[marden]

Oprah's school 'too strict' - parents


TheAge.com.au | Tuesday, 20 March 2007

Oprah Winfrey has opened a second South African school amid reports that her first is like "life in a prison".
A small group of mothers at Winfrey's Leadership Academy claim "the strict visitation rules are far from ideal and they want greater access to their children," according to the Hollywood Reporter.

The mothers say they are only allowed to see their daughters for two hours a month at the boarding school outside Johannesburg.

One mother, Angela Conradie, said her homesick daughter "phones me in tears sometimes, and then I don't know what to say to her".

But Winfrey has pressed on, opening a second school in South Africa.

The Seven Fountains Primary School, funded by Oprah's Angel Network charity, cost $US1.6 million to create, according to a blog on the Hollywood Reporter's website.

The school is reportedly bigger than the first, with 25 classrooms, a computer centre and two sports fields.

Oprah's school 'too strict' - parents - New Zealand's source for entertainment news, gossip & music, movie & book reviews on Stuff.co.nz

Oprah's response?

"Our goal is to protect the health, welfare and well-being of the students at the Oprah Winfrey Leadership Academy," said a spokesman for Oprah's Harpo Productions. "As with other boarding schools, we provide a structured, safe and nurturing environment in which the girls can learn and develop."

Harpo Responds to Criticism of Oprah's School

If the parents don't like it then take the snotty little brats to some other school and you can have ALLLLLL the freedom you want.

Right on, Oprah!

Funny how she and I think alike.

[invisibleX]

Oprah and Marden think alike.


This is so easy I feel a little dirty about it.


Hell, even the name of the school is creepy.

[IceEnclosure]

she's crazier and scarier than a shithouse rat.

[besson3c]

Oprah is the new Ted Koppel

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by IceEnclosure 

she's crazier and scarier than a shithouse rat.

Is "shithouse" censored?

[earthlings]

I feel bad for the parents and grandparents raising the kids before Oprah said said she had this leadership academy. Now the grandparents have to live in poverty alone without the kids help..... They even spent Christmas without their family. Why didn't Oprah let them see their family for Christmas? Oprah spent Christmas in South Africa with her new "CHILDREN" and not with her family and the kids without their family.

[marden]

Originally Posted by earthlings 

I feel bad for the parents and grandparents raising the kids before Oprah said said she had this leadership academy. Now the grandparents have to live in poverty alone without the kids help..... They even spent Christmas without their family. Why didn't Oprah let them see their family for Christmas? Oprah spent Christmas in South Africa with her new "CHILDREN" and not with her family and the kids without their family.

Oprah says these parents are absolutely free to withdraw their children at any time. They are there subject to Oprah's rules. They signed up for the school and agreed to the rules. If they don't want to abide by the rules they should leave.

[earthlings]

Well I don't think any kid left yet.

[marden]

Originally Posted by earthlings 

Well I don't think any kid left yet.

Of course not. These parents know they can't do as good a job of bringing up these kids in a healthy and positive way that's free from the crappy influences that doom many and adversely influence most.

[earthlings]

Yeah. But they still love their kids.

[marden]

Originally Posted by earthlings 

Yeah. But they still love their kids.

Sure! And the kids probably love their parents. But, as the song goes, 'what's love got to do with it?'

There is no one who is going to deny the emotions between parent/s and child/ren. The issue at the heart of this matter is whether the atmosphere is conducive for learning if the parents visit more often.

They tried more frequent visits and it impaired the learning environment.

Keep in mind these aren't infants.

The first two classes of the Academy will include 152 girls of ages 11-12, selected from 3,500 nationwide applicants in South Africa. Although the incoming classes of girls will enter grades 7 and 8, the Leadership Academy plans to provide middle school and high school education for girls in grades 7 through 12.[4][5] To qualify as a candidate for the Leadership Academy, the potential student must show that she is academically qualified, and that her family must have a household income no greater than $787 a month.[6]

Oprah Winfrey Leadership Academy for Girls - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They are able to live away from home without emotional scarring.

[IceEnclosure]

shithouse

[IceEnclosure]

****house

sorry. but what's the diff between shithouse and f√ckhouse?

[marden]

Originally Posted by IceEnclosure 

****house

sorry. but what's the diff between shithouse and f√ckhouse?

Maybe someone forgot to program that variation into the screen.

[wallinbl]

Originally Posted by marden 

Oprah says these parents are absolutely free to withdraw their children at any time. They are there subject to Oprah's rules. They signed up for the school and agreed to the rules. If they don't want to abide by the rules they should leave.

