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You are here: MacNN Forums > Software - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Applications > Safari 3.0 beta

Safari 3.0 beta (Page 5)
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Clinically Insane
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Jun 15, 2007, 10:51 AM
 
Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - View Post
We've established? You and which committee? It's plainly obvious that iTunes/iLife is just a darker variant of Unified and so is Leopard's theme.
Again, put a Mail window next to iTunes. Do they look the same? No. iTunes is darker, more metallic, has sharper corners. That is what we call "establishing." Anyway, you can call it a "variant," but it is still not the same theme. It's way similar, yeah, but there's no reason to expect a program to suddenly be unified on 10.4 just because it's going to use the systemwide theme on 10.5.
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JLL
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Jun 15, 2007, 01:27 PM
 
Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - View Post
I have to correct you there: Unified is in fact a standard look in 10.4.
As others have said, they are not the same, and Safari uses the standard textured window look and continues to do so in Tiger. That way it looks like it always have.

Why should Apple change all their textured apps in Tiger? iTunes was a UI test app for Leopard and making the textured apps unified in Tiger won't make them look like iTunes anyway.

Safari on Windows is unified because it then fits in with the other Apple app on that platform.

IMHO Apple should really make it look like a Windows app. What would the majority of Mac users think if Office for Mac suddenly looked exactly like the Windows version?
JLL

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Jun 15, 2007, 01:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by JLL View Post
Why should Apple change all their textured apps in Tiger? iTunes was a UI test app for Leopard and making the textured apps unified in Tiger won't make them look like iTunes anyway.
iPhoto has the Unified look as well, btw.

Originally Posted by JLL View Post
What would the majority of Mac users think if Office for Mac suddenly looked exactly like the Windows version?
We saw that when Word 6.0 came out.
     
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Jun 15, 2007, 02:21 PM
 
Well Safari 3 beta has created some sort of MAJOR problem on my iMac, even after I removed it using the un-installer.
My computer is now slow and plagued by spinning beachballs on starting applications, It comes up up with a keychain dialogue every time dashboard starts up (something about something having been updated) that locks-up the system for about 5mins.
This is the worst Beta Apple has ever produced, it's even worst than the OSX public beta, that was just useless due to the lack of OSX apps. This is actually broken.
     
JLL
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Jun 15, 2007, 02:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogika View Post
iPhoto has the Unified look as well, btw.
All of iLife has the same custom look.

Originally Posted by analogika View Post
We saw that when Word 6.0 came out.
And what a success that was.
JLL

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Jun 15, 2007, 02:41 PM
 
Originally Posted by Mediaman_12 View Post
Well Safari 3 beta has created some sort of MAJOR problem on my iMac, even after I removed it using the un-installer.
My computer is now slow and plagued by spinning beachballs on starting applications, It comes up up with a keychain dialogue every time dashboard starts up (something about something having been updated) that locks-up the system for about 5mins.
This is the worst Beta Apple has ever produced, it's even worst than the OSX public beta, that was just useless due to the lack of OSX apps. This is actually broken.
That's peculiar. Nobody else is reporting such problems. Do you have any system hacks installed that might have gotten confused from the update?
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Jun 15, 2007, 02:59 PM
 
The Safari beta has broken most of my 3rd-party Dashboard widgets, I notice.
     
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Jun 15, 2007, 03:50 PM
 
I've fixed the font display issue in Safari!

I know many folks are having this issue, I found the solution here.

You have to edit your .plist file in Notepad and make sure to add Lucida Grande and Lucida Grande Bold to the text the linked entry gives you to copy and paste. The filenames are lucidagrande.ttf and lucidagrandeb.ttf, respectively. This solved the problem for me immediately.

Now that I can finally use Safari in Windows XP I am noticing some bugs here and there. For example, I couldn't log in via the menu bar on the nnforums site, instead I had to go to a thread, click "post reply" and get rerouted to a separate login screen.

The font smoothing is noticeably different at first, especially because I've been using Firefox all day, but I'm getting used to it. And I don't know if it's really twice as fast as anything, but Safari has been noticeably faster than Firefox for me, and that's a good sign.
     
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Jun 15, 2007, 03:58 PM
 
Another note about the font smoothing.

