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voodoo · 06:18 PM

None. We have waited an extra bastard half a year for NOTHING!

I. AM. SO. MAD!!!

http://www.insidemacgames.com/news/s...ArticleID=6834

Schilling said that they've decided to cancel the port of the toolset. He told IMG that the development of the toolset had to be halted because it would have taken over a year to port it to the Mac. Schilling explained that the project to port the toolset was underway, but as the developers (Omni Group) dug deeper into the code, the estimate grew from 6 months to over a year of development time. So instead of delaying the game another 6 months, the hard decision to cancel the toolset was made.

This has been a bad week for Bioware RPG fans.

Gul Banana · Jan 8, 2003, 04:41 AM

Damnit, that is so the last straw... there is no way in hell I'm buying the game now.

Guy Incognito · Jan 8, 2003, 06:33 AM

Why does this surprise anyone? I knew something like this would probably happen.

The company is dishonest with their potential Mac customers, saying the game was close to being finished last summer and then suddenly becoming very quiet and only posting updates on a very obscur non-Mac gaming site instead of their own frickin' webpage.

Screw BioWare...even if it's a Canadian company I should be supporting.

voodoo · Jan 8, 2003, 06:18 PM

This is not Bioware's fault AFAIK. The blame lies with MacPlay. It is a terribly lousy company.

Hope they get their act together in the future.

mac freak · Jan 8, 2003, 07:42 PM

What the #$%&!?

I thought the god damn toolset was the reason we didn't GET TO PLAY THIS GAME LAST FRIGGIN' AUGUST!? As I have said in many a NWN thread before, Bioware is lying scum... LYING SCUM!

It's now quite obvious that NOTHING was happening with the Mac port before the PC version was released, even though Bioware claimed "simultaneous development & release." We were supposed to get this game months ago, but didn't "because MacPlay had decided to port the toolset," plus the impression that the rest of the game was PORTED ALREADY.... which seemed acceptable; this game is half a game without that toolset.

In short, I'm disappointed. ARGH.
ARGH.

By the way -- I've played the PC version, and it's not as good as BG1 or 2. So don't be too mad/excited

a2daj · Jan 8, 2003, 10:19 PM

First, MacPlay has nothing to do with NWN. MacSoft will be publishing it.
Second, where have you people been, under a rock? The Mac port of the game portion was no where close to being done. The NWN site had a link to the Mac game progress. While yes, the tools are a HUGE part of the game, the Mac version will still get the client, server, single player game, and the ability to play other people's mods.

Actually, I do blame Bioware more than MacSoft. Bioware was the company that decided to create the tools using non-cross platform dev tools (Borland RAD tools, or whatever it's called). MacSoft stepped up to the plate and at least attempted to get the tools ported. The major complaint I have with MacSoft is that they didn't announce the status of the tools until now, something that seems they've known about for several months. Now if they charge the full $60 MSRP for the game, then I'd be even more upset.
I am disappointed as the rest of you, but try and get the facts straight and put everything into perspectve before venting.

SteevAK · Jan 8, 2003, 10:22 PM

I just wanted to point out your topic title is redundant.

I'm not interested at all in NWN, but I feel your pain. It sucks.

Atef's Carcase · Jan 8, 2003, 10:42 PM

It is a bit redundant to use 'friggin' and the other word--'friggin' is meant as a sterile replacement for the nastier one. You really didn't need to use the bad one here. In the Lounge I'd understand, but in Games it is unfortunate to see that it hasn't been edited out, or, worse yet, corrected by yourself.

cutterjohn · Jan 8, 2003, 11:40 PM

Originally posted by voodoo:
None. We have waited an extra bastard half a year for NOTHING!

I. AM. SO. MAD!!!

http://www.insidemacgames.com/news/s...ArticleID=6834

This has been a bad week for Bioware RPG fans.

yep, NWN w/o the toolset is sort of like a car on cinder blocks, no wheels, and no engine to boot.

scratch yet another purchase. Off to buy the windoze version we go.

blizzard · Jan 9, 2003, 12:30 AM

Yeah...I've been trying to edit it, but between the forum outages and the fact that I am somehow unable to edit that message, it's been complicated. I'll post in the mod forum and get one of the admins to take care of it.

voodoo · 05:12 AM

Originally posted by Atef's Carcase:
It is a bit redundant to use 'friggin' and the other word--'friggin' is meant as a sterile replacement for the nastier one. You really didn't need to use the bad one here. In the Lounge I'd understand, but in Games it is unfortunate to see that it hasn't been edited out, or, worse yet, corrected by yourself.

