[FulcrumPilot]

WTF!! Soldered-in battery? WTF??

[Scandalous Ion Cannon]

I think they got it covered in the proper forum.

[Apple Pro Underwear]

actually, just looked for 5 minutes and i can't find anything

so how do we change the battery or whatever? bring it or mail it to apple or a apple store?


i suspect the batteries must last awhile before they wear out because the last battery hoopla was quite bad for apple.

[meelk]

yeah I apparently am missing the battery thread too. The battery soldered in battery makes me weary. Apple should be forced to replace batteries in these for the cost of the battery alone, and shipping, at max. Forcing people to buy new batteries that they solder in seems like prime target for a class action lawsuit.

[dampeoples]

What's so bad about soldered batteries? It should be a simple task to heat the old solder to let it loose, and they'll have a battery exchange program anyway.

[tooki]

Lots of gadgets use soldered-in batteries. It's not a big deal for a halfway-experienced hobbyist or computer shop to do. If it's just 2 or 3 solder joints, I could do it in around 5 minutes.

You have to remember: no iPod is designed to be opened by the user. What's inside should, therefore, be of relatively little concern. No way is Apple gonna worry about how hard it is to disconnect the battery on a device that is sold as a "closed box".

Sheesh...

tooki

[alligator]

Give it up guys. You can bet within 10 days there will be ads for companies who will replace your nano battery to double the life at half the cost.

[dampeoples]

Hehe, class action lawsuit...

[bradoesch]

This doesn't look like a hard job.

[rickey939]

Apple will be out of business by this time tomorrow.™

[dampeoples]

yeah, but a class action lawsuit would be better!

[Mastrap]

Originally Posted by meelk

Forcing people to buy new batteries that they solder in seems like prime target for a class action lawsuit.

Especially as Apple is forcing you to purchase a nano. Right now.

[PookJP]

Originally Posted by rickey939

Apple will be out of business by this time tomorrow.™

And the G5 Powerbook will be released the day afterwards.©

[meelk]

Originally Posted by Mastrap

Especially as Apple is forcing you to purchase a nano. Right now.

You act as tho the whole closed case thing isnt a damn scam, and you know well it is.

[budster101]

ipodresq.com is offering their services right now...

[Apple Pro Underwear]

ok, i'm not too concerned i suppose. i changed my 1st gen iPod but if i bought a 3rd or 4th gen, i'd bring it to the the store just like i would this nano.

i just hope it will cost around 50 or less and i'll be cool. i expect the battery will last me 2 years (based on my original iPod).

[dampeoples]

Let's make a petition! Damn this forceful battery purchase!

[dcmacdaddy]

Originally Posted by dampeoples

Let's make a petition! Damn this forceful battery purchase!

Yeah!!!

Where are our options to buy an iPod without a battery? Huh, huh?

Damn Apple for not giving us the choices we want.

</sarcasm>

[strictlyplaid]

<sigh> The nano's great, but yeah--it'd be even greater with a small, sleek removable battery like the PSP or most cell phones have.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by bradoesch

This doesn't look like a hard job.

Nope. No problem at all. With a good 60W iron, a clean desoldering vacuum and a few minutes, that thing's history. Piece of cake.

We all realize that the battery is soldered in so that the whole device can be smaller and weigh less, don't we? Just like why they didn't put in the extra chip that would make the Nano work with Firewire? No Big Deal. Really.

[strictlyplaid]

Originally Posted by ghporter

Nope. No problem at all. With a good 60W iron, a clean desoldering vacuum and a few minutes, that thing's history. Piece of cake.

We all realize that the battery is soldered in so that the whole device can be smaller and weigh less, don't we? Just like why they didn't put in the extra chip that would make the Nano work with Firewire? No Big Deal. Really.

Honest question: how does soldering it in save weight? How heavy is it to put in some copper connectors to a removable battery?

I'm not an engineer, so maybe there's something I'm missing here.

[budster101]

Because it works better.

[dampeoples]

Because you would have to have a removable door with some sort of a latch, extra connections from those to the circuit board, the connections, and a battery that's in a housing, to name a few. The entire product woudl be at least 1/4" thicker.

[budster101]

Yeah. because it works better.

[meelk]

Originally Posted by strictlyplaid

<sigh> The nano's great, but yeah--it'd be even greater with a small, sleek removable battery like the PSP or most cell phones have.

This is *exactly* the point that these idiots who just crawl up Apple's ass and sniff roses instead of crap are missing.

[Kenneth]

So far, I didn't find any problem yet.

[budster101]

I dig the nano just as it is and would not change a thing. Have you even used one? It's freaking awesome... and all you have to do is velcro it to the back of your phone and now you have an iTunes Phone iPod...

