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Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 06:48 PM

http://washingtontimes.com/world/200...2209-7042r.htm

PARIS � The French are arrogant, rude and surly to foreign visitors, said a leading French politician behind a scathing report on how the Gallic welcome leaves much to be desired.
____Bernard Plasait, a member of France's upper house of parliament, has concluded what millions of visitors have known for years.
____"Our bad image in this area, the arrogance we are accused of, our refusal to speak foreign languages, the sense we give that it's a great honor to visit us are among the ugly facts of which we should not be proud," reads the first paragraph of Mr. Plasait's report, which was commissioned by the government....
____Tourism Minister Leon Bertrand said, "Our aim is to let tourists know that France is trying to improve its welcome and the French that they have to do better."

Well at least they are planning on doing something about it.

Mastrap · Oct 14, 2004, 06:53 PM

Have you actually ever been to France?

Parisians are no more rude than New Yorkers, go to the countryside and people are friendly and helpful. As long as you, the visitor, make a bit of an effort.

CharlesS · Oct 14, 2004, 06:54 PM

When I was in France, the people didn't seem rude at all. They seemed perfectly friendly. I remember being somewhat surprised. And this was after the Bush anti-French madness got started, too.

ambush · Oct 14, 2004, 07:08 PM

blame it on Bush?

Atomic Rooster · Oct 14, 2004, 08:19 PM

New poll...

The French think Zimphire is rude!

News a eleven.

CD Hanks · Oct 14, 2004, 08:26 PM

I think what is being said is that the loudest of the French population are giving it a bad reputation, contrary to the reality.

Basically, they're trying to ditch their own stereotype.

effgee · Oct 14, 2004, 08:34 PM

Uh oh, an administration that openly talks about things that suck and need to be improved - no wonder Zim's all confused ...

Seriously, though - Mastrap has it 100% right - go to France, make an effort and (as long as you're not in Paris) you'd be surprised how many really friendly folks you meet. "All French are rude" is about as intelligent of statement as "All Germans are nazis" or "All Americans are uneducated" ... bull-doo-doo all around.

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 09:53 PM

Originally posted by effgee:
no wonder Zim's all confused ...

What am I confused about?

I didn't post a post of confusion.

villalobos · Oct 14, 2004, 09:54 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
http://washingtontimes.com/world/200...2209-7042r.htm

PARIS � The French are arrogant, rude and surly to foreign visitors, said a leading French politician behind a scathing report on how the Gallic welcome leaves much to be desired.
____Bernard Plasait, a member of France's upper house of parliament, has concluded what millions of visitors have known for years.
____"Our bad image in this area, the arrogance we are accused of, our refusal to speak foreign languages, the sense we give that it's a great honor to visit us are among the ugly facts of which we should not be proud," reads the first paragraph of Mr. Plasait's report, which was commissioned by the government....
____Tourism Minister Leon Bertrand said, "Our aim is to let tourists know that France is trying to improve its welcome and the French that they have to do better."

Well at least they are planning on doing something about it.

What I got from that article.
'France is still the world's No. 1 tourist destination in terms of numbers.'

Sounds like a dreadful place to visit to me.

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 09:56 PM

Originally posted by villalobos:
What I got from that article.
'France is still the world's No. 1 tourist destination in terms of numbers.'

Sounds like a dreadful place to visit to me.

Sure... if you also leave out these facts.

But the report concludes that this is meaningless because a considerable proportion are just passing through on their way somewhere else.
____"To claim we are the 'number-one tourist destination in the world' doesn't count for anything," says the report. "Among the 75 million visitors counted in 2003 were those who were only crossing the country, once on their way to Spain or Italy and a second time to return home."
____The report says a more realistic way of judging is by the annual income from tourists, which places France in third place with $36 billion after the United States ($90 billion) and Spain ($40 billion).

So yeah.

villalobos · Oct 14, 2004, 10:01 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Sure... if you also leave out these facts.

