[tavilach]

Just as a frame of reference, how much better are the PowerBook G5's going to really be? Are we talking, say, 2x faster? 5x faster? 10x faster?

I'm so tempted to wait, but I need a laptop for college.



Edit: Before you get mad at me, perhaps I should elaborate. My question is not a "what are the PowerBooks going to be like?" type of question. I'm no fool...I know that this is very unpredictable. Rather, I'd like a simple comparison of the G4 and the G5. Granted, the G5 in the PowerBooks will be a bit "neutered," if you will, but I'd just like an overall comparison of the two processors. The G5 is supposedly a blazingly fast processor, but what does that mean? I know that there's more to processing than speed, but I really have no frame of reference, speed-wise. Perhaps a good comparison would be a 1.6 GHz G5 PowerMac and a 1.42 GHz G4 PowerMac. What kind of speed difference are we looking at?

Do you see what I'm trying to get at? I'd just like a reasonable comparison of the two chips, and with that information, I can make an assumption relating to the future speed of the PowerBook G5 in comparison to the current PowerBook G4. I'm just not that versed in this stuff (the hardware), and I want to make an educated decision about whether or not buying a PowerBook G4 will be a mistake (note that I'm not asking if it will...that's up to me). Personally, if the G5 will only be 2x as fast, I'm cool with getting the G4 now. I need a laptop, and a 100% speed boost wouldn't really affect my productivity. If it'll be 10x as fast, that gets me a little nervous. I just need some frame of reference.

I hope my elaboration helps .

[SafariX]

Can we adopt a 3 strikes and you're out policy...only no strikes, and no outs....just me voting people off?

[tavilach]

Originally posted by SafariX:
Can we adopt a 3 strikes and you're out policy...only no strikes, and no outs....just me voting people off?

That was truly profound. Back to the topic?

[Maflynn]

Well your asking for a comparison on a product that does not exist. you could probably extrapolate the benchmarks between the G4 and G5 PowerMacs which can be found at barefeats

Heat and power consumption will be factor’s that in all likelihood slow the G5 down in a laptop configuration. Which of course decreases the performance edge between the two.

Without a shipping G5 PB, it really doesn’t make too much sense to speculate since IBM could introduce a faster lower powered cpu which of course throws these PM benchmarks out the window.

If you want to buy a PB now, I say go for what you need today and let tomorrow worry about tomorrow.

Mike

[chris v]

Originally posted by SafariX:
Can we adopt a 3 strikes and you're out policy...only no strikes, and no outs....just me voting people off?

Sure! Just start here and here.

[Maflynn]

Originally posted by SafariX:
Can we adopt a 3 strikes and you're out policy...only no strikes, and no outs....just me voting people off?

If you don't like his posts just ignore them, nobody is forcing you to read them.

These forums are here to foster communication not squelch it. so relax.

[tavilach]

Originally posted by Maflynn:
Well your asking for a comparison on a product that does not exist. you could probably extrapolate the benchmarks between the G4 and G5 PowerMacs which can be found at barefeats

Heat and power consumption will be factor’s that in all likelihood slow the G5 down in a laptop configuration. Which of course decreases the performance edge between the two.

Without a shipping G5 PB, it really doesn’t make too much sense to speculate since IBM could introduce a faster lower powered cpu which of course throws these PM benchmarks out the window.

If you want to buy a PB now, I say go for what you need today and let tomorrow worry about tomorrow.

Mike

Those benchmarks don't show a huge difference between the G4 and the G5. Hmm...good to know...

[Maflynn]

No they don't but I suspect the sacrifices neded to make the G5 work in such a small form factor (pb case) may increase the speed difference - to what degree who knows.

Mike

[tavilach]

Originally posted by Maflynn:
No they don't but I suspect the sacrifices neded to make the G5 work in such a small form factor (pb case) may increase the speed difference - to what degree who knows.

Mike

Wouldn't it decrease the speed difference?

[olePigeon]

I really don't think there's going to be a G5 laptop any time soon. You're better off getting a laptop now. And even if a G5 laptop does come out tomorrow (which it won't), it's not like you can't sell a next-to-new G4 laptop with only little loss to you.

[tavilach]

Originally posted by olePigeon:
I really don't think there's going to be a G5 laptop any time soon. You're better off getting a laptop now. And even if a G5 laptop does come out tomorrow (which it won't), it's not like you can't sell a next-to-new G4 laptop with only little loss to you.

That's not what I'm asking, though. I'm trying to figure how how much better the G5 processor really is.

[siflippant]

Originally posted by tavilach:
That's not what I'm asking, though. I'm trying to figure how how much better the G5 processor really is.

[alligator]

I own a 1.8 GHz single processor G5 and a brand new 1.3 GHz PowerBook. The speed difference is not very noticable. Sure, maybe if you are using Photoshop, rendering video, or some other processor intensive application, but using Word - can't even tell the difference.

Go with the PowerBook now. No question about it. It's better to upgrade later and have something to play with today. You will eventually make more money, and you will want to upgrade eventually, no matter what you buy.

The speed difference is there, but it's not a "rock your world" speed difference. It's just an "average" upgrade.

[tavilach]

Originally posted by alligator:
I own a 1.8 GHz single processor G5 and a brand new 1.3 GHz PowerBook. The speed difference is not very noticable. Sure, maybe if you are using Photoshop, rendering video, or some other processor intensive application, but using Word - can't even tell the difference.

Go with the PowerBook now. No question about it. It's better to upgrade later and have something to play with today. You will eventually make more money, and you will want to upgrade eventually, no matter what you buy.

