[Athens]

American made cars or imports take your pick of what you like more...

[Kevin]

I don't pick one over the other really. They both are pretty equal now-a-days.

So I guess I go for the one I can get cheaper, get labor FOR cheaper, and get parts FOR cheaper.

[RAILhead]

I used to buy only American Made cars until they went to crap. I now buy Nissan, Infiniti, Lexus and our next major car purchase will probably be a Jaguar.

Maury

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by RAILhead

I used to buy only American Made cars until they went to crap.

Maury

The 80s?

Because that is when the US cars took a dive. (Even my dad was buying VWs then)

By the early to mid 90s it picked back up.

You couldn't get him to buy a VW now.

Things have pretty much leveled off.

[RAILhead]

Not in my opinion. The interiors of American cars pale in comparison to the interiors of the companies I mentioned. When I buy a car, I want the interior to spoil me or my wife, and I have yet to find an American car that can come close tot he detail and build of a Lexus, Infiniti or even a Nissan.

Mechanically, things are getting closer -- but I'll probably be driving my Nissan far longer than my Dad will be driving his GMC.

Maury

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by RAILhead

Not in my opinion. The interiors of American cars pale in comparison to the interiors of the companies I mentioned. When I buy a car, I want the interior to spoil me or my wife, and I have yet to find an American car that can come close tot he detail and build of a Lexus, Infiniti or even a Nissan.

Lexus maybe. Nissan? No. I've seen Chryslers with interiors just as good.

But then again, I wasn't thinking about that. I was thinking more along the lines of engine and drivertrain.

But you DO have a point there with interior.

But that is something that never bothered me. I guess If I was using my car to travel long distances at a time it would be more of a concern.

I tend to like deep bucket seats.

[Athens]

The way I see it is like this

Import Pay more upfront and pay more for parts but they last a hell of a lot longer problem free
Domestic pay less upfront and pay less for parts but they break way more often.

In the end they both cost you the same in the long run but the import is more reliable during that same time span.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Athens

The way I see it is like this

Import Pay more upfront and pay more for parts but they last a hell of a lot longer problem free
Domestic pay less upfront and pay less for parts but they break way more often.

In the end they both cost you the same in the long run but the import is more reliable during that same time span.

Again, maybe in the 80s early 90s.

But I haven't seen that myself.

it all matters HOW you take care of the thing.

Now one could say those who PAY more for their car might be more in tune with taking CARE of it more.

That, and a lot of domestics are being run into the ground by teenagers that never change their oil.

You are seeing a new trend on Junky Honda Civics on the used board because of the recent trend of Teenagers using Civics more.

Not because Civics are starting to suck more, but because the people who are using them, aren't taking care of them.

So buying a used Foreign car isn't as worry free as it used to be.

You are going to end up paying MORE for it than you would a used domestic.

[Busemann]

American cars are crap. The main reason it's beginning to pick up is because they are outsourcing to Europe and Japan. The new Ford GT is a great example of this.

[Goldfinger]

I would say "import" heh.
American cars could be technically pretty good and reliable BUT they have certain disadvantages to us Europeans. Big engines (displacement) = insane taxes in europe. So that rules out most american cars. Engine sizes above 2.0 liters are considerd pretty "large". Plus most big engines tend to drink more (not saying that they all do, but most of them do) and that's not a good thing with fuel prices up to twice as much as you pay.
No diesels. If you don't offer a diesel then don't expect your car to sell.
Interior build quality. I have never ever seen an american car that even offers decent interior build quality. Even more expensive cars like Cadillacs or certain expensive sports cars offer no decent interior build quality.
And interior build quality is maybe one of the most important things that make you say "hmm, this car feels solid".

I guess you could say, I want cheap parts and labor but I don't think that there is a single American car that offers really good quality. Reasonable quality, yes, but really good ? No.

Disclaimer: don't take this as an Americans-bashing (country/people) post boys because, it isn't. It's just that I think that American cars are really disappointing.

[Kevin]

I've seen cheap American economy cars with over 200k miles on it without any MAJOR re-hauls.

This is not odd.

I've heard people scream they were never gonna buy an American car because of ONE lemon they owned.