I can actually view smaller font sizes on a web page with relative ease. What looked fine in Firefox looks too big in Safar, but even though the text is smaller than I usually have it set, it looks fine. I remember reading in one of the forums here that because of the way S
     
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Jun 15, 2007, 04:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogika View Post
The Safari beta has broken most of my 3rd-party Dashboard widgets, I notice.
I think this was the root of the problem I was having. I removed some of the more 'active' widgets (one that scrolled BBC headlines possibly the main culprit) and hopefully things may have improved.
It's strange that removing the Safari beta, doesn't seam to reverse the changes it makes to Dashboard.
     
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Jun 15, 2007, 04:29 PM
 
Does uninstalling the beta require you to restart? Because you'll probably have to before the removal fully takes effect.
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Jun 15, 2007, 05:03 PM
 
My apologies because I had started a thread about the following issue… but Safari 3 public beta doesn't play nice with AlchemyTV DVR… I had to uninstall Safari 3 public beta to get AlchemyTV DVR working again… which is a pity since I find Safari 3 public beta really fast, and this comes from a guy with a crappy dsl where any browser speed increase is a God's sent.

Does uninstalling the beta require you to restart?
Yes.
     
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Jun 16, 2007, 01:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chuckit View Post
Does uninstalling the beta require you to restart? Because you'll probably have to before the removal fully takes effect.
I had indeed restarted (multiple times in-fact) As I had un-installed the beta on wednesday, and was still having problems yesterday (till I removed the above mentioned widgets).
     
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Jun 16, 2007, 02:09 PM
 
Its buggered up iChat for me too. Im getting that same 'chat joining' error when receiving a new message from someone. Plus huge delays when i try to send text. I do use chax too mind. But im not about to uninstall that (in case this is contributing to the problem). I'll revert back to Safari V2 I think, as it just is not significantly different to the V3 beta anyway.
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Jun 16, 2007, 02:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by cold aspiration View Post
did safari 3 fix the memory leak? I'm surprised nobody has even mentioned it.
After a couple days running the beta it looks to me like they've changed the memory behavior. Whether they've fixed the leak I don't know. Machine's been up 4 days since installing the beta, and Safari has been in use without a restart the entire time. It's currently using ~330 megs of memory. Now, while that's a big hunk of memory, Safari hasn't gotten at all sluggish with that memory load, which does happen with earlier versions.
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Jun 16, 2007, 06:15 PM
 
It's safe to say that the release of Safari 3beta took all the thunder out of the Navigator 9beta release lol. Coincidence that both have resizable text area??

Patrix.
     
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Jun 16, 2007, 09:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by Grrr View Post
Its buggered up iChat for me too. Im getting that same 'chat joining' error when receiving a new message from someone. Plus huge delays when i try to send text. I do use chax too mind. But im not about to uninstall that (in case this is contributing to the problem). I'll revert back to Safari V2 I think, as it just is not significantly different to the V3 beta anyway.
It does seem this could be chax related after all. There is a chax update out today which says it addresses an incompatibility with safari V3.

I don't seem to get the chat joining error now, but there does still seem to be a strange delay creeping into the works from somewhere. However ive only been able to test it for a few minutes so far. So its a little early to be certain.
The worst thing about having a failing memory is..... no, it's gone.
     
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Jun 17, 2007, 03:37 AM
 
I found this little feature:



If you type a address wrong Safari will offer a Google search box
Signature depreciated.
     
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Jun 17, 2007, 04:47 AM
 
What. A. Mess. I accept that it's a beta and I might expect some instability. But IMHO it's been released for public testing way too early. It stuffed up Mail for me, as described by other posters; ditto iChat. I might be more forgiving if the beta didn't play nicely with 3rd-party apps, but these are core Mac OS X components, and I don't think it's too much to expect that they would have been tested rather more thoroughly in advance of the public beta release. I've uninstalled it, and everything now works properly again. Enough said......
     
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Jun 17, 2007, 05:06 AM
 
what's with the grey highlight - anyone know?

     
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Jun 17, 2007, 09:38 AM
 
Also I just noticed that the grey shaded url doesn't reflect the page you are on (it seems to show the first page you opened up) but if you manually highlight the url it changes to show the page you are viewing.
     
