Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Notebooks > MacBook Pro 15" with "Grainy" Matte Display?

MacBook Pro 15" with "Grainy" Matte Display? (Page 3)
Thread Tools
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 12, 2006, 04:18 PM
 
Have you contacted Apple yet Spaz? I'm curious as to what they'll tell you.
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 12, 2006, 05:03 PM
 
Has anyone tried the following:

- Looked at the screen while windows XP (under bootcamp - not parallels) is running to see if the issue is still present.

- Hooked the MBP up to an external display (try both LCD - glossy and/or matte and CRT to be sure).

- Not sure if this is possible - but maybe there is a way to connect an external source (maybe another computer of some sort) up to the MBP's screen!?

I'll be getting my MBP C2D Glossy next week (hopefully mon or tue) and I'll do some testing too.

When I was in the MAC store deciding on what screen to go for I was checking out a glossy and a matte side by side. I'm pretty sure these weren't C2D ones - however, I could see a marked grainy effect in the matte that wasn't present in the glossy display. I remember checking them out at all levels of brightness too (but didn't check the system prefs. for 16 bit colours or anything). I really hope that apple haven't chosen a cheaper supplier of glossy screens for the C2D revision B models! Otherwise I'll be harassing those supposed 'geniuses' down at the store. LOL, in my experience the geniuses have been as retarded as the spotty freaks in PCWORLD who pretend to know about computers! Christ! A GCSE in computing doesn't make you an expert people!

Jeez, I need to calm down and stop ranting!
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 12, 2006, 05:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by MartyMcSly View Post
Has anyone tried the following:

- Looked at the screen while windows XP (under bootcamp - not parallels) is running to see if the issue is still present.

- Hooked the MBP up to an external display (try both LCD - glossy and/or matte and CRT to be sure).

- Not sure if this is possible - but maybe there is a way to connect an external source (maybe another computer of some sort) up to the MBP's screen!?

I'll be getting my MBP C2D Glossy next week (hopefully mon or tue) and I'll do some testing too.

When I was in the MAC store deciding on what screen to go for I was checking out a glossy and a matte side by side. I'm pretty sure these weren't C2D ones - however, I could see a marked grainy effect in the matte that wasn't present in the glossy display. I remember checking them out at all levels of brightness too (but didn't check the system prefs. for 16 bit colours or anything). I really hope that apple haven't chosen a cheaper supplier of glossy screens for the C2D revision B models! Otherwise I'll be harassing those supposed 'geniuses' down at the store. LOL, in my experience the geniuses have been as retarded as the spotty freaks in PCWORLD who pretend to know about computers! Christ! A GCSE in computing doesn't make you an expert people!

Jeez, I need to calm down and stop ranting!
The issue is also under Windows XP. Originally this was thought to be a WinXP only issue, as the way OS X deals with dithering is different, but now it's evident in both. I've hooked the MBP up to an external display and the ext. display looks the way it normally looks without the grain.
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 12, 2006, 06:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by pbmikez View Post
The issue is also under Windows XP. Originally this was thought to be a WinXP only issue, as the way OS X deals with dithering is different, but now it's evident in both. I've hooked the MBP up to an external display and the ext. display looks the way it normally looks without the grain.
Check your private messages man.

Oh, did you try an external LCD monitor or was it CRT. Because if it's a dithering issue, it probably matters what kind of display you hook up to it.
     
Mac Enthusiast
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Monterrey, Mexico
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 12, 2006, 08:51 PM
 
I just read the other pc threads.. it has to be a BIOS thing (and not the screen quality as I suspected). Just for the record here is a thread from notebook review in which I state the grainy screen on the Compaq which is dated back in November 2005. I just checked the compaq site to see if they got a new BIOS and nope.. none.

Horrible HP screens! - Notebook Forums and Laptop Discussion
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 12, 2006, 10:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by polendo View Post
I just read the other pc threads.. it has to be a BIOS thing (and not the screen quality as I suspected). Just for the record here is a thread from notebook review in which I state the grainy screen on the Compaq which is dated back in November 2005. I just checked the compaq site to see if they got a new BIOS and nope.. none.

