[Nicko]

I am going to Europe next week for a holiday and will be there for about 8 days (I know its not enought time). Arriving in Amsterdam the plan is to take the train to paris and then go somewhere else. We were thinking of heading to Bordeaux for a wine tour and then a side trip to a seaside town to see the ocean.

So my question is, is Bordeaux a good place to visit? Or would it be better to go to a different area of France this time of year? I bought a lonely planet guide to france and there is so much to see...but so little time.

Also, what is a good length of time to be in Paris. As its kind of expensive I was figuring in about two or three days max. I think Versailles will take up 1 whole day of that at least.

I haven't been to france in over a decade, so if anyone who lives/and or has been there recently has some advice it would be much appreciated.

[:XI:]

French girls.

Oh, you meant places to go didn't you?

Er, go to The Louvre and laugh at how small the Mona Lisa is. Ride the tube. Go up the Eiffel Tour. Get a characture done, but don't sit for just anyone as some of them are really bad.

I spent 3 days in paris several years ago now, I didn't spend a lot of money. Almost nothing really, but I'm tight-fisted old coot so your mileage may vary . I wasn't eating at fancy places very often, one place my party went to the menus only had prices for the drinks which were more than reasonable. Boy! Did we get a shock when we got the bill!

[Goldfinger]

Originally Posted by Nicko

I am going to Europe next week for a holiday and will be there for about 8 days (I know its not enought time). Arriving in Amsterdam the plan is to take the train to paris and then go somewhere else. We were thinking of heading to Bordeaux for a wine tour and then a side trip to a seaside town to see the ocean.

So my question is, is Bordeaux a good place to visit? Or would it be better to go to a different area of France this time of year? I bought a lonely planet guide to france and there is so much to see...but so little time.

Also, what is a good length of time to be in Paris. As its kind of expensive I was figuring in about two or three days max. I think Versailles will take up 1 whole day of that at least.

I haven't been to france in over a decade, so if anyone who lives/and or has been there recently has some advice it would be much appreciated.

Well Bordeaux itself isn't all that interesting really. The wine tasting could be interesting . The Landes area south of Bordeaux is pretty boring as well, nothing but woods. I would suggest Carcassonne or the coastal area around Béziers and Perpignan.

Stay 2 days in Paris, it's enough. Personally I wouldn't go to Versailles, it's a bit boring, I went to Versailles once (been to Paris hundreds of times, but I don't live that far from it..) but I'm not planning on going back anytime soon. And you certainly don't need a whole day for it. The Louvre, yeah, if that sort of stuff interests you then I guess you could do it. But I would spend your time with the Eiffel tower, arc de triomphe and all the other stuff. Don't be fooled by the common thought that all restaurants in France are fantastic. It's utter ********. You have a few possibilities for food in France. Cheap and crap, cheap and mediocre, expensive and mediocre and expensive and good. But it's cheap and good that you want and you won't find it. Buy a Michelin guide for food it has an entire section just for Paris. Oh and if you rent a car then take it for a spin around the place de l'etoile, if you aren't used to that kind of traffic you'll probably be scared as hell . But it's good fun.

Enjoy your stay.

[jnrjr79]

If you are trying to conserve time, I would suggest the Picasso museum or Musee D'Orsay instead of the Louvre. Everyone who goes to the Louvre who doesn't have the time to spend all day there just goes and looks at the three most famous things and calls it a day. If it's important to go to the Louvre to mark something off of life's big checklist, then ok. But, if you are really interested in appreciating art with some efficiency, I think the smaller museums are more manageable.

Goldfinger, I don't know where you draw the line on cheap vs. expensive, but I think you're off base on the assessment of the food over there. As you live in Belgium you may take it for granted, but things as simple as a baguette or a croissant in France are infinitesimally better than the equivalent stateside.

Also, if you're looking for a cool area to walk around that looks nothing like the rest of Paris, La Defense is pretty cool. I also dig the Luxembourg Gardens if you have some nice weather.

