[Spliff]

http://maccentral.macworld.com/news/...4/14/symantec/

Crap. I really like SpeedDisk.

[MojoRising022]

Practically speaking - are either of these programs even remotely useful on OS X? If so, are they better than the 300 other mac-only utilties ot there?

[Spliff]

Originally posted by MojoRising022:
Practically speaking - are either of these programs even remotely useful on OS X? If so, are they better than the 300 other mac-only utilties ot there?

There is no faster Mac disk defragger than Norton Speed Disk. It rules. The other defraggers take forever and ever.

However, Norton's disk repair utilities have never worked well with OS X.

A disk defragger is still necessary for OS X. Since 10.3.2, I've had system lockups that turned out to be caused by a heavily fragmented hard drive with very little contiguous free space (130 MB or less). Many other Panther users have had the same problem and defragging the disk always fixed the problem for them.

TechTool Pro 4 has a disk defragger, but it is slow. My friend, who owns TTP 4, recently defragged his 40 GB disk. It took 16 hours. Norton Speed Disk could do it in 1-2 hours.

[Red Wolf]

I've never had an issue with Disk Doctor and Panther... once I got all the updates for Norton anyway And Speed Disk is the bomb for optimization. While I'll get along without Norton Utilities and I certainly won't miss their last to update for OS X policy it is still disappointing to see them go. I guess the new TechTool Pro just finally got to them.

At least they are keeping their ever so important for a Mac anti-virus and Internet security

[typoon]

Forget Norton. The only 2 utilites you need is DiskWarrior to check the disk and Drive 10 for optimization. Norton is nothing but trouble.

[coolmacdude]

Unless you do heavy video or graphics work, there really is no need to optimize at all.

[typoon]

Originally posted by coolmacdude:
Unless you do heavy video or graphics work, there really is no need to optimize at all.

True but it never hurts if you've never done it before to the machine. Either way you CAN'T live without DiskWarrior.

[Red Wolf]

Originally posted by coolmacdude:
Unless you do heavy video or graphics work, there really is no need to optimize at all.

I've seen too many Macs permentantly lose their data because the drive crashed and was already so badly fragmented that recovery was impossible. Yes, a simple backup could prevent this but we all know not that many Mac users have good backups. I don't believe the "speed up your drive" hype but I can't say optimization is only for a select few, either. TechTool will get the job done with Drive 10's optimizer but Norton had speed.

I'm wondering how many OS X updates it'll take to make NU 8.0.2 incompatible.

[gorickey]

Norton? Hmmm, doesn't ring a bell anymore...

[CharlesS]

Well, Speed Disk and UnErase were occasionally useful apps, and fairly decent. However, Disk Doctor sucked spectacularly and tended to cause lots of damage, and that is what killed Norton Utilities.

The one problem with Speed Disk was that it was integrated with Disk Doctor, so it wouldn't let you defrag if DD claimed there was a problem with the directory. I lost the ability to use Speed Disk long ago after DD started turning up a repetitive non-existent problem, which would have destroyed my drive had I opted to "fix" it. I know this because I lost a drive to this, a very long time ago.

[Holigen]

Ive had Norton for a while. Since 9 at least. However, now, if anything goes wrong, I just wipe my whole freaking drive. It seems to take less time to reinstall OS X and put everything that I backed up from my iPod back on my hard drive than to wait forever and a day for DD...

[tooki]

So Norton Disk Doctor Kevorkian's medical license has been revoked. Finally.

tooki

[typoon]

Originally posted by tooki:
So Norton Disk Doctor Kevorkian's medical license has been revoked. Finally.

tooki

It's about time too.

[angelmb]

Originally posted by Spliff:
There is no faster Mac disk defragger than Norton Speed Disk. It rules. The other defraggers take forever and ever.

However, Norton's disk repair utilities have never worked well with OS X.

A disk defragger is still necessary for OS X. Since 10.3.2, I've had system lockups that turned out to be caused by a heavily fragmented hard drive with very little contiguous free space (130 MB or less). Many other Panther users have had the same problem and defragging the disk always fixed the problem for them.

TechTool Pro 4 has a disk defragger, but it is slow. My friend, who owns TTP 4, recently defragged his 40 GB disk. It took 16 hours. Norton Speed Disk could do it in 1-2 hours.

