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JeremyA · Feb 10, 2004, 08:17 PM

They have to be joking.

Someone say it isn't so. At the very least they could give us iSync support.

Jeremy

Timo · Feb 10, 2004, 08:26 PM

Yep, looks like we'll be jacked out of $40.

Of course, we can always stay with Palm Desktop 4.1.

mdc · Feb 10, 2004, 08:27 PM

question: *why*?

maxintosh · Feb 10, 2004, 08:41 PM

This is outrageous. Palms have synced with Macs since the original Pilot. When Palm drops out of the game, there will be *NO* PDAs that sync natively with the Mac. I sincerely hope Apple comes up with a new version of iSync that works with Palm OS Cobalt devices.

Anyone feel like starting a petition against Palm for this insulting move?

SupahCoolX · Feb 10, 2004, 08:52 PM

F Palm. That is all.

Lordx_ · Feb 10, 2004, 09:00 PM

And I was going to buy a Palm PDA when Palm OS 6 pdas were released... Doubt that is gonna happen now.

Cadaver · Feb 10, 2004, 09:08 PM

Its now time for Apple to step up to the plate and produce its own PDA... one that actually works with the Mac.

Apple needs to develop a killer PDA... one that sweeps the market like the iPod did. And, just to pour salt in Palm's wound, it should work with the PC as well.

(Hey, I can dream, can't I?)

In all seriousness, Apple will surely have to address this issue to the best of their ability if they want to keep their "digital hub" concept going. Otherwise, what the hell use is iSync? A whole software framework just to sync your iCal calendar with your iPod??

maxintosh · Feb 10, 2004, 09:24 PM

Originally posted by Cadaver:
n all seriousness, Apple will surely have to address this issue to the best of their ability if they want to keep their "digital hub" concept going. Otherwise, what the hell use is iSync? A whole software framework just to sync your iCal calendar with your iPod??

That might be Palm's reasoning -- iSync is worthless for just phones and the iPod... Apple will almost be forced to develop a new version of iSync that can sync Palm conduits. Maybe they can buy Palm Desktop back from palmOne and use its conduit architecture for a new version of iSync.

We can only hope...

Axo1ot1 · Feb 10, 2004, 09:39 PM

couldn't they get sued for this?

NeXTLoop · Feb 10, 2004, 11:01 PM

Here's the link to the contact form for PalmSource Product Marketing. This is the correct form for suggestions on how to improve Palm OS. I'd say that making sure it supports the Mac is an appropriate suggestion.

We probably want to make sure any feedback isn't too flaming. Attract more flies with honey than vinegar.

PalmSource Product Marketing

NeXTLoop · Feb 10, 2004, 11:06 PM

Here's the email I just submitted...

Dear Sir or Madam:

I just read the news that Palm OS 6 will not be available with a Macintosh compatible version of the Palm Desktop software.

As a Macintosh user, not to mention a registered Palm developer, I'm just curious as to the reasoning behind this decision. Due to their superior support for the Macintosh platform, Palm devices have always been the favored PDA for Macintosh users.

Given this questionable decision to no longer offer out-of-the-box support for the Mac, you may be inadvertently aliening what, until now, has been a very loyal segment of Palm's user base.

I hope that this email will reach the right person/persons, and perhaps this ill-conceived decision will be reversed.

Sincerely,
Matt Milano
President
Praevius, Inc.

MadBrowser · Feb 10, 2004, 11:07 PM

This is actually really lame.

Since I got my Treo 600 I've gone from thinking a PDA was a useless toy to a really useful tool...

Even with 3rd party sync options, you just know that MS isn't going to write an Entourage conduit for a third party sync platform.

This totally blows. Bad move Palm.

I think we can convince Palm to AT LEAST build a synchronization framework... We don't really need the desktop program, just HotSync and related libraries.

itai195 · Feb 10, 2004, 11:07 PM

I really don't care for Palm Desktop, but having a Hotsync app is kind of crucial!

