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ThinkInsane · Jul 5, 2005, 12:16 PM

I know we have some aircraft guys, so I though I would share some pictures I took at the Rochester International Airshow a couple of weeks ago. I wish I had brought my D70, but it was supposed to rain (and did), so the Fuji compact had to do.

More here.

FulcrumPilot · Jul 5, 2005, 04:10 PM

mig-19 (or f-100 sabre?) with that f-15 up there?

FulcrumPilot · 09:09 PM

My favorite airshow entrant ever - BF109

ghporter · Jul 5, 2005, 08:59 PM

Think, at least the Thunderbirds got to fly for you! The last airshow I went to I worked at-November '03 at Lackland AFB, the first airshow ever at Lackland. OK, so it was really on the Kelly airfield, but that had become part of Lackland so it counted. (Nice bit of irony; Lackland was built on what was the old bombing range for Kelly Field...) Anyway, it was rainy and cold and the ceiling was too low for the Thunderbirds to fly. We did see some Confederate Air Force (what do they call themselves now?) planes, which was very cool, but just about everyone came for the Thunderbirds, and the whole show sort of wound down after they announced they wouldn't be flying.

Fulcrum, from the wing tanks, I think it's a F-86. Correction: having checked the link Think posted I KNOW it's a Sabre. And the 109 rocks!

Gankdawg · Jul 5, 2005, 10:37 PM

Great pics, thanks.

xi_hyperon · Jul 5, 2005, 10:51 PM

Yeah, definitely a Sabre. They rock.

Nice pics!

ThinkInsane · Jul 5, 2005, 11:17 PM

Yep, it was a Sabre, and it made for a pretty cool heritage flight. I'd love to see that 109 in the air!

brapper · Jul 5, 2005, 11:19 PM

Great pics. Well taken.

JoshuaZ · Jul 5, 2005, 11:32 PM

Ooooo! Go go go Luftwaffe!

ThinkInsane · Jul 5, 2005, 11:37 PM

Another shot of the F-86

Fulcrum, the F-100 was the "Super Sabre"

cszar2001 · Jul 6, 2005, 01:09 AM

Originally Posted by FulcrumPilot

My favorite airshow entrant ever - BF109

That plane (technically not a "real" 109) is gonna be at an airshow not far from here at the end of July. My D70 is waiting.

FulcrumPilot · Jul 6, 2005, 09:59 AM

Originally Posted by ThinkInsane

Another shot of the F-86

Fulcrum, the F-100 was the "Super Sabre"

Yeah realized that after I posted too lazy to edit.

willed · Jul 6, 2005, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by cszar2001

That plane (technically not a "real" 109) is gonna be at an airshow not far from here at the end of July. My D70 is waiting.

What's not "real" about it?

(Genuine, rather than sarcastic, question)

wdlove · Jul 6, 2005, 10:34 AM

Very nice pictures on and all. I had the privilege of seeing an air show many times while in the Air Force. What an awesome sight to see our military in action.

ghporter · Jul 6, 2005, 11:05 AM

An interesting asside: you will NEVER see an A-10 do a demonstration flight at an event with F-15s or F-16s. It's because it makes the fast movers look bad! I was priveleged to work at Bergstrom AFB when A-10s were being delivered there from the factory, and I was once tasked to set up a public address system to support an A-10 demo for a large number of HIGH brass.

The A-10 did everything the Thunderbirds do (with single planes), but it did these things while never leaving the space immediately over the airfield. The Thunderbirds will do a pass over the field and take five minutes to turn around, while the A-10 managed to turn in the space between the overrun and the fence. F-15s F-16s can fly "inverted," but they still have to keep the nose pointed away from the ground to fly level. An A-10 can fly inverted straight and level, without having to point the nose anywhere but straight ahead. It was too cool!

cszar2001 · Jul 6, 2005, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by willed

What's not "real" about it?

(Genuine, rather than sarcastic, question)

The design of the 109 was "exported" to other countries - in this case Spain.
They built their own version of the 109. The "Red 7" as the plane is known is one of those.
The cockpit also has nothing to do with the original plane - it`s as modern as any small plane today. There are a few other modifications made that I forgot.

I hope I´ll be able to go to the airshow in 2 weeks so I can take my own (amazing) pictures.

cszar2001 · Jul 6, 2005, 11:32 AM

A shot of the instrument panel:

FulcrumPilot · 12:07 PM

Oh yeah thats a Gustav version, they made a whole lot of those. Yes that cockpit looks swanky, compared to this tight one:

someone stole the asi?

