[imdipped]

The MacBook (Late 2007) - Technical Specifications list the Operating temperature as: 50° to 95° F (10° to 35° C)
MacBook (Late 2007) - Technical Specifications

I read on this forum that most think 130 –140 F is normal. What gives; I’ve always heard that heat is the enemy.

I will be purchasing a MacBook later this month and upping the ram to 4GB. The added heat of the 800Mhz frontside bus, the X3100 GPU and the extra ram will make it hotter than before. I am considering going with the 2GHz model for that reason. I expect that is why Apple redesigned the vents, and not for cosmetic or model identification purposes. I hope it’s not marginal. I don’t know if Apple shot themselves in the foot by trying to have such thin notebooks when it’s so hard to control the heat and still have a quiet notebook.

If Apple introduced a 15 incher, I would probably have opted for that to get greater heat dissipation. It’s not that much larger.

After all that, this Crestline MacBook is the one I have waiting for.

[adamfishercox]

Apple didn't make a computer that will die when you put supported RAM in it. You will be fine, and choosing a lower speed processor shouldn't make a difference really.

[mduell]

Note that's an environmental requirement, i.e. the temperature of the room the MacBook is in should be in that range. Typical CPU operating temperatures range from 95-120F at idle and 120-190F at full load. See Section 5 of this pdf for full details on the maximum operating temperature and the chip's thermal management system.

And karma to you for calling it Crestline; it's actually Crestline-GM, but I won't pick that nit.

[imdipped]

Thank you mduell, I learned Crestline from you, and now Crestline-GM.

[frdmfghtr]

While on the topic of environment, why is the altitude important? The only thing I can think of is that the lower air density at altitude would affect air cooling.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by frdmfghtr 

While on the topic of environment, why is the altitude important? The only thing I can think of is that the lower air density at altitude would affect air cooling.

For the hard drive... there are a lot more limitations than Apple mentions, including limits on temperature change (typically 36F/hour) and wet bulb temperature.

[Marek]

Originally Posted by mduell 

Note that's an environmental requirement, i.e. the temperature of the room the MacBook is in should be in that range. Typical CPU operating temperatures range from 95-120F at idle and 120-190F at full load. See Section 5 of this pdf for full details on the maximum operating temperature and the chip's thermal management system.

That's interesting. since i put Leopard on my MacBook (the one from May07), with 2 GB RAM, the cooler is all the time on. i put iStat Pro, and checked the temperature-it never falls under 61C. That is 141F!?
Although the system is actually idle at 93%.
that means 7-8% workload. i already uinstalled things in the dashboard that could do something i dont know..but it is the same.

anyone with MacBook and Leopard?

i am thinking of going back Tiger.

[Dork.]

I wouldn't worry too much about how hot the chips get under load. The essential thing is whether or not that heat is getting away from sensitive components in a timely fashion. These systems are designed to dissipate the heat.

If you're concerned about heat damage to your laptop, the best thing you can dos is not use it directly on your lap and make sre all the vents are clear. Remember, Apple does not call their portable computers "laptops" anymore -- they are "notebooks". This is not only because the computers tend to get warm (and they don;t want to get sued if you get injured due to the heat), but also because if you are using them on a soft surface (like your lap) that blocks the airflow through the vents, the computer can overheat.

If you want to use the computer on your lap, get a lap desk, or put it on something hard, like a book.

For what it's worth, I have a new MacBook, and I don't think ti gets much warmer to the touch than any other Apple laptop. In fact, I think the MBP's get warmer....

[frdmfghtr]

Originally Posted by Marek 

That's interesting. since i put Leopard on my MacBook (the one from May07), with 2 GB RAM, the cooler is all the time on. i put iStat Pro, and checked the temperature-it never falls under 61C. That is 141F!?
Although the system is actually idle at 93%.
that means 7-8% workload. i already uinstalled things in the dashboard that could do something i dont know..but it is the same.

anyone with MacBook and Leopard?

i am thinking of going back Tiger.

Define "all the time on." If you mean never below 1800 RPM, that's normal; the fan will never drop below that when operating. My MacBook sits at 140F nearly all the time when on AC power, with occasional drops to the 120-130F range when at home with the heat turned down, on the battery, doing simple things like web surfing.

(Just checked now via iStat Pro...117F just running Firefox)

[Marek]

Originally Posted by frdmfghtr 

Define "all the time on." If you mean never below 1800 RPM, that's normal; the fan will never drop below that when operating. My MacBook sits at 140F nearly all the time when on AC power, with occasional drops to the 120-130F range when at home with the heat turned down, on the battery, doing simple things like web surfing.

(Just checked now via iStat Pro...117F just running Firefox)

hi,
i didnt check the RPM, i can't tell you know, but i know i can hear the cooler, whereas under Tiger i could hear it only at the full load.

yeah see, you have 117F just running Firefox, i have over 140F when running Safari, not even surfin, just writing the post here. that's not normal. it is Intel Core2Duo, 2.0 MHz. and there's also some space between laptop and the desk.

[frdmfghtr]

Yes, 117F...in a room with the heat turned down, running on the battery only, with minimum load. If I understand right, the Core 2 Duo will go into a reduced power/performance state when on the battery and with low load, and run at full performance when on AC power.

I'm sitting at 140F right now, using Safari this time, plugged into the wall. I had these same temperature behaviors under Tiger.

When you have the fan on and the temperature at 140F, are you on AC power or the battery?

[Marek]

hmmm..funny.

i'm always on AC power.

is your fan on at 140F?

[frdmfghtr]

Yes, 1800 rpm. This the fan's minimum speed-it will never run slower than this.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by frdmfghtr 

While on the topic of environment, why is the altitude important? The only thing I can think of is that the lower air density at altitude would affect air cooling.

You're right, but there are other issues. mduell points out that higher altitudes could impact the hard drive (pressure differentials inside and outside the drive are sometimes a problem), but there are other parts that could be affected as well. For example, both cooling and pressure differential can affect how electrolytic capacitors behave at different altitudes. Note that there are three different maximum altitudes stated: max operating, max storage, and max shipping. These reflect the physical and electrical conditions of the computer in the three different situations.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by ghporter 

You're right, but there are other issues. mduell points out that higher altitudes could impact the hard drive (pressure differentials inside and outside the drive are sometimes a problem)

Actually hard drives are vented (that little white hole that says 'DO NOT COVER') to equalize the pressure, but I think the issue is a minimum air density inside the hard drive for the heads to glide on.

[ghporter]

That's an actual vent? I thought it was an overpressure port. Today I learned something new.

[mduell]

It's a vent hole with a very fine filter on it...