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starman · Mar 10, 2005, 08:19 AM

So, I'm writing this app. Turns out someone beat me to naming the app with the name I wanted to give it, and I wanted it BADLY because now I have to give it some bullsh*t name. The kicker? Not to toot my own horn but mine's better. It's not even released yet and it's better. Better stability, features, etc. and I'm not even done with the damn thing yet.

I want mine to be the one that's known with the name that's easy to remember.

So what do I do? Name it what I want and hope the app overshadows the other one or suck it up and give it the bullsh*t name?

Mike

skalie · Mar 10, 2005, 08:27 AM

Think of a better name than the one you had.

demograph68 · Mar 10, 2005, 08:28 AM

What's it called? What does it do?

starman · Mar 10, 2005, 08:38 AM

Originally posted by demograph68:
What's it called? What does it do?

I don't want to say just yet.

Mike

DarwinX · Mar 10, 2005, 09:00 AM

Originally posted by starman:
I don't want to say just yet.

Mike

Ahhh! D.A.M.N. suspense!

Randman · Mar 10, 2005, 09:20 AM

You snooze, you lose.

E's Lil Theorem · Mar 10, 2005, 09:24 AM

Originally posted by skalie:
Think of a better name than the one you had.

Since you can't tell us more about it, I think this is the best advice. I mean, you could try contacting the other developer, but your chances of him agreeing to something you'd be happy with (like letting you use the name) are slim.

pooka · Mar 10, 2005, 09:24 AM

Put a lowercase "i" in front of the name.

benb · Mar 10, 2005, 09:39 AM

In your case, you just might need to get the ideas a bit sooner.

First the domain name, and now this!

demograph68 · Mar 10, 2005, 09:57 AM

It's a solitaire game.

starman · Mar 10, 2005, 09:58 AM

Originally posted by pooka:
Put a lowercase "i" in front of the name.

Well, that's the problem. That's what I wanted to do

Mike

Deimos · Mar 10, 2005, 10:02 AM

Is it an app like iFlicks?

starman · Mar 10, 2005, 10:15 AM

Originally posted by Deimos:
Is it an app like iFlicks?

No.

The reason why I don't want to say too much about it is because I have ideas that the "competition" doesn't and I don't want to tip my hat to anything.

Mike

angelmb · Mar 10, 2005, 10:20 AM

adding a "!" at the end of the name is an option?

Y3a · Mar 10, 2005, 10:20 AM

You SHOULD HAVE registered the name and started the legal paperwork first, then YOU WOULD HAVE IT and while you waited for the lawyers you can finish the product, packaging etc. You had a good idea, but your marketing sucks..

starman · Mar 10, 2005, 10:29 AM

Originally posted by Y3a:
You SHOULD HAVE registered the name and started the legal paperwork first, then YOU WOULD HAVE IT and while you waited for the lawyers you can finish the product, packaging etc. You had a good idea, but your marketing sucks..

Or....

I had no idea that such a thing COULD exist in the first place.

There's no "packaging" or "lawyers". It's shareware.

Maybe I'm making too much out of nothing.

Mike

starman · Mar 10, 2005, 10:36 AM

Ok, I have an idea for another name.

How and where would I register it if I haven't released it yet?

Mike

budster101 · Mar 10, 2005, 10:44 AM

Originally posted by starman:
Ok, I have an idea for another name.

How and where would I register it if I haven't released it yet?

Mike

Write down your idea in a complete manner.

- Name
- What it is for
- Function
- Relation of name to product
- Date, Signature

Go to a UPS store, they have notory publics to stamp and whitness the date and time of your confirming of this information. This will help substantiate the first notion of the idea.

Now you can develop your product, and stamp a copywrite applied for notice on it.

This is all you should need for now.
(My guess based on experience in inventing various products of my own, that subsequently went nowhere, which is why I'm in here typing like an idiot instead of lounging on a beach somewhere with a frozen drink in one hand and my beautiful wife next to me...)

If anyone wishes to claim the name, then you can show the paper denoting the time and date of your idea's birth. Request the same from the inquiring party...

mitchell_pgh · Mar 10, 2005, 10:48 AM

I wouldn't worry much about it. Try to be creative and consider an alternative name.

Remember Panic's Transmit started out "Transport" or something like that.

or change the "i" to an "e" eTunes, ePhoto, etc. etc. etc.

In the end, it's all about the quality of the software.

Millennium · Mar 10, 2005, 11:17 AM

What is the name of the app which took your name? That doesn't necessarily tell us anything about what your own program does, so it should keep your secrets safe.

Transmit, by the way, used to be called "Transit". I think i've still got a really old copy of it somewhere.

saddino · Mar 10, 2005, 11:35 AM

Originally posted by budster101:
Write down your idea in a complete manner.

