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I gota be careful who I tell about MacNN...
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Aug 3, 2005, 11:55 PM
 
I had a friend from school instant message me asking if I was gay because of you guys! Thanks a lot
     
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Aug 3, 2005, 11:59 PM
 
Blog Comments:

So what did you tell him?

Posted by: MindFad at 12:01AM, 08/08/05
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:02 AM
 
I tried to sig-spam the forums.
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:04 AM
 
oh 'Fad :heart:


(i'm on a roll with this.)

edit: pics of time machine florida?
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:07 AM
 
Ya, blame it on us.
"That's okay, I'd like to keep it on manual control for a while."
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:13 AM
 
Just come out of the closet already...
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:13 AM
 
I think certain members have secret crushes on you.

I would go so far as to say they masturbate to pics of you... but you know what I mean.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:15 AM
 
Well then I should take some better pictures than the ones that some people have... since I look so much better now...
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:15 AM
 
I know you don't think you're gay right now, tie-belt notwithstanding, but lets say you started to develop a crush on a male friend, and it started getting sexual for you. Would you fight those urges, or would you welcome them? I would fight them, cause I'm happily married, and I try to discourage any sexual urges that don't originate my wife. I also personally believe in the whole Adam/Eve scenario. But the way a person rolls (down there) is totally up to them (except my kids, haha - kidding? man, I hope so...).

This goes to all of my fellow right wingers. Fight or welcome?


[stealth edit: I reworded some of this to put myself in a better light. :/]
( Last edited by DeathMan; Aug 4, 2005 at 12:21 AM. )
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by DeathMan
II would fight them, cause I'm happily married, and I fight any sexual urges that aren't directed toward my wife.
Sooo you're saying if you were single you would go for it?
"That's okay, I'd like to keep it on manual control for a while."
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:18 AM
 
NONE OF YOU GET IT! FLORIDA IS LIVING IN THE FUTURE.

jesus.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:19 AM
 
Ummm. Probably my personal religious beliefs would keep me from going for it. Its difficult to say for sure though, because it hasn't happened. I would have a very difficult time with it, like I said, for religious reasons. I know a lot of people don't believe in this as a question of morality, but I consider it a question of personal morality, and it would be tough.

Is it hypocritical of me to think something is not okay for me, but perfectly fine for someone else?
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:21 AM
 
Originally Posted by DeathMan
Ummm. Probably my personal religious beliefs would keep me from going for it. Its difficult to say for sure though, because it hasn't happened. I would have a very difficult time with it, like I said, for religious reasons. I know a lot of people don't believe in this as a question of morality, but I consider it a question of personal morality, and it would be tough.

Is it hypocritical of me to think something is not okay for me, but perfectly fine for someone else?
Well I wouldn't say hypocritical but I do think it is a bit sad IF you do find yourself attracted to men but don't act on it because of some "rulebook". One way or another not acting on it will effect your life or marriage.
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:22 AM
 
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:24 AM
 
Originally Posted by Scandalous Ion Cannon
Well I wouldn't say hypocritical but I do think it is a bit sad IF you do find yourself attracted to men but don't act on it because of some "rulebook". One way or another not acting on it will effect your life or marriage.
I wholeheartedly agree. However IMO in marriage, it is important not to act. Whether its a man or a woman you're thinking about. I agree that it would affect my life/marriage to just ignore something like that. Even if I weren't married.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:25 AM
 
Quite honestly I get a lot of people who "assume" I'm gay just because I work with a Mac and actually ADVOCATE working with a Mac. <sigh>. (That and the fact that I have a fairly high number of gay co-workers ... who are all cool folks by the way.)

It's not like I drive a saab to IKEA or anything .....

Anyway: back to the original topic. I don't pass judgement on anyone but myself and I stay pretty harsh with myself. (Even though I disappoint myself quite often.) Anyone who judges anyone else without being free from criticism is a hypocrite. So ... take care of yourself and don't worry about what other's think. (Does that make sense?)
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:26 AM
 
Blog Comments:

Hay guyz, why am I stuck two minutes in the future?

Am I gay now, too?