So yeah. [/B]

All right so that US of A is about 18 times the superficy of France, and drains about 2.5 time the amount of money that France does... And Spain drains about as much, and is about the same superficy. I guess those damn spaniards must be a bunch of arrogant as.....s huh? But since you never been there you would not know would you?

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 10:02 PM

Hey, I am not the one claiming anything. The French are saying this. Take it up with them.

ASIMO · Oct 14, 2004, 10:04 PM

Zimpie, so how was Paris? Or Barcelona? Tell me which was your favorite.

villalobos · Oct 14, 2004, 10:06 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Hey, I am not the one claiming anything. The French are saying this. Take it up with them.

Not the French, just a few of them.

For your informations, the Americans say that the invasion of Irak was a colossal mistake.

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 10:06 PM

Originally posted by ASIMO:
Zimpie, so how was Paris? Or Barcelona? Tell me which was your favorite.

ASIMO again, I am not the one making these claims. Some French people are

You guys crack me up.

alphamatrix · Oct 14, 2004, 10:09 PM

Spent 2 weeks in France, can't say they were rude to me.

villalobos · Oct 14, 2004, 10:11 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
ASIMO again, I am not the one making these claims. Some French people are

You guys crack me up.

[/B]

Hey, I am not the one claiming anything. The French are saying this. Take it up with them.

Flip
Flop

Flip
Flop

Flip
Flop

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 10:15 PM

OMG U ARE TEH BUSTED M3!@@

Of course I wasn't trying to say all the French are saying this.

You guys will grab for any straw no matter how pathetic wont you?

I expected better.

villalobos · Oct 14, 2004, 10:18 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
OMG U ARE TEH BUSTED M3!@@

Of course I wasn't trying to say all the French are saying this.

You guys will grab for any straw no matter how pathetic wont you?

I expected better.

don't take it personally, I am here to help you. I really hate it when you make a fool of yourself.

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 10:19 PM

Originally posted by villalobos:
I really hate it when you make a fool of yourself.

I am not the one being a petty little woman.

villalobos · Oct 14, 2004, 10:22 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
[img][/img]

[img][/img]

I am not the one being a petty little woman.

Like I said above, I care for you. Don't be pissed off. It will be all right. See? Feel better already dontcha?

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 10:24 PM

Don't care for me so much that you come off as a pretentious loon.

villalobos · Oct 14, 2004, 10:27 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Don't care for me so much that you come off as a pretentious loon.

See? I am trying to help and right away you have to come up with personnal attacks and name calling. That's not fair.

That really is unfair.

The world is sooooo unfair.

Bad Zimph'. Bad, bad Zimph'.

MacNStein · Oct 14, 2004, 10:34 PM

Wonder what's up with you idiots? Zimph posted an article, take it up with the French official that said it. You guys are running around like a bunch of whiny b!tches with your asses on fire. Pitiful.

What you should be saying is:

"WTF is up with Leon Bertrand? Where does he get that from?"

or

"Who here has visited France lately? How was your experience?"

But no, you choose to be a bunch of ass-hats, screaming at and abusing the guy who didn't even say anything one way or the other.

Children, please, take your Flintstones vitamins and go to bed. You're obviously a cranky bunch of brats when you don't get enough sleep.

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 10:36 PM

Originally posted by villalobos:
See? I am trying to help and right away you have to come up with personnal attacks and name calling. That's not fair. That really is unfair. The world is sooooo unfair.

Bad Zimph'. Bad, bad Zimph'.

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 10:37 PM

Originally posted by MacNStein:
Wonder what's up with you idiots? .. <snip>

They are just fanboys in training.

villalobos · Oct 14, 2004, 10:37 PM

Originally posted by MacNStein:
Wonder what's up with you idiots? Zimph posted an article, take it up with the French official that said it. You guys are running around like a bunch of whiny b!tches with your asses on fire. Pitiful.

What you should be saying is:

"WTF is up with Leon Bertrand? Where does he get that from?"

or

"Who here has visited France lately? How was your experience?"

But no, you choose to be a bunch of ass-hats, screaming at and abusing the guy who didn't even say anything one way or the other.

