Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

Atheist · 08:06 AM

My partner is generally of the mind that change is bad. He enjoys a certain amount of predictability in his life. Thus I thought installing Parallels on his new MacBook would give him a bit of the familiar and ease the transition. I got him a 20" Dell widescreen monitor and he keeps XP in fullscreen mode on the 20" and does his mac stuff on the MacBook screen. (He is finding the size of the screen a bit of an issue). Trouble is, he's hardly using the Mac for anything. It's been almost 5 months and I've got him using Mail, iCal, and iTunes. He does everything else on XP. It's not helping that every time he selects "Print" in Safari it crashes. I installed Office on the Mac but he won't use it. He insists on using Office in XP.

Edit: I forgot to mention his online university website doesn't work with Safari or Firefox. That was the impetus for installing Parallels in the first place.

Anyone else have a similar experience?

Mrjinglesusa · Dec 3, 2006, 08:54 AM

I think it definitely helps. This will be especially true when Leopard comes out with full Boot Camp support for Vista (which it better have). I shown my MBP to several Windows users and they are in awe when I open Parallels and show it running XP. Had one friend even try to log into his Exchange server - worked flawlessly and he was impressed. Boot into Vista using Boot Camp and jaws drop. Fact is, the ability to run TWO (or more if you use Parallels) different operating systems on the same computer is a huge benefit. I honestly don't know why anyone would want to buy a "PC" anymore.

BTW, Office 2007 in Parallels is very, very nice. I can see why your friend prefers it to the Mac version. Hopefully the Universal version of Office will be just as good. If not, I too may find myself using Office in Parallels.

vmarks · Dec 3, 2006, 09:52 AM

I see what you're saying Atheist - he's barely using the Mac side of things. But figure out that Safari printing problem. IE should be a last resort, used just for those recalcitrant university websites that refuse to design to W3C standards.

I'm in a similar boat. I'm getting a Mac Mini for my in-laws, and intend to put parallels on it for their banking websites and Office. (Yes, I'll put Mac Office on there, but Mac Office is bad about non-English languages.

It's a valid question: if you have to reboot to get to XP / Vista, you'll be more inclined to use Mac, especially if that's where the email and itunes are. If you have parallels, it's just as easy to do 90% of the work there.

Honestly, I don't have a problem with this, really: If it means that the OS that is native rather than virtualized is more resistant to virus attack, then if XP/Vista goes under, there's still a computer to use.

Here's an interesting question: My father-in-law is tied to a Palm V. Palm support on Mac has been waning, and Address Book.app is nasty about non-English vCards and how they relate to Palm. -- Would the Palm and HotSync work virtualized to the Mac USB port? I would love to get him a bluetooth phone and see if that worked any better, but he's been resistant to do that because he likes a phone that is a no-frills phone only.

And that's a fairly decent example of why it's hard to switch sometimes - creatures of habit with hardware that is not mac approved makes the switch difficult.

Blasphemy · Dec 3, 2006, 10:36 AM

If it doesn't depend on active x, he can probably change the user agent in firefox and have the uni's website work.

The Godfather · Dec 3, 2006, 10:37 AM

Atheist,
The latest beta of Parallels has this feature called "Coherence", where Windows apps share the same desktop as Mac apps. However, you gotta remember to use Parallels in the primary monitor or you would effectively be boycotting their Windows experience (it crashes in secondary displays).
Having iTunes and Office:Mac on the 20" screen would attract him to the Mac side.

Atheist · Dec 3, 2006, 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by The Godfather

Atheist,
The latest beta of Parallels has this feature called "Coherence", where Windows apps share the same desktop as Mac apps. However, you gotta remember to use Parallels in the primary monitor or you would effectively be boycotting their Windows experience (it crashes in secondary displays).
Having iTunes and Office:Mac on the 20" screen would attract him to the Mac side.

Yeah... I was looking into the Coherence thing... but I'm not sure it's going to do much good for my partner. He's pretty much a single-tasking person and does everything in fullscreen mode. On the Mac side, he rarely minimizes windows... he just hits the close button. Not surprisingly I frequently find his computer with no open windows but many Apps running.

mduell · Dec 3, 2006, 01:53 PM

You're disappointed that he's not using an OS that doesn't work (Safari crashes on printing, the sites he needs don't work on Mac) for him?

Atheist · Dec 3, 2006, 02:07 PM

Originally Posted by mduell

You're disappointed that he's not using an OS that doesn't work (Safari crashes on printing, the sites he needs don't work on Mac) for him?

The printing issue isn't that big a deal... he really doesn't print much except school stuff for which he has to use IE anyway. So the only real reason to use XP is for his school. But he uses it for ALL of his browsing, document editing, chatting... pretty much everything.

What's disappointing is that he hasn't embraced the Mac like I thought he would. For him the Mac environment is different (read unsettling) thus he continually falls back to the environment that is familiar (read comfortable). I really wanted to wean him off of Windows cuz I hate having to support multiple OS's at home.

Just today he saw me working on Vista (I'm a software developer and have to keep abreast of all of MS's latest technology). He loved how it looked and said "Oh wow, can you put that on my Parallels?". Ugh...

Blasphemy · Dec 3, 2006, 02:08 PM

maybe you should just offer to install boot camp w/ xp or vista and let him be done with it. He could have mac hardware and native use of the OS he clearly loves.

TheoCryst · Dec 3, 2006, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by Blasphemy

maybe you should just offer to install boot camp w/ xp or vista and let him be done with it. He could have mac hardware and native use of the OS he clearly loves.