I'd rather Apple just build this function into iSync than that they make their own PDA.

maxintosh · Feb 10, 2004, 11:29 PM

It would be good if everyone took the time to write them a letter...

yukon · Feb 10, 2004, 11:53 PM

i bought a Palm, tried to use the installer for OS X. It errored out with "file not found" during install on two different drives, after being decompressed with Stuffit7 and 8, and after a couple redownloads. Their techsupport suggested resetting the Palm itself (aughh, a little stupid there).

I'm lucky, I've got a PC here to load the software on, works fine, excepting some strange unpredectable broken-hotsync issues that fix on restart.

I dunno, I won't be buying Palm again, but I like having the thing....or just "something". Definitly I'll be going with a mini-laptop next time, cheap, fast, and capable.

NeXTLoop · Feb 11, 2004, 12:02 AM

Another possibility as a replacement is the Sharp Zaurus PDA. It runs Linux, and there's already a project underway to get Darwin/OS X apps to run on it.

eevyl · Feb 11, 2004, 12:36 AM

I also had plans about replacing my Palm m130 with a Cobalt powered one in the near future, but if Mac sync support is not right out of the box... I won't...

Amazing ...

maxintosh · Feb 11, 2004, 12:49 AM

Originally posted by yukon:
i bought a Palm, tried to use the installer for OS X. It errored out with "file not found" during install on two different drives, after being decompressed with Stuffit7 and 8, and after a couple redownloads. Their techsupport suggested resetting the Palm itself (aughh, a little stupid there).

Install it using Pseudo, which gives the installer root privelages. You can find it on VersionTracker.

maxintosh · Feb 11, 2004, 12:50 AM

Originally posted by NeXTLoop:
Another possibility as a replacement is the Sharp Zaurus PDA. It runs Linux, and there's already a project underway to get Darwin/OS X apps to run on it.

Bah, I played with a Zaurus for a while... too big and too clunky, but definately very geeky

The problem is that Sharp doesn't seem to know what they want to do with the product in terms of long-term plans.... and if they do, they ain't telling.

fnevitt · Feb 11, 2004, 01:01 AM

I have a palm Zire71 and it synced fine under 10.2 but when I installed 10.3 it stopped working. I have installed and reinstalled and done everything I can think of to get my Palm to sync but no luck, any ideas?

selowitch · Feb 12, 2004, 05:02 PM

Here's some interesting remarks on this topic. I, for one, am livid!

<http://www.macintouch.com/#notesandtips>

selowitch · Feb 12, 2004, 05:03 PM

Originally posted by eevyl:
I also had plans about replacing my Palm m130 with a Cobalt powered one in the near future, but if Mac sync support is not right out of the box... I won't...

Amazing ...

My thoughts exactly. I don't want to have to use *shudder* PocketPC. Yeech!

selowitch · Feb 12, 2004, 05:08 PM

Originally posted by maxintosh:
This is outrageous. Palms have synced with Macs since the original Pilot. When Palm drops out of the game, there will be *NO* PDAs that sync natively with the Mac. I sincerely hope Apple comes up with a new version of iSync that works with Palm OS Cobalt devices.

Anyone feel like starting a petition against Palm for this insulting move?

I do!!! How could Donna Dubinsky and Jeff Hawkins do this, now that the former chiefs of Handspring have been borged (er, reabsorbed) by PalmOne? They're Mac people, for crying out loud.

Help could be on the way with this third-party application:

<http://www.markspace.com/pressrelease/040210.html>

TampaDeveloper · Mar 4, 2004, 10:14 AM

Don't get livid, just tell them, in one sentence, how you shop...

go to http://www.palmsource.com/contact/write_os.html

and put a variation on this theme:

"I support Mac OSX and will only buy products that are compatible."

Thats what I did. If enough people do it, they rethink their strategy. If not, oh well...

