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Chris Grande · Sep 29, 2003, 02:00 AM

Take a look: http://www.adobe.com/products/creativesuite/main.html

Including:
Photoshop CS
Illustrator CS
InDesign CS
and GoLive CS

(Looking forward to the demo of GoLive since MX 2004 sucks)

sandsl · Sep 29, 2003, 02:00 AM

Nice. Any news on availability? No demo available yet either.

timmerk · Sep 29, 2003, 03:11 AM

End of November, they will start shipping.

timmerk · Sep 29, 2003, 03:12 AM

Originally posted by Chris Grande:
(Looking forward to the demo of GoLive since MX 2004 sucks)

Yah it does, what a flop. It runs like a dog on my 1 ghz laptop!

Can't even handle a semi complicated page.

TC · Sep 29, 2003, 04:49 AM

Co Author sounds like a nice alternative to Contribute.
It is much more limited in what it can do but I think this could make it much easier for customers to pick up (maybe contribute gives them too much control).

Overall Go Live sounds like a really good upgrade, the CSS 2 and source code improvements sound great. The only question as with Macromedia, why did they use Opera for previews instead of WebCore?

ablaze · Sep 29, 2003, 05:09 AM

And mandatory software activation (� la WinXP) is a windows-only "feature".

http://www.adobe.com/activation/main.html

nobitacu · Sep 29, 2003, 05:30 AM

Sweet! I guess I've just found another way to burn my pocket when Nov. arrives.... don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing.

Ming

as2 · Sep 29, 2003, 07:00 AM

Does anyone know if the new CS versions fully support the G5 processors 64-bit processor?

BrunoBruin · Sep 29, 2003, 07:29 AM

As long as InDesign and Illustrator are FASTER, I will be upgrading.

Judge_Fire · Sep 29, 2003, 07:49 AM

I've been waiting for a full- featured, 48- bit PhotoShop for so many years... and this could be it.

With 16 bits per channel, this might _require_ a G5 for smooth operation.

Just when you though hardware got fast...

J

workerbee · Sep 29, 2003, 08:00 AM

Originally posted by Chris Grande:
Take a look: http://www.adobe.com/products/creativesuite/main.html

Looks nice so far (CreativeMac had a preview, too).

Only thing that bothers me a little bit: as an owner of PS7 and a recent upgrader to Acrobat 6 Professional, I'm basically going to have to pay Acrobat twice (and what for: one of the slowest programs on OS X, right down there with MM Studio MX 04) and think they should have a more tiered approach to pricing. As for the new artwork, well, I don't know...

Helvetica Neue · Sep 29, 2003, 08:26 AM

Originally posted by BrunoBruin:
As long as InDesign and Illustrator are FASTER, I will be upgrading.

Both are faster.

mishap · Sep 29, 2003, 08:55 AM

Originally posted by workerbee:
As for the new artwork, well, I don't know...

Yeah the new artwork is horrible, but if it works better in osx...that will be cool.

I'll only be upgrading photoshop...i dont see what new features illustrator or indesign could have that i may possibly want from those apps.

I know MX in "studio mx" means absolutely nothing. Is Adobe going down the same path? CS sounds clinical or something... oh well 'clinical' goes along with the way my ibook looks.

bbxstudio · 11:10 AM

Originally posted by Helvetica Neue:
Both are faster.

That's not saying much

I think the real question is, are they as fast as they can (or should) be? Illustrator 10 borders on unusable at times (that spinning beachball is all too familiar - Illustrator takes forever to get its crap together when switched into from another application, being hidden or revealed, quitting, just about any basic function - it's a mess). What was once a finely honed tool for vector illustration (version8) has since become a jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none bloatware product. Illustrator used to fly through extremely complex files, now it crawls and chokes on even moderately complex illustrations.

Helvetica Neue · Sep 29, 2003, 11:15 AM

Originally posted by bbxstudio:
That's not saying much I think the real question is, are they as fast as they can (or should) be? Illustrator 10 borders on unusable at times (that spinning beachball is all too familiar - Illustrator takes forever to get its crap together when switched into from another application, being hidden or revealed, quitting, just about any basic function - it's a mess).

I think effort was made to increase speed in Illustrator CS/11 for exactly this reason.
"Faster performance - Enjoy faster opening, saving, and printing of files; copying and pasting; and displaying of artwork."