Horrible HP screens! - Notebook Forums and Laptop Discussion
This sucks. It's probably never going to get fixed because only a small amount of people even see it or even care. Most people just shrug it off thinking it's how it's (supposed) to be or something. All I know is, I don't like it. And yes, the screen does look sparkly (that's a good word to use... grainy is okay but, sparkly everyone knows what that looks like. It seriously looks like there's dust all over my screen and it makes me want to wipe it but, I can't because it's already clean.
     
Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Ormond Beach, Fl.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 12, 2006, 10:58 PM
 
Originally Posted by TheSpaz View Post
This sucks. It's probably never going to get fixed because only a small amount of people even see it or even care. Most people just shrug it off thinking it's how it's (supposed) to be or something. All I know is, I don't like it. And yes, the screen does look sparkly (that's a good word to use... grainy is okay but, sparkly everyone knows what that looks like. It seriously looks like there's dust all over my screen and it makes me want to wipe it but, I can't because it's already clean.
Are you gonna call Apple tomorrow, or should I?
-Ben- 15" Macbook Pro 2.33, 2GB RAM, 160HD, Matte
My
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 12, 2006, 10:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by jasonsRX7 View Post
The Rev A Macbook Pro that I had was grainy. I called it "sparkly" at the time. I am typing this on a glossy Macbook that isn't grainy at all, it looks great. I've got a matte C2D MBP on the way, and if it has a grainy screen, I am sending it back and getting glossy. The MBP screen should look at least as good as the Macbook, but the ones I've seen so far haven't. My old Powerbook screen looked better than the MBP.
I noticed you said you have the glossy MacBook (which none of the MacBooks have this problem). I think you'll get the MBP and realize that you're gonna return it and then you'll get the glossy and it will have the same effect, so what will you do then?
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 12, 2006, 11:00 PM
 
Originally Posted by atc ben View Post
Are you gonna call Apple tomorrow, or should I?
Are you good at talking on the phone? Cause I suck at phones.
     
Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Ormond Beach, Fl.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 12:04 AM
 
I just downloaded this small LCD Test app, and you can really see the sparkle effect when you run the Gradients pattern.
-Ben- 15" Macbook Pro 2.33, 2GB RAM, 160HD, Matte
My
     
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 01:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by TheSpaz View Post
I noticed you said you have the glossy MacBook (which none of the MacBooks have this problem). I think you'll get the MBP and realize that you're gonna return it and then you'll get the glossy and it will have the same effect, so what will you do then?
Well I didn't think about the fact that it is a CTO with the 160gb drive, so I don't think the 14 day return policy applies to me. I'll just have to live with it, I guess, but at least I'll be using it on a 30" Cinema display most of the time, so I won't have to look at it. I'll use the Macbook when I'm on the road.
     
Mac Elite
Join Date: Oct 1999
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 01:41 AM
 
I don't see it. I see a little banding between green and red, but that's about it.

     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 09:41 AM
 
Originally Posted by iomatic View Post
I don't see it. I see a little banding between green and red, but that's about it.

Try looking at solid green. It should be solid but, it's sparkly instead.
     
Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 01:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by TheSpaz View Post
Are you good at talking on the phone? Cause I suck at phones.
well, could someone call apple please, and see what they say?
it seems that every apple's screen, except MBs, has this grainy thing; i wonder why no one has mentioned it before, and thanks to thespaz for bring this up
un jour,
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 02:34 PM
 
This thread makes me worry about my new 15" MBP (C2D). Even though I have not noticed it when I was using for the last several days, I feel I may notice this grainy screen issue. I was hoping my MBP will be defect free as my other Macs have been defect free to this day.
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 03:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by BadApple View Post
I was hoping my MBP will be defect free as my other Macs have been defect free to this day.
That kind of contradicts your user name ;-)
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 04:06 PM
 
From a user on the Apple Discussions forum:

"The 18-bit thing is simple. Each "pixel" on your LCD screen is actually made up of 3 subpixels: red, green, and blue, very close together. In "millions of colors" mode, each of these subpixels should have 256 possible values, from 0 (off) to 255 (full bright). This is 8 bits per subpixel (2^8 = 256) also known as 24-bit color, for a total of 2^24 = 16,777,216 displayable colors.