[strictlyplaid]

Originally Posted by budster101

Because it works better.

Thx.

[budster101]

sure.

[strictlyplaid]

Originally Posted by dampeoples

Because you would have to have a removable door with some sort of a latch, extra connections from those to the circuit board, the connections, and a battery that's in a housing, to name a few. The entire product woudl be at least 1/4" thicker.

Hm, I don't like the removable door thing, but some cell phones have batteries that are literally one-piece deals where the back of it is the back of the phone. So you could save the door pieces, etc. and have the appearance of a sleek one-piece unit. Not sure how much smaller the internal wiring can be thanks to the soldering, but I imagine all you'd have to do is solder the wires to copper connectors rather than to the battery terminals.

Anyone know how the RAZR does it? Does that have a removable battery?

[Captain Obvious]

Originally Posted by bradoesch

This doesn't look like a hard job.

Hate to break it to you but most people out there don't have soldering irons. Just because there is an unbelievably high geek quotient in the forum doesn't mean that what would be routine for you would be a normal repair for most people. I know of very few people who spent their weekend nights working on their soldering skills.

It may be a more marketable skill now that the nano has been introduced, maybe it will help you meet chicks.

[strictlyplaid]

Answered my own question about the RAZR via Google. Here's a picture of the removable battery in place:



And yet, it's still quite thin and sleek, no?

[dampeoples]

Originally Posted by strictlyplaid

Hm, I don't like the removable door thing, but some cell phones have batteries that are literally one-piece deals where the back of it is the back of the phone. So you could save the door pieces, etc. and have the appearance of a sleek one-piece unit. Not sure how much smaller the internal wiring can be thanks to the soldering, but I imagine all you'd have to do is solder the wires to copper connectors rather than to the battery terminals.

Anyone know how the RAZR does it? Does that have a removable battery?

It doesn't necessarily have to be a removable door, that's just the first thing that came to mind. Either one (door/battery or battery door) would require a seal, possibly further adding bulk to the unit.
I'm pretty sure the wire difference between a removable battery and straight wired isn't much, but then you have one more set of connections, a mechanical one, which is prone to failure as well (Have you ever bent the terminals in the back of a calculator/phone, etc to make the connection better, or heard of the eraser to clean a contact?). You know how these class action lawsuit people are...

[dampeoples]

Originally Posted by strictlyplaid

Answered my own question about the RAZR via Google. Here's a picture of the removable battery in place:
And yet, it's still quite thin and sleek, no?

Perhaps, but if you close it, it would be a better example, as the screen/keyboard are on different sides. I know nothing about the phone, though, it might be smaller closed.

I'm not saying it can't be made with a removable battery, I just think it would make it larger.

[strictlyplaid]

Originally Posted by dampeoples

It doesn't necessarily have to be a removable door, that's just the first thing that came to mind. Either one (door/battery or battery door) would require a seal, possibly further adding bulk to the unit.

My cellphone (Samsung R225) doesn't have a seal and it's never been a problem. As long as you don't plunge the nano into water, which I wouldn't recommend even with the one-piece unit, I can't see why that would be an issue.

Originally Posted by dampeoples

I'm pretty sure the wire difference between a removable battery and straight wired isn't much, but then you have one more set of connections, a mechanical one, which is prone to failure as well (Have you ever bent the terminals in the back of a calculator/phone, etc to make the connection better, or heard of the eraser to clean a contact?). You know how these class action lawsuit people are...

Actually, having owned a number of these devices, I never have done any of those things because I only swap out the rechargeable batteries once every few years. If the swapping were more frequent, I'd believe it -- or, if Apple had manufacturing issues that meant they came out bent from the factory, but usually Apple's build quality is quite good. I still think the fact that the nano is basically disposable without a replaceable battery is a bigger problem than an occasional bent contact, though perhaps you could convince me with usability studies or something.

[Scandalous Ion Cannon]

This battery thing is the last concern that I have with the Nano.

[strictlyplaid]

Originally Posted by Scandalous Ion Cannon

This battery thing is the last concern that I have with the Nano.

What concerns do you have?

[GSixZero]

Originally Posted by strictlyplaid

What concerns do you have?

I'm concerned about how I'm going to fend off the throngs of hot women who will want to have my children due to me sporting such a cool and sexy tech gadget.

[Scandalous Ion Cannon]

Originally Posted by strictlyplaid

What concerns do you have?

Honestly the firewire syncing thing. I am getting one for my sister who has the original iPod and my G4 cube. It is fast syncing with firewire but it is going to be odd giving her a new one and having it take 4 hours to fill. I also don't like Apple ditching firewire.

