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You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > Blu-ray/HD DVD... Who is winning?

View Poll Results: Which do you have? (Choose only ONE. Includes stand-alones and game consoles.)
Poll Options:
HD DVD 34 votes (17.09%)
Blu-ray 87 votes (43.72%)
Both 14 votes (7.04%)
Neither 70 votes (35.18%)
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 199. You may not vote on this poll
Blu-ray/HD DVD... Who is winning? (Page 62)
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Eug
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Sep 4, 2007, 02:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by *TL View Post
I'll be interested to see how this does with it's $200 price tag. Between this and the premium prices for The Sopranos 6.1 & 6.2, Lost, and Heroes, I'm starting to think that TV on HD disc might be a non-starter.
The Star Trek box set is actually $125 for those of us with the Amazon HD promotion, and $138.95 for everyone else. Even $125 is still a little steep, but it's less than 2/3rds the MSRP.

P.S. Heroes was $59.46, or in my case $65.44 because it's about $6 extra for shipping to Canada.
     
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Sep 4, 2007, 02:54 PM
 
Star Trek on DVD has always been overpriced (I own almost all of seasons of all the shows) so I wouldn't expect HD-DVD to be any different. But to be honest, I'm not that interested in this release. It's not even the original show, strictly speaking, since some of the effects had to be redone. I haven't seen it, but it seems to me that the cheesiness of a lot of that stuff was part of what made it charming, and I would guess that they have made it look "better" than the original.
     
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Sep 4, 2007, 02:55 PM
 
I didn't mind the redone effects when I saw them on tv. They're not overly superfluous, unlike Star Wars.
     
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Sep 4, 2007, 03:00 PM
 
The effects are very, VERY good. I'm an old school Trekkie, I used to watch it on NBC, I own several episodes on 16mm, I'm a HUGE fan. If the effects sucked, I'd be the first to say it.

The EARLY redone effects aren't so hot. They made some amazing changes over the last few months, but they didn't go back and fix them for the HD-DVD release. Stupid.

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Sep 4, 2007, 03:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
The Star Trek box set is actually $125 for those of us with the Amazon HD promotion, and $138.95 for everyone else. Even $125 is still a little steep, but it's less than 2/3rds the MSRP.

P.S. Heroes was $59.46, or in my case $65.44 because it's about $6 extra for shipping to Canada.
Yeah I didn't think the price of Heroes was out of line - I paid $65 with expedited shipping from Amazon. Considering the price of TV shows when DVD was still new, I consider $65 to be a bargain.

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Sep 4, 2007, 11:00 PM
 
Originally Posted by starman View Post
The effects are very, VERY good. I'm an old school Trekkie, I used to watch it on NBC, I own several episodes on 16mm, I'm a HUGE fan. If the effects sucked, I'd be the first to say it.

The EARLY redone effects aren't so hot. They made some amazing changes over the last few months, but they didn't go back and fix them for the HD-DVD release. Stupid.
OK, watching the blinking Gorn eyes made me giddy, but what do you mean "early" (vs. late) redone effects?

Do you have a screengrab link somewhere?

Either way, I think I'll be buying it. I bought a few episodes of the original DVD, but back then it cost way too much to buy them all. When the box set came out again, I held off... for hi-def. So, now is the time to buy... redone effects or not. I just hope they aren't too CG looking. At least it's supposedly nowhere as hokey as the Star Wars updated effects.

What I'd really like is an option for either/or for the effects, selectable during playback. This is possible with the hi-def formats, but I'm guessing the reason they didn't do it is because:

1) It'd be even more work.
2) They didn't clean up the transfers from the old effects.
     
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Sep 4, 2007, 11:27 PM
 
Trek Movie Report | Star Trek XI news, rumors, info and downloads should have the differences. Early on, the starfields and E weren't so good. They improved with time.

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Sep 4, 2007, 11:34 PM
 
IIRC, the old effects looked terrible in HD, or couldn't be remastered in HD, or something to that effect.
     
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Sep 4, 2007, 11:38 PM
 
Meh. Some of the CG is good, some is OK, and some of it just looks like they changed things for no good reason.

I really dislike the fact that the rear view on Squire of Gothos now has the back parts of the ship in the way. I am also disappointed by the new tricoder screen. It's lost some of its charm.
     