Some cheaper/faster desktop LCD displays (and, apparently, notebook displays) are only capable of displaying 6 bits per subpixel, or 18-bit color, totalling 2^18 = 262,144 colors. I didn't know the MBP had one of these unfortunate displays, but apparently it's common.

Dithering is placing a lower number of colors in a certain pattern to trick your eye into seeing a higher number of colors. This is done by the video card automatically. So, -if- this theory is correct, the speckled pattern is coming from normal dithering.

Now apparently the x1600 is supposed to do "temporal dithering" which involves altering the color of -the same pixel-, quickly enough to mitigate the pattern effect you're going to get from dithering. From what I can tell from the message board threads, this is stuck in freeze-frame (or the dithering is just really bad) due to a video BIOS bug.

The problem is, who knows if this is the actual issue, and if it is, it was apparently fixed a while ago, so why would they ship like this? Also, it means everyone should be seeing this issue, unless some people got 24-bit displays (unlikely).

Regardless, this gives some cause for hope. Thanks!"
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 09:18 PM
 
I' ve read from other forums (http://www.notebookforums.com/thread173555.html) that the same grain issue appears on other PC laptop screens with ATI Mobility X1600 graphics card aswell. Asus provided a bios update for the card, and it resolved the issue!

When is Apple going to release a bios update? This is very embarassing to Apple, which advertises its computers to be made for media people working with graphics etc. We have been waiting for a fix for almost a year now. I can't use my MacBook Pro for work because the graphics quality is appalling. The grain appears even on the Mac OS X. I'm very disappointed.
     
Dedicated MacNNer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: New York City
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 10:17 PM
 
I personally don't think the problems with the sparkle/grain of the MBP have anything to do with that Asus notebook with that deep 'grain' issue. Have you seen the pics? That's clearly a GPU issue - you don't have to be an expert to see that. The grainy effect on their screens are more like artifacts due to a glitch in the GPU - where on the MBP, it's more of a subtle sparkle due to it being in the panel's coating.

The issue with the MBP is the panel itself (I know, I sound like a broken record, but it's so obvious that it's frustrating to see people think otherwise). The only way Apple will be able to fix this problem is to change the LCD panel brand in the MBP (which happens often during the life of a notebook revision as they shift parts).

Since there is nothing technically wrong with the MBP LCD (other than it not being the best one out there in terms of quality), don't expect anything from Apple except a 100% refund when you return it (I didn't tolerate a 'restock fee' and nor should anyone else). If Apple sees a significant number of customers returning their $2K+ MBPs, perhaps then they'll actually do something about it (like use a better LCD panel).

To me, there are 4 things that are a MUST when I am in the market for a notebook - and smooth, bright and clear glossy screen, silent operation (within reason), stylish design, and solid build quality. If Apple would have used the same LCD panels as Sony does in some of their VAIOs, it would have been a 4/4 for me.
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 10:31 PM
 
Okay. So it's the coating on the display. That clears that up then. Anyways... how do we get a better screen? Are we stuck with this one until our next computer purchase? I mean... if Apple doesn't count it as a defect, then what are we supposed to do. Just deal? I still have a few more days to bring my computer back... if I bring it back, I'll have to pay the restocking fee and then wait until they build a better computer before I can buy a new one again? This is bogus.
     