Also, InDesign CS/3 is speedier; it's also touted as one of the new features:
"Improved performance - Enjoy faster screen redraw and overall responsiveness when zooming, scrolling with the Hand tool, importing Adobe Photoshop� files, wrapping text, printing, and exporting Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) files."

Having used both, I can vouch for this, although I might not go so far as saying Illustrator 8 speed.

laxthxdude · Sep 29, 2003, 11:18 AM

Q: Which products will require product activation?
A: Initially, Adobe's activation process will be implemented in Photoshop CS for Windows desktop products. Photoshop CS for Windows may be sold to customers in individual retail boxes, or may be a part of the Adobe Creative Suite software or the Adobe Video Collection Professional software.

Windows activation on Photoshop product only... Perhaps because they know Photoshop on Windows is one of the most popular pirated programs out there???

DeathMan · Sep 29, 2003, 11:58 AM

I wonder if the the photoshop pen tool will work the same as the illustrator pen tool.

I want to be able to be dragging the handle, hold down the space bar and move the point rather than the handle. Thats all I really want.

And maybe speed improvements with opening the styles dialog, or deleteing or moving layers.

clarkgoble · Sep 29, 2003, 03:00 PM

I've been asking this question but haven't seen an answer yet. While the CSS stuff is a nice upgrade (as are the expected bug fixes) does anyone know if GoLive has improved table handling? That was one place Dreamweaver was much better.

Eyenovation · Sep 29, 2003, 03:19 PM

Originally posted by DeathMan:
I wonder if the the photoshop pen tool will work the same as the illustrator pen tool.

That'd be nice.
I'm definitely upgrading.
Wooo Hooo

Stephane · Sep 29, 2003, 03:21 PM

I read on Apple site that only Photoshop and Illustrator have been tweaked for the G5.

But I think all 4 apps won some speed from the "os x only" code redesign.

I read on Adobe's site that Palettes can now be docked and minimized the way it was done on Golive Cyberstudio : I think Golive and Adobe lost this feature because of licensing problems and now they're back :-)

My wish #1 is faster Golive and Illustrator and #2 and 3 : better CSS handling and Javascript generator in Golive.

Photoshop won mostly (from what I read) interface enhancements.

kovacs · Sep 29, 2003, 03:53 PM

Photoshop CS looks like a decent upgrade, I really like the improved support for RAW files. Text on path, 16 bit editing, the color matching and the improved file browser are pretty cool too. The new filter overview could be very handy, enough reason for me to upgrade...

DeathMan · Sep 29, 2003, 04:46 PM

I wonder when they'll introduce adjustment layer filters. Like you put a filter adjustment layer, and put gaussian blur on that, and everything behind it gets blurred. Wouldn't that be snazzy. Maybe next version when we've got the CPU power for it.

OwlBoy · Sep 29, 2003, 05:03 PM

Originally posted by DeathMan:
I wonder when they'll introduce adjustment layer filters. Like you put a filter adjustment layer, and put gaussian blur on that, and everything behind it gets blurred. Wouldn't that be snazzy. Maybe next version when we've got the CPU power for it.

That would be snazzy!

Hmm, now I need to save up for CS Suit Upgrade...

I am mainly looking forword to more speed, and those splash screens are gonna be rocking...

-Owl

:dragonflypro: · Sep 29, 2003, 06:24 PM

I am sure the whole CS suite will be nice...but I am most interested in ID CD and GoLive CS.

And of the 2 mostly GoLive...

...DW MX 2004 is really starting to get on my nerves.... and it has only been 3 weeks.

toby

Chris Grande · Sep 29, 2003, 07:01 PM

Originally posted by :dragonflypro::

...DW MX 2004 is really starting to get on my nerves.... and it has only been 3 weeks.

nerves?!?!? mine are gone.....

Socially Awkward Solo · Sep 29, 2003, 08:56 PM

Originally posted by ablaze:
And mandatory software activation (� la WinXP) is a windows-only "feature".

http://www.adobe.com/activation/main.html

"Activation will also be implemented soon on the Macintosh version of Adobe Photoshop CS."

Socially Awkward Solo · Sep 29, 2003, 09:39 PM

OK back to the G5's. Now it says that Photoshop CS has the G5 plug in built in. Big deal. Did they recompile the whole app to fully support the G5? Photoshop 7 with the G5 plug-in still only supports 2 gigs of RAM which is stupid.

