[simonmartin]

Hi,

I'm after some suggestions as to good effects SW for my guitar.

I want to hook the guitar up to my Mac (OSX), use the SW to give me the sound effects etc and take a line out to my hi-fi amp. I don't use a midi guitar.

Ideally it would be a free standing program which doesn't rely on stuff like QBase or whatever.

Anything considered.

Thanks

Simon

[gorickey]

http://www.apple.com/soundtrack/

Will that work?

[dlefebvre]

Amplitube Live wich works as a standalone guitar amp simulator. You can use the presets it comes with or create your own. It's about 99$. I love it, but be careful, there seems to be an issue with Quicktime 6.4 and there is no patch available yet. It worked great on Jaguar with QT 6.3.

[simonmartin]

Originally posted by dlefebvre:
Amplitube Live wich works as a standalone guitar amp simulator. You can use the presets it comes with or create your own. It's about 99$. I love it, but be careful, there seems to be an issue with Quicktime 6.4 and there is no patch available yet. It worked great on Jaguar with QT 6.3.

dlefebvre,

Thanks, I'm just downloading the trial version now...

How do you hook up your guitar exactly?

Simon

[Taipan]

Hi!

Just connect the guitar to the Mac's sound input. You probably need to set the input level to the maximum (I did it via the Audio-MIDI-Configuration utility).
But as dlefebvre said, it won't work with QT 6.4 (as in Panther).

[simonmartin]

Originally posted by Taipan:
Hi!

Just connect the guitar to the Mac's sound input. You probably need to set the input level to the maximum (I did it via the Audio-MIDI-Configuration utility).
But as dlefebvre said, it won't work with QT 6.4 (as in Panther).

Taipan,

I use a 2x533 G4. This box only has a mic in, a minijack.

Can I use that if I get an adapter of some kind?

Mind you I am using Panther...

Simon

[Tim2 at Omni]

Originally posted by simonmartin:
Taipan,

I use a 2x533 G4. This box only has a mic in, a minijack.

Can I use that if I get an adapter of some kind?

Mind you I am using Panther...

Simon

I have my guitar plugged into my G4 via a 1/4-inch to 1/8-inch adaptor. You should be able to find one at Radio Shack (or the equivalent in whatever country you may live in), or any good music store. Plug your guitar's line out to the adaptor's big end, and plug the adaptor's little end into your microphone port on your Mac. Works great!

As for effects... I don't know. Are you really looking to do real-time effects, or are you saving this to disk? I've written a couple of little programs that take sound input, pass them through Audio Units for various effects, and then output the result. Unfortunately, the latency (the time between when you start playing and when you hear the result) is usually pretty large. Software is slow, man. I'd invest in some effects pedals or an effects bank if you're serious about this.

[simonmartin]

Originally posted by Tim2 at Omni:
I have my guitar plugged into my G4 via a 1/4-inch to 1/8-inch adaptor. You should be able to find one at Radio Shack (or the equivalent in whatever country you may live in), or any good music store. Plug your guitar's line out to the adaptor's big end, and plug the adaptor's little end into your microphone port on your Mac. Works great!

As for effects... I don't know. Are you really looking to do real-time effects, or are you saving this to disk? I've written a couple of little programs that take sound input, pass them through Audio Units for various effects, and then output the result. Unfortunately, the latency (the time between when you start playing and when you hear the result) is usually pretty large. Software is slow, man. I'd invest in some effects pedals or an effects bank if you're serious about this.

Tim2,

Thanks for that. I'll get the adapter you mention.

On the subject of latency: a friend of mine who is a very serious player says it's a massive problem when playing through computers.

The Amplitube site says:
"The new MacOS® X Core Audio features are fully exploited by AmpliTube™ Live, which plays without any perceivable latency. This means that even the most sophisticated guitarist will feel just like there's a hard-wired amp at the other end of their cord."

Do I believe them or not?

Simon

[Tim2 at Omni]

Originally posted by simonmartin:
"The new MacOS® X Core Audio features are fully exploited by AmpliTube™ Live, which plays without any perceivable latency.

Do I believe them or not?

Well, think about it this way. If your microphone jack were wired directly to your audio out port, the only latency would be the amount of time it takes for the electrons to travel from your guitar's pickups to your speakers. This is an "imperceptible amount" to basically everybody.

But your microphone port is not wired like that -- the analog signal is being transformed into a digital signal (this takes time), which is then passed through an application or audio unit via CoreAudio (this takes even more time). The audio data must then by analyzed and then modified by that application (this takes lots of time). Then the audio data must be converted back into an analog format before it can be played through your speakers.

In short, there will be noticeable latency any time your audio signal is converted, analyzed, or transformed by software. This can take anywhere from a couple of miliseconds to half a second or more, depending on the effect being applied.

[nickm]

This can take anywhere from a couple of miliseconds to half a second or more, depending on the effect being applied.

A couple of milliseconds isn't perceptible, half a second is. I'm not sure where the boundary lies with audio, but 1/10th of a second (100 ms) is definitely perceptible visually.

I think if your processing required less than 1/20th of a second, you'd probably be ok. That's 50 million cycles on a 1GHz processor, potentially enough time to do some interesting things.

For what it's worth, Apple seems to be claiming a 10 ms latency, though it is difficult to say, exactly. I think the 10ms figure on that page is for Mac OS 9...

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by Tim2 at Omni:
In short, there will be noticeable latency any time your audio signal is converted, analyzed, or transformed by software. This can take anywhere from a couple of miliseconds to half a second or more, depending on the effect being applied.

However, OS X's CoreAudio is faster than many hardware mixers (the OS itself is currently at sub-millisecond latency, AFAIK, which is unheard of in the rest of the industry).

The point about effects processing requiring CPU time and hence generating latency applies.

If you're a decent rhythm guitarist/keyboarder, latency much over 5ms will be irritating and **** your timing.

-s*

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by nickm:
For what it's worth, Apple seems to be claiming a 10 ms latency, though it is difficult to say, exactly. I think the 10ms figure on that page is for Mac OS 9...

That IS for OS 9.

OS X is below 40 samples. That's less than a millisecond at CD resolution (44kHz), and less than half a millisecond at DVD-audio.

-s*

[arekkusu]

The latency isn't a problem. The effects work very well. What is a problem is preamping the signal... if you just plug directly into the line in, you'll get a very low signal which will be playable but with a lot of gate noise.

You'll get much better results if you go through a stereo or some other preamp first, then into your Mac. My stereo has a mic in line which I plug the guitar into, adjust the the mix level, and then plug the headphone out into the mac line in. Works well.

[Tim2 at Omni]

Originally posted by arekkusu:
What is a problem is preamping the signal... if you just plug directly into the line in, you'll get a very low signal which will be playable but with a lot of gate noise.

You're absolutely right. I should have pointed that out that when I said to buy a 1/4-inch-to-1/8-inch adaptor, I was really just giving my two-dollar solution. Your best bet is definitely to preamp the signal first.

[simonmartin]

Thanks for everyone's input.

I guess the only way to find out how good amplitube is in terms of latency is to give it a go.

Is there any way I can use my hi-fi as a pre-amp as well as a power-amp?

I guess not...

Simon