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Jun 17, 2007, 10:52 AM
 
I don't have 3 beta installed, but my guess would be that you use the Graphite appearance and that Safari is honouring that appearance selection, something it doesn't do at the moment in v.2.
     
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Jun 17, 2007, 02:51 PM
 
Originally Posted by JLL View Post
All of iLife has the same custom look.


Actually iCal is still the ugly brushed metal.
     
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Jun 17, 2007, 02:53 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogika View Post
The Safari beta has broken most of my 3rd-party Dashboard widgets, I notice.
Wow, that's weird. Safari 3 runs beautifully on my G5 desktop. I It scrolls better in MySpace and no crashes at all. I was curious if the Mac version was actually a beta?
     
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Jun 17, 2007, 04:58 PM
 
Safari 3 itself performs wonderfully.

It broke my DASHBOARD WIDGETS. AppleSearch, LyricTracker, Wikipedia widget, Fernsehen, Leo translation widget - all dead. Window shows, but no text entry fields, no buttons.
     
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Jun 17, 2007, 04:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by hldan View Post
Actually iCal is still the ugly brushed metal.
That's not part of iLife.
     
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Jun 17, 2007, 05:01 PM
 
BTW - Fascinating account on why Safari for Windows is an Earth-shaking event:

The Secret Diary of Bill Gates: WWDC 2007: Worst. Keynote. Ever.

What's really interesting here is what he didn't say.

Steve didn't mention that Nokia adopted the WebKit, the open source core of Safari, and adapted it to create the S60WebKit, which will be the core of Nokia's new browser on their smart phones, starting with the S60 Release 3 edition of their Symbian OS.

By the way, Symbian S60 phones reached an interesting milestone this spring. At about the same time as Apple reached the 100 million iPods sold milestone, Symbian S60 phones (Editions 1, 2, and 3 total) also reached 100 million units sold. The Safari WebKit based browser on the S60 Edition 3 smart phones has been available to Nokia and its partners since about November of 2005 which implies at least several million phones with this browser have been shipped, even if some S60 Edition 3 phones don't include the browser.

With sales of S60 Edition 3 smart phones at 15 million per quarter in Q1 2007, it would seem fair to say that the WebKit based share of the browser market might also increase from this source, and could potentially double the "Safari" share of the browser marker if nothing else changed.

But oh, yes, there are changes.

Steve mentioned that a half a million FireFox downloads occur each day, and that 1 million iTunes downloads happen each day, too. If Apple can persuade 5% of their iTunes downloaders to use Safari for Windows, they'll add nearly another 18 million Safari users, doubling their market share over today's 5%.

So far we're projecting a 15% market share for Safari by WWDC 2008, and we haven't even accounted for iPhone sales, which could easily add a few more percentage points to browser share for Safari.

All of this is really about the iPhone.

As long as Safari is a 2nd class web citizen, Safari users will face web sites that are IE only and lock them out or shunt them off to an inferior web experience. This affects users on the Macintosh to some degree, but those users can install alternate browsers that take a bug-for-bug-compatibility-with-IE strategy, rather than emphasize standards-compliance, like Safari. On the iPhone, users won't have that choice, at least not in the foreseeable future.

Safari for Windows is a bold play to recapture the internet, which we more or less successfully hijacked for a long time. Steve is betting on a combination of standards compliant browsers to build up a large enough market share to boost the efforts of the tiny open source community, and reinforce in turn the efforts of Apple.
developers don't even need to wait for the iPhone market to mature. Nokia is creating new potential customers every day, by shipping WebKit enabled phones.

By delivering the "lowest common denominator" first, in such an elegant simple way, Steve Jobs is handing his developers a new market on a silver platter, a market that already has more application-hungry customers than the entire Macintosh market has ever had, and which will easily double in size this year, even if the iPhone utterly flops. He's handing them Nokia's customers, and all the iTunes using Safari for Windows customers, too, really.