Dedicated MacNNer
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: New York City
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 10:45 PM
 
When Dell got caught in this sparkle/grain mess with several of their models (each with different size screens and GPUs) people just kept getting them replaced and returning them until they either caught on, or switched panel brands (no one knows for sure). Their displays have gotten better, but it's still a complete crap shoot and some still sparkle. Have you seen my list of notebooks that I've gone through? It's happening to all the PC makers so Apple was bound to join the club sooner or later. Hopefully one of the brands that they get their supply from doesn't use such a harsh anti-reflective coating (or whatever they do to get that sparkle finish)

There are only a handful of LCD panel makers (the big ones) and it seems that MANY notebook brands are all pulling from the same inventory piles (depending on what they order and how they order them). If I had to guess, I would say that Apple has no idea that these displays suck and that their cheaper ($1000 cheaper) MacBook's have 10x better screens than their 'pro' line.

The only way you'll have to pay the restocking fee is if you allow them to charge you for it. I simply asked (nicely) that the store manager and one of the 'genius' guys look at my MBP and the MB side by side and open up an all white window on both machines. They both saw it as it's so obvious. So I showed genuine concern that I couldn't work with this - I stated I worked with a lot of white backgrounds and this LCD was unacceptable. They credited me in full. I almost walked out with a black MB, but if I go that route, I'll have to custom config one as 2GB is a must for me.

I do hope that Apple proves me wrong on this and quickly changes panels instead of waiting for current stock to be sold out. Even the guy at the Apple Store said to wait a few weeks before I re-order in hopes of Apple switching panels either due to customer complaints, or just running out of them. If so, I'll be right back online at the Apple Store getting another MBP!
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 10:59 PM
 
Okay, here's the deal guys. I am now 100% convinced that this is 100% not software related. This is definitely a crappy coating on the screen.... I've looked and looked and StiZeven is exactly right, those guys on the PC forum were noticing a different type of grain. It was not the shimmery, sparkly dusty look that I am seeing. What I'm seeing is the pixels being slightly distorted due to the obvious fact that the coating on the screen is slightly bumpy and the pixels cannot show through it without getting slightly diffused looking. I'm just sad because my PowerBook display looks perfect, then again, the pixels are bigger so it shows through the coating better... but, having such a high resolution display makes it so the pixels seem shimmery a bit. Also, if you move windows around you can see that the pattern does not change a bit (which it apparently was shifting with the PC computers). So don't hold your breath for a firmware update cause it's NOT coming EVER. You'll have to sell your computer or return it for a refund if you don't like it.

Now I'm torn on what to do.

1. Trade it in for a full refund and wait until they fix 'em
2. Deal with it for the lifetime of the computer
3. Wait until my 14 day return period is up and then sell it
4. Trade it in for a glossy display and hope it doesn't have this problem.

I wonder if I can open my new computer right at the Apple Store... that way if I don't like it... I can say (nah... I need a different one).
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 11:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by StiZeven View Post
When Dell got caught in this sparkle/grain mess with several of their models (each with different size screens and GPUs) people just kept getting them replaced and returning them until they either caught on, or switched panel brands (no one knows for sure). Their displays have gotten better, but it's still a complete crap shoot and some still sparkle. Have you seen my list of notebooks that I've gone through? It's happening to all the PC makers so Apple was bound to join the club sooner or later. Hopefully one of the brands that they get their supply from doesn't use such a harsh anti-reflective coating (or whatever they do to get that sparkle finish)

There are only a handful of LCD panel makers (the big ones) and it seems that MANY notebook brands are all pulling from the same inventory piles (depending on what they order and how they order them). If I had to guess, I would say that Apple has no idea that these displays suck and that their cheaper ($1000 cheaper) MacBook's have 10x better screens than their 'pro' line.

The only way you'll have to pay the restocking fee is if you allow them to charge you for it. I simply asked (nicely) that the store manager and one of the 'genius' guys look at my MBP and the MB side by side and open up an all white window on both machines. They both saw it as it's so obvious. So I showed genuine concern that I couldn't work with this - I stated I worked with a lot of white backgrounds and this LCD was unacceptable. They credited me in full. I almost walked out with a black MB, but if I go that route, I'll have to custom config one as 2GB is a must for me.