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Sep 5, 2007, 12:09 AM
 
Wow, that second link with the tricoder... it's a step in the wrong direction IMO. Old ones had better art direction.

The other thing I don't like is the effects are pretty cheap. :/
     
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Sep 5, 2007, 12:11 AM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
Meh. Some of the CG is good, some is OK, and some of it just looks like they changed things for no good reason.

I really dislike the fact that the rear view on Squire of Gothos now has the back parts of the ship in the way. I am also disappointed by the new tricoder screen. It's lost some of its charm.
Well, that's what the rear view would look like now wouldn't it?

Anyway, I'd be more ticked off at how crappy that ship looks in cheap 3D compared to the old model.

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Sep 5, 2007, 12:41 AM
 
Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - View Post
Well, that's what the rear view would look like now wouldn't it?
Only if it were a wide angle view. There's nothing there that says it's a wide angle view.

ie. They're overinterpreting it, just for the sake of it.
     
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Sep 5, 2007, 02:21 AM
 
Possibly. *shrugs*

Dunno why they didn't do a shot-for-shot redo.
     
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Sep 5, 2007, 03:18 AM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
Only if it were a wide angle view. There's nothing there that says it's a wide angle view.
I can't believe I'm discussing Trekkie-Science, but…

What? At that distance (what is it? miles?) it's obvious that you'd see the back thingamajiggas. There's nothing there that says it's a telescopic view.

If it was just a regular window then of course you'd expect to see them. Much like you would see the planks hanging out over your car rear window.

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Sep 5, 2007, 08:26 AM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
Meh. Some of the CG is good, some is OK, and some of it just looks like they changed things for no good reason.

I really dislike the fact that the rear view on Squire of Gothos now has the back parts of the ship in the way. I am also disappointed by the new tricoder screen. It's lost some of its charm.
God, I don't remember the ship looking that bad when I watched it on TV. And why the hell are the new screens so much dimmer than the old ones?
     
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Sep 5, 2007, 09:38 PM
 
Sorry been out of town. The banned one ask for a list and I was at work and I did a quick search and found the Wiki article. It stated "Japanese" firsts and not world firsts. When I tried "Toshiba format fails" in Google it brought up links to the failed attempt to unify the new HD disk format.

As an FYI I am going to wait and buy The new Samsung BD-UP5000. ($540/€400)
     
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Sep 5, 2007, 09:49 PM
 
The unified HD disk? You mean the Warner TotalHD disc? That's not a Toshiba thing...

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Sep 5, 2007, 09:52 PM
 
No, he's referring to back before either was on the market. Sony and Tosh were in talks to use the BD media but HDi, etcetera from HD DVD, but the talks fell through.
     
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Sep 5, 2007, 09:55 PM
 
Ah, never even heard about that one...

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Sep 6, 2007, 01:01 AM
 
It was interesting back then too... Sony said something to the effect that Toshiba had acquiesced and would consider adopting BD, and then Toshiba promptly said that was BS. And the rest is history.

Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
As an FYI I am going to wait and buy The new Samsung BD-UP5000. ($540/€400)
If you're waiting for a €400 price, you're going to be waiting a long time. AFAIK, the price was going to be €400 more than a similar BD-only player.

Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - View Post
I can't believe I'm discussing Trekkie-Science, but…

What? At that distance (what is it? miles?) it's obvious that you'd see the back thingamajiggas. There's nothing there that says it's a telescopic view.

If it was just a regular window then of course you'd expect to see them. Much like you would see the planks hanging out over your car rear window.
They were trying to outrun the planet, and it was off in the distance. But the point is that the back thingamajiggas were not there before. It's not as if it would have been impossible to add them back then, but the decision was not to.

Adding them now serves no useful purpose. Neither does futzing with the tricoder readout so dramatically.
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 11:15 AM
 
Report: Sony Says Blu-ray Standalone Players Out-Selling HD DVD | High-Def Digest

Oh knows how true it is but even if it was I am sure there is at least 4 pages worth of arguing value in it.
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 11:17 AM
 
The thread needs it, we've been on page 62 for like 3 days, which I'm pretty sure is against the law.
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 12:18 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES View Post
Oh look there are $1000 HD-DVD players also.
Integra unveils first HD DVD player: the $1099 DHS-8.8 - Engadget HD
And a $3500 Blu-Ray player.