BobMaherz · Mar 4, 2004, 07:17 PM

Originally posted by Cadaver:
Its now time for Apple to step up to the plate and produce its own PDA... one that actually works with the Mac.

Apple needs to develop a killer PDA... one that sweeps the market like the iPod did. And, just to pour salt in Palm's wound, it should work with the PC as well.

(Hey, I can dream, can't I?)

In all seriousness, Apple will surely have to address this issue to the best of their ability if they want to keep their "digital hub" concept going. Otherwise, what the hell use is iSync? A whole software framework just to sync your iCal calendar with your iPod??

If PalmSource is actually dropping out, this is a big opportunity for the right parties-- for example Apple or for Chronos SW. Or better yet, a collaboration between the two. A robust syncing capability between Palm (and other PDAs), the Chronos PIM, and the Apple database system, linked with iSync and .Mac, and with phones (including Bluetooth) would be dynamite. Imagine a world where all this works seamlessly, and any syncing issues can be resolved unambiguously. This can be done. Who will step up to the plate and reap the rewards?

CharlesS · Mar 5, 2004, 01:22 AM

Originally posted by selowitch:
I do!!! How could Donna Dubinsky and Jeff Hawkins do this, now that the former chiefs of Handspring have been borged (er, reabsorbed) by PalmOne? They're Mac people, for crying out loud.

Help could be on the way with this third-party application:

<http://www.markspace.com/pressrelease/040210.html>

I think that whoever designed the whole Palm OS were Mac people. Look at the way it's implemented - files all have type and creator codes, for God's sake.

This decision is an absolute mystery to me...

Maflynn · Mar 5, 2004, 06:20 AM

Originally posted by TampaDeveloper:
Don't get livid, just tell them, in one sentence, how you shop...

go to http://www.palmsource.com/contact/write_os.html

and put a variation on this theme:

"I support Mac OSX and will only buy products that are compatible."

Thats what I did. If enough people do it, they rethink their strategy. If not, oh well...

Thanks for the link, I voiced my displeasure of there dropping native support. It seems strange that they alienated one of there most fiercely loyal customer segments. As I mentioned in my email, There's less reason to support the palm. If I go to PPC, I need to purchase missing-sync or pocketmac, if I purchase a cobalt pda, I need to purchase missing-sync (or another sync utility).

The palm interface certainly has advantages to how i work, but I'm seriously thinking of voting with my wallet. The pda market is so competitve and to drop support on such a loyal customer base is not good business sense.

Mike

mitchell_pgh · Mar 5, 2004, 06:45 AM

I think PDAs are a "has been" era...

An iPod can do most of what the palm was originally popular for. An easy to synch address book.

Perhaps I'm simply not around people that have nice palm devices, but the few people I know with Palm devices rarely use them to 1/3 their potential.

CharlesS · Mar 5, 2004, 09:36 AM

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
I think PDAs are a "has been" era...

An iPod can do most of what the palm was originally popular for. An easy to synch address book.

Perhaps I'm simply not around people that have nice palm devices, but the few people I know with Palm devices rarely use them to 1/3 their potential.

Can you enter addresses, look at your calendar, enter events in your calendar, and set alarms on the iPod?

Maflynn · Mar 5, 2004, 10:25 AM

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
I think PDAs are a "has been" era...

An iPod can do most of what the palm was originally popular for. An easy to synch address book.

Perhaps I'm simply not around people that have nice palm devices, but the few people I know with Palm devices rarely use them to 1/3 their potential.

Can you jot down notes, use a spreadsheet, read and write email with an ipod. Ipod's have there place, just not as a pda. I cannot use a device that does not allow inputting of data or no word/excel like features. Plus I think the appointments and contacts are much more robust on a pda then whats on the ipod.

Mike

mitchell_pgh · Mar 5, 2004, 10:54 AM

Originally posted by CharlesS:
Can you enter addresses, look at your calendar, enter events in your calendar, and set alarms on the iPod?