I've heard the same idiots then go buy a foreign car and ruin it too, and say the same thing.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by KevinK

I've seen cheap American economy cars with over 200k miles on it without any MAJOR re-hauls.

This is not odd.

I've heard people scream they were never gonna buy an American car because of ONE lemon they owned.

I've heard the same idiots then go buy a foreign car and ruin it too, and say the same thing.

My 87 only has 251k on it, budy has a 88 Golf with 450k on it, I know 3 other Honda's with 400+k on them. I dont know any Domestics that made it past 200k that was still in good running condition

[Kevin]

Athens I said WITHOUT ANY MAJOR WORK.

I don't know of ANY Honda ever made that can go for 400+k on them without work.

ANY CAR that it is.

But hey, if you would like to post pics of said car, and it's engine and work book, go right ahead.

I usually sell my cars around 150k anyhow. I usually want a new one by then.

usually ever 5 or so years.

[Athens]

http://brian.is.a.rootboy.net click on prelude it has engines, body and inside pics and you can even make out its milage last month, i've added another 10k since I took those pictures. For the 400+ our local weather man from Global (BCTV) has a Honda with 400+k on it.

[Goldfinger]

Originally Posted by KevinK

I've seen cheap American economy cars with over 200k miles on it without any MAJOR re-hauls.

This is not odd.

I've heard people scream they were never gonna buy an American car because of ONE lemon they owned.

I've heard the same idiots then go buy a foreign car and ruin it too, and say the same thing.

The things is that the *perception* of quality with american cars is very low. Technically they may be very good, and I fully agree with you that most cars that are taken care of correctly will last you a very long time. But, when you enter a car and you see bouncy and cheap plastics, then the first thing you think is "oh, this isn't going to last too long". And you step out of the dealership and walk into the next one. It's like that for mee anyway. Even if I absolutely know that the car is technically very good. Like older Toyotas, like the Carina E (no idea if they ever sold it in the states). It was a car with a huuuuuge interior, it would probably last a billion miles but the interior looked soooo cheap that I didn't like the car. Perception of quality is an important factor for a lot of people.

[Randman]

How many "foreign" cars are built in the US these days? And how many "US" cars have parts from other places? I'd opt for reliability, durability, price and looks these days.

[dreilly1]

I didn't think that it really mattered anymore, since all the distinctions are getting muddled. American companies are moving their manufacturing to Mexico, and Japanese companies are moving their manufacturing to the U.S. If your goal is to keep American workers employed, you might be better off buying a Toyota or a Honda.

Then you have situations like Saab, which is a GM/Subaru joint venture now. A friend of mine bought a Saab this month because it was under the same "GM Employee Pricing" promotion that all the other GM brands are running right now. , and he got a car with Subaru's all-wheel drive and engine. And is Chrysler an American company or a German company now?

Some time back someone (I think it might have been Sealobo (edit -- nope, not him...)) posted a graph of different car brands and who owns what.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Randman

How many "foreign" cars are built in the US these days? And how many "US" cars have parts from other places? I'd opt for reliability, durability, price and looks these days.

Indeed.

That really cool Saab? Owned by GM.

[Athens]

you know really only time will tell because cars built today, we just wont know until 20 years down the road how good they are. Based on the cars built in the 80's and 90's it seems imports are better, currently domestics look like they cought up but we wont know for another 10 years. My friends 1998 Dodge Neon has more problems then my 87 Prelude and they both where abused pretty bad.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Athens

My friends 1998 Dodge Neon has more problems then my 87 Prelude and they both where abused pretty bad.

I have a 99 Neon that has REALLY been abused. No major problems.

But then again I check my oil a few times a week, and regularly replace it. I also use Synthetics.

Let me guess your friend had head gasket issues?

If he knew what he was doing, Chrysler would have fixed it for free.

Didn't effect the 99s though.

Take my brother for example. He just bought a new Accord last year. It's been in the shop countless times. He sold it a few weeks ago. It was a lemon.

I would never said Accords suck. Or foreign cars suck.

[as2]

I have to admit that I'm a fan of German made cars - Audi in particular.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by KevinK

I have a 99 Neon that has REALLY been abused. No major problems.

But then again I check my oil a few times a week, and regularly replace it. I also use Synthetics.

Let me guess your friend had head gasket issues?