The speed difference is there, but it's not a "rock your world" speed difference. It's just an "average" upgrade.

Now that was a helpful response .

[Maflynn]

Originally posted by alligator:
I own a 1.8 GHz single processor G5 and a brand new 1.3 GHz PowerBook. The speed difference is not very noticable.

I have to disagree on the PB vs G5. My setup, admittedly is a little different. I have a 15” PB (1.25GHz) and a G5 2.0GHz and there is a large speed difference between the two. When I click on anything in the dock and its up with maybe 1/2 bounce. Non-MP aware apps such as Unreal or call of duty which truly tax the system also show a large gain on the G5 for those games I can run on high detail and still pull in decent frame rates. The PB would choke. Running the client versions of seti@home and folding@home is well over a 2 to 1 speed difference. Even if you factor in the clock difference the G5 is still faster on running those apps (seti & folding)

When apple releases a G5 PB you have no idea what sacrifices will have needed to be made to make it work (heat and battery). Those sacrifices will the performance, conversely the speed increases of the cpu could offset that, i.e., IBM releases a 3 GHz cpu.

Bottom line is your trying to compare an unreleased product with a product that well into its life cycle.

Mike

[tavilach]

Originally posted by Maflynn:
I have to disagree on the PB vs G5. My setup, admittedly is a little different. I have a 15” PB (1.25GHz) and a G5 2.0GHz and there is a large speed difference between the two. When I click on anything in the dock and its up with maybe 1/2 bounce. Non-MP aware apps such as Unreal or call of duty which truly tax the system also show a large gain on the G5 for those games I can run on high detail and still pull in decent frame rates. The PB would choke. Running the client versions of seti@home and folding@home is well over a 2 to 1 speed difference. Even if you factor in the clock difference the G5 is still faster on running those apps (seti & folding)

When apple releases a G5 PB you have no idea what sacrifices will have needed to be made to make it work (heat and battery). Those sacrifices will the performance, conversely the speed increases of the cpu could offset that, i.e., IBM releases a 3 GHz cpu.

Bottom line is your trying to compare an unreleased product with a product that well into its life cycle.

Mike

You obviously have a very different perspective . I won't be using my laptop for gaming, though...just programming, Adium, and what not...so I doubt it'd be a huge difference. Am I right?

I'm not trying to compare an unreleased product with the G4, though. I'm just trying to compare the two processors. I know that it's just an approximation, and the G5 will end up being "neutered," but I'm just looking for a very general comparison. It seems to me that we're not looking at the PowerBook G5 being 10x faster...perhaps 1.2x faster with word processing and stuff, and 2x faster with gaming and what not. Does that seem pretty reasonable?

[alligator]

Originally posted by Maflynn:
I have to disagree on the PB vs G5. My setup, admittedly is a little different. I have a 15” PB (1.25GHz) and a G5 2.0GHz and there is a large speed difference between the two.

Ahh, but there's the difference. You have a dual processor G5, and I have a single G5 chip. I'm comparing one 1.8 GHZ G5 chip to a single 1.33 GHz G4 chip. In this setting, the difference is not that noticable unless the application is very demanding. Can I notice it, sure. Does it really matter to me - no. I actually prefer to use the PowerBook for most things because I can take it anywhere in the house (wireless internet). With the G5, I'm tied to my desk.

Also, my G5 has 1.5 GB of RAM, the G4 has 768 MB, if that makes a difference.

[Randman]

Wait and see the specs on the G5 iMac. I would think the PBs would have similar specs, though 1) I think February is the earliest for even announcing (if they solve the heat issues) the model to give the new iMac some time to ring up sales; 2) as a student, what will you be doing with the laptop? Is there a sound reason you would NEED a G5 PowerBook right away? Get a G4 iBook or PowerBook and enjoy it. Then you can always upgrade to a second rev PB with amped specs.

[tavilach]

Originally posted by Randman:
Wait and see the specs on the G5 iMac. I would think the PBs would have similar specs, though 1) I think February is the earliest for even announcing (if they solve the heat issues) the model to give the new iMac some time to ring up sales; 2) as a student, what will you be doing with the laptop? Is there a sound reason you would NEED a G5 PowerBook right away? Get a G4 iBook or PowerBook and enjoy it. Then you can always upgrade to a second rev PB with amped specs.

Yes, that does seem to be the best way to go.

[olePigeon]

Originally posted by tavilach:
That's not what I'm asking, though. I'm trying to figure how how much better the G5 processor really is.

It completely depends on how memory intensive the application is. You may see differences in apps like Final Cut, Maya, and large Photoshop files. It won't be very noticeable in apps like iTunes, MS Office (unless you copy/paste 300 pages), and IDEs.

It also depends on whether or not the applications themselves are taking advantage of 64-bit memory addressing. The G5's main strong-point is the ability to address huge amounts of memory and have the BUS to carry that info between the memory and the CPU.

Actual raw CPU power is not that different. This is all about the memory.

[siflippant]

Originally posted by tavilach:


I'm not trying to compare an unreleased product with the G4, though. I'm just trying to compare the two processors.

But, mmmm... you still ARE comparing an unreleased product with the G4 [unless anyone else here knows of a G5 laptop for sale]... as ppl have already posted, there may have to be sacrifices made by IBM in order to horseshoe one of these processors into a laptop... but until that time arrives, buy a powerbook, you won't regret it!

[Crusoe]

Your general comparison may be OK but I would highly expect G5 Powerbook's memory bus speed to be half of the desktop models. So a G5 1.6 PB would run at 400Mhz rather than 800Mhz. While better than G4 bus speeds it's still going to affect performance.