Of course, the iPhone won't flop. It will penetrate markets that all the pundits have been saying lay beyond it, due to the presumed "lack" of an SDK. Well, the SDK was right there in front of them, all along. A mere man-month and 600 lines of code later, and a mission critical business application was demoed on stage, live, on an Phone, 18 days before the iPhone ships. It has flick-to-scroll lists, hot-links, touch-to-call ability, pinch-to-resize, and the whole taco right there, carefully hidden in plain sight all along.

The iPhone is Apple's first computer that will directly appeal to the Enterprise customer in a way that circumvents all the bean counter's brainwashing we've done for decades. Custom applications, easy to build with open standards, and a major industry partner with substantial market penetration already, Nokia.

And that, my dear blogosphere friends, is why I think this WWDC Keynote was an earthshaking event, cleverly hidden behind the glitz of Core Animation and the iPhone.

The internet will never be the same again.
     
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Jun 18, 2007, 12:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by Don Pickett View Post
Whether they've fixed the leak
This idea that there's only one leak, or that the memory behavior of safari is actually related to a "leak" in the accurate sense of the word, is definitely an incorrect one. They've fixed at least tens, and probably more like hundreds, of leaks, as well as drastically improved cache management and reduced the size of many data structures within webkit. In my testing the cache changes had the largest effect.
     
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Jun 18, 2007, 03:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by jmp998 View Post
This was driving me crazy, but the fix is simple. The Adobe Acrobat plugin is crashing Safari...Maybe upgrading to Acrobat 8 would also work, still running 7.0 here.
Upgrading to 8.0 did indeed do the trick, thanks!

Oddly, I installed the beta on two G4 machines at home over the weekend. One has the crashing problem...but the other does not!
     
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Jun 18, 2007, 05:23 PM
 
My web based widgets broke.
     
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Jun 18, 2007, 06:08 PM
 
Same here. That's a lot of third party widgets that died.
     
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Jun 18, 2007, 06:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by Catfish_Man View Post
This idea that there's only one leak, or that the memory behavior of safari is actually related to a "leak" in the accurate sense of the word, is definitely an incorrect one. They've fixed at least tens, and probably more like hundreds, of leaks, as well as drastically improved cache management and reduced the size of many data structures within webkit. In my testing the cache changes had the largest effect.
That may be true, but Safari still eats memory like a fat guy at Dunkin Donuts.
The era of anthropomorphizing hardware is over.
     
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Jun 18, 2007, 11:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by Don Pickett View Post
That may be true, but Safari still eats memory like a fat guy at Dunkin Donuts.
A nice attempt at a simile, but a fat guy eats *what* at Dunkin Doughnuts?

You need to remove the word "at," and then it will flow.
     
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Jun 19, 2007, 03:55 AM
 
Seriously, dude. A dangling simile just embarrasses all of us.

If you're running the beta you can go to the advanced panel in the preferences and turn on the simile checker.
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Jun 19, 2007, 09:53 AM
 
Originally Posted by CatOne View Post
A nice attempt at a simile, but a fat guy eats *what* at Dunkin Doughnuts?

You need to remove the word "at," and then it will flow.
One would hope that one's audience would be able to deduce what a man would eat in an establishment with "Donuts" in its name. Did one overestimate one's audience? Does one need to use smaller words?

The era of anthropomorphizing hardware is over.
     
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Jun 20, 2007, 04:41 PM
 
Apparently you can hack the Safari 3.0 plist so it will display a pie chart in the URL bar to indicate page loading/rendering progress. I've always found that the default progress bar in Safari was 1) too distracting, and 2) falsely gave the "perception" that Safari was slower because it could get hung up waiting on some ad or script to finish ... even though the page was fully viewable. The more subtle approach of the pie chart is a welcome improvement IMO.

defaults write com.apple.Safari DebugUsePieProgressIndicator -bool true



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Jun 20, 2007, 05:30 PM
 
Mmmm... pie.
     
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Jun 20, 2007, 05:39 PM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
Apparently you can hack the Safari 3.0 plist so it will display a pie chart in the URL bar to indicate page loading/rendering progress. I've always found that the default progress bar in Safari was 1) too distracting, and 2) falsely gave the "perception" that Safari was slower because it could get hung up waiting on some ad or script to finish ... even though the page was fully viewable. The more subtle approach of the pie chart is a welcome improvement IMO.

defaults write com.apple.Safari DebugUsePieProgressIndicator -bool true



OAW
I like. The pie is much less frustrating to watch than a half-filled address bar.
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Jun 21, 2007, 04:45 AM
 
Very cool tip, thanks OAW.
     
