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You are here: MacNN Forums > Enthusiast Zone > Gaming > PS3, Wii or XB360

View Poll Results: Which ones would it have to be ?
Poll Options:
Sony PlayStation 3 202 votes (31.91%)
Nintendo Wii 328 votes (51.82%)
Microsoft XBox 360 213 votes (33.65%)
None 34 votes (5.37%)
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 633. You may not vote on this poll
PS3, Wii or XB360 (Page 35)
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Nov 13, 2006, 02:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dark Helmet View Post
Turns out the PS2 has the biggest library, most 3rd party support and does 1080i when the Wii can't 6 years later..
Would you please stop repeating that the PS2 can do 1080i? It makes no difference if Gran Turismo can be played in 1080i -- 99% of PS2 games can't even come CLOSE. If the PS2 has better graphics than the Wii I will eat my Wiimote (when I get it).
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 02:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
Would you please stop repeating that the PS2 can do 1080i? It makes no difference if Gran Turismo can be played in 1080i -- 99% of PS2 games can't even come CLOSE. If the PS2 has better graphics than the Wii I will eat my Wiimote (when I get it).
thank you icruise

Zelda is a gamecube port and it looks just as good as most ps2 games (gameplay in games that is, FMV does not count)

just look at madden 07 for wii and for ps2..look at the gameplay videos, i think the wii holds up if not better...
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Nov 13, 2006, 02:51 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
Would you please stop repeating that the PS2 can do 1080i? It makes no difference if Gran Turismo can be played in 1080i -- 99% of PS2 games can't even come CLOSE. If the PS2 has better graphics than the Wii I will eat my Wiimote (when I get it).
What difference does it make? It is not sony's fault other games are not in 1080i.

The PS2 that is 6 years old can do 1080i if the developers want. The Wii cannot. End of story.

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Nov 13, 2006, 02:52 PM
 
Originally Posted by Jolt21 View Post
Zelda is a gamecube port and it looks just as good as most ps2 games (gameplay in games that is, FMV does not count)

just look at madden 07 for wii and for ps2..look at the gameplay videos, i think the wii holds up if not better...
Why are you saying that like it is a good thing that a 6 year old system can look at good as one that hasn't even come out yet?

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Nov 13, 2006, 02:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dark Helmet View Post
Why are you saying that like it is a good thing that a 6 year old system can look at good as one that hasn't even come out yet?
because the wii is just the gamecube with a little bit more umph...not enought to look fresh right out the gate like the 360 did, so there will be overlap between the generations. eventually the developers will push it so that wii will be defined in the next generation. even from some of the e3 videos, one could see it coming...i would bet by the end of 07.

its not a big deal to me at all anyway, i will get the wii and another system
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Nov 13, 2006, 03:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dark Helmet View Post
What difference does it make? It is not sony's fault other games are not in 1080i.

The PS2 that is 6 years old can do 1080i if the developers want. The Wii cannot. End of story.
It couldn't be that the nature of Gran Turismo 2 made it one of the few games that the PS2 could output in Hi-Def?

But whatever. I'm getting a little tired of debating these same issues with you. You don't like the Wii. Every post you make, every article you link to, screams this. We get the point.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 03:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
It couldn't be that the nature of Gran Turismo 2 made it one of the few games that the PS2 could output in Hi-Def?
I don't remember the DVD of the game having a built in processor to help render higher resolutions but I'll double check.

Oh, and you can do a software hack to have ALL games output and up-convert to 720p and 1080i.

So ya, you better call it quits.

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Nov 13, 2006, 03:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dark Helmet View Post
I don't remember the DVD of the game having a built in processor to help render higher resolutions but I'll double check.
I'm saying that a racing game is very different from an FPS or platformer.

Oh, and you can do a software hack to have ALL games output and up-convert to 720p and 1080i.

So ya, you better call it quits.
I'd like to know more about that. Link please?
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 04:00 PM
 
Originally Posted by starman View Post
Right now, I think that the price and lack of games is a serious detrement to the PS3.

