as any other laptop made today. It's actually pretty solid which may be the problem. I've you've ever seen a desktop motherboard, you know that all the ports are very solidly bolted and/or soldered onto the motherboard. It makes it difficult to replace only part of it. Maybe if you had a friend who is good with soldering and working with small electronics he could try a solution, but it would still be extremely difficult.
I don't necessarily agree with Rag A Muffin when he says that they have no right to push the charges on you. It sounds like you aren't even sure how this happened. I have never heard of this happening, and it could easily sound like user error to anyone else. However, when talking to Apple you need to be resolute in your opinion that it was not you. Not that you need to lie and formulate a story, but I still think that some type of pre-mature fatigue induced failure with the plastic part (ruling out accidental damage). I think that "pre-mature" is important because Apple provides a one-year warranty which is at least how long these parts should last for.
You also said that the USB still works. Try and use this information! Say that because the USB has always worked, you didn't question any play that you may have felt when inserting a cable earlier. Try and make it sound like this didn't all of a sudden happen (that would sound like you broke it). Make it sound like it was starting to feel a little loose a month or two ago, but everything worked. The ports are on the back of your TiBook and are difficult to look at directly to check for problems. Question the tech's conclusion as rash. I'm not saying this is going to work, as the situation is very questionable, but arguing can't hurt.

BTW, I would hate to see you loose this case. I am a college student and have dealt with Apple's service people in the past. They tried to charge me twice for repairs that were obviously mechanical failure. I brought my computer into the AppleStore and a Genius looked at it before shipping it off, so I had him call and straighten things out. If for some reason I had to pay for the repairs, I never could have. In your situation if you really have to (and this wouldn't be elegant) OrangeMicro (and probably others) makes a USB PC CardBus (PCMCIA) cards that add up to four USB 2.0 ports. This would be the cheapest way for you to get reliable USB (and faster at that!) Sorry to bring that up, especially since I'm rooting for you!

Oh, I'm assuming the computer is less than a year old. After this works out, I'd suggest buying AppleCare if you already haven't. As much as this situation may have unsettled any faith in Apple's service, they usually are good and I can see their side. However if anything was to fail in the future, it would be good to have.

[urrl78]

Not cool if you are not certain if it was an accident or not. Has someone used your computer? If I was not certain it was my fault then I would take the blame unless I was CERTAIN it was no accident. I would probably look into a way to fix it myself with epoxy or what not. My first thought would be if I could repair it from the inside to keep the exterior looking brand new. Is this an Aluminum or Titanium model? There are websites out there that can show one how to dismantle a Powerbook.

[PBG4 User]

You could always write a letter to the BBB. Apple seems to respond quite quickly when people do this.

[southtdi]

To me this sounds like fatigue. I've had stubborn USB devices where I had to do a bit of wiggling to get loose but never have i seen a connector break. I would guess that the plug was put together a little wrong and that led to it. If you have the Tibook there is also a cover so about the only way to mess it up is with the cable in place and that in itself would be hard.

If you can, i would take it to the store and show a Genius the problem. Explain the point that a USB cable sits in t's connecter fairly securely and that there is a cover protecting it (if a tibook) when not in use. Let him be aware that you find it hard to break something like that since it is embedded inside a small connector. Even twisting a USB cable down woudl make it pretty hard to break. Hopefully they will see the light and make sure that the computer is fixed.

[silentfeet]

Originally posted by urrl78:
Has someone used your computer?

Dear urrl78,
No one has ever used the computer except me

If I was not certain it was my fault then I would take the blame unless I was CERTAIN it was no accident.

I am not certain that I did not do it. I am certain that I cannot pinpoint any significant occurrance where this would, or did happen. I will try for a fix as Apple has refused to repair w/o a $900 fee.

I Is this an Aluminum or Titanium model? There are websites out there that can show one how to dismantle a Powerbook.[/B]

This is a 1 gig/867 mHz Tibook.
Thanks for your input.

[silentfeet]

Originally posted by PBG4 User:
You could always write a letter to the BBB. Apple seems to respond quite quickly when people do this.

Dear PBG4 User,

Thanks for your suggestion. What is the "BBB" and how could I contact them?
Apple has refused to reconsider its decision.

[silentfeet]

Originally posted by southtdi:
To me this sounds like fatigue. I've had stubborn USB devices where I had to do a bit of wiggling to get loose but never have i seen a connector break. I would guess that the plug was put together a little wrong and that led to it. If you have the Tibook there is also a cover so about the only way to mess it up is with the cable in place and that in itself would be hard.