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Jun 21, 2007, 08:55 AM
 
Originally Posted by MartiNZ View Post
Microsoft Messenger is also crashing on me since installing the Safari beta. And that's crashes to error reporter from just closing chat windows, with no add-ins or anything. Any thoughts?
Yep Messenger is crashing for me too. The backtrace shows the crash is related to WebKit so I'm thinking the Safari beta is the cause.
     
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Jun 21, 2007, 11:18 AM
 
Anyway to easily remove this brushed metal from Safari 3.0?

EDIT:
Never-mind I went with iridium until UNO is working with 10.4.10 again...
( Last edited by zerostar; Jun 21, 2007 at 11:30 AM. )
     
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Jun 22, 2007, 01:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by rotuts View Post
Im not sure this is the thread but I had to put my 5 cents in

Jobs is incredibly brright at times and sometimes he lets his very large ego shoot himself in the foot.

why bother putting aapl engineeers on a pure windows app that gets aapl no money at all?

the potential for riddicule in infinite see the blogs now!

no windows person is going to swtich because of a browser

they have Itunes that adds revenue to aapl

so sad such a waste of aapl resourses

shouldn't this effort been placed in say iLife?

make no sense to me at all

appreciate any positive view of the windows safari to see if Im wrong

cheers
More like 2¢. You do realize spellcheckers and caps keys do come on most computers these days?

This is a computer-generated message and needs no signature.
     
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Jun 22, 2007, 09:19 AM
 
The newest nightly WebKit has an awesome redesign of the element inspector. It's just lovely and amazingly useful.
     
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Jun 22, 2007, 01:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by jmp998 View Post
This was driving me crazy, but the fix is simple. The Adobe Acrobat plugin is crashing Safari. Open adobe reader, access adobe reader preferences, in the "Internet" preferences, UNcheck "Display PDF in browser using Adobe Reader". Safari will then render the PDF itself, much faster and nicer than the Adobe plugin. It would be nice if safari 3.0 would automatically make this change, or at least have an internal preference setting to change it. Maybe upgrading to Acrobat 8 would also work, still running 7.0 here.
Hmm, I had the same problem and altered the settings in Acrobat Standard (7), but now Safari just downloads all PDF's in stead off displaying them inline. Anybody else seen this behaviour and knows a fix?
     
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Jun 23, 2007, 05:12 AM
 
Originally Posted by analogika View Post
Same here. That's a lot of third party widgets that died.
The 3.0.2 update fixed this problem!
     
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Jun 23, 2007, 06:26 AM
 
Is there a BUG? I can not close my windows on my iBook in Safari, I did upgrade to Version 3.0.2 (522.12)...

Hardware Overview:

Machine Name: iBook G4
Machine Model: PowerBook6,5
CPU Type: PowerPC G4 (1.1)
Number Of CPUs: 1
CPU Speed: 1.07 GHz
L2 Cache (per CPU): 512 KB
Memory: 1.25 GB
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Serial Number: UV416H91QJP
     
Gus
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Jun 23, 2007, 07:35 AM
 
Originally Posted by Gus View Post
Hmm, I had the same problem and altered the settings in Acrobat Standard (7), but now Safari just downloads all PDF's in stead off displaying them inline. Anybody else seen this behaviour and knows a fix?
3.02 didn't seem to fix this problem.
     
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Jun 23, 2007, 08:38 AM
 
The problem is Acrobat 7, not Safari. Upgrade to 8 and everything is alright.

The new 8 plugin is pure delight after what Adobe presented us with before.

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Jun 23, 2007, 03:01 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogika View Post
The 3.0.2 update fixed this problem!
Why does this update require a machine restart? It's an f-ing web browser!
     
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Jun 23, 2007, 04:55 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Why does this update require a machine restart? It's an f-ing web browser!
Because it's not updating 'just the web browser', it's updating the Webkit framework too. which it used by all sorts of other parts of the OS (ie Dashboard). Notice how installing v3 removed v2.
     
 
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