For the Wii, I'm PERSONALLY not sold on the remote. The lag in the store over the weekend, the lack of games I'm personally interested in (Excite truck??), really makes me wonder if the Wii is going to be a huge hit.

I'd really like to hear people's impressions of the Wiimote WHEN THEY USE IT. What were the conditions? How responsive was it? What games did you use?
(I was at the mall this weekend and was going to run over to Gamestop to try it, but there wasn't enough time. We were there for a movie and right afterwards had to drop off a friend. I did get a peek through the window, and people were in there having fun with it.)

A lot of people have been using it and have not had any lag, including people in this thread.
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Nov 13, 2006, 04:01 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
Yeah, I was going to say that. The PS2 launched with only 500,000 units in North America, although it had a LOT more units available during its Japanese launch. I don't think the PS3 shortages are going to be a problem over the long term, any more than the initial shortage of the Xbox 360 was.
The problem is PS3 is launching so late. PS2 launched early, so by the time it's competitors were on the market the supply shortages were over.

Sony is launching much later than the XBox 360 and about the same time as the Wii with much fewer units. Compared to the competition, it's marketshare will be very slim.
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Nov 13, 2006, 04:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by goMac View Post
The problem is PS3 is launching so late. PS2 launched early, so by the time it's competitors were on the market the supply shortages were over.
Dude, learn your history. The Dreamcast was already out for 13 months before the PS2.

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Nov 13, 2006, 04:07 PM
 
You could say that the Dreamcast was more of a competitor for the Playstation 1 and Nintendo 64, since they were the other systems out at the time (although it was of course superior to them technologically). I assume he was talking about the Gamecube and Xbox, both of which launched after the PS2. I realize that Sega was trying to get the jump on the competition by coming out so much earlier, but it didn't seem to help.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 04:08 PM
 
Is Nintendo the spin doctor of video games? - Joystiq

"But the way Nintendo spins things, this was a business that absolutely needed a new idea, or else face doom and destruction. In fact, while the games industry could always use new ideas, the entity which really needed to come up with something fantastic was and is Nintendo. It had been absolutely sidelined as a console manufacturer in the past decade, by competitors with more money and a superior ability to deliver technically advanced machines. If anyone NEEDED something new, it was Nintendo."

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Nov 13, 2006, 04:09 PM
 
Originally Posted by starman View Post
Dude, learn your history. The Dreamcast was already out for 13 months before the PS2.
The Dreamcast was nearly a DOA launch. The PS2 had a large lead on the Cube and the XBox. The Dreamcast and PS2 did not co-exist for that long.
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Nov 13, 2006, 04:09 PM
 
i just want xbox to die off, i have one and its crap. i am ashamed i left nintendo.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 04:10 PM
 
wow we posted at the same time!
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 04:22 PM
 


why would anyone want a crappy ps3 for 599 us dollars...599 us dollars 599 us dollars 599 us dollars 599 us dollars
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 04:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by Mellon View Post


why would anyone want a crappy ps3 for 599 us dollars...599 us dollars 599 us dollars 599 us dollars 599 us dollars
Because a blu-ray player is $1200 US dollars, $1200 US dollars, $1200 US dollars.

The games is gravy.

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Nov 13, 2006, 04:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dark Helmet View Post
Because a blu-ray player is $1200 US dollars, $1200 US dollars, $1200 US dollars.
Well, Amazon has Blueray players starting at $730, but it's still more than the PS3. Why don't you want an Xbox 360 HD DVD player? It's only $200.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 04:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
Why don't you want an Xbox 360 HD DVD player? It's only $200.
Plus $500 for the XBOX itself. And HD DVD is already losing the format war. In a few years your disks will be little more than expensive coasters. Nobody wants to invest in that.
( Last edited by TETENAL; Nov 13, 2006 at 05:29 PM. )
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 05:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by TETENAL View Post
Plus $500 for the XBOX itself. And HD DVD is already loosing the format war. In a few years your disks will be little more than expensive coasters. Nobody wants to invest in that.
First of all, it's $400 for the Xbox. Secondly, I was directing that specifically at Dark Helmet, since he already has an Xbox 360.