I much preffer another option to defrag. From SuperDuper! Fragmentation pdf:

"Disk fragmentation: the inevitable slowdown Straight out of the box, a new Macintosh feels fast! Everything seems zippy: starting up, logging in, launching applications. There’s nothing quite like it.

But, after you’ve used your system for a while, you may notice that it gradually, inevitably slows down. Usually, this is most noticeable after a system update, especially a large one: updates tend to be comprised of hundreds or thousands of small files. The result: slower operation.

How to use SuperDuper! to defragment your system. Although there are tools out there that will defragment your drive “in place”, they can take a long time to accomplish their task, and are often very OS-version dependent. Fortunately there’s another solution: SuperDuper!

One of the positive side effects of a disk clone is that your files are defragmented during the copy operation. SuperDuper copies your files, one after the other, without leaving “holes” that encourage fragmentation by deleting anything on the drive (unlike some other products, SuperDuper actually skips files it’s been told not to copy, as opposed to deleting them after the fact).

To accomplish this, simply clone your boot drive to another volume using the “Backup – all files” Copy Script as described in the manual’s Appendix, making sure to check the “Reboot from volume name” option to boot from it when you’re done. You should notice that this fresh “copy” is significantly faster! When you’re satisfied that everything is running properly on the new volume, just clone it back over the original as described in the Appendix. The result: a faster system!

A Better Solution: the Safety Clone. It’s not just for safety anymore! But you don’t have to make a full clone to gain most of the benefits. By simply creating a Safety Clone, you’ll fully defragment your system files which – for the most part – are the primary problem after an update. So, by creating (and occasionally updating) your Safety Clone, you’ll also be assured of a fast, defragmented system – with minimal wasted time."

[veryniceguy2002]

So, can someone recommend me what utility/utilities should I use to cover all the things that Norton Utilities can do?

I got Drive 10, but I found it is quite awkful to boot my Mac from the CD in order for me to use it.

[bradoesch]

Originally posted by veryniceguy2002:
So, can someone recommend me what utility/utilities should I use to cover all the things that Norton Utilities can do?

I got Drive 10, but I found it is quite awkful to boot my Mac from the CD in order for me to use it.

Use DiskWarrior instead of Norton Disk Doctor.

[-Q-]

Originally posted by veryniceguy2002:
So, can someone recommend me what utility/utilities should I use to cover all the things that Norton Utilities can do?

I got Drive 10, but I found it is quite awkful to boot my Mac from the CD in order for me to use it.

Unfortunately, that slow boot seems to be a side effect of OS X - most all utilities that boot from CD take an extreme amount of time to do so.

That said, I'm a big fan of DiskWarrior. I've heard good things about TechTool Pro 4 but I've not used it yet.

[iNeusch]

I wonder if we needs those apps at all...

[bradoesch]

Originally posted by iNeusch:
I wonder if we needs those apps at all...

Are you talking about the discontinued Norton apps or DiskWarrior? I'm only sad to see Speed Disk going, but I'd say DiskWarrior is a must for anyone with disk problems.

[-Q-]

I think Disk Warrior is a must, period. Run it once every couple of months as preventative maintenance, along with a regular backup, and you can kiss disk problems goodbye.

[iNeusch]

Originally posted by -Q-:
I think Disk Warrior is a must, period. Run it once every couple of months as preventative maintenance, along with a regular backup, and you can kiss disk problems goodbye.

How can we be sure it's 100% safe (if anything can be...)
And does it optimize ?

You're gonna make me try it

[Sven G]

The best thing would be if Apple developed Disk Utility in such a way to make it a complete and "self-managed" maintenance utility, for OS X 10.4+: maybe, if Symantec open-sourced the Norton Utilities for Macintosh (unlikely, but who knows...), or made them "available" (with or without the $$$) to Apple, the "mothership" could incorporate some of the better features, such as Speed Disk functionality, and so on, if really useful and needed; or maybe Apple is going to rely only on its own forces...? Difficult to say, at this time...

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by Holigen:
Ive had Norton for a while. Since 9 at least. However, now, if anything goes wrong, I just wipe my whole freaking drive. It seems to take less time to reinstall OS X and put everything that I backed up from my iPod back on my hard drive than to wait forever and a day for DD...