That's no excuse for ridiculous rules that have little positive benefit.

Originally Posted by marden 

Of course not. These parents know they can't do as good a job of bringing up these kids in a healthy and positive way that's free from the crappy influences that doom many and adversely influence most.

Right - they have no choice. So Oprah comes in and sets up over the top rules and there is no choice for the parents. Given the alternatives, they choose to take the risk on Oprah in hopes of something better. Oprah is a fool to think that family is of no importance. Even if these kids learn great leadership skills, to have all love sucked out of their lives is not a good trade.

[wallinbl]

To qualify as a candidate for the Leadership Academy, the potential student must show that she is academically qualified, and that her family must have a household income no greater than $787 a month.

What's with the lack of a sliding scale? This irks me about many financial requirements surrounding education. So, at $786/month, your kid goes for free. At $788/month, your kid can't go because you're too rich. I had this problem with "need" based financial aid in college. My parents made just barely enough money for me to not qualify for several grants. Problem was, income - grant < grant income limit, so my parents would end up with less money than someone whose kid was on the grant.

[marden]

Originally Posted by wallinbl 

That's no excuse for ridiculous rules that have little positive benefit.



Right - they have no choice. So Oprah comes in and sets up over the top rules and there is no choice for the parents. Given the alternatives, they choose to take the risk on Oprah in hopes of something better. Oprah is a fool to think that family is of no importance. Even if these kids learn great leadership skills, to have all love sucked out of their lives is not a good trade.

Sigh! Ok. You win. Tell Oprah I said that she should fire her Board of Directors, the professional educators and staff and psychologists and administrators and hire you to run things because, on the basis of reading an article or a website, you know better than ALL of them.



Or did you stay at a Holiday Inn last night and wake up an expert on child education and sociology?

[wallinbl]

Originally Posted by marden 

Or did you stay at a Holiday Inn last night and wake up an expert on child education and sociology?

I'm not the expert - my mother is. I listen to her complain about this crap constantly. Our push towards efficiency and consistency in rules has bled over to education, where it's a bad thing. The idea that all kids can be treated the same and that hardline rules apply to everything is ridiculous. Standardized tests, performance metrics, and all the unbreakable rules are bad for kids. People like to blame the increase in Ritalin on lazy parents or lazy shrinks, but the schools are as much at fault as anyone. Guess what? Some kids think differently (no, not as in Apple). Rather than come up with a way to accommodate that, we're moving in the opposite direction - larger classrooms, more standardization, etc.

Don't tell me (or my mother) that the current set of education 'experts' has a clue. They haven't learned how to best educate children, they've learned how to best move kids through the grade levels while constantly having their budget underfunded. That's not to say that these people couldn't be great educators, it's simply that they have been put in a crap situation and forced to deal with it. We run kids through school the same way we run patents through the patent office.

[wallinbl]

Originally Posted by marden 

Sigh! Ok. You win. Tell Oprah I said that she should fire her Board of Directors, the professional educators and staff and psychologists and administrators and hire you to run things because, on the basis of reading an article or a website, you know better than ALL of them.

Do you ever have an opinion of your own, or are you just a conduit for Ann Coulter/Ted Koppel/Oprah?

[shifuimam]

Oprah is such a d0uchebag. She's almost as self-centered as Kanye West, and I'm freakin' sick to death of her.

She could stand to make her voluntary boarding schools a little less militant. It's possible to provide an outstanding education while allowing kids to still talk to their parents.

marden, you make Republicans look really bad. PLEASE shut up. I'm serious. I'm a Republican, and I'm sure there's at least one other one here at MacNN, and you're doing us no favors.

[Wiskedjak]

I'm going to have to agree with Abe on this one. These kids are being offered an opportunity that they would not otherwise have. They, and their families, are entering willingly, knowing the rules. They aren't being deceived, abducted or held against their will. To my knowledge, Oprah is not profiting, or even breaking even, from this venture.

[marden]

Originally Posted by wallinbl 

I'm not the expert - my mother is. I listen to her complain about this crap constantly. Our push towards efficiency and consistency in rules has bled over to education, where it's a bad thing. The idea that all kids can be treated the same and that hardline rules apply to everything is ridiculous. Standardized tests, performance metrics, and all the unbreakable rules are bad for kids. People like to blame the increase in Ritalin on lazy parents or lazy shrinks, but the schools are as much at fault as anyone. Guess what? Some kids think differently (no, not as in Apple). Rather than come up with a way to accommodate that, we're moving in the opposite direction - larger classrooms, more standardization, etc.