If you can, i would take it to the store and show a Genius the problem. Explain the point that a USB cable sits in t's connecter fairly securely and that there is a cover protecting it (if a tibook) when not in use. Let him be aware that you find it hard to break something like that since it is embedded inside a small connector. Even twisting a USB cable down woudl make it pretty hard to break. Hopefully they will see the light and make sure that the computer is fixed.

Dear southtdi,

I believe this is a case of the plastic becoming fatigued, however, obviously I can't prove it to Apple, especially since it's an Apple tech determining this problem to be "accidental damage." Furthermore, Apple has denied my request that the matter be reconsidered. Apple wants $900 to repair the unit,and has made it clear that it is not going to fix the unit at its own expense. If I knew that I was truly responsible for the problem, I wouldn't have bothered posting my grievance against Apple, although I don't blame anyone for being suspicious–it's a lot of money out-of-pocket. However, since I do not believe that I broke the plastic guide, and that the problem has been caused by fatigue of the plastic, and not by "significant pressure" applied by me as the senior Apple tech has decided as the cause, I do not think I should pay for this repair. Moreover, this unit has been twice sent in before which finally resulted in Apple replacing the logic board. How do I know that the tech didn't damage the palstic upon installation? I don't. However, can I prove it? No. And I don't imagine that the tech who repaired this unit would ever admit to it either. So, I am not that optimistic about Apple doing anything except to insist I pay for the repair. That, I will not do. BTW, this Tibook is a replacement for the first one that I bought which Apple replaced after I had sent it in five times in less than a year. I have two Macs, the Tibook, and an Imac G4 15" , both with AppleCare. The Imac has not had one failure. However, I have had nothing but bad luck with the Tibook G4. Yes, when Apple replaced the first PowerBook, a 667 mHz, after a year of grief, I ended up with a newer, and faster machine. However, I reiterate, even this one had to have the logic board replaced. Honestly, I have taken great care, and at considerable expense to insure that my TiBook looks and performs its very best. Its condition, with the exception of the loose USB guide, is mint. This is why it pains me to hear Apple telling me that I damaged the unit, and that this is the only possible explanation. Pardon the pun, but right now, I am soured on Apple. I'm sure I'll get on with life, however, I don't feel very much like singing any praises to Apple in public, or in private.
I understand what you said regarding the metal case around the guide, thereby making it somewhat difficult to snap, or crack.
I probably will take it to a Mac Genius and at least get another opinion before abandoning all hope, and just biting the bullet. Thanks for your comments, and suggestions.

[romeosc]

Should have bought Safeware insurance! Your homeowner policy will cover it but there is a deductable..... Safeware has no deductable!

[kafoochy]

Originally posted by silentfeet:
Dear PBG4 User,

Thanks for your suggestion. What is the "BBB" and how could I contact them?
Apple has refused to reconsider its decision.

I'm assuming he meant the Better Business Bureau, although I'm not sure how much it will help you.

[bighead]

I'm a portable AND desktop certified tech, and I've never seen a cracked USB or FireWire port on a computer that WASN'T caused by accidental damage. It's called accidental damage because it generally wasn't done on purpose, and maybe it is not even done by you. Maybe you don't realize you damaged the port.

Needless to say, I've been in and out of more machines than a porn star has been, well, you get the idea. A cracked port is not and should not be covered under warranty.

[silentfeet]

Originally posted by bighead:

Needless to say, I've been in and out of more machines than a porn star has been, well, you get the idea. A cracked port is not and should not be covered under warranty.

Dear Bighead,

Thank you for your expertise and comments regarding my cracked port problem. Fortunately, after receiving the unit back today, unrepaired of course, the port still works–just no plastic guide. I will live with it. Thank you for presenting your perspective, which btw, is Apple's perspective, as well.

To all those that gave constructive advice to me, I say thank you. The fight is over. Apple won. Still, I am consoled by the fact that the port works, and I take comfort in knowing that,although a repair would have been desirable, it could have been a lot worse. Thanks romeosc for making me aware of Safeware Insurance. I will get it to combat any future misfortunes, should they occur.
Thanks RAG ON A MUFFIN, KAFOOCHY, URRL78, PBG4 USER, WUZUP101, and SOUTHTDI for all your input. I'm moving on. All the best! This matter is closed.