DeathMan · Sep 29, 2003, 09:52 PM

Originally posted by Socially Awkward Solo:
Photoshop 7 with the G5 plug-in still only supports 2 gigs of RAM which is stupid.

Hmmm, how convienient. "Oh, it only supports 2 gigs of RAM? Well THIS version over here supports the full 8 and then some" (adobe rep rubs his hands together in glee)

Socially Awkward Solo · Sep 29, 2003, 10:14 PM

Originally posted by DeathMan:
Hmmm, how convienient. "Oh, it only supports 2 gigs of RAM? Well THIS version over here supports the full 8 and then some" (adobe rep rubs his hands together in glee)

Well is it true though?

smogscythe · Sep 30, 2003, 01:34 AM

i don't think the price is really worth the upgrade at all. like a macromedia move (i think MX means macromedia's 10th anniversary?) it only adds a few new updates just to keep up to par. plus, the new "branding" is confusing! ah, i see the feather icon in my dock... is that inDesign? what? wait! no, it's.. photoshop?

Gee4orce · Sep 30, 2003, 02:41 AM

Why isn't there a 'Web Publiser' edition - replacing InDesign with GoLive + Photoshop and Illustrator ?? Seems like Adobe missed the boat on this one.

And it looks as if GoLive has had it's dynamic web site tool removed ! Probably a good thing though, because they stank !

voodoo · Sep 30, 2003, 05:06 AM

Wow! Adobe get a frickin' CLUE! ****ing palettes EVERYWHERE!?!

75% of screen real-estate used up for palettes and 25% for something you are actually WORKING ON.

And this is on a WIDESCREEN 23" HD monitor!!

Idiots.

workerbee · Sep 30, 2003, 07:12 AM

Originally posted by voodoo:
Wow! Adobe get a frickin' CLUE! ****ing palettes EVERYWHERE!?!

75% of screen real-estate used up for palettes and 25% for something you are actually WORKING ON.

Judging from the size of the fonts and menues, I'd say this is probably a TiBook screen (1280x8something) plastered onto a HD display. So there should be a lot more room on the display... for even more palettes.

Severed Hand of Skywalker · Sep 30, 2003, 07:26 AM

Originally posted by voodoo:
Wow! Adobe get a frickin' CLUE! ****ing palettes EVERYWHERE!?!

75% of screen real-estate used up for palettes and 25% for something you are actually WORKING ON.

And this is on a WIDESCREEN 23" HD monitor!!

Idiots.

Oh brother, they just opened up all the pallets they could for that screengrab to make it look cool, that is not a normal setup.

Stephane · Sep 30, 2003, 07:40 AM

That 's why I will soon use a dual displays config : for screen real estate, I think it is better to have 2 19" (1280x1024) CRT displays than one "big" 20" TFT at 1600X1200...

Stephane · Sep 30, 2003, 07:43 AM

I read they put anchorable (?) palettes in ID like there use to be in Golive Cyberstudio... Anyone read/saw something like that.
It was a really cool feature to avoid screen cluttering.

keston · 08:36 AM

uhh.. buddy... maybe YOU

should get a clue? That screen is just a demo, showing probably all possible palettes. Do u even use photoshop professionally?

Lots of palettes and options are a good thing in a pro app, i can put each one where i want to suit my workflow, and you can close the ones you don't need. Just because they are showing you all the palettes dont mean you have to work that way...

how does it go? Better to keep your mouth closed and have people think you are a fool, than to open it and prove them right... or something like that. Whichever way, i think you just hit that mark.

Originally posted by voodoo:
Wow! Adobe get a frickin' CLUE! ****ing palettes EVERYWHERE!?!

75% of screen real-estate used up for palettes and 25% for something you are actually WORKING ON.

And this is on a WIDESCREEN 23" HD monitor!!

Idiots.

JKT · Sep 30, 2003, 08:40 AM

Originally posted by TC:
The only question as with Macromedia, why did they use Opera for previews instead of WebCore?

Presumably because they are cross-platform applications - WebCore isn't available on Windows, Opera is.

Brien · Sep 30, 2003, 09:14 AM

Did Adome do like Macromedia and drop version numbers? Is photoshop CS photoshop 8? Or a super photoshop 7?

Immortal K-Mart Employee · Sep 30, 2003, 09:27 AM

Originally posted by brien:
Did Adome do like Macromedia and drop version numbers? Is photoshop CS photoshop 8? Or a super photoshop 7?