I imagine that the drives of the future will read both Blueray and HD-DVD, assuming that they both have some success. There are already such dual-format drives being made.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 05:18 PM
 
HD DVD is winning the format war by a wide margin at the moment and the Xbox 360 only costs $400. Thanks for playing though.

At any rate, the format war hasn't really begun yet, since the PS3 isn't out yet. But to say HD-DVD is losing is so far from the truth it can be considered a complete lie. How exactly is HD-DVD losing? It's selling much better, costs half as much, has a better movie library and every credible source has stated that the movies look better on HD-DVD then they do on Blu-Ray.

The PS3 can and will change the entire game, but until Blu-Ray comes down in price, and the PS3 is widely available and they start using better codecs, HD-DVD is going to remain the champ. The home theater crowd is embracing HD-DVD and shunning Blu-Ray.

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Nov 13, 2006, 06:20 PM
 
Originally Posted by TETENAL View Post
Plus $500 for the XBOX itself. And HD DVD is already losing the format war. In a few years your disks will be little more than expensive coasters. Nobody wants to invest in that.
LOL. How in the WORLD do you come up with some BS statement like that? BR is getting its ASS KICKED right now.

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Nov 13, 2006, 06:24 PM
 
I am total awe of this thing. It's just that jawdroppingly good.

<-- Click to enlarge.

If you have an Xbox 360 and an HDTV, GET ONE NOW!!
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 06:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by starman View Post
LOL. How in the WORLD do you come up with some BS statement like that? BR is getting its ASS KICKED right now.
Yeap. Quite handily.

Our local Hollywood Video store used to have a "Next Generation DVD" section that had both formats. Now it's just HD-DVD.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 06:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
First of all, it's $400 for the Xbox. Secondly, I was directing that specifically at Dark Helmet, since he already has an Xbox 360.
Actually I saw an XBox 360 Core for $200 today. $300 for the premium.
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Nov 13, 2006, 06:27 PM
 
Originally Posted by starman View Post
LOL. How in the WORLD do you come up with some BS statement like that? BR is getting its ASS KICKED right now.
Does anyone have numbers?

Either way it is not surprising considering ONE blu-ray player is on the market.

Check back in a year.

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Nov 13, 2006, 06:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by Eug Wanker View Post
I am total awe of this thing. It's just that jawdroppingly good.

If you have an Xbox 360 and an HDTV, GET ONE NOW!!
Two questions: How is the noise? And did you use the Circuit City deal?
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 06:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by goMac View Post
Actually I saw an XBox 360 Core for $200 today. $300 for the premium.
Was that after the $100 Microcenter rebate I heard about?
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 06:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
Was that after the $100 Microcenter rebate I heard about?
Yeah. I was thinking about getting one. I want an XBox 360 but so far haven't felt the urge to spring for one yet. $300 for a premium might be just right.
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Nov 13, 2006, 06:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
Two questions: How is the noise? And did you use the Circuit City deal?
The drive is quieter than the Xbox 360 itself, and it's WAY quieter than the Xbox 360's DVD drive.

ie. The HD DVD drive's noise is insignificant. If anyone is going to complain about anything, it would be about the fans in the Xbox 360. Luckily for me, when the soundtracks are playing, I don't hear the Xbox 360.

I'm in Canada so I did not use that CC deal. (We don't have CC. Or sort of... Radio Shack was bought out by CC, but they are still the same Radio Shack stores.) Fortunately, it's only $199 CAD here, which is US$175, including the remote and King Kong.

P.S. Here is the drive on my Mac:

     
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Nov 13, 2006, 06:41 PM
 
Does it actually do anything connected to the Mac?
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 06:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
Does it actually do anything connected to the Mac?
Well, it can read CDs and DVDs. However, when I stick in an HD DVD, I get:



HD DVDs should become readable in Leopard (as they are in Vista), but the commercial HD DVDs still won't be playable until Apple implements AACS and VC-1 support, etc. into DVD Player.app.