I'm liking this idea. As much as most Mac zealots hate to admit it, some people just can't/don't want to switch away from Windows. Pushing harder will only make him more difficult to reason with. I actually know a guy at my university with a black MacBook that uses XP via Boot Camp exclusively, and he's perfectly happy about it. After all, he has the OS he loves running on one of the best laptops the market has to offer.

vmarks · Dec 3, 2006, 03:13 PM

As long as there's a Mac OS with similar applications on it as well, so that if Windows goes sour, he can reboot and continue working.

Without that, it's not a fantastic proposition.

I think for someone like yourself Atheist, you needed to perhaps introduce it properly:

"This is a change. It does a few things differently, and a few things better. One of the differences is the green button on the title bar. That's zoom, not full-screen. This black triangle under the application? That means it's still running. You can close a window but the application will stay open until you quit it."

You set up mail for him. I think I would have set up some browser to have done the uni and gotten printing fixed properly. I think I would have set up his instant messaging accounts.

Sure, some people don't want to switch away as TheoCryst says. Still, you had his patience, you could have probably had his cooperation. Now you won't have a chance until his XP goes down and you say 'I have time in two days - until then, you have Office:Mac, iChat / Adium, and here's printing in the browser with firefox.' and then get to it in two days and see if he's managed to adjust to a different way of working.

It seems interesting to me that he's willing to consider the changes in look and work of Vista, but is too resistant to change to really use the Mac for more than iTunes.

Well, each to his own.

Atheist · Dec 3, 2006, 03:43 PM

Originally Posted by vmarks

As long as there's a Mac OS with similar applications on it as well, so that if Windows goes sour, he can reboot and continue working.

Without that, it's not a fantastic proposition.

I think for someone like yourself Atheist, you needed to perhaps introduce it properly:

"This is a change. It does a few things differently, and a few things better. One of the differences is the green button on the title bar. That's zoom, not full-screen. This black triangle under the application? That means it's still running. You can close a window but the application will stay open until you quit it."

You set up mail for him. I think I would have set up some browser to have done the uni and gotten printing fixed properly. I think I would have set up his instant messaging accounts.

Sure, some people don't want to switch away as TheoCryst says. Still, you had his patience, you could have probably had his cooperation. Now you won't have a chance until his XP goes down and you say 'I have time in two days - until then, you have Office:Mac, iChat / Adium, and here's printing in the browser with firefox.' and then get to it in two days and see if he's managed to adjust to a different way of working.

It seems interesting to me that he's willing to consider the changes in look and work of Vista, but is too resistant to change to really use the Mac for more than iTunes.

Well, each to his own.

I did all that you suggested. We sat down and I introduced him to the interface. I set up all of his IM clients and MS Office. I showed him how to use everything. And until I installed Parallels, he hardly used it (he still has his Dell Inspiron laptop).

I'm not sure what you mean by "I would have set up some browser to have done the uni" ... His university's web site doesn't work with any of the browsers on the Mac. IE on Windows is the only choice.

The printing thing is frustrating... I have an HP PSC All-In-One printer on my PowerBook. Every time I go to print on his MacBook, the printer doesn't show up... I add it and make it the default printer and everything is fine until he reboots... then it disappears. The crashing thing from Safari is probably related somehow...

Back to the original topic... I think your last statement is probably the most relevant... to each his own.

vmarks · Dec 3, 2006, 03:57 PM

I figured you had done all that.

Shame on a uni for not having a website that complies with standards. Still, there ought to be a way to fake it out, whether by user agent in firefox or Opera - but it isn't necessary if he's not interested in any case.

What's interesting is that he has his Dell and is using the MacBook in Parallels.

PSCs are a pain anywhich way you cut it, on Mac or on Windows. HP updates their drivers sporadically, let's say.

I'm a fan of separate devices rather than the all in one, and making the printer a network printer via rendezvous/bonjour.

You know what? G-d bless his heart. He uses a Mac and lives primarily in Windows on it. When Windows breaks, he'll use the Mac side briefly until you can fix it, and you'll just need to keep supporting two operating systems.

mitchell_pgh · Dec 3, 2006, 04:21 PM

I'll put it this way... without parallels, a friend of mine wouldn't have purchased a MacBook Pro.

MANY people have wanted to try a Mac, but not that many were willing to "gamble" $1000+ with the reality being they may not like the OS. It's a much easier sell if you can say "and if you don't like OS X... which I think you will... you can always install Windows XP/Vista"

My friend installed Parallels and realized he didn't really need Windows. He writes papers in Office, surfs in Safari and uses iChat for his chatting... He found that he doesn't do much more.

Jawbone54 · Dec 3, 2006, 04:22 PM

Originally Posted by mitchell_pgh

I'll put it this way... without parallels, a friend of mine wouldn't have purchased a MacBook Pro.

MANY people have wanted to try a Mac, but not that many were willing to "gamble" $1000+ with the reality being they may not like the OS. It's a much easier sell if you can say "and if you don't like OS X... which I think you will... you can always install Windows XP/Vista"

My friend installed Parallels and realized he didn't really need Windows. He writes papers in Office, surfs in Safari and uses iChat for his chatting... He found that he doesn't do much more.

I have a story almost exactly like yours, except my friend started using Boot Camp. He refused to buy a Mac until he knew he had the "security blanket" of Windows. The other day I asked him how often he used Windows, and he said about 5% of the time, compared to about 50/50 when he first bought it.

Gossamer · Dec 3, 2006, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by Atheist

The printing thing is frustrating... I have an HP PSC All-In-One printer on my PowerBook. Every time I go to print on his MacBook, the printer doesn't show up... I add it and make it the default printer and everything is fine until he reboots... then it disappears. The crashing thing from Safari is probably related somehow...

I have a PSC 1210v and a PSC 1209 that both work pretty well on an Intel Mac and a couple PowerPC machines. The installation is always picky, though. Are you using the installed from HP's website?