Don't tell me (or my mother) that the current set of education 'experts' has a clue. They haven't learned how to best educate children, they've learned how to best move kids through the grade levels while constantly having their budget underfunded. That's not to say that these people couldn't be great educators, it's simply that they have been put in a crap situation and forced to deal with it. We run kids through school the same way we run patents through the patent office.

No, I think your advice would result in getting these girls sent back to their homes and schools which may not even be as good as you describe.

Further, why don't you actually ask mom how she feels about this instead of trying to guess how she would feel. I think you'd be surprised to find that despite your knowing how she feels about education, generally, you might not realize this is a different situation.

It is in South Africa.

And Oprah has the $$ & the clout to expect, demand, attract and get the finest professionals in the field of education and sociology to be on her board of directors as well as advisors and administrators and etc.

Nothing but the best for Oprah.

[mitchell_pgh]

Is this a private school? Do the parents and kids know what they are getting into? Can you leave the "Opera Compound" once you arrive?

I'm guessing the answer to all my questions are "Yes."

I'm not saying I agree with her, but it's her money and she can set up any rules she likes. If my daughter/son was crying every day, I would consider pulling them out.

[marden]

Originally Posted by wallinbl 

Do you ever have an opinion of your own, or are you just a conduit for Ann Coulter/Ted Koppel/Oprah?

Some of you just don't get it. The reason we all sound alike is because once upon a time EVERYBODY thought this way! And then things started to become new and improved and then you all wonder why there are so many new kinds of problems that never existed before.

And then when people try to tell you how to right things you just insist on having things your way.

Well, you guys are going to screw up the country and I'll be saying, I told you so.

Meanwhile, Oprah is making sure that if push ever comes to shove in some 20 years from now there will be a group of smart, principled, healthy young African women who will be prepared to lead you to the promised land.

[marden]

Originally Posted by shifuimam 

Oprah is such a d0uchebag. She's almost as self-centered as Kanye West, and I'm freakin' sick to death of her.

She could stand to make her voluntary boarding schools a little less militant. It's possible to provide an outstanding education while allowing kids to still talk to their parents.

marden, you make Republicans look really bad. PLEASE shut up. I'm serious. I'm a Republican, and I'm sure there's at least one other one here at MacNN, and you're doing us no favors.

If you knew what you were talking about you would keep it to yourself. And if you have any smarts at all you'd better get out my face cuz I will hurt your feelings. Go be ignorant somewhere else, boyo.

BTW, you'll get no further warnings.

[marden]

Originally Posted by mitchell_pgh 

Is this a private school? Do the parents and kids know what they are getting into? Can you leave the "Opera Compound" once you arrive?

I'm guessing the answer to all my questions are "Yes."

I'm not saying I agree with her, but it's her money and she can set up any rules she likes. If my daughter/son was crying every day, I would consider pulling them out.

On Inside Edition last evening Oprah said exactly that. If ANY parent wants to withdraw their daughter she BLESSES THEM to do so. Like, come on, ruin your daughter's life and future because of some short term angst or homesickness.

Kids cry at summer camp. Does that mean it's bad for them?

Kids cry because they can't have junk food or talk to their friends or watch tv or listen to gangsta rap or stay up late. So whenever the kid cries you think the best thing is to capitulate to the child's tears? I think we'd know who was the parent and who was the child in that kind of relationship. The child would be pulling the adult's strings!

[marden]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak 

I'm going to have to agree with Abe on this one. These kids are being offered an opportunity that they would not otherwise have. They, and their families, are entering willingly, knowing the rules. They aren't being deceived, abducted or held against their will. To my knowledge, Oprah is not profiting, or even breaking even, from this venture.

We have often disagreed but I have always respected your intelligence and never more so than with this post.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally Posted by marden 

On Inside Edition last evening Oprah said exactly that. If ANY parent wants to withdraw their daughter she BLESSES THEM to do so. Like, come on, ruin your daughter's life and future because of some short term angst or homesickness.

Kids cry at summer camp. Does that mean it's bad for them?

Kids cry because they can't have junk food or talk to their friends or watch tv or listen to gangsta rap or stay up late. So whenever the kid cries you think the best thing is to capitulate to the child's tears? I think we'd know who was the parent and who was the child in that kind of relationship. The child would be pulling the adult's strings!

I'm sure there are other students just waiting to take their space should any student choose to leave.

[marden]

Originally Posted by mitchell_pgh 

I'm sure there are other students just waiting to take their space should any student choose to leave.

Could you imagine the self-recriminations a parent would have to live with if they ever withdrew their daughter out of a misguided desire to ease the child's temporary homesickness?