Children, please, take your Flintstones vitamins and go to bed. You're obviously a cranky bunch of brats when you don't get enough sleep.

Given the historical stance of Zimph' on France, one has to wonder why he would post that though. Gee, yeah I wonder why?

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 10:38 PM

You mean the posts I have made making fun of "freedom fries" and those who ban French products or such?

TheBadgerHunter · Oct 14, 2004, 10:57 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
You mean the posts I have made making fun of "freedom fries" and those who ban French products or such?

Classical example of conditioned repsonse: they disagree with you so much every day that you could be saying anything and they would still disagree.

Plus the report didn't say the french were rude it said that there were areas that made them SEEM rude.

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 10:59 PM

Originally posted by TheBadgerHunter:
Classical example of conditioned repsonse: they disagree with you so much every day that you could be saying anything and they would still disagree.

Yup.

ASIMO · Oct 14, 2004, 11:15 PM

Originally posted by MacNStein:
Wonder what's up with you idiots? Zimph posted an article, take it up with the French official that said it. You guys are running around like a bunch of whiny b!tches with your asses on fire. Pitiful.

...

Children, please, take your Flintstones vitamins and go to bed. You're obviously a cranky bunch of brats when you don't get enough sleep.

Are you really that inane? Or have you simply put zimpy on ignore for the past couple of years until tonight and are simply ignorant of history?

But in defense of zimpy, I think zimpy does not need your defense -- nor mine for that matter. He is a big boy, now. Besides, I have always been nice to zimp, if sometimes a bit harsh. Right, zimpy? I enjoy zimpy's posts and threads, how they have evolved and revolved in the past years.

Zimphire · Oct 14, 2004, 11:16 PM

Wanna go out back and french kiss?

ASIMO · Oct 14, 2004, 11:21 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Wanna go out back and french kiss?

I tried it once. Felt dirty. PDA is not my thing. Let us keep it in the bedroom.

MacNStein · Oct 14, 2004, 11:28 PM

Originally posted by ASIMO:
Are you really that inane? Or have you simply put zimpy on ignore for the past couple of years until tonight and are simply ignorant of history?

But in defense of zimpy, I think zimpy does not need your defense -- nor mine for that matter. He is a big boy, now. Besides, I have always been nice to zimp, if sometimes a bit harsh. Right, zimpy? I enjoy zimpy's posts and threads, how they have evolved and revolved in the past years.

Hogwash. "Don't shoot the messenger", as the old saying goes. Yell about the French minister who said those things, not Zimph. When he's making attacks, call him to task on it, but he wasn't doing that in this thread.

CharlesS · Oct 15, 2004, 12:01 AM

Originally posted by effgee:
(as long as you're not in Paris)

Hey, I was in Paris, and I encountered a grand total of one person whom I considered to be genuinely rude. Everyone else seemed friendly or at least neutral. They were a lot more patient with me than I probably would have been had I been in their shoes and had to deal with someone as inept at the language as I.

yukon · Oct 15, 2004, 12:01 AM

Because Americans do their best to learn the languages of the countries they visit and truly love the forigners that live there. I'm not saying the French are any different, the article (though in the Washington Times....) argues they aren't.

Does "IBL" still work anymore ;-), quite the personal argument up there, the good old lounge....

CharlesS · Oct 15, 2004, 12:14 AM

edit: dp

Xeo · Oct 15, 2004, 12:20 AM

I'm in the fanclub and even I think this thread went down the tubes for no reason. Although it can be said that your title and your last statement mean that you agree with the article. But mostly it's just people taking a **** for the sake of taking a ****.

sideus · Oct 15, 2004, 12:29 AM

This thread went to crap in no time. Seems to me whenever Zimphire starts a thread, it is guarantied that certain people will post a reply antagonizing him. Ridiculous.

Zimphire · Oct 15, 2004, 06:16 AM

Originally posted by yukon:
Because Americans do their best to learn the languages of the countries they visit and truly love the forigners that live there.

We have people working here in the US that doesn't even know the language.

phoenixboy70 · Oct 15, 2004, 06:20 AM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
We have people working here in the US that doesn't even know the language.