HD-DVD also has some players coming from another cheap supplier. Shinco I think was the name.

Alpine is also making a mobile HD DVD player. I guess there is demand from people wanting to watch hd movies on a 7" screen on the back of a head rest in riced out Honda Civics.
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 12:29 PM
 
Yup; so they can say they have it. Doesn't surprise me.
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 12:55 PM
 
Full article @ X-bit labs - Samsung�s Duo HD Universal Player to Cost �400.
Samsung’s Duo HD Universal Player to Cost €400.
Samsung’s Blu-ray/HD DVD Player Gets the Price

Category: Multimedia

by Anton Shilov

[ 07/10/2007 | 11:11 PM ]

Samsung Electronics at IFA (Internationale Funhausstellung) conference in
Germany revealed that its first hybrid blue laser-based video player will be relatively affordable and will become available in the fourth quarter of the year.

Samsung’s Duo HD BD-UP5000 will be initially available in Europe and will cost approximately €400 ($550), which is considerably below the cost of LG’s BH100 player that also can playback both Blu-ray and HD DVD movies, reports Digi-Times web-site. It is not exactly clear in which countries the novelty will be available and whether its launch will be supported by widespread availability of Blu-ray or HD DVD movies in Europe.
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 01:22 PM
 
Originally Posted by Montezuma58 View Post
Can you believe they still sell $3000 up-converting DVD players today?
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 01:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES View Post
Report: Sony Says Blu-ray Standalone Players Out-Selling HD DVD | High-Def Digest

Oh knows how true it is but even if it was I am sure there is at least 4 pages worth of arguing value in it.
Aren't these the same people that claimed they had sold 7 million PS3's?
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Sep 6, 2007, 02:17 PM
 
Originally Posted by goMac View Post
Aren't these the same people that claimed they had sold 7 million PS3's?
Oh what you looking for reliable data from Toshiba that excludes any PS3 sales in the player market?
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 07:22 PM
 
Sony says stand alone BD players have been outselling HD players for the past 12 weeks. Toshiba responds by not denying it. (Sales chart here.)
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 08:20 PM
 
Originally Posted by *TL View Post
Sony says stand alone BD players have been outselling HD players for the past 12 weeks. Toshiba responds by not denying it. (Sales chart here.)
Interesting... I'd be nervous if HD-DVD can't sell as many stand-alone players when the price is considerably less.
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 08:58 PM
 
Heh. Funny. I recently recall some douche going on about Acer....

Acer Joins HD DVD Promotional Group | High-Def Digest

New, Improved and Legal in 50 States
     
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Sep 6, 2007, 09:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
They were trying to outrun the planet, and it was off in the distance. But the point is that the back thingamajiggas were not there before. It's not as if it would have been impossible to add them back then, but the decision was not to.

Adding them now serves no useful purpose. Neither does futzing with the tricoder readout so dramatically.
That's the most ridiculous fanboy rant I have ever heard

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Sep 7, 2007, 12:36 AM
 
Dunno about fanboy rant. It seems that in their enthusiasm, they're just doing some superfluous stuff. It's not as if it makes the stuff actually look better.

It's not as cheesy as the Star Wars additions, but it's not as if adding ship thingamajigs improves it.


Originally Posted by pooka View Post
Heh. Funny. I recently recall some douche going on about Acer....

Acer Joins HD DVD Promotional Group | High-Def Digest
Acer has been making HD DVD PCs since last year.


Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES View Post
Report: Sony Says Blu-ray Standalone Players Out-Selling HD DVD | High-Def Digest

Oh knows how true it is but even if it was I am sure there is at least 4 pages worth of arguing value in it.
HD DVD standalone unit sales are significantly higher than Blu-ray standalone sales.

However, my understanding is that Blu-ray standalone revenue is more than HD DVD standalone revenue recently (last couple of months), because Blu-ray standalone players cost so much. Also, while Blu-ray might have a lead for a very restricted period of time for unit sales, they are significantly behind in the year-to-date numbers.

ie. Sony is spinning the truth yet again.

P.S. Here is Toshiba's response.
( Last edited by Eug; Sep 7, 2007 at 12:46 AM. )
     
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Sep 7, 2007, 06:58 AM
 
I talked to my coworker that has both the PS3 and the 360 with the HD DVD add on. Someone wanted to know how they are hooked up to his TV. He said he has the PS3 hooked vis HDMI and the 360 via component. I asked again which he liked better and he said the same thing, the 360 and to him movies look better on the 360.