Yes, they also changed their name to "Adome"

voodoo · Sep 30, 2003, 11:55 AM

Originally posted by keston:
uhh.. buddy... maybe YOU should get a clue? That screen is just a demo, showing probably all possible palettes. Do u even use photoshop professionally? Lots of palettes and options are a good thing in a pro app, i can put each one where i want to suit my workflow, and you can close the ones you don't need. Just because they are showing you all the palettes dont mean you have to work that way...

how does it go? Better to keep your mouth closed and have people think you are a fool, than to open it and prove them right... or something like that. Whichever way, i think you just hit that mark.

4 smileys .. :clap: :clap: :clap:

voodoo · Sep 30, 2003, 12:00 PM

Originally posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker:
Oh brother, they just opened up all the pallets they could for that screengrab to make it look cool, that is not a normal setup.

It is normal for Adobe apps.

How many palettes are there in Keynote? One. Oh how about.. M$ Office? One and one toolbar. Okay then, how about ANY well designed Macintosh app? Three tops. Adobe has a ridiculous palette fetish. All their palettes are then TABBED to further add confusion and clutter.

I've heard people defend Adobe left and right but when they begin defending the sea of palettes I just laugh and walk away.

mishap · Sep 30, 2003, 01:08 PM

Originally posted by voodoo:
It is normal for Adobe apps.

How many palettes are there in Keynote? One. Oh how about.. M$ Office? One and one toolbar. Okay then, how about ANY well designed Macintosh app? Three tops. Adobe has a ridiculous palette fetish. All their palettes are then TABBED to further add confusion and clutter.

That's why I always thought GoLive was a joke. I've tried Flash MX 04 (which i;m very happy with), but i have yet to try DW MX 04. But, damn, there is no way i would ever switch to that GoLive crap.

Immortal K-Mart Employee · Sep 30, 2003, 01:28 PM

Originally posted by voodoo:
It is normal for Adobe apps.

Good at least you can turn them off and they remember positions unlike Macromedia apps.

If you are comparing word/keynote to photoshop then you obviously don't use it professionally.

clarkgoble · Sep 30, 2003, 02:10 PM

When you have lots of functions don't you need lots of pallets? The issue is how to keep them out of the way when you don't need them. Adobe's solution is fairly good. You can hide those you don't want and have tabs for switching between those you use but don't use that often. The other solution is what OmniGraffle uses.

I'd actually say that 50% of the time I have only the main pallet open in GoLive. It is under the menu and unobtrusive. I then have an other tabbed pallet about 40% of the time.

voodoo · Sep 30, 2003, 02:13 PM

Originally posted by Immortal K-Mart Employee:

If you are comparing word/keynote to photoshop then you obviously don't use it professionally.

I don't think you are getting the message I am trying to get across here. I know you're not thick or anything so I'll just assume it was I who was not clear.

-- I am comparing application DESIGN and fact is even the Microsloth apps look pretty sweet compared to the Adobe package right now - it didn't use to be like that, back when somebody in Adobe CARED about designing an elegant app. There is nothing more ironic than making elegant designs in an app that is appallingly inelegant --

I couldn't care less what it actually DOES. (FYI I do use PS)

Judge_Fire · Sep 30, 2003, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by DeathMan:
I wonder when they'll introduce adjustment layer filters. Like you put a filter adjustment layer, and put gaussian blur on that, and everything behind it gets blurred. Wouldn't that be snazzy. Maybe next version when we've got the CPU power for it.

Especially since we had this already in 1996 with Live Picture, which incidentally had regular layers and 48-bit before PhotoShop, too. In 1996. Too bad it never got popular.

See this heated discussion from way back for more details.

J

Judge_Fire · Sep 30, 2003, 02:38 PM

Originally posted by voodoo:
75% of screen real-estate used up for palettes and 25% for something you are actually WORKING ON.

100% for the image and 100% for the palettes...

..when you use the Tab key!

J

Superchicken · Sep 30, 2003, 03:48 PM

I want a G5 and Photoshop... sniffle... I'll go back to my iBook and Elements 2

TC · Sep 30, 2003, 04:24 PM

Originally posted by JKT:
Presumably because they are cross-platform applications - WebCore isn't available on Windows, Opera is.

It uses the Internet Explorer rendering engine on Windows. Microsoft provides it on Windows the same way Apple now provides WebCore.