I do hope that Apple proves me wrong on this and quickly changes panels instead of waiting for current stock to be sold out. Even the guy at the Apple Store said to wait a few weeks before I re-order in hopes of Apple switching panels either due to customer complaints, or just running out of them. If so, I'll be right back online at the Apple Store getting another MBP!
Okay... I can ask them nicely but, they're still a business... what if they stick to their guns and tell me I have to pay the fee? I'm just like you... to me, having the extra fuzz their really makes my photos look like crap. I really hope Apple does something about this... it really IS unfair to us PRO users that the MacBooks have crystal clear displays while we suffer with the sparkles.

Wait a second. Is it possible to get the display replaced on the MacBook Pro for $249? Because that's how much it would cost to return the computer.
     
Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 13, 2006, 11:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by TheSpaz View Post

Now I'm torn on what to do.

1. Trade it in for a full refund and wait until they fix 'em
2. Deal with it for the lifetime of the computer
3. Wait until my 14 day return period is up and then sell it
4. Trade it in for a glossy display and hope it doesn't have this problem.

I wonder if I can open my new computer right at the Apple Store... that way if I don't like it... I can say (nah... I need a different one).
thespaz,
actually you only have 3 first options, the 4th is not gonna work, mine is glossy and suffer the same problem.
watever your decision will be, hope u enjoy it.
un jour,
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 12:16 AM
 
Originally Posted by outthere View Post
thespaz,
actually you only have 3 first options, the 4th is not gonna work, mine is glossy and suffer the same problem.
watever your decision will be, hope u enjoy it.
Is your computer past the 14 day returnable period?
     
Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 01:54 AM
 
Originally Posted by TheSpaz View Post
Is your computer past the 14 day returnable period?
how do they define the 14 day period term? is it from the invoice date?
if so then im still in business, , and btw do they consider glossy screen a custom figure, dont know if they would give me a full refund
thespaz, u know what to do yet? man, im dying here
un jour,
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 06:51 AM
 
I'm going to be seriously hacked off if my glossy MBP comes with this defect. I'm going to kick up such a stink in the Regents Street store that you'll be able to smell it in the states! Whats the issue with returning a Custom build if this is the case? Can we not take it back to the store for a full refund!? If not why not and is this rule stated anywhere on the apple site, clearly enough for everyone to read it BEFORE they click the buy button!? I know for sure 100% that the guy on the phone mentioned nothing about not being able to have a full refund if it was faulty (when I placed the order) for my 2.33 glossy 160GB MBP.

It arrives today from Shanghai so I'll keep y'all posted.....
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 07:29 AM
 
I think the problem is with the X1600. It has the same dithering problem, not a sparkle effect like some people are saying, I dont even understand what they're talking about. Okay maybe there's two issues: sparkle and dithering, but I would like to see the dithering problem fixed, like the ASUS computers etc. It has been widely discovered that ALL laptops with X1600 have the same exact problem. Why would be MacBooks Pro's with X1600 be any different? The issue is explained (and the fix for ASUS) very well here, please read: http://www.notebookforums.com/thread173555.html

Or go make a Google search: "grainy x1600"

Ofcourse I'm also aware that the MacBook Pro screens are crap quality, but still with BIOS update I think we can fix the worst issue.

Is there a email for a Apple tech support, or a developer team?
( Last edited by betonfoot; Nov 14, 2006 at 07:40 AM. )
     
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: South Detroit
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 07:45 AM
 
Originally Posted by aesculanus View Post
i would seriously take another look at the display setting in the preferences; this sounds like a classic case of display being set at 16-bit rather than 24
Ha! That'd be hilarious if some new bug was setting all the MBP depth to thousands! That doesn't create any pattern or grain in white areas though, where they've all said it's most noticable. Neither did Spaz's noise simulation that he did in Photoshop. In fact I can't imagine ANYthing being able to create a sparkle effect in a sollid white area, even a graphics card, leading me to agree that it must be in the screen coating, eh.