If he knew what he was doing, Chrysler would have fixed it for free.

Didn't effect the 99s though.

Take my brother for example. He just bought a new Accord last year. It's been in the shop countless times. He sold it a few weeks ago. It was a lemon.

I would never said Accords suck. Or foreign cars suck.

Is that why so many Neons have blue smoke, I've always wondered why almost every one Ive seen was smoking a bit.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Athens

Is that why so many Neons have blue smoke, I've always wondered why almost every one Ive seen was smoking a bit.

Yup, from 96 to 98. The 1st gens had head gasket issues.

Most however wasn't effected. Most people who did take very good care of the car it didn't happen to.

It was still a flaw in the part. So Chrysler would fix it for free.

[RAILhead]

Here's a GMC Sierra Denali vs Nissan Titan interior. The GMC screams redneck to me, as do the Ford interiors (only much more so -- and don't even bring up a Dodge).




As far as interiors go, when American cars can look as good as these, then I'll consider buying one:







Those are the interiors of my wife's Infiniti, a Jaguar S Type, and a Lexus GS.

Maury

[Kevin]

I am tellin ya man, this is SO redneck!

[as2]

I have to say that some of the sexiest cars I've seen are Spykers - Made by a Dutch company.

[RAILhead]

Originally Posted by KevinK

I am tellin ya man, this is SO redneck!

SNIP PIC

Uhhh...hello? The Crossfire isn't a truck.

Maury

[spatterson]

I'm all about the German autos.... BMW in particular...

I want me the M5

[wdlove]

The last American car that I purchased, was probably 26 years ago. The foreign cars just are better made and more reliable. Consumer reports give the higher ratings and recommendations to foreign cars. The value of American cars is showing up in the layoffs at Ford and GM. along with planned plan closings. They just aren't getting the message.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by RAILhead

Uhhh...hello? The Crossfire isn't a truck.

Maury

*shrug* you just said interiors in general.

trucks aren't really luxury cars RAILhead.....

[RAILhead]

Originally Posted by KevinK

*shrug* you just said interiors in general.

trucks aren't really luxury cars RAILhead.....

Come on now Kevin, I plainly showed a GMC truck interior compared to my Titan interior, and I then commented on how the GMC screamed redneck, etc.

The comparison in the other pics I posted were to be viewed against the interiors of American cars, which is why I said "when American cars can look as good as these, then I'll consider buying one."

Maury

[E's Lil Theorem]

Originally Posted by as2

...Audi in particular.

I'm an Audi man as well

S4: w00t, w00t!

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by RAILhead

The comparison in the other pics I posted were to be viewed against the interiors of American cars, which is why I said "when American cars can look as good as these, then I'll consider buying one."

Maury

That must have been what threw me off.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

I like the exterior look of Americans cars more as they seem to be a bit less conservative most of the time. I haven't seen the interior of an American car I like though. Even neat looking cards like the PT Cruiser and Prowler (expensive) both have this cheap plastic creaky interior.

Can't comment on the engines though as I have personally tested both.

[jasonsRX7]

American car interiors suck. Nothing against the way the cars are built, I don't know enough about that to be judgemental. But when you sit on the inside, you're surrounded by crap. Even luxury vehicles like the Lincoln Navigators have this extremely cheap and crappy silver paint that scratches and rubs off easily.

[JHromadka]

I have a Toyota Celica right now, but my next vehicle will be American. I'll never buy a foreign truck.

[RAILhead]

Originally Posted by JHromadka

I have a Toyota Celica right now, but my next vehicle will be American. I'll never buy a foreign truck.

I was the same way about American trucks, too -- and I had been for years -- until it came time to buy a new one.

Titan it is.

Maury

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by jasonsRX7

American car interiors suck. Nothing against the way the cars are built, I don't know enough about that to be judgemental. But when you sit on the inside, you're surrounded by crap. Even luxury vehicles like the Lincoln Navigators have this extremely cheap and crappy silver paint that scratches and rubs off easily.

I've noticed the designs of it always seem oriented around people wearing thick gloves or partly retarded like some babys toy. Thick dials, giant drink holders etc.

Thats fine for trucks or minivans but you don't want to buy a Prowler with the same look.