BTW, under Vista, the drive gets seen as a Toshiba DVD/HD X807616 USB Device.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 06:46 PM
 
How is the speed on loading movies?

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Nov 13, 2006, 06:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by starman View Post
How is the speed on loading movies?
Pretty fast. Not quite as fast as my DVD player, but pretty good. It's certainly way faster than what is described for the Toshiba HD-A1.

One cool thing is that the menu is an overlay to the playing movie.

ie. When I'm watching Corpse Bride and press "Menu", a see-thru menu overlay pops up at the bottom of the screen, but the movie continues to play. If I select "Scene selection", then I get a translucent film-strip of scenes at the bottom like that film-strip at the top of iPhoto...



I can scroll through the images and pick the scene I want.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 08:55 PM
 
Originally Posted by Eug Wanker View Post
I am total awe of this thing. It's just that jawdroppingly good.

<-- Click to enlarge.

If you have an Xbox 360 and an HDTV, GET ONE NOW!!
Honestly, I'm not going to buy one, simply for the facts that I don't watch movies all that often, and that the format war isn't over. If Blu-ray wins, I don't want to be stuck with an expensive decoration.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 09:36 PM
 
Mission Impossible: III - Scene selection:



Selecting a video commentary:



Viewing picture-in-picture video commentary:




King Kong - Normal screen:



Interactivity:



Scene selection (while movie is playing):



Bookmarks:




Corpse Bride - Special Features menu (while movie is playing):

     
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Nov 13, 2006, 09:57 PM
 
As soon as I get my HDTV, I'm going for it.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 10:27 PM
 
Gears of War, looks really impressive. Once M$ makes the system smaller n quieter with a built in HD-DVD drive, ill probably get one(XB360).

My personal opinion here.... looks like HD-DVD is going to win the format war.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 10:43 PM
 
Originally Posted by Hawkeye_a View Post
My personal opinion here.... looks like HD-DVD is going to win the format war.
I agree, but why do you think it is?

As silly as it sounds, I think that HD and DVD are both terms that people are familiar with already, so they might gravtitate towards that. The informed might realize some of the advantages of Blue Ray, but the average consumer might lean towards HD-DVD for that, among other reasons.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 10:47 PM
 
BlueRay is going to win once the PlayStation 3 becomes more available. When everybody already just has the player, they will obviously purchase media in that format instead of an extra HD-DVD player or $200 add-on for the XBOX.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 10:56 PM
 
Don't expect your PS1 and PS2 games to be work properly on the PS3. If you have a PS2, then keep it.


Originally Posted by TETENAL View Post
BlueRay is going to win once the PlayStation 3 becomes more available. When everybody already just has the player, they will obviously purchase media in that format instead of an extra HD-DVD player or $200 add-on for the XBOX.
I think Blu-ray may win Japan. I think HD DVD will win everywhere else in the world.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 10:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by TETENAL View Post
BlueRay is going to win once the PlayStation 3 becomes more available. When everybody already just has the player, they will obviously purchase media in that format instead of an extra HD-DVD player or $200 add-on for the XBOX.
Maybe, maybe not. When the PS2 first came out it seemed like a good deal to get a DVD player included with it. But soon DVD players plummeted in price and I don't think in the long term all that many people used the PS2 as a DVD player (or at least not their main DVD player). Of course, the thing about HD-DVD/Blu-ray is that you really need an HDTV to get the most out of it, so this time around you're probably not going to be seeing as many "$30 specials" sold at Walmart to the trailer park crowd. It's going to be a much more limited audience until HDTV itself really starts to catch on.

