[phobos]

This is my last year in graphic design.And I gonna do the bachelor here in greece the next year.The thing is that after that I'm considering leaving greece and making a master either in U.S.A or in UK(more probable)After that if all goes well maybe I could stay
in UK or USA for real work.I really want to do this but I don't know how easy it is to be employed for a work that is creative and not scanning pics and making the layouts of a magazine in quark.The way I see it (correct me ofcourse if I'm wrong) the competition is very high compared to greece where the competition is high only in the big advertisement agencys.Also I think that out of greece either you work your whole life as a scanner boy (which means no creativity) or make a very specific part of a job which also means no creativity at all.Here in greece where everything is so under evolved you have more opportunities to do the whole job on your own.On the other hand everything "advanced" that you could do on other countries here in greece it would be rejected in a second.So please inform me for the opportunities in other countries.I really want to go outside of greece because this is the only way I could evolve as a graphic designer.So
waiting for your opinions...

[mayhemstudios]

The job market is very bad here in the United States, especially for Graphic Designers. I am trying to find a good job and get some new clients.

Cal

[Clive]

In the UK if you're good you can get a creative job any time, even now. As times get harder there are less jobs, but if you really are good, then you'll always get work.

If you're not so good there's plenty of varied design/production work - which requires an eye for detail.

Either way, the UK is a huge market for designers, and you can always get by one way or another.

[MikeM32]

I was working for 4 1/2 years in the production end. The thing was it wasn't a true "design" job, even though we did do alot of stuff in-house involving setting up full layouts and lots of typography. But it was mostly "copying" someone elses (either a sales rep., a prep dept. person or the customers/clients) rudimetiary sketch or layout.

I will say that much of the artwork supplied to us from ad agencies and freelancers did involve the use of the latest software. In turn they had to be prepared to receive files in newer software formats. I think the agencies in my area generally are trying to remain competetive with each other by keeping up to date with technology. the production places have to do so to be prepared for those files and so forth.

Because we generally didn't "conceive" the artwork they could get away with paying a "production" salary/wage. Many of the people I worked with there weren't what I'd consider artists at all. Lots of people in this line of work can't even draw. It's as-if they up and picked the career out of a "hat" so to speak. My boss there was one of those types. She'd been doing production-end work for so long she acted as-if it was the "end-all/be-all" of the visual commercial art field.

The management there just got so poor I had to bail-out. The emerging phylosophy was that we should act as-if wer'e dealing directly with the clients. My problem with that was they expect all that "dedication" but don't want to pay what it's worth or ever say it's anything more than production work. Then there's the total lack of recognition in return for that level of dedication.

A few of those people I worked with were actually quite talented. Talented enough to up and leave for something better, but tied down to the job for whatever reason(s) (kids, loans, mortgages, whatever). They needed the security of a low profile job, a paycheck and the benefits.

I see lots of openings that fall under the "Graphic Design" title, that aren't really "creative" job offerings. A few are actually more creative oriented offerings. I'm from the northeast not far from New York City and the region I live in may have alot to do with the general availabilty of commercial art work.

A friend of mine did freelance design work for many years and then decided to go to work for someone else. Even though he grossed more as a freelancer he also had to shell out for all his own expenses including medical benefits and so on.

I can't really "guesstimate" how open the creative design field is since I've never really worked in it. But I'd think you'd find stuff up around my "neck of the woods" (New York, New Jersey, Connecticut area). But a word of warning: the cost of living here is probably the highest in the whole country.

Mike

[ 11-10-2001: Message edited by: MikeM32 ]

[phobos]

So as I see it US is a no no..Common everybody give some more opinions...
Mike how are you doing professionmaly?I think that you are between jobs.Am I right???Hope for the best

[MikeM32]

My ex boss was a Greek american Maybe that has something to do with it

She was attractive though (but paranoid as hell)

Mike

[Apple Pro Underwear]

kick some ass. get over here and try your luck.

if your good, get better and come on over and lets wreak some havok on these design monkeys

if you suck, get better technically and come on over and lets wreak some havok on the production side

just get over here and design your butt off.

if you're a hard worker, then there will always be something for the guy who goes the that extra 7 miles

[godzookie2k]

no, don't come over here! Thats just more competition in an already heated field! Just kidding. I live in the DC/Metro area and though I can't find a full time position to save my life, I'm picking up alot of freelance work that is keeping me QUITE busy. However if you aren't too much into living the "where-the-hell-is-the-next-paycheck-coming-from" life, then I wouldn't *rush* over here.