[TETENAL]

Opel is the way to go. Does that count as American car?

[mitchell_pgh]

The US falls in the middle regarding problems.

Japanese and Korean automakers have around 13 problems per 100 vehicles.
The US has around 18 problems per 100 cars.
European automakers have around 21 problems per 100 vehicles.

That being said, there are some US cars that blow away the average... like the Mustang (with only 5 problems per 100 cars)

Source: http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosins.../01-110081.htm

[Albert Pujols]

Originally Posted by KevinK

I am tellin ya man, this is SO redneck!

The Crossfire is basically a European car. Most of the parts and design, including the interior are from the Mercedes R170.

[ghporter]

I chose "imports" but my 2002 Honda Civic Coupe was built in Marysville, Ohio. My previous Honda was built in Ontario, so that counts as an import too.

And much of the content of Ford's Escort is (or at least was) supposed to be imported. They made a huge point of that several years ago. Where do Chevrolet models that used to be Geos come from? Suzuki still makes several of them. Differentiating between where a board meets is really useless when trying to determine the "political" implications of which car company to buy from.

As for why I buy Hondas, it's because in the over 20 years that I've been doing so, they've never let me down. In 1981, my first new Honda car had a problem with the bearing on its water pump. I got a new pump from an auto parts store for around $20, and installed it myself (with some friends' help) in about 15 minutes with hand tools and without needing to drain the cooling system. My sister-in-law's new Mustang needed a similar repair, and it took the dealer 3 hours to replace the pump, including draining and refilling the cooling system and having to pull the whole engine to even get at the pump. Yes, they've been good to me. I like their styling, their color combinations, and the way they insist that dealers provide top class service departments. I can't say that all Honda dealers are great-when I bought my 1993 hatchback the sales dude almost made me walk away; I told him I wanted this model but was interested in what I could get with it, and he tried to hard sell the car to me! The car sold itself-he almost screwed it up.

[moonmonkey]

I have, and will only ever buy Aston Martins.

The interior is IMO better than a lexus.

[Athens]

I like VW and Honda most with Acura (I know its Honda) and Audi being close behind. For trucks I love Nissans.

My current 87 Honda Prelude has been good to me and I drive the hell out of the thing.

[Lancer409]

Originally Posted by moonmonkey

I have, and will only ever buy Aston Martins.

The interior is IMO better than a lexus.

DB9

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by mitchell_pgh

The US falls in the middle regarding problems.

Japanese and Korean automakers have around 13 problems per 100 vehicles.
The US has around 18 problems per 100 cars.
European automakers have around 21 problems per 100 vehicles.

That being said, there are some US cars that blow away the average... like the Mustang (with only 5 problems per 100 cars)

Source: http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosins.../01-110081.htm

I can believe it.

[ambush]

finally an american vs import car thread w/o Kilbey screaming non sense

On topic :

I think that Import cars look better. Just look at a cavalier... Kilbey calls it the edge of coolness.. wow it's pretty much the ugliest car ever made.



BUT I do LOVE the crossfire.. I've seen one and I was amazed. The focus is cool too, but I guess it doesn not count since it's a 100% euro design. Can't think of any other cool american cars for the moment. Oh yeah the new mustang kicks. That's it. (No, I don't like the viper...)

The VW may have more problems... but heck we've had a dodge caravan for like 9 years (changing it every like 3 years) and we've had so many problems with it, it's not even funny.

Never had a prob with the passat, nor the turbodiesel golf, nor the normal golf.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by ambush

finally an american vs import car thread w/o Kilbey screaming non sense

On topic :

I think that Import cars look better. Just look at a cavalier... Kilbey calls it the edge of coolness.. wow it's pretty much the ugliest car ever made.

You can't say that when their is VW Cabriolets and Golfs out there running.

I like the new Cobalt from Chevy. It's basically a redesigned Cavalier.

They need to make a faster one however.

[ambush]

Originally Posted by KevinK

You can't say that when their is VW Cabriolets and Golfs out there running.

I like the new Cobalt from Chevy. It's basically a redesigned Cavalier.

They need to make a faster one however.

vs




you gotta be kidding me.

of course, there's a huge price difference.

[Busemann]

Originally Posted by ambush

Let's party like it's 1989!