Don't expect your PS1 and PS2 games to be work properly on the PS3. If you have a PS2, then keep it.
I plan to keep my PS2 in any case, but having trouble with 200 out of all the PS1 and PS2 titles (how many games is that, I wonder?) isn't too terrible coming out of the starting gate. They will continue to fine-tune the emulation.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 11:00 PM
 
the fact that they make the HD look like the DVD logo and make it look normal, made me think that it was the "official" thing, and blu-ray was just a 3rd party media at first.
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Nov 13, 2006, 11:07 PM
 
The game trading site Goozex.com (which I recommend by the way) has listings for 2752 PS1 games and 3806 PS2 games. (I think they recently added some imports to their listings, and there are sometimes games that were never even produced listed there, but it should be a ballpark figure). So 200 is a fraction of a percent of the entire library that has trouble on the PS3. Compare that to the Xbox 360, which has a pretty limited list of Xbox 1 games that are backwards compatible.

Edit: Wikipedia says that there have been 1,319 PS2 games released in North America. It doesn't say how many PS1 games were released for North America, but combined the number must be at least 3-4,000.
( Last edited by icruise; Nov 13, 2006 at 11:23 PM. )
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 11:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by TETENAL View Post
BlueRay is going to win once the PlayStation 3 becomes more available. When everybody already just has the player, they will obviously purchase media in that format instead of an extra HD-DVD player or $200 add-on for the XBOX.
Yeah, just like UMD won because everybody had that player.
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Nov 13, 2006, 11:33 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chuckit View Post
Yeah, just like UMD won because everybody had that player.
I don't think that comparison holds true, though, since UMDs could only be played in the PSP (which not not everyone had, by any means) and they were often more expensive than the DVDs! But Blu-ray is a standard that many manufacturers can choose to manufacture players for.
     
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Nov 13, 2006, 11:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
I don't think that comparison holds true, though, since UMDs could only be played in the PSP (which not not everyone had, by any means) and they were often more expensive than the DVDs! But Blu-ray is a standard that many manufacturers can choose to manufacture players for.
Yeah, but the argument here was that Blu-Ray would win because everybody would already have PS3s and nobody would want to buy extra players. Once we acknowledge that third-party players make or break the format, we can no longer claim the PS3 will be the deciding factor.

In fact, I'd say the success of the PS3 in America is still a big question. Japan likes its own companies, and will favor Sony over Microsoft. The US just might favor Microsoft over Sony this time around. If PS3 sales are lukewarm, and Blu-Ray is depending on that, Blu-Ray is screwed.
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Nov 13, 2006, 11:53 PM
 
Originally Posted by Jawbone54 View Post
I agree, but why do you think it is?

As silly as it sounds, I think that HD and DVD are both terms that people are familiar with already, so they might gravtitate towards that. The informed might realize some of the advantages of Blue Ray, but the average consumer might lean towards HD-DVD for that, among other reasons.
A combination of factors actually.

If i were a studio-exec/content-provider.... i would be cautious of a single corporation in charge of a format. I think most people in the business are aware of corporations like Microsoft, Sony...even Apple rying to control the channel of delivery. Examples being.... Windows and iTMS. If i were a content provider id be cautious of making that mistake with the movie industry.

As a "semi-informaed" consumer i dont want a monopoly to exist. the reason why so many people are tied to windows is cause of what M$ did, and that inevitably leads to higher costs and lower quality. iTMS might suffer from this eventually, but there is a healthy dose of competition. the very nature of formats is that its single goal is to be the primary medium for a particular industry. competition is a no-no. and id rather have the DVD/MPEG consortium in charge of a format than a corporation be it Microsoft/Sony/Apple.

As an average consumer (who usually make/break a format)... price.

Most people will argue capasity, speeds and specs..... inconsequestial if you ask me. the goal is HD Video delivery. they both do that.
( Last edited by Hawkeye_a; Nov 14, 2006 at 12:03 AM. )
     
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Nov 14, 2006, 12:15 AM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
They will continue to fine-tune the emulation.
That's the strangest part of all this. The PS3 does not use emulation. It has a PS2 onboard.
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