Posted by: MindFad at 12:28AM, 08/08/05
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:26 AM
 
haha, i feel kinda bad pooping on this thread, it's going to be a good'un.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:27 AM
 
Originally Posted by DeathMan
I know you don't think you're gay right now, tie-belt notwithstanding, but lets say you started to develop a crush on a male friend, and it started getting sexual for you. Would you fight those urges, or would you welcome them? I would fight them, cause I'm happily married, and I fight any sexual urges that aren't directed toward my wife. I also personally believe in the whole Adam/Eve scenario. But the way a person rolls (down there) is totally up to them (except my kids, haha - kidding? man, I hope so...).
Sex is always a choice. If your convictions are not above sex then you do not actually have convictions you simply have uncommitted ideals. My first commitment above anything else is to God. One of the commitments I have made in my life is to follow the road He's laid out for me which includes me being a Pastor.
I know that there is nothing I can do outside of that that will bring true happiness in my life. There's a great John Reuben song called All I Have:
https://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/...istId=74026909
It's course goes, "I'm all right, I'm OK, I kind of like doing things this way, all I have is what God gives, and that's all the life that I was meant to live"
Very good song. Very much the way I feel.
Life is not exclusively about sex, life isn't even exclusively about the person living it.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:27 AM
 
Originally Posted by MindFad
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Hay guyz, why am I stuck two minutes in the future?

Am I gay now, too?

Posted by: MindFad at 12:28AM, 08/08/05
2 minutes and 4 days...

edit: i give up. joke failed.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:30 AM
 
Wow, we totally killed it. We rock.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by DeathMan
I wholeheartedly agree. However IMO in marriage, it is important not to act. Whether its a man or a woman you're thinking about. I agree that it would affect my life/marriage to just ignore something like that. Even if I weren't married.
It is just I see soooooo many happily married men sleep with men behind their families back. It is sad really as I don't know if they are married for show or because they are in denial. Tons of "straight married men" want to date me discretely. Uh uh.

If the desire is really strong you may not be able to last and it might be better to divorce and deal with it. If not your desires may cause you to feel negative towards your wife or be mad at yourself.
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by MindFad
Blog Comments:

Hay guyz, why am I stuck two minutes in the future?

Am I gay now, too?

Posted by: MindFad at 12:28AM, 08/08/05
Blog Comments:

a/s/l?

Posted by: ManOfSteal at 12:30AM, 08/03/05
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:31 AM
 
Originally Posted by Salty
Sex is always a choice. If your convictions are not above sex then you do not actually have convictions you simply have uncommitted ideals. My first commitment above anything else is to God. One of the commitments I have made in my life is to follow the road He's laid out for me which includes me being a Pastor.

So pretty much you'd fight it. What aren't pastors allowed to do, beyond having relations with members of their genders? This is not baiting, I'm curious.


Also your line about convictions is off base. Were you trying to say if your convictions outlaw sex, but you do it anyway, you don't have convictions? Or just if sex doesn't play a part in your belief system?

[edits edits edits -- get it right the first time, eh?]
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:33 AM
 
Originally Posted by MindFad
Wow, we totally killed it. We rock.


edit: looks like MOS is living in the past.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:35 AM
 
As opposed to if you divorce her and ditch your kids... you won't feel negatively towards her then!
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:35 AM
 
Originally Posted by d4nth3m4n
edit: looks like MOS is living in the past.
Yeah, I'm getting a head start is all for the future.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:36 AM
 
NOBODY UNDERSTANDS ME!!!

i'm going to go sulk now.
[removed oversize image; you need to stop ignoring the rules dude. -- tooki]
( Last edited by tooki; Aug 8, 2005 at 12:11 AM. )
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:42 AM
 
Originally Posted by Scandalous Ion Cannon
It is just I see soooooo many happily married men sleep with men behind their families back. It is sad really as I don't know if they are married for show or because they are in denial. Tons of "straight married men" want to date me discretely. Uh uh.

If the desire is really strong you may not be able to last and it might be better to divorce and deal with it. If not your desires may cause you to feel negative towards your wife or be mad at yourself.

My approach will be don't sleep with anyone other than my wife. Its pretty simple. Some people don't do that. I've only been married for 5 years, so to me it still feels pretty new and great. I can't say its been much of a challenge to follow this rule. If you're at a point where you want to date men behind your wife's back, something went wrong in the not-immediate past (where MoS is living I guess -- I'm not really following that side plot.)

To me that scenario is less a matter of gender, and more a matter of keeping one's dick in one's pants.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:53 AM
 
Originally Posted by ManOfSteal
Blog Comments:

a/s/l?

Posted by: ManOfSteal at 12:30AM, 08/03/05
Blog Comments:

23+4 days, 2 minutes/M/Floor'duh

u?