[Randman]

A walking tour along Champs d'Elysée is good, and from there, you can hit the Eiffel Tower. If you've done it in the day, try the nighttime or vice verse.
La Defense is good. The Louvre is good and it can be done on the quick. A tour in and around Notre Dame is good. I don't know the name but that big underground mall is a good way to spend a few hours. Or just grab a seat on the Metro and cruise.
There's always Euro Disneyland for a day and the stops along the way are decent. If you were there today, there'd be WWII stuff going on at Normandy.

[Goldfinger]

Originally Posted by jnrjr79

Goldfinger, I don't know where you draw the line on cheap vs. expensive, but I think you're off base on the assessment of the food over there. As you live in Belgium you may take it for granted, but things as simple as a baguette or a croissant in France are infinitesimally better than the equivalent stateside.

Yeah, I understand that the cheap-expensive/good-bad line is a bit grey. But my point was: look out were you eat in France, tourists are often fooled because they think "hmm, France, they have fantastic cheap food everywhere" and that's something that is just not true. If you want fantastic and cheap food go to Italy. Now, I must add that I'm talking about real food, not the simple snack. As you say, you can't go wrong with simple things like baguettes of course.
Compared to american cuisine...well everything is better than that (except for the really expensive restaurants of course).
Ah well, I like to rant about this stuff because I like food. Like every Belgian..

[Troll]

There's a fun Segway tour you can do now although I think it's a bit expensive. You do get a trip around Paris in the open air without the foot ache though ... and you get to test drive a Segway! Otherwise look at the Paris Walking Tours for the Marais and Montmartre. That'll give you decent info, make sure you see the good sites and the tours are not expensive. Mike's Bike Tours is another option.

I would skip Versailles. It's a whole day and you'll need at least 3 full days in Paris. Versailles' gardens are beautiful, but the palace itself is just another chateau.

If you do the Louvre, either focus on 1 wing only or do the main sites and leave. It's too much to absorb. Either way, go to the Musee d'Orsay. Notre Dame, Sacre Coeur, Luxembourg Gardens, Eiffel Tower, rue Mouffetard, St. Sulpice, Invalides, the Pont Alexandre - all must sees.

As a 1 day tour, I'd start at Notre Dame. Pop across the river to Shakespeare & Co., then back onto the island, walk up to the end of the Ile de la Cite and perhaps take a boat trip (the Vedettes Pont Neuf are the most reasonable). When it drops you off again, cross the Pont Neuf and take a walk along to Seine up to Pont des Arts. Take some photos from Pont des Arts, cross over into the Louvre, then through the Tuileries to Place de la Concorde and up the Champs Elysees. That little tour will give you a good view of Paris.

Spend time in cafés. Just sit and enjoy. Paris is about café society and people as much as it is about beautiful architecture and museums.

Trips outside of Paris - consider the D-Day landing beaches in Normandy and the excellent Peace Museum as Caen as a base for exploring the area. Otherwise, consider the Champagne area rather than Bordeaux. More manageable. I would avoid Bordeaux actually. It's too big and disjointed for the time you have.

[Randman]

The Segway tours actually look kinda interesting. They didn't have them last time I was in Paris.

[Nicko]

Heh a segway tour. Now that sounds cool. Hmmm yea mb Versailles isn't all that its made out to be.

Hmmmm Champagne instead of Bordeaux, will check that out too.

Good thing I haven't reserved anything yet!

Speaking of hotels.... what is the best area to stay in that is close to the sights? Did I mention it has to be cheap?


Edit: eh, 70 euros for four hours on a segway? To much for me, but would probably be awsome.

[Randman]

Check online if you can. It was two years ago, but my then-g/f and I scored some rooms 1 block from the Champs and near the Arc for less than US$75 a night. The rooms were fine as well. Weekday discount.

[Randman]

BTW, if you haven't been before, London isn't very far away and worth spending a couple of days there. More so than other parts of France, imo.

