[Fink-Nottle]

Just looking for some opinions here.

I'm running Mac OS X on an iMac. I've just updated to Adobe Golive 6 but I'm wondering what the best application would be for producing web graphics. I have been using Photoshop 5LE but it's not ideal... I'd probably be better off with a vector package.

Anyway, my options as far as I can see are:
-Photoshop 7
-Illustrator X
-Deneba Canavas
-Corel Graphics Suite
-Stone Create
-?

Needless to say, money is a big factor. Any opinions greatfully accepted.

[pobodysnerfect]

well if you could stand working in classic mode for awhile longer then IMHO Fireworks is hands down the best WEB graphics application out there. Photoshop is great for photos and can have a higher learning curve. Illustrator is my favorite for print projects and I have not used Deneba, Corel or Stone products so I can't speak to them.
As for needing a vector package, when it comes to web work you will be mostly producing gif and jpeg files as small as you can and will not benefit from vector graphics, unless you want a dynamic site in which case I would recommend Flash which is a vector based web animation program. Hope this helps...

[Bobby]

I use 3 graphics programs. Photoshop, Photoshop, and Photoshop.

I took a class on photoshop & since then I don't use any other graphics applications...

[Griggsy]

Since it went to 6 (adn now 7, OS X tastic), nothing touches Photshop, and even if it did, there's Imageready sitting there in the background to lend morale support

[CreamKoRn]

All the graphic programs that i have used do not compare to photoshop 7. The programs I have used are Photoshop, Freehand 10, Illustrator 10, Corel Graphics Suite and alot more. Even though Photoshop 7 has a high learning curve, once you learn it you never use anything else.

[Millennium]

Yo be honest, Photoshop and Illustrator shouldn't really be compared; one's a bitmap editor and the other is a vector editor. They work in completely different ways, and there's times when you'd want to use one but not the other.

Also, don't underestimate the GIMP. While it's certainly not suitable for actual photographs (RGB colorspace only, and no color management) it's actually quite good for Web graphics. Of course, it does mean you'll have to use XFree, and that causes problems of its own. But given its price, it's at least worth a try.

[Justin W. Williams]

Whatever happened to that Cocoa port of GIMP?

[l008com]

I suggest you buy the Adobe Web Bundle, once it contains all OS X programs, which it might now. Golive 6 and Photoshop 7 are all you really need. If you know how to use them, they can do anything. Except drawing vector art, but Illustrator comes with the bundle too doesn't it? SO then you're really ALL SET.

[Fink-Nottle]

Hello all,

Thanks for all the advice. I've been playing with some options which I'll relay for anyone who's interested.

-I downloaded the Illustrator 10 demo ($400, http://www.adobe.com/illustrator). It's obviously powerful but it's rather daunting and almost certainly overkill for my needs.

-I downloaded the Stone Studio demo ($299 or $150 for the main 'Create' application - http://www.stone.com). There are alot of things I REALLY like about this package. It's simple and quite powerful. However, a big drawback is that it will only output rasterized graphics at 72 dpi. That's okay for webwork but I find that rather limiting. Obviously I could output as EPS or PDF and convert using another applications... but why?

-I tried iDraw. ($40, http://www.MacPowerUser.com/) For the price it's good (and it's a very cheap way to produce SWF files) but I ran into some graphic glitches. I'll keep an eye on future updates though.

That leaves Deneba Canvas ($350, http://www.deneba.com) and the Corel Suite ($550, http://www.corel.com). I'm going to try the Canvas demo but the Corel software has no demo and as it's fairly pricey I'm not very keen. If anyone uses these apps I 'd be curious to get an opinion. Both of them are ranked fairly well on versiontracker.

Thanks again all!

(edit: fixed URL)

[ 04-23-2002: Message edited by: Fink-Nottle ]

[MemeTransport]

I'm glad you are going to try Deneba Canvas. It is a hugely under-rated app. It's not as slick as some of the other packages but it's amazing what it will do. I love its blending modes (I think it calls them sprites).

Try the demo of Fireworks too. You get some very decent power and web tools in one package. It makes things like drop menus and roll overs much easier to do. Macromedia has a couple of bundles with Fireworks that are worth a look too.

That said, consider bundles like Adobe's. What other posters have written about Photoshop is true. They're alot o' bucks and a bit daunting but once you get a handle on them they really do give you almost unlimited power.

PS. If you decide to keep it simple with something like Fireworks then I'd strongly recommend a good text editor. There are some (nearly-) free ones, several decent X-Windows ones (eg. Bluefish) and BBedit. Once I got used to writing HTML/XML in BBedit I found Dreamweaver and GoLive almost insufferable. You can learn lots from coding yourself too (BBedit makes it fairly easy by helping you fill in the tags).