Posted by: MindFad at 12:55AM, 08/08/05
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:53 AM
 
Originally Posted by DeathMan
So pretty much you'd fight it. What aren't pastors allowed to do, beyond having relations with members of their genders? This is not baiting, I'm curious.


Also your line about convictions is off base. Were you trying to say if your convictions outlaw sex, but you do it anyway, you don't have convictions? Or just if sex doesn't play a part in your belief system?

[edits edits edits -- get it right the first time, eh?]
I'm not saying that in the most... I guess literal sense. I'm saying it in the most... me sense (the convictions part, I don't see convictions as being something you should be willing to go back on... I think that makes you pretty spineless... that's not to say I'm entirely spineful all the time... but it's more who you'd like to be less than who you are...)

And Pastors couldn't fulfil their role as a Shepherd of God's people if they were involved in an on going homosexual relationship with someone because that is living a lifestyle of unrepentant sin. It's one thing to be a sinner it's another thing to make that your life style. Sexual sins are actually identified differently than any other sin in Scripture because they are said to be committed against the inner person. Which is true, when you do something wrong sexually it's different than just going out and beating up your neighbour, you break what should be a deep connection with your spouse, and you distort what is supposed to parallel your relationship with God.
It's one thing to have trouble with lying, to have trouble with always being kind toward people, it's another to say I will be dishonest about something and do not care that is who I will be, and live as that person, likewise it is another to decide you will live a life style of hatred toward one person or many. So yes if you look at this, those "Christians" who go out of their way to attack gay people are in essence living just as sinful of a life style as the people the hate (though the type of sin is different you should note.)
Of course this hinges on the fact that an embrace of a homosexual life style is sin. The reasons for why homosexual behaviour and some associated characteristics are sinful are actually somewhat complex. A great book that I originally picked up for a paper as an example of a gay bashing book (based on the cover) is Out of Order: Homosexuality in the Bible and the Ancient Near East by Donald J. Wold. You can buy it for like 20 bucks or something. But essentially the guy is a greek and hebrew scholar (and probably a few other things haha) and for once a biblical scholar that can write in a manner that doesn't make me want to rip out my hair. And he examines all the biblical text on the issue.
The case beyond what Wold goes into can also be made that homosexuality is the result of an improperly formed psychological love connection between one's self and one's gender (IE the inability to accept genuine love and acceptance from what you associate as male). Thus choosing to embrace this state could be said to be sinful.
Blah... I'm actually a bit too tired right now to explain it... but suffice it to say, that when someone tells you the bible says not to be gay since it was written by a bunch of straight people... they haven't done their research.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:54 AM
 
Deep.
I tried to sig-spam the forums.
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by DeathMan
My approach will be don't sleep with anyone other than my wife. Its pretty simple. Some people don't do that. I've only been married for 5 years, so to me it still feels pretty new and great. I can't say its been much of a challenge to follow this rule. If you're at a point where you want to date men behind your wife's back, something went wrong in the not-immediate past (where MoS is living I guess -- I'm not really following that side plot.)

To me that scenario is less a matter of gender, and more a matter of keeping one's dick in one's pants.
You awful prude! Don't you watch TV!? If things get even mildly inconvenient just ditch it... frick what is your problem!?
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 12:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by dillerX
Deep.
Oh, like hell you read through that. I get tired just looking at huge blocks of texts with no paragraph breaks, so I gave up.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:00 AM
 
Originally Posted by Salty
Sex is always a choice. If your convictions are not above sex then you do not actually have convictions you simply have uncommitted ideals. My first commitment above anything else is to God. One of the commitments I have made in my life is to follow the road He's laid out for me which includes me being a Pastor.
I know that there is nothing I can do outside of that that will bring true happiness in my life. There's a great John Reuben song called All I Have:
https://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/...istId=74026909
It's course goes, "I'm all right, I'm OK, I kind of like doing things this way, all I have is what God gives, and that's all the life that I was meant to live"
Very good song. Very much the way I feel.
Life is not exclusively about sex, life isn't even exclusively about the person living it.
Linking to a song when discussing sexuality and sexual orientation is a bit fem, don't you think?