[Nicko]

Originally Posted by Randman

BTW, if you haven't been before, London isn't very far away and worth spending a couple of days there. More so than other parts of France, imo.

Actuallly, I'm going to London for 2 days before heading to the Amsterdam.
Agreed, London is very cool. Last time I was there was over a year ago and it was in Feburary...DAMN cold too. I remember I didn't even bring a proper jacket, thinking it would be warmer. heh, atleast the weather SHOULD be nicer this time.

[khufuu]

Wow! It seems that TROLL is the only one who appreciated Paris.

In no apparent order, the best things on my trip were:

Notre Dame
Musee d'Orsay (mainly painting and sculpture)
Musee Carnavalet (everything.. painting, sculpture, furniture, clothes) (my favorite)
and if you have a nice sunny day

Sainte-Chapelle (on the left bank beside the Conciergerie has some of the best stained glass in the world...better than anything I've seen to date.)

Other than that, just walk walk walk. Eat nothing American. Have real butter on your bagettes and drink wine and cafe-au-lait any and every chance you stop at a cafe.

Also have to agree with TROLL on Bordeaux. Too little for to much travel. Champagne, Burgundy or Normandy are you best bets. Reims (in Champagne) is supposed to be quite nice...never been myself though.

[Goldfinger]

Originally Posted by khufuu

Wow! It seems that TROLL is the only one who appreciated Paris.

Now that's just not true.

[budster101]

Originally Posted by :XI:

French girls.

Oh, you meant places to go didn't you?

:funny:

[RAILhead]

...leave as quickly as possible?

/couldn't resist

[paul w]

Originally Posted by Nicko

Heh a segway tour. Now that sounds cool. Hmmm yea mb Versailles isn't all that its made out to be.

Hmmmm Champagne instead of Bordeaux, will check that out too.

Good thing I haven't reserved anything yet!

Speaking of hotels.... what is the best area to stay in that is close to the sights? Did I mention it has to be cheap?


Edit: eh, 70 euros for four hours on a segway? To much for me, but would probably be awsome.

Champagne is an easy day trip from Paris, no need to stay overnight, just catch a train to Reims, see a cave or two, have a champagne lunch and check out the cathedral. I wouldn't put it tops on my list, unless I was a big champagne fan. Around Paris you have some nice day sights, like Versailles, Chartres and Monet's garden in Giverny. If you are looking for other day trips there's Barbizon, Fontainebleau, Normandy, even Mont Saint Michel - something to see!

Also if you're in the southwest, I highly recommend you check out some of the prehistoric caves in the region, plus you've got the Dordogne which has some fabulous food, wine and country side.

Paris is a city you should plan to walk around in. Seeing the sights isn't as hard or as important as you might think. If your into its cosmopolitan side it has a couple decent ethnic neighborhoods.

Hell I can even recommend you a cheap hotel in the center. Depends what you're looking for, price range and so on. Let me know if you have any specific questions.

[theolein]

I'm not a big fan of Paris, and I agree that Bordeaux is not that special (it does have a good old city and some very interesting bars though) and the weather might not be all that good in Normandy at this time of the year unless there's a high pressure area, check www.meteofrance.com , then it certainly has some of the most stunning scenery (and the food is good as well). The south of France usually has good weather around this time of the year and if you get there before July the place shouldn't be too crowded. There's loads to see and do in the South as well, Marseille, Montpellier, Arles, the Camargue etc.

Edit: Paul's right about the Dordogne, which is south west of Paris, being an absolutely beautiful area. I spent a summer there many years ago, and I have some good memories.

[khufuu]

Originally Posted by Goldfinger

Now that's just not true.

It is so!

Actually, re-reading your post it seems like your favor the 'gastronome' side of French travel over the sight-seeing side. That's something I definitely neglected when I went. I didn't really get into the food as much as I should have. (Egypt and Malta were definitely food experiences though.)

I suggest that, when traveling in France, make sure to scope out where all the locals are eating and go there. If you see too many tourists, you've found the wrong spot to eat.