His opinion, not mine.
     
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Sep 7, 2007, 09:18 AM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
I talked to my coworker that has both the PS3 and the 360 with the HD DVD add on. Someone wanted to know how they are hooked up to his TV. He said he has the PS3 hooked vis HDMI and the 360 via component. I asked again which he liked better and he said the same thing, the 360 and to him movies look better on the 360.

His opinion, not mine.
He's an idiot, then.

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Sep 7, 2007, 10:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
HD DVD standalone unit sales are significantly higher than Blu-ray standalone sales.

However, my understanding is that Blu-ray standalone revenue is more than HD DVD standalone revenue recently (last couple of months), because Blu-ray standalone players cost so much. Also, while Blu-ray might have a lead for a very restricted period of time for unit sales, they are significantly behind in the year-to-date numbers.

ie. Sony is spinning the truth yet again.

P.S. Here is Toshiba's response.
Nope - Look at the chart linked above. 12 weeks ago, BD overtook HD in standalone marketshare, not revenue. Toshiba responded not by denying it but by saying we're still up for the year ~55 to 43. Could be a fluke, but with a significant price advantage and its marketshare down from 70/30 earlier in the year, it looks like HD's last remaining advantage is on its way out.
     
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Sep 7, 2007, 12:59 PM
 

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Sep 7, 2007, 01:01 PM
 
HAHAHAHA


Also, what does the "R" stand for in TOS-R?
     
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The Original Series - Remastered
     
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Sep 7, 2007, 01:08 PM
 
Ah, thanks.
     
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Sep 7, 2007, 01:43 PM
 
Originally Posted by starman View Post
Ha ha ha... "Buy a HD player, TOS-R, and we'll have Kirk hand deliver the unit and set it up for you."

     
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Originally Posted by *TL View Post
Nope - Look at the chart linked above. 12 weeks ago, BD overtook HD in standalone marketshare, not revenue. Toshiba responded not by denying it but by saying we're still up for the year ~55 to 43.
You just repeated what I said.

Originally Posted by Eug
Also, while Blu-ray might have a lead for a very restricted period of time for unit sales, they are significantly behind in the year-to-date numbers.
     
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Sep 7, 2007, 10:51 PM
 
Originally Posted by starman View Post
He's an idiot, then.
As far as I'm concerned they are POS3 and the Litter Box360

I don't own either. (BD or HD DVD). Personally I'd like to Sony come out on top because Sony is one of our customers. They sell more players, we sell more semiconductors. In fact, we sell parts to just about everyone involved, so who ever comes out on top, we win.
     
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Sep 7, 2007, 10:57 PM
 
     
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Sep 7, 2007, 11:01 PM
 
No problems at all here (and I actually have out of date firmware).

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Sep 7, 2007, 11:01 PM
 
I was just looking at the Final Cut Studio 2 web page. It has DVD Studio 4 as part of the suite. Apple no longer sells it as a stand alone application? I also noticed it has support for HD DVD, but not BluRay Disc. Will Apple be adding BD support?
Apple - Final Cut Studio 2 - DVD Studio Pro 4
( Last edited by Chongo; Sep 8, 2007 at 07:38 AM. )
     
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Sep 7, 2007, 11:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
I was just looking at the Final Cut Studio 2 web page. It has DVD Studio 4 as part of the suite. Apple no longer sells it as a stand alone application? I also noticed it has support for HD DVD, but not BluRay Disc. Will aple be adding BD support?
Apple - Final Cut Studio 2 - DVD Studio Pro 4
This was like 2 pages ago. Rather than restart all that stuff, I will let you go back and read what was said.
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Sep 7, 2007, 11:59 PM
 
If Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan comes out on HD-DVD... I'll be tempted to buy a HD-DVD player or a combo player. Having just re-watched the movie, it's simply amazing.

I'm starting to list my "must have movies" and it's a good split. If I list all of my current DVDs, it's heavily leaning Blu-ray.
     
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Originally Posted by goMac View Post
This was like 2 pages ago. Rather than restart all that stuff, I will let you go back and read what was said.
Thanks, will do
     
 
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