This is a computer-generated message and needs no signature.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by Salty
Sex is always a choice. If your convictions are not above sex then you do not actually have convictions you simply have uncommitted ideals. My first commitment above anything else is to God. One of the commitments I have made in my life is to follow the road He's laid out for me which includes me being a Pastor.
I know that there is nothing I can do outside of that that will bring true happiness in my life. There's a great John Reuben song called All I Have:
https://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/...istId=74026909
It's course goes, "I'm all right, I'm OK, I kind of like doing things this way, all I have is what God gives, and that's all the life that I was meant to live"
Very good song. Very much the way I feel.
Life is not exclusively about sex, life isn't even exclusively about the person living it.
Word of friendly advice:

If you really think that your destiny is to be a pastor, and if you really want to make an impact on people, I'd consider improving your communication skills. Being a pastor or any sort of member of the clergy requires fluent speaking, reading, and writing ability, no? I don't know a whole lot about Desmund Tutu, but he seems wonderfully articulate and bright. I don't think he would be as prominent a figure as he is if he weren't as articulate a man as he is.

No offense, but at times your writing is nearly incomprehensible, and it is very hard to identify your point. This particular post isn't too bad, but I've noticed this in several of your other posts (including "that said" two or three times in some posts). I would assume that much of this carries over to your speaking as well.

Shoot for the stars, don't just be a pastor, be a pastor that matters.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by Randman
Linking to a song when discussing sexuality and sexual orientation is a bit fem, don't you think?
Even I have never done that.
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:02 AM
 
Originally Posted by MindFad
Oh, like hell you read through that. I get tired just looking at huge blocks of texts with no paragraph breaks, so I gave up.
BUSTINATED.
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:04 AM
 
Originally Posted by Salty
Sex is always a choice. If your convictions are not above sex then you do not actually have convictions you simply have uncommitted ideals. My first commitment above anything else is to God. One of the commitments I have made in my life is to follow the road He's laid out for me which includes me being a Pastor.
I know that there is nothing I can do outside of that that will bring true happiness in my life. There's a great John Reuben song called All I Have:
https://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/...istId=74026909
It's course goes, "I'm all right, I'm OK, I kind of like doing things this way, all I have is what God gives, and that's all the life that I was meant to live"
Very good song. Very much the way I feel.
Life is not exclusively about sex, life isn't even exclusively about the person living it.
Be gay and a pastor.

http://www.fabmagazine.com/features/...ife/index.html
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:08 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c
Word of friendly advice:

If you really think that your destiny is to be a pastor, and if you really want to make an impact on people, I'd consider improving your communication skills. Being a pastor or any sort of member of the clergy requires fluent speaking, reading, and writing ability, no? I don't know a whole lot about Desmund Tutu, but he seems wonderfully articulate and bright. I don't think he would be as prominent a figure as he is if he weren't as articulate a man as he is.

No offense, but at times your writing is nearly incomprehensible, and it is very hard to identify your point. This particular post isn't too bad, but I've noticed this in several of your other posts (including "that said" two or three times in some posts). I would assume that much of this carries over to your speaking as well.

Shoot for the stars, don't just be a paster, be a pastor that matters.
That's why I'm gona go over my sermons with my wife before I preach
Seriously though when I do speak I try my best to go over what I'm going to say several times, that way I filter out all the stuff that I don't need to say... actually I end up preaching to myself more than my kids because I get the long uncut 2 hour version... they get the at most half hour version.
Not to mention, when preaching God quite often takes over, and you end up saying stuff you didn't realize you were going to say... it's kinda cool actually.

Contrast that with MacNN... which is generally just stream of consciousness...
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:11 AM
 
Originally Posted by Scandalous Ion Cannon
If being a gay pastor means your church has to have a website like, http://www.mcctoronto.com/ I think I'll stay clear than you very much

Besides people who try and fill pastoral roles while living lifestyles of sin will not have the impact as Pastor should... it just... it's hard to explain to a non Christian.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:11 AM
 
Originally Posted by Salty
Not to mention, when preaching God quite often takes over, and you end up saying stuff you didn't realize you were going to say... it's kinda cool actually.
Soo what you are saying is God speaks though you from time time time and totally "takes over" what you are saying putting words in your mouth in his favor?

ummmm
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:15 AM
 
Originally Posted by Salty
That's why I'm gona go over my sermons with my wife before I preach
Seriously though when I do speak I try my best to go over what I'm going to say several times, that way I filter out all the stuff that I don't need to say... actually I end up preaching to myself more than my kids because I get the long uncut 2 hour version... they get the at most half hour version.
Not to mention, when preaching God quite often takes over, and you end up saying stuff you didn't realize you were going to say... it's kinda cool actually.
I didn't know you are married!

Contrast that with MacNN... which is generally just stream of consciousness...
That's just my point... if you want to be persuasive here (and based on the sheer number of posts of yours where you preach your beliefs, I'd assume you do or else why bother?), why not cut out the stream of consciousness stuff? I, for one, feel less inclined to take anybody seriously that writes this way.