Also the fact that the headphone port doesn't have the extra pins means add ons could be limited. The fact that the ports on the bottom are off centre is also shitty because adding it to a speaker system will make it look off centre or not work at all.

Either way I am still buying one for me and my sis.

[Lancer409]

Originally Posted by budster101

I dig the nano just as it is and would not change a thing. Have you even used one? It's freaking awesome... and all you have to do is velcro it to the back of your phone and now you have an iTunes Phone iPod...

i'd put that scratch/sharpie resistant coating that was announced a few months back (the stuff that would make cd/dvd's damn near invulnerable...

[analogika]

Originally Posted by meelk

This is *exactly* the point that these idiots who just crawl up Apple's ass and sniff roses instead of crap are missing.

Charming.

Quoted on slashdot:

If you want to reduce reliability of a soldered connection, add a connector. If it still isn't unreliable enough, add a socket.

And looking at that thing: adding a battery connector would have increased the length by at least a mm.

And adding a simply removable battery the thickness by at least 2 mm.


As it is, *most* people don't replace their current iPod's batteries themselves (though many do), and yet, they still manage to find technically savvy people who'll do it for them. Is there ANY reason assume that things will be different with the nano?

[SSharon]

I am firmly on the side that says this battery problem is nonsense. I have never replaced a battery on any of my cell phones, my laptop, or anything else that uses a lithium ion battery (except maybe a digital camera). I don't think people need to change the batteries in their ipods as much as some people think they do. I wish the battery in my phone was soldered because as it is it frequently loses contact and turns off.

The lack of firewire is the only flaw I see. (Does it work with the pocketdock, or will it once the new devices that use the new dock connector come out?)

[JoshuaZ]

I'd buy one if I could hook my camera up to it, which is one of the main reasons I'm going to replace my old 2nd Gen iPod with a new one.

RIP Mini. You were a good seller and very cute. The Japanese loved you.

[Eriamjh]

Have the nano batteries failed already? That was quick!

[porieux]

...

[analogika]

Originally Posted by SSharon

I wish the battery in my phone was soldered because as it is it frequently loses contact and turns off.

That wouldn't be a Nokia, would it?

[strictlyplaid]

Originally Posted by analogika

Charming.

Quoted on slashdot:

If you want to reduce reliability of a soldered connection, add a connector. If it still isn't unreliable enough, add a socket.

And looking at that thing: adding a battery connector would have increased the length by at least a mm.

And adding a simply removable battery the thickness by at least 2 mm.

Without evidence, this is just a restatement of a position. Sorry that I don't put stock in the authority of random Slashdotters... But if +1mm in length was all that a removable battery took, I'd gladly take the compromise. The nano would still be, well, nano!

Originally Posted by porieux

I have a RAZR and it's quite a bit thicker than the iPod nano.
I am considering the velcro thing though...

Interesting... wonder if that's because it's a phone and not an MP3 player, or because of the battery design. Not sure. Is it possible to make a nano-sized phone? That would be sweet!

[analogika]

Originally Posted by strictlyplaid

Without evidence, this is just a restatement of a position. Sorry that I don't put stock in the authority of random Slashdotters... But if +1mm in length was all that a removable battery took, I'd gladly take the compromise. The nano would still be, well, nano!

I'm sorry, but the fact that solder joints are superior to plug connectors is a) conventional wisdom, and b) obvious to anyone who's ever worked with electronics. The unreliability of extremely shallow battery connector sockets is something that just about all Nokia phone owners can attest to.

Now, take a look at internal photographs of the iPods and the new nano - check out the size of that battery connector. That's a couple of millimeters.

Now take a look at the battery compartment lid on your mobile phone. Depending on how well-constructed/robust it is, it will add a millimeter or three to the phone. The thinner it is, the more likely you will have inadvertently pulled it off over the past few years - not to mention that the battery and lid are ALWAYS the first thing to fly off somewhere. And the stupid lid always gets looser over time. At least for every one of my phones.

*Great* care and a helluva lotta work went into making the nano as absurdly tiny as humanly possible, while keeping it extremely sturdy and resilient to flex - if the Ars Technica destruction test is any indicator. There is no tolerance for any lid latch, and *everything* has been stripped down to reduce unnecessary bulk.

Yeah, they're hellishly anal about the design, but that extra two millimeters shaved down is precisely why this thing will sell on a scale that will put the iPod mini to shame.

[Randman]

Wrong forum.

[meelk]

This arguement doesnt change the fact that Apple seems to be the only company making portable electronics that feels that the end user should not be easily able to change out their own battery. From phones, to PDAs, to Gameboys and beyond, everyone allows you to change the battery in pretty much any portable electronic device. Imagine having to send your watch in for service when the battery ran out instead of just buying another and putting it in yourself.