- Name
- What it is for
- Function
- Relation of name to product
- Date, Signature

There is a big difference between Copyrights, Trademarks and Patents. FYI, your "advice" only applies to Copyright, and even then, it's not the best straegy for protection. Since I've filed for all three of these at various times (with lawyers and without), here's what I know:

On Copyright: you don't have to do anything to claim Copyright. At the time you have created something (e.g. an article, novel, painting, etc. something creative) you automatically have a copyright by the nature of creating it in the first place. However, if you get involved in a legal dispute (i.e. someone plagarizes your work and claims it as their own), then a registered Copyright affords legal advantages that are worth the trouble. It's easy to do: get forms at www.copyright.gov and fill them out. For $30, it is legally offers much more protection than the "write down, notarize and seal" method you describe.

On Trademark: you don't have to do anything to claim a Trademark. At the time you are producing a product or service in the marketplace, you automatically have a claim on the trademark...but only if someone else cannot challenge it. So, for the same reason as Copyright, it is best to register a Trademark with the USPTO (also, you can register for a Trademark before your product or service is ready). It costs about $250 and is much more involved than filing for Copyright. There is a period where others can challenge your claim, but if you make it past that period, and are actively selling/producing your product or service, then you will get a legal Trademark (which you will have to defend proactively so as not to lose it).

In the OP's case, if someone came up with the same name, and is actively producing a product with it, then you're out of luck. You can try to negotiate to buy it. As someone mentioned above, if you thought the name was valuable, you should have filed to register a Trademark on in -- shareware or not -- it's the only way to protect a product/service name.

On Patent: to protect an idea, it must be new, useful and non-obvious invention (not just "some idea"). The only protection you can get is to file for a Patent with the USPTO. It's about $350 to file, and the forms are complex and must be completed perfectly. For this reason, most people use a patent attorney. The process takes about 2 years and there are additional fees for issuance and maintenance.

budster101 · Mar 10, 2005, 02:59 PM

Originally posted by saddino:
In the OP's case, if someone came up with the same name, and is actively producing a product with it, then you're out of luck. You can try to negotiate to buy it. As someone mentioned above, if you thought the name was valuable, you should have filed to register a Trademark on in -- shareware or not -- it's the only way to protect a product/service name.

On Patent: to protect an idea, it must be new, useful and non-obvious invention (not just "some idea"). The only protection you can get is to file for a Patent with the USPTO. It's about $350 to file, and the forms are complex and must be completed perfectly. For this reason, most people use a patent attorney. The process takes about 2 years and there are additional fees for issuance and maintenance.

Uh. Wow.
Thank You. I've learned a great deal as well from your post.

Yep, my patents ran out a long time ago.

Say-lah-vee.

Captain Obvious · Mar 10, 2005, 03:06 PM

Originally posted by starman:
Or....

I had no idea that such a thing COULD exist in the first place.

There's no "packaging" or "lawyers". It's shareware.

That's insanely naive. If you are a real developer you should take this sort of thing more seriously if you want to make a living off of it.

ManOfSteal · Mar 10, 2005, 05:50 PM

I would become Microsoft�...oh wait...

starman · Mar 11, 2005, 11:52 AM

Originally posted by Captain Obvious:
That's insanely naive. If you are a real developer you should take this sort of thing more seriously if you want to make a living off of it.

What, exactly, should I take "more seriously"? I already make a damn good living as a software engineer. This is a piece of shareware I'm writing, and I don't think this little thing is going to get me a new car.

Mike

starman · Mar 11, 2005, 11:54 AM

Originally posted by Millennium:
What is the name of the app which took your name? That doesn't necessarily tell us anything about what your own program does, so it should keep your secrets safe.

Actually, the name of the app gives it all away.

I just got back from an overnight stay in Atlantic City. I'm going to try to perhaps bang out a pre-1.0 version today or sometime this weekend so I can get a jump start on the whole thing. The problem is that if I do that, it gives the "other guys" a view of what I'm working towards and I'm not sure if I want them to see it before I'm actually finished with a 1.0 version.

Mike

Randman · Mar 11, 2005, 11:59 AM

demograph68 · Mar 11, 2005, 12:07 PM

Originally posted by starman:
What, exactly, should I take "more seriously"? I already make a damn good living as a software engineer. This is a piece of shareware I'm writing, and I don't think this little thing is going to get me a new car.

He's probably a lawyer, that's why he cares so much.

BLAZE_MkIV · Mar 11, 2005, 12:10 PM

Do what microsoft does, they don't have windows copywrited they have "microsoft windows" copywrited and microsoft trademarked. Just come up with an original company name and call you product by company name + product name.

saddino · Mar 11, 2005, 12:39 PM

Originally posted by BLAZE_MkIV:
Do what microsoft does, they don't have windows copywrited they have "microsoft windows" copywrited and microsoft trademarked. Just come up with an original company name and call you product by company name + product name.

That's a useful branding tip for companies that want to use a generic (and thus unprotectable) name for a product or service and have a valuable trademark for their company name. However, it doesn't allow Microsoft, for example, to produce "Microsoft® Photoshop" so in this case, the OP likely cannot appropriate his competitor's name by simply adding his company's name first.

IMHO, his best strategy, withstanding registering for a Trademark:
1) Come up with his own name (I believe he says he has); and
2) Get his product to market to establish ownership of that name.

As long as his new name is non-infringing, he should be in the clear.

saddino · Mar 11, 2005, 12:41 PM

[Edit: double post]