You can even edit your own posts after posting them.
( Last edited by besson3c; Aug 4, 2005 at 01:28 AM. )
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by Salty
If being a gay pastor means your church has to have a website like, http://www.mcctoronto.com/ I think I'll stay clear than you very much

Besides people who try and fill pastoral roles while living lifestyles of sin will not have the impact as Pastor should... it just... it's hard to explain to a non Christian.
Actually, your religious dogma is very easy to grasp.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by Scandalous Ion Cannon
Soo what you are saying is God speaks though you from time time time and totally "takes over" what you are saying putting words in your mouth in his favor?

ummmm
A Prophet was someone characterized by this trait. The idea of God talking through someone is not exactly a new one. Granted they had other characteristics but... and you're not a prophet just because God speaks through you to someone... though that is prophetic uhh... hard to explain. But groups like YWAM actually do spiritual exercises of trying to hear what God has to say to another person. I've participated in one. One of their former presidents came and spoke at my college for day of prayer, very very good speaker, very very large Polynesian man who also enjoyed dancing. Embarrassed me by mentioning in one of the sessions that I had fixed his iBook for him (He had an old 500Mhz iBook.)

Again, the idea of hearing God's voice is hardly a new one. Silly non-christians...
     
Salty  (op)
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:21 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c
Actually, your religious dogma is very easy to grasp.
Ouch you cut me deep... though I am curious as to how my religious beliefs that are fundamental to Christianity, or rather accepted by all groups that claim to be Christian (I mean... that's what Dogma means...) are easy to grasp. I didn't even mention the divinity of Christ, His virgin conception and birth. Or the Trinity.

Though if you're using dogma improperly... you can think of my phrase the same way when my mom asks me why using a Mac would be better than her PC. It would be faster, Exposé would help her, Safari would keep viruses out, but explaining that to her with her limited frame of reference is very difficult. I don't mean it as an insult.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:22 AM
 
Originally Posted by Salty
Again, the idea of hearing God's voice is hardly a new one. Silly non-christians...
On the topic of being persuasive, another worthwhile technique might be to not be condescending by throwing in a petty cheap shot to the people you are attempting to "teach" (esp. since you weren't really provoked).

I wish you all the success in the world with being a pastor, but at this point it appears as if you have a few things to learn (many lessons which you seem to blow-off).
     
Salty  (op)
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:25 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c
I didn't know you are married!



That's just my point... if you want to be persuasive here (and based on the sheer number of posts of yours where you preach your beliefs, I'd assume you do or else why bother?), why not cut out the stream of consciousness stuff? I for one feel less inclined to take anybody seriously that writes this way. You can even edit your own posts after posting them.
I'm not married... though that doesn't mean that I never will be. Though I'll make sure to tell you when I am

Oh and by the way... I honestly don't think regardless of how I speak on here I'm terribly likely to convince people. At best I might say something that peeks your interest. Most likely I will get far more from simply posting here than anyone will from listen to me... aside from free tech support.
People generally come to faith in Christ because they have had an encounter with HIM, and it generally helps when they can see the difference God has made in the lives of others. So the people I work with that are likely to come to faith in Christ through me talking to them are more likely my youth group kids, and other people I'll talk to off line. This is one reason that successful online ministries tend to focus less on evangelism and more on equipping the saints... because the internet is far more useful for helping to communicate Christian truth to the unconverted. Facts rarely win people to a saving faith.
     
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:26 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c
why not cut out the stream of consciousness stuff? I for one feel less inclined to take anybody

Quoted for emphasis. I couldn't read your last post all the way through. Please try to read through it before you hit the post button.
     
Salty  (op)
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Aug 4, 2005, 01:27 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c
On the topic of being persuasive, another worthwhile technique might be to not be condescending by throwing in a petty cheap shot to the people you are attempting to "teach" (esp. since you weren't really provoked).

I wish you all the success in the world with being a pastor, but at this point it appears as if you have a few things to learn (many lessons which you seem to blow-off).
I didn't mean that as an insult... I just find it funny how so many people are surprised when you talk about hearing the voice of God, or going somewhere because God told you to. When if you actually are open to it... it's not all that amazing a lot of the time. Sometimes it's as simple as Him telling you to go give someone a hug... actually He had me hug three people in one week... I was getting a bit frustrated with Him cause I'm not a huggy person.
     
 
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