Good Luck!

[MemeTransport]

Corel Graphics

I used to draw maps with Corel Draw on a PC in a production environment (3-5 maps a day every day). It isn't as slick as most of the other products. Corel has never been very good at interface design--they seem to prefer spending their time cramming in more features. Once I got used to it I found that it had some very nice features and conveniences: right click is your friend.

Photo-Paint is a decent editor but doesn't hold a candle to Photoshop.

Corel has a bad habit of not fully debugging their apps. Version 7 of Corel Draw was a nightmare. Versions since 9 are apparently better. The Mac versions have always been buggy though and not very well supported. The Mac version tends to get updated when Corel's strategy-of-the-week accidently includes Macs. That said, they are making some very pro-mac noises lately so maybe they mean it this time.

The Corel Suite give a lot of value for the money but I'd be wary of their support. :o

[Kenny]

Originally posted by Fink-Nottle:
<STRONG>Just looking for some opinions here.

I'm running Mac OS X on an iMac. I've just updated to Adobe Golive 6 but I'm wondering what the best application would be for producing web graphics.</STRONG>

I work for the last 12 years in graphic design and i've switch more than once from software to software, believe me from Paint (circa 1986), the very first illustrator, freehand to the latest on OS X. Right now the best is the Adobe collection GoLive/Photoshop/Illustrator...
Particularely impressive is how the each work together, although all the software can open another one automatically, look in the GoLive manual, you will be amaze what it can do with photoshop or illustrator files.

Since you indicate that you need an app for the web, i would'nt recommend a vector app, they are usually not as good in writing compressed images.

Although i did'nt try the latest Canvas or Corel offering, they always seem's more "amateurish" they simply don't feel "pro" enough for my taste. I've tried almost all the other package on OS X and even the most feature pack lack the finish of the Adobe line.

Another good bet is Macromedia Fireworks, working both in vector and bitmap in one software is a plus although i find the interface less than ideal, but you may find it ok. Firework is not out yet so you have to find an alternative way of getting it If your use to Photoshop, Firework may seem weird to you.

As for the actual HTML, GoLive tend to get more code in but only if you use the grid object, it is still IMHO the best wysiwyg HTML app out there. I tend to write a lot of code by hand so BBEdit (or something else) is really helpfull, you can even use the "view source" in Omniweb, you can write and save change and it's color coded.

Hope you find THE app that please you.

[funkboy]

Fireworks MX

Hail to the King, baby

[Fink-Nottle]

Greetings all and thanks for all the advice. I've really appreciated the input and I've considered it carefully while trying out the software. To respond to a couple of previous points:

-I wasn't too concerned about image optimization as I already have 'Adobe Golive 6'. You can bring in any image as a TIFF and the web optimization options kick in.

-I tried Deneba Canvas but it was painfully slow on my iMac 400 with 384 megs of RAM. I realize that's not the fastest machine but it felt like I was using Mac OS X 10.0 again.

-I use Dreamweaver and Fireworks for Windows at my other job and I've never been that impressed by them. I find them unintuitive and the interface often clunky. I know people that love them and can do great stuff with them... but they grate on me.

Anyway, I decided to go with the Stone Studio (http://www.stone.com) for a number of reasons:

-I like the interface... it's simple but there is alot of power behind the simplicity.
-I love the 'Image Well'... it's a lightning quick method of exporting graphics etc. Very useful for me.
-The supporting apps are cool too. Slice and Dice has a few limitations which they need to fix it but for ease of use it beats anything I've seen. The billing software is nice too... again very simple to use.
-Their support is superb. I e-mailed a few questions while trying it out and got answers back with an hour each time.
-It generates excellent PDF files with embedded fonts etc. My printshop requested EPS files with fonts... but the PDF Create generated worked fine.

On the minus side, I'm sure that Illustrator can do more stuff. But as my needs are fairly simple... basic web graphics, letterheads etc, this is not really an issue. There's some limitations (ie. Slice and Dice needs more flexibility, it can't create nice looking GIFS due to a bug in Quartz) but the programmes are updated fairly regularly so I hope to see these fixed. And then of course there's the risk of not going with the standard solution (Adobe Illustrator etc)... but if I worried about that that I'd be running Windows right now.

So for now I'll be using Stone Studio, Adobe Golive and when necessary, and old version of Photoshope LE which I will probably replace with Adobe Photoshop Elements for OS X when it arrives.

Anyway, thank again everyone!

[KaptainKaya]

Originally posted by funkboy:
<STRONG>Fireworks MX

Hail to the King, baby </STRONG>

Photoshop and Illustrator too