Well Atef, you pillar of morality and good language, thank you.

It is the forum outages that are to blame for the profanity in the thread title. I wrote it as I was angry and then I edited it, but when I hit the edit button the forums went south and apparently another identical thread was created. But nobody posted in it. Hm. Apparently people wnated to post here. You people could have let it die by NOT posting here. Damn it.

Now, I'll let you in on something Atef. YOU ARE REDUNDANT.

Got that? Good.

http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.p...hreadid=139267

[edit: added the url to the thread with the politically correct thread]

voodoo · Jan 9, 2003, 02:30 AM

Originally posted by SteevAK:
I just wanted to point out your topic title is redundant.

I'm not interested at all in NWN, but I feel your pain. It sucks.

Thanks.

MickS · 04:26 AM

Whatever people think about MacSoft the primary fault here sits squarely with BioWare for the following reasons:

1. It was BioWare that said that they would release a single product that would run on PC, Linux and Mac.

2. When developing the toolset they chose to do it without any consideration of the porting issues.

Now MacSoft do deserve some criticism for coming into the arena and saying "We'll do that in n months" without any idea of what was involved.

The other issue here is that MacSoft have decided that that's it. It would take too long (cost too much) to port the toolset, so they aren't going to do it. This will have been an economic decision based on the likely sales of a standalone toolset or "NWN Complete" version. This IMO is a shame, even if it was going to take a while it might be worth something to do this.

a2daj · Jan 9, 2003, 12:02 PM

MacSoft, not MacPlay.

MindFad · Jan 9, 2003, 01:20 PM

Well, there goes the interest in it. I love modding games, and this was a big selling point. Oh well. I miss making Myth 2 maps.

Those were the days.

Guy Incognito · Jan 9, 2003, 01:29 PM

Last I heard, the minimum requirements for NWN for Mac was going to be an 800MHz G4. That combined with no DM toolset (the primary thing that made NWN shine compare to all the other RPG games...and probably the only reason for getting NWN) is starting to make me believe BioWare will sell about 138 copies of NWN.

This will anger BioWare to no end. And I will laugh...and laugh. Poor suckers.

Atef's Carcase · Jan 9, 2003, 01:36 PM

Those of us who are mature dealt with the outages with patience and composure. You, voodoo, opted for the juvenile delinquent approach. The topic title has been edited, either by you or an admin, so I stand vindicated, despite your temper-tantrum.

voodoo · Jan 9, 2003, 02:17 PM

Originally posted by Atef's Carcase:
Those of us who are mature dealt with the outages with patience and composure. You, voodoo, opted for the juvenile delinquent approach. The topic title has been edited, either by you or an admin, so I stand vindicated, despite your temper-tantrum.

Here is a suggestion for you: Drop dead.

Hypocrite

Guy Incognito · Jan 9, 2003, 04:42 PM

Originally posted by Atef's Carcase:
Those of us who are mature dealt with the outages with patience and composure. You, voodoo, opted for the juvenile delinquent approach. The topic title has been edited, either by you or an admin, so I stand vindicated, despite your temper-tantrum.

Give me an EFFIN' break!

Dude, you're taking the internet way too seriously...go take a breath of fresh air or something.

exca1ibur · Jan 12, 2003, 03:24 AM

LOL!

Good reply Guy and Voodoo.

I agree with you about NWN. The entire point of this game was to have a toolset to create our own campains. I have been waiting all this time for that MAIN feeature, now we loose it and they want us to pay the full price. ouch. Might have to let this one go, and hope for a better game in the future.

jmelrose · Jan 12, 2003, 08:41 AM

I'd like to suggest that all Mac users email Bioware/Macsoft and let them know that releasing 1/2 a product for the Mac had, at least, better mean releasing it at half price. (Or a large discount of some kind.) Perhaps that will at least give them pause as to their course of action.