Perhaps putting together a nice identity package for yourself and cold-mailing it to studios whos work works well with yours, with a letter saying how you are moving to the states soon and were looking for work. Then set a date to move here and set up meetings with art directors to look at your work in person.

Good Luck.
Nick

[phobos]

Yes that was what I was thinking.The only way to be great and do great projects is sowewhere out of Greece.I'm gonna miss this village!!!!(Cause that's what it is...) I don't really mind working long hours or not having enough money for some months but the hard part for me is the different way of life in U.K.Things are very different there and I must confess that in this part I prefer Greece.Oh well you can't have it all..

[godzookie2k]

I've worked in europe and in the US doing design, Depending on what kind of designer you are, I always found publication and ad design (read: print) is so much more cutting edge than American design. The European audience is, usually, much more "design-aware" than the American audience. So, the talent level in Europe, in my opinion, is much higher over all than the American side. I *love* European design. Perhaps somewhere else in Europe (UK?) could be a stop-gap solution for you? Y'all Euro's are always putting out cool stuff.


Nick

[mitchell_pgh]

The market in the US is competitive because of the terrorist attacks. Usually designers are let go after a little while. You may be looking through rose colored glasses. No matter what area you get into, your going to have to deal with the production end of it. Like my old boss said, "You can design the universe, but how would you print it?"

A sure way not to get a job is to only look online at Monster.com headhunter.com etc. etc. You won't find a job that way. You will need to look at organization websites or university websites (it takes more time, but it's worth it!)

[phobos]

Do you know the rents on england???? Is it expensive.550$ are the logical price here in greece???
I think that life in UK is expensive..Am I right????
If I don't do the bachelor in Greece I'm gonna do it in Middlesex University.For the master I haven't decided yet.

[ford prefect]

I think there are jobs in the U.S. If you're a good designer, you can get picked up by somebody small, and if you get better, you can move on to bigger and better things. Maybe you get here, and have to work at Denny's for a while, a lot of people have to, but for good artists/designers, there's always going to be work.

What happens if you absolutely CAN'T find a design job? You get some crap job until you can afford a ticket back to Greece, and you're back where you started, so the way I see it, you can't really lose.

[godzookie2k]

LOL, thats what I did ford prefect. man did that bring back some memories.

The design world isn't competitive because of the 9/11 attacks, it has been this way (getting progressively worse) for at least the last year. The dot com-blow out it partially to blame. Its a VERY tough market out here but there is work, it is just hard to find. i'm sure you will get something.

re: london
Yes, london/UK is expensive, but, keep in mind, when you work there you also get paid to balance that cost of living, so it isn't *that* expensive if you are working there.

Ok, I just got up, so I'm a little too groggy to say anything really coherent so this'll probably get edited later.
Nick

[Griggsy]

There's alays people looking for talent in the uk but it depends on one thing, which is more important than a good portfolio, being able to bull****, this is the ability to sell yourself as the best designer out there,especially at the moment.

It's the difference between an artworker and a designer, the ability to convince the client of your design solution and a lot of that has to do with the client's trust in you

Pick on the areas of your folio that you think are strong and then sell, sell, sell yourself.

Also if sombody asks you can you do something, if you haven't done it but have heard or read about it say you can do it! Best way to learn, sheer panic

Also research the companies that you are going for and find out their history, jobs are scarcer than they have been for a while so it is an employers market, so it helps to go armed with knowledge, (or just plain armed if your desperate), and I'll just add to the advice already in this forum, which is try to find somewhere small where you get to do everything.

[bluedog]

Within the last few days, three people I know have lost their jobs in the Midwest.

I was laid-off today as a production artist for a marketing company.

My brother-in-law worked for a large worldwide agency that places talent for graphic design skills and web technical staff was laid off last Thursday.

A longtime friend just quit his job because he hasn't gotten a paycheck in 3 months. They kept promising a breakthrough and bonuses. Finally, he said, "I can't afford to work for nothing."

The market in the US is soft. If you want to work in the design field, I suggest a better market. You may get here and find an opportunity, but the risk of having to take any job just to make a living seems higher than at other times.