LOOOOOOOOOL

Xeo · Oct 15, 2004, 06:28 AM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
We have people working here in the US that doesn't even know the language.

If you were anyone else I'd think you did that on purpose, but I know it's just part of the rules you go by. (It's fine)

TETENAL · Oct 15, 2004, 06:35 AM

Originally posted by Mastrap:
Have you actually ever been to France?

Parisians are no more rude than New Yorkers.

I haven't been to New York yet, but I have been in France and one can clearly notice that the French are (or appear to be) much more rude than the Spaniards for example. Spaniards are friendly and helpful, the younger population speaks English very well, and when you � at least try to � speak their language they are so happy. French openly show you that they are not interested in talking with foreigners.

This is all on average all of course. There are really nice French people and asshole Spaniards, but a general difference in attitude can not be denied.

Nevertheless France is a great country that is well worth a visit. One just needs to get used to it that it's nothing personal when you don't get a warm welcome.

phoenixboy70 · Oct 15, 2004, 06:37 AM

Originally posted by TETENAL:
I haven't been to New York yet, but I have been in France and one can clearly notice that the French are (or appear to be) much more rude than the Spaniards for example. Spaniards are friendly and helpful, the younger population speaks English very well

BWAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAHAAAA

badidea · Oct 15, 2004, 07:09 AM

If you are German then our best friends, the French, can be extremely rude (quite understandable)!
When I was 15, I was in Bourge (central France) for a school exchange program. There was one teacher in that school who didn't allow us German children in his class just because we were German!!

Makes a lot of sense: school exchange but don't come to my school...
(and this was just one example of quite a few more I experienced back then)

effgee · Oct 15, 2004, 07:20 AM

Originally posted by badidea:
... When I was 15, I was in Bourge (central France) for a school exchange program. There was one teacher in that school who didn't allow us German children in his class just because we were German!! ...

He was probably embarassed because he and/or his (grand-)father collaborated with the nazis during WW2.

Proves the usual point - there's a lot of ignorant pr*cks, no matter where you go.

Toutgood · Oct 15, 2004, 08:00 AM

Here in Paris, the most visited city in the world by the way, I'm more struck by the rudeness and lack of understanding displayed by foreign tourists than by the Parisians (many of whom are about as rude as people in my hometown New York).

But also, people around the world have different ideas on politeness. In the USA being polite often means overdone saccarine sweetness, smiles, The Gap type "Hey, how's it going!" greetings. That bothers me too. And in many ways the direct, but no smiles or chattiness, approach to politeness can be kind of nice.

And hey, over here regulars get better treatment than first timers- go to a caf�, restaurant, store over and over and things change. Then you get the "Hey, how are you doing?'s - and you know what? They're sincere!

Hugi · Oct 15, 2004, 08:15 AM

I've been to France several times and I find the people there to be generally nice. In fact, I find that most anywhere I go, people are generally nice, be it France, US, Britain, Germany, Iceland, etc. etc. If you just treat other people like you expect to be treated yourself, you'll suddenly meet a whole lot more nice people.

But of course, who am I to ruin a fun game of stereotyping...

Oisín · Oct 15, 2004, 08:24 AM

Originally posted by Hugi:
I've been to France several times and I find the people there to be generally nice. In fact, I find that most anywhere I go, people are generally nice, be it France, US, Britain, Germany, Iceland, etc. etc. If you just treat other people like you expect to be treated yourself, you'll suddenly meet a whole lot more nice people.

And an extra one for the gallery:

Zimphire · Oct 15, 2004, 08:34 AM

Originally posted by Hugi:
I've been to France several times and I find the people there to be generally nice. In fact, I find that most anywhere I go, people are generally nice, be it France, US, Britain, Germany, Iceland, etc. etc. If you just treat other people like you expect to be treated yourself, you'll suddenly meet a whole lot more nice people.

But of course, who am I to ruin a fun game of stereotyping...

Same here. Every place I have been to I have been nice to.

I am thinking about going to Europe sometime soon. France is probably on my list.