Go here if you want to know more about this classic:
http://www.bf109.com/

Layout detail:
http://members.macconnect.com/users/...9K-4Layout.jpg

Here is a K-4 cockpit layout explained in englisch:

http://members.macconnect.com/users/...ranslation.pdf

ThinkInsane · Jul 6, 2005, 12:59 PM

Originally Posted by ghporter

An interesting asside: you will NEVER see an A-10 do a demonstration flight at an event with F-15s or F-16s. It's because it makes the fast movers look bad! I was priveleged to work at Bergstrom AFB when A-10s were being delivered there from the factory, and I was once tasked to set up a public address system to support an A-10 demo for a large number of HIGH brass.

The A-10 did everything the Thunderbirds do (with single planes), but it did these things while never leaving the space immediately over the airfield. The Thunderbirds will do a pass over the field and take five minutes to turn around, while the A-10 managed to turn in the space between the overrun and the fence. F-15s F-16s can fly "inverted," but they still have to keep the nose pointed away from the ground to fly level. An A-10 can fly inverted straight and level, without having to point the nose anywhere but straight ahead. It was too cool!

When I was in high school, I belonged to the Explorer Post run by the 174th at Hancock Field. At the time they still had A-10's (now F-16's), and that started my life long love of those big ugly Warthogs.

A buddy of mine flies A-10's with the 51st. He says that if they ever mothball the 'hogs, he'll resign his commission. He has no desire to be anything other than a hog driver. He loves that plane like most people love their wives. I've got some pics he sent me while still in the Gulf. I'll have to dig them up and post them.

Last summer I saw an A-10 flight demo, and it was just as impressive as you say. the only down sound to the demo I saw was that the DEC wouldn't let them demonstrate the cannon over Lake Ontario. Apparently they don't want to do anything to disrupt that mercury level

FulcrumPilot · Jul 6, 2005, 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by ThinkInsane

When I was in high school, I belonged to the Explorer Post run by the 174th at Hancock Field. At the time they still had A-10's (now F-16's), and that started my life long love of those big ugly Warthogs.

A-10's will probably get their big ugli asses shot outa the sky in a real op with some real armies though. Just because it was successful in iraq doesnt mean a thing. Like why arent they using it a hell lot more in afganistan I wonder.....

ThinkInsane · Jul 6, 2005, 01:45 PM

Actually, they can take a hell of a lot of damage and still stay in the air. There have been A-10's that have come in missing half of each wing, and engine and a stabilizer, and still touched down safe and sound. It's a tough plane, to be sure. I was talking to a patient at work that was in the Soviet Army (we're a big immigration point) and he told me that they were taught to be terrified of A-10's and the damage they cause to ground troops. Now there's a ringing endorsement of a war machine

ghporter · Jul 6, 2005, 03:03 PM

An A-10 can loose:
Everything forward of the cockpit firewall
The outer third of BOTH wings
One tail
One engine
Sever ALL the longerons in the fuselage
BOTH hydraulic systems

And STILL fly 300 miles home. In Gulf War I a South Carolina Air Guard A-10 came home with a two-foot diameter hole in one wing. The pilot knew something had happened, but not the extent of the problem because the plane "flew rough." They WILL protect their pilot from up to 37mm antiaircraft shells as well. The engine design places their heat signature above and behind where the aircraft actually is; heat seekers don't find A-10s. You CANNOT hear an A-10 coming; you can only hear it after it has passed over you, something I saw demonstrated in Panama in 1989-Noriega's PDF troops HATED the A-10s.

Plus, they can loiter over an area for an extended period because of their very low stall speed, so if anyone wants to take a shot at them, they meet Mr. GAU-8 with 3000 or 6000 (selectable by the pilot) rounds per minute of 30mm antiarmor Gatling gun return fire. In Iraq, the real professional soldiers went up against the A-10...and lost badly.

JohnM15141 · Jul 6, 2005, 05:08 PM

In air to ground environments the A-10 is outstanding and is no more vulnerable than anything else flying in the same enviroment. In an air to air environment the A-10 is just a target, just like anything else that is meant for ground support. As a flying machine it's the most manueverable aircraft in the Air Force inventory.

Originally Posted by FulcrumPilot

A-10's will probably get their big ugli asses shot outa the sky in a real op with some real armies though. Just because it was successful in iraq doesnt mean a thing. Like why arent they using it a hell lot more in afganistan I wonder.....