I love the U.S., but we need some time apart.
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 09:09 AM
 
I took some photos of my MacBook Pro screen with my digitalcamera with macro lens. The photos have been taken very near the screen, so you can clearly see the grainy pixel patterns. The first photo is supposed to be a solid black on a website background. The second one is taken from gradient fill (gray to black) in Photoshop. The third one is a picture of a car tire.

And yes the same kind of grain was created by ATI Mobility X1600 graphics card (same as apple is using) on ASUS computers, and they fixed it with a bios update. So I think there could be a way to update the bios for Mac as well.

Here are the pictures: http://www.laspalmas.nu/macbookpro_grain.jpg
     
Junior Member
Join Date: May 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 09:38 AM
 
yes it is the screen coating... i have it too on my 23" cinema display... i checked them out at the apple stores... this problem is just to a degree of how much of it you notice... and yes it's the anti-glare coating and so the glossy screens will not have this problem

heck... even the pink casts are a result of the anti-glare...
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 10:39 AM
 
Quote: "yes it is the screen coating... i have it too on my 23" cinema display.."

Why do you say its the coating? How can coating affect the pixels? And why do you think its not the problem with the graphics card? Because this same thing was fixed on ASUS computers, using same graphics cards.
     
Mac Elite
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: New York
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 10:45 AM
 
Originally Posted by TheSpaz View Post
Okay... I can ask them nicely but, they're still a business... what if they stick to their guns and tell me I have to pay the fee? I'm just like you... to me, having the extra fuzz their really makes my photos look like crap. I really hope Apple does something about this... it really IS unfair to us PRO users that the MacBooks have crystal clear displays while we suffer with the sparkles.

Wait a second. Is it possible to get the display replaced on the MacBook Pro for $249? Because that's how much it would cost to return the computer.

In the spring when I was dealing with defect MBPs at the Apple Soho Store, they refused to waive the restocking fee because they said everything was 'within spec' (an apple favourite that cannot be backed up with any objective specification standard - totally arbitrary). I just disputed the charge with my credit card company and sent in print outs of apple discussions posts on warped display bezels, whines and heat. Within a week they had reversed the charge. That might be an option?
( Last edited by pete; Nov 14, 2006 at 12:16 PM. )
     
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 11:15 AM
 
Mine just got here, and yes, it's grainy. Nothing I can really do about it, I've got to have it, and I'll be using it with an external display mostly, so oh well.
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 11:16 AM
 
Originally Posted by betonfoot View Post
I took some photos of my MacBook Pro screen with my digitalcamera with macro lens. The photos have been taken very near the screen, so you can clearly see the grainy pixel patterns. The first photo is supposed to be a solid black on a website background. The second one is taken from gradient fill (gray to black) in Photoshop. The third one is a picture of a car tire.

And yes the same kind of grain was created by ATI Mobility X1600 graphics card (same as apple is using) on ASUS computers, and they fixed it with a bios update. So I think there could be a way to update the bios for Mac as well.

Here are the pictures: http://www.laspalmas.nu/macbookpro_grain.jpg
Okay, thanks for the pictures. That's DEFINITELY the video card and I DEFINITELY have a different problem than you. my problem is clearly not the pixels like yours. I see a shimmer from the anti-glare coating on my screen. Black is 100% black and white is sparkly. You need to bring that computer back because it's definitely not supposed to be like that.
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 11:21 AM
 
Originally Posted by jasonsRX7 View Post
Mine just got here, and yes, it's grainy. Nothing I can really do about it, I've got to have it, and I'll be using it with an external display mostly, so oh well.
I can't believe Apple can sell computers that look like this. It's totally not like Apple. I guess when they start putting PC chips in it, they start acting like they're just one of the regular PC companies. It's sad, Apple usually has better quality control than this.
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 11:24 AM
 