No, I will admit that some people do use their PDAs to the fullest... but many don't. I went from having a PDA to simply using a paper daily planner (I kind of went in the reverse direction).

- The batteries never die on a daily planner.

- I never have to reset anything or lose anything on my daily planner.

- I can write 3X faster in a daily planner and then key in information in about the same time it would take to simply write in info in a Palm.

- Nobody ever says "Oh WOW, what's that" when I'm writing in my daily planner.

I'll admit, I probably purchased my Palm (like many) as a novelty and not a necessity.

Group51 · Mar 6, 2004, 09:47 AM

Message to Palm:

I just read that Palm wont be supporting Mac Users anymore. This is rather sad, as I like Palms.

I shall have to give Symbian products serious consideration in future.

***

If I'm going to have to drop the Palm, I might as well merge it with a Bluetooth Phone, something like a Sony Ericsson P900 or a Nokia 9500.

CharlesS · Mar 6, 2004, 08:06 PM

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
No, I will admit that some people do use their PDAs to the fullest... but many don't. I went from having a PDA to simply using a paper daily planner (I kind of went in the reverse direction).

- The batteries never die on a daily planner.

- I never have to reset anything or lose anything on my daily planner.

- I can write 3X faster in a daily planner and then key in information in about the same time it would take to simply write in info in a Palm.

- Nobody ever says "Oh WOW, what's that" when I'm writing in my daily planner.

I'll admit, I probably purchased my Palm (like many) as a novelty and not a necessity.

Paper planners are missing some huge things, though:

1. They can't alert you when an event occurs - they are only useful if you keep glancing at them every few minutes (this is a huge problem for those of us that are slightly absent-minded, like myself).

2. The space to write things in doesn't grow at all - it has a fixed size, forcing you to cram large notes into a tiny space and subsequently later to be unable to read them.

3. You can't change the display and look at a calendar of your entire month and see what's due, when unless you sync by hand with a wall calendar (see comment on #1).

4. If you enter something like an address into the computer, it doesn't show up in the paper address book unless you sync it by hand (again, comment on #1).

5. Since they're so cheap, you don't give them the same kind of care that you give a PDA (yes, I've lost several paper address books and planners).

6. In case you do lose it (heaven forbid), paper planners don't backup to your computer as easily.

7. You can't easily transfer things between two planners without copying everything manually.

Wiskedjak · May 2, 2004, 10:21 PM

Originally posted by Axo1ot1:
couldn't they get sued for this?

Under what grounds?

BobMaherz · May 3, 2004, 06:45 PM

Originally posted by BobMaherz:
If PalmSource is actually dropping out, this is a big opportunity for the right parties-- for example Apple or for Chronos SW. Or better yet, a collaboration between the two. A robust syncing capability between Palm (and other PDAs), the Chronos PIM, and the Apple database system, linked with iSync and .Mac, and with phones (including Bluetooth) would be dynamite. Imagine a world where all this works seamlessly, and any syncing issues can be resolved unambiguously. This can be done. Who will step up to the plate and reap the rewards?

Here is what I sent to PalmSource:

I like my T3. But if syncing with the Mac is not robustly supported for the Palm, that T3 will be the last Palm device I ever buy.

Please come to your senses.

Person Man · May 4, 2004, 04:56 PM

Originally posted by BobMaherz:
Here is what I sent to PalmSource:

I like my T3. But if syncing with the Mac is not robustly supported for the Palm, that T3 will be the last Palm device I ever buy.

Please come to your senses.

PalmSource doesn't make the T3. PalmOne does.

Palm split into two companies: PalmSource (the OS company) and PalmOne (the hardware company). PalmOne licenses the Palm OS from PalmSource.

Also, the week PalmSource announced that they were leaving Mac support to third parties, PalmOne made an announcement reaffirming support for the Mac.

Meaning, that PalmOne will handle the Mac support for their devices, NOT PalmSource. (Either that, or they'll bundle a third party solution in the box with the device).