Be polite, but be firm. And most of all, be ready to back up your words if they chose to release it at a similar pricepoint to the PC version: DON'T BUY IT. There are lots of other great RPGs out there, and my PC friends all tell me that the Neverwinter Nights single player campaign is nothing extraordinary (see BG2 for that). Spend your money on Freedom Force instead! Now there's a great game!

I, for one, am less interested in Neverwinter without the development tools, but a Bioware RPG for $29.99 SRP would be a lot more interesting...

juanvaldes · Jan 12, 2003, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by exca1ibur:
LOL! Good reply Guy and Voodoo.

I agree with you about NWN. The entire point of this game was to have a toolset to create our own campains. I have been waiting all this time for that MAIN feeature, now we loose it and they want us to pay the full price. ouch. Might have to let this one go, and hope for a better game in the future.

because of this I will not buy the game. It's that simple. I waited 6 months for nothing, and now they want me to pay the same price my friends did 6 months ago without the games main selling point? **** no.

proux · Jan 12, 2003, 05:16 PM

The Mac porting companies still don't get it. They release the games too late after the PC release date. This has several nasty effects on sales:

1) The game has lost its novelty appeal, something else is coming out soon.

2) By the time it is released on the Mac, the price is much lower for the PC version but you have to pay full price on the mac.

Add the fact that the PC version is more optimised, often more features...
If you are a real gamer either you already bought the game or can buy it cheaper for the PC.

And they are complaining sales are not good on the Mac?
Just put a little more money to port the game faster, release it less than 2 months after the PC and you will sell more copies, and have more money to port things like the MWN toolset.

And now they say that they can't port BG2: Throne of Bhaal because it is too late and the sales will be too low arg..
stupid stupid stupid people.

voodoo · Jan 12, 2003, 08:23 PM

proux: good points

Brad Oliver · Jan 12, 2003, 08:53 PM

Originally posted by proux:
The Mac porting companies still don't get it. They release the games too late after the PC release date.

Every Mac publisher and porting house is painfully aware of these realities. What most Mac gamers are not aware of, however, is that the increased cost of simultaneous development is greater than the revenue received from the increased Mac copies sold whne a Mac release is simultaneous or near-simultaneous.

Sure, this sucks but it's not going to change unless the Mac market grows more to absorb the added costs involved.

Gul Banana · Jan 12, 2003, 09:04 PM

That's... an interesting insight. And not at all a pleasant one:/ I'm glad that games aren't all that important to me, or it would be very depressing indeed.

proux · Jan 13, 2003, 04:32 PM

Brad,
of course you have a much greater insight than most of us...
but we are not talking about simultaneous releases, just less than 2 months apart. Unfortunatly real gamer mindset is that a Mac game will come out too late after the PC version. Thus he will own a PC and buy PC games. How many such people would dump their PC if they knew they had a fair chances to get the games they want? Oh well, it is all about market share anyway, if only Macs would be 10/15% of the market...

BTW great job with JKII...

Brad Oliver · Jan 14, 2003, 04:53 AM

Originally posted by proux:
but we are not talking about simultaneous releases, just less than 2 months apart.

For all practical purposes, 2 months apart is "nearly simultaneous" since it means that Mac development was likely ongoing for several months before the PC project went final.

mac freak · Jan 20, 2003, 11:17 PM

I was a bitter Mac gamer for years.
And years.
And years.

So I gave in and bought a KVM switch to share my monitor/peripherals with a pure gaming PC.

Now I just don't need to worry about all the �ber-late shoddy ports the Mac gets. Bottom line is, Macs in their current state SUCK as a gaming platform. Of course, I still use the Mac for all my real work (photoshop, flash, fireworks, browsing, writing), since it's almost impossible for me to work in Windows...
heck, I even have a hard time working in OS X, so I still run 9.2.2

But I reccommend that any serious gamers out there that are still limiting themselves by owning only Macs pay a visit to www.ibuypower.com and build a gaming machine. Then you won't have anything left to be bitter about regarding Macs

g_procee · Jan 22, 2003, 08:49 AM

http://nwn.bioware.com/about/macversion.html says:

"[Jan 10 2003]
Just to clarify, the Mac version of Neverwinter Nights will include both the dedicated server and DM client in addition to the main game.
"

voodoo · Jan 22, 2003, 10:07 AM

Well that sounds good. But I don't know whom to belive anymore.

Well, I am of an optimistic nature so I'll choose to belive Bioware