JasonsRX7 - did ya get glossy or matte (out of interest)
     
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 11:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by TheSpaz View Post
I can't believe Apple can sell computers that look like this. It's totally not like Apple. I guess when they start putting PC chips in it, they start acting like they're just one of the regular PC companies. It's sad, Apple usually has better quality control than this.
It looks the same as the rev A MBP that I got a few months ago and sent back. I don't know why people weren't complaining about it back then. I did, I even posted a thread taking pictures of the screen (mostly because of uneven brightness though).
Originally Posted by MartyMcSly
JasonsRX7 - did ya get glossy or matte (out of interest)
I got the matte display so it would more closely match the external display. Otherwise I would have gotten the glossy, because I like the way it looks on my MacBook.
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 12:01 PM
 
Originally Posted by jasonsRX7 View Post
It looks the same as the rev A MBP that I got a few months ago and sent back. I don't know why people weren't complaining about it back then. I did, I even posted a thread taking pictures of the screen (mostly because of uneven brightness though).

I got the matte display so it would more closely match the external display. Otherwise I would have gotten the glossy, because I like the way it looks on my MacBook.
You guys, I don't think there's any way around this. It's 2 choices now.

1. Keep the MacBook Pro (because it's a super fast awesome portable computer)
2. Return it, get your money back and be without a computer (you don't want a MacBook and you don't want to pay for a super expensive Mac Pro and you also don't want an iMac which probably has the same issue.)
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 12:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by MartyMcSly View Post
JasonsRX7 - did ya get glossy or matte (out of interest)
I read that they both suffer from this.... sadly. They must use a different screen vendor for the MacBook.
     
Mac Elite
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: New York
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 12:20 PM
 
When you have three displays in front of you, the macbook, a cinema display 20" and the macbook pro 15, it becomes very obvious that the mBp doesn't have the same quality display as the other two. Some people might not have had the chance to compare, but for those who have it's a disappointing realisation that the expensive pro laptop has a poor display. I mean, the display is a KEY part of a laptop and it's a part other manufacturers manage to get right. Why can't Apple?
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 12:28 PM
 
How about this scenario:

I take my MacBook Pro back.
Get a Mac Pro (2 Dual-Core 2.0GHz Xeons) - $2,200
Save up for a 20" Apple Display

Problem solved. I'm so disappointed in my MacBook Pro... thought it would be the same build quality (or better) than my PowerBook G4. The reason I didn't research the MacBook Pro's before is because I figured they used the same case design and same overall quality as the PowerBook G4. I guess I was wrong.
     
Mac Elite
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: New York
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 01:08 PM
 
I have another suggestion:

-take your macbook pro back
- get a beautiful imac 20" from amazon for around $1400
- get the cheapest macbook as a portable system

I think the quality of both macbooks and macbook pros is lacking, but it's much easier to accept when you pay $1000 for the macbook, than double that for the macbook pro. The imacs seem to be good quality, however.
     
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 02:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by TheSpaz
Get a Mac Pro (2 Dual-Core 2.0GHz Xeons) - $2,200
I debated quite a bit about whether to get a Mac Pro or the MacBook Pro, and ultimately decided on the MacBook Pro because I don't want to have to bother maintaining multiple computers anymore. I also picked up some external drive enclosures to deal with storage constraints on a laptop. So for me, it will pretty much be a desktop that I can use on the couch sometimes.
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 08:26 PM
 
How do you determin the current LCD screen on MBP is lower quality than the previous PB/MBP? I keep the brightness setting around 15 to 20% mos of the time and what I see on the screen seem as clear as other LCDs I have used. I admit I wear a pair of eye glasses and my relatively poor eye sight may be the reason who I am seeing things you are seeing.
     