Ah...the waiting forever and a day for DD...to finally and thoroughly **** up the drive.

The reason I threw away NU a few years ago is quite simple:

I had been experiencing flaky behavior from an external hard drive.

Norton diagnosed a disk error on the drive that wasn't being flagged by Disk Utility.

I had Norton run over the disk several times, each time repairing the error it had found.

After that, the disk would not mount at all, nor would it show up in Disk Utility.

Norton Utilities had well and truly FUBARed my hard drive.

Or so I thought.


I tried DiskWarrior. It took a little under three minutes, after which the disk was in perfect order. I have not had a problem with itsince - but I also made sure to remove all traces of the bastard that was Norton Utilities.

May they rest in long-overdue peace.

I'd also suggest a title change for this thread:

"Symantec finally gets a ****ing clue."

-s*

[typoon]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
Ah...the waiting forever and a day for DD...to finally and thoroughly **** up the drive.

The reason I threw away NU a few years ago is quite simple:

I had been experiencing flaky behavior from an external hard drive.

Norton diagnosed a disk error on the drive that wasn't being flagged by Disk Utility.

I had Norton run over the disk several times, each time repairing the error it had found.

After that, the disk would not mount at all, nor would it show up in Disk Utility.

Norton Utilities had well and truly FUBARed my hard drive.

Or so I thought.


I tried DiskWarrior. It took a little under three minutes, after which the disk was in perfect order. I have not had a problem with itsince - but I also made sure to remove all traces of the bastard that was Norton Utilities.

May they rest in long-overdue peace.

I'd also suggest a title change for this thread:

"Symantec finally gets a ****ing clue."

-s*

I know what you mean. I'have had an issue like that with Norton as well. Thank god I had Techtool Pro 4 and Diskwarrior.

[-Q-]

Originally posted by iNeusch:
How can we be sure it's 100% safe (if anything can be...)
And does it optimize ?

You're gonna make me try it

Leaving your house isn't 100% safe.

But the people at Alsoft have done a thorough job in developing Diskwarrior so that it does no harm to your machine. Nothing 100% foolproof (they always build a better fool), but Diskwarrior is definitely top notch.

And no, it doesn't optimize the drive, just the drive's directory. Things are still fragmented on the disk itself.

[bradoesch]

Alsoft has a defrag/optimer program for OS 9, but I have no clue what they're gonna do about OS X (if anything.)

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by typoon:
I know what you mean. I'have had an issue like that with Norton as well. Thank god I had Techtool Pro 4 and Diskwarrior.

The fun ends when **** software starts costing you real money, and NU *almost* did.

Buy DiskWarrior.

-s* (not affiliated in any way with the makers of DiskWarrior)

[CharlesS]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
The fun ends when **** software starts costing you real money, and NU *almost* did.

Buy DiskWarrior.

-s* (not affiliated in any way with the makers of DiskWarrior)

What he said. I had a very similar experience with Norton.

Speed Disk was nice, but I became unable to use it, because Norton was finding fake errors on all my drives, errors which if 'fixed' would make my drives unmountable. Since Speed Disk scans the directories first and doesn't let you optimize until you 'fix' them with Norton, I was not able to use it. The whole suite has become basically useless. DiskWarrior is the way to go; hopefully they will port one of their optimizers to OS X eventually so that we'll have a decent defragger as well.

[tooki]

Required reading: TidBits: Optimizing Disks Is a Waste of Time

Recommended reading: TidBits: Shootout at the Disk Repair Corral

By line for both articles:

David Shayer was a senior engineer on Norton Utilities for Macintosh 3.0, 4.0, and 5.0. Before that he worked on Public Utilities, a disk repair program that won the MacUser Magazine Editor's Choice Award, and on Sedit, a low-level disk editor.

tooki

[Todd Madson]

In a way it's an end of an era but after running into several
instances of trashed drives after running their software (not
from Speed Disk though) I can't say I'll miss it terribly much.
It seemed much more suited to OS9 and its predecessors really.

[iNeusch]

Originally posted by -Q-:
Leaving your house isn't 100% safe.

LOL