Dedicated MacNNer
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Osprey, Florida
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 10:10 PM
 
Just an observation today - I compared several older Apple monitors up to the 30 incher and my 15" Ti, 15" Al and new MBP C2D 15". They are all at a lower light level all the time and they all have some "grain". I have not noticed it before this thread. I am going to call it a normal variation and forget it. This is not to say that the variation may be too much to accept but in my case I am not going to complain as I have not noticed it before.

aehaas
     
gix
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Cali
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 14, 2006, 10:31 PM
 
TheSpaz,
I have been sent to a mac lab in an art college by connection, and i have compared my mbp c2d with many G4 and mpb cd (there were many students with all different mac). And yes, the conclusion is, almost all of the lcd has this grainy issue. even the glossy screen on mbp looks a bit sparkly too. the only one w/o this problem might be the glossy screen macbook. well...at least the tech and couple of students agreed with me. so i guess it is not the video card issue at this point.

But, i do agree with what a student said,"either you keep the matte screen or get a glossy one with reflection." And half of the students at the lab did not notice this grainy issue when we asked them if they noticed anything of this screen. but after i pointed out the issue, many of them still dont think it bothers them because they got used to this already. Then we plug a Dell 20' widescreen to the mac and we have noticed that it also has this sparkly feeling, but just slightly better than mbp.

So after this, I decide to keep my mbp; because i went to the store again and i really do not like the glossy one.

And for people who believe it was the video card, i think dont expect apple would release a firmware to fix this problem, because it is the display. and i doubt if apple would use new display since the old powerbook has the same issue and they would replace it long time ago if they admit it.
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 15, 2006, 11:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by gix View Post
TheSpaz,
I have been sent to a mac lab in an art college by connection, and i have compared my mbp c2d with many G4 and mpb cd (there were many students with all different mac). And yes, the conclusion is, almost all of the lcd has this grainy issue. even the glossy screen on mbp looks a bit sparkly too. the only one w/o this problem might be the glossy screen macbook. well...at least the tech and couple of students agreed with me. so i guess it is not the video card issue at this point.

But, i do agree with what a student said,"either you keep the matte screen or get a glossy one with reflection." And half of the students at the lab did not notice this grainy issue when we asked them if they noticed anything of this screen. but after i pointed out the issue, many of them still dont think it bothers them because they got used to this already. Then we plug a Dell 20' widescreen to the mac and we have noticed that it also has this sparkly feeling, but just slightly better than mbp.

So after this, I decide to keep my mbp; because i went to the store again and i really do not like the glossy one.

And for people who believe it was the video card, i think dont expect apple would release a firmware to fix this problem, because it is the display. and i doubt if apple would use new display since the old powerbook has the same issue and they would replace it long time ago if they admit it.
Yes: I agree. Every LCD display that I ever used has this sparkle effect to a degree, however it's REALLY BAD on my MacBook Pro and that it why I'm returning it. I looked closer at my PowerBook G4 and it's a very little bit sparkly and so is the LCD I use at work, however it's a very small amount and doesn't bother me at all. The MacBook Pro is a different story though... maybe I got a worse one than you did... maybe it's very subtle to you on yours but, it's very "in-your-face-obvious" on mine and I'm sorry but, I cannot live with that. I just didn't wanna drop $2,500 on a computer and be unhappy using it. If it works for you, then that's cool too. What it really comes down to is, are you happy with it? If so, that's great and I hope you stay happy but, I've already packed it up and it's going back tonight. I'm getting a Mac Pro with a 20" LCD (but, I'm gonna look at it first before I buy it )
     
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 15, 2006, 12:13 PM
 
Have You seen MBP C2D 17" model display? How it looks?
     
TheSpaz  (op)
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Nov 15, 2006, 12:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by Sulev View Post
Have You seen MBP C2D 17" model display? How it looks?
I have not. If anyone has seen the 17" MBP C2D Screen... let us know what it looks like.
     
 
Thread Tools
Forum Links
Forum Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On
Top
Privacy Policy
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:28 PM.
All contents of these forums © 1995-2015 MacNN. All rights reserved.
Branding + Design: www.gesamtbild.com
vBulletin v.3.8.8 © 2000-2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2