I shudder to think of how terrible such a thing might be for the parent to have to live with.

[shifuimam]

Originally Posted by marden 

If you knew what you were talking about you would keep it to yourself. And if you have any smarts at all you'd better get out my face cuz I will hurt your feelings. Go be ignorant somewhere else, boyo.

BTW, you'll get no further warnings.

Hahahahahahahhahahahahaha

What?

Very ghetto fabulous response. "you'd better get out my face". I don't know many Republicans who play the Ebonics card. BTW, don't worry about hurting my feelings. It doesn't happen much in my world.

Sure, kids are spoiled, but I hardly think that allowing them to see their parents for more than two hours a month is going to turn them into ghetto wannabes with no sense of decency or rules. These aren't college kids. They're not adults. They're children, and it's pretty shitty for a parent who desperately wants their kids to have a good education to have to weigh that against having very minimal contact with their own children.

Unfortunately, BET.com is websensed at my job, so I can't read Oprah's response. Anyone care to post it?

[besson3c]

Well, he will hurt your feelings.

He called me a gadfly, and this wound is still festering with no apology to help me deal with my trauma. Marden, you should apologize to me, it's the humane and decent thing to do.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by wallinbl 

I'm not the expert - my mother is. I listen to her complain about this crap constantly. Our push towards efficiency and consistency in rules has bled over to education, where it's a bad thing. The idea that all kids can be treated the same and that hardline rules apply to everything is ridiculous. Standardized tests, performance metrics, and all the unbreakable rules are bad for kids. People like to blame the increase in Ritalin on lazy parents or lazy shrinks, but the schools are as much at fault as anyone. Guess what? Some kids think differently (no, not as in Apple). Rather than come up with a way to accommodate that, we're moving in the opposite direction - larger classrooms, more standardization, etc.

Don't tell me (or my mother) that the current set of education 'experts' has a clue. They haven't learned how to best educate children, they've learned how to best move kids through the grade levels while constantly having their budget underfunded. That's not to say that these people couldn't be great educators, it's simply that they have been put in a crap situation and forced to deal with it. We run kids through school the same way we run patents through the patent office.

This is exactly right! Well said...

Education in this country is in really rough shape, and the blame can be shared all around.

[Madrag]

I know Oprah's evil will come out in its full extent some day.
I hate how she, Dr Phil and others "drink" from the peoples' poverty and misery...

[besson3c]

Hey Madrag,

I'm double clicking on your read me first document and it isn't doing anything... I thought you might want to know about this so you can fix it.

It said to read me first.

[Gossamer]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Hey Madrag,

I'm double clicking on your read me first document and it isn't doing anything... I thought you might want to know about this so you can fix it.

It said to read me first.

Aren't you going to chastise him for having a sig that's 7 pixels too tall? I know that's your style.

[Dakar²]

That son of a bitch.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Gossamer 

Aren't you going to chastise him for having a sig that's 7 pixels too tall? I know that's your style.

7 PIXELS!! 7 bloody pixels!! OMFG!!! It's all fun and games when it is 1 or 2 pixels taller than regulation standards, but we aren't screwing around any longer once it reaches 5-7 pixels. This is bullshit and must be stopped!

Gossamer: I thank you for your diligence in coming up with this measurement when it was most needed, you are a nice young lad whose parents probably raised you well.

I summon all mods to commence in a senate hearing about what kind of punishment to issue for this misdemeanor. This meeting will ajourn in 03 hours, 27 minutes. Do not be late!

Can we get this area quarantined?

[besson3c]

[Monique]

Originally Posted by shifuimam 

Oprah is such a d0uchebag. She's almost as self-centered as Kanye West, and I'm freakin' sick to death of her.

She could stand to make her voluntary boarding schools a little less militant. It's possible to provide an outstanding education while allowing kids to still talk to their parents.

marden, you make Republicans look really bad. PLEASE shut up. I'm serious. I'm a Republican, and I'm sure there's at least one other one here at MacNN, and you're doing us no favors.

I do not always agree with Republicans but Oprah forgets we are talking about Africa where families are even closer than anywhere else in the world. And to seperate the girls from their families is stupid. I am for a close relationships between parents and school personnel. This is often how a school can be successful with the involvement of everyone concerned.

[Madrag]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I'm double clicking on your read me first document and it isn't doing anything... I thought you might want to know about this so you can fix it..

the sig says to read me first: or "read my post first", not anything else. I'm self-centered
BTW, MacNN has the same sig, copycats!

[::maroma::]

Originally Posted by IceEnclosure 

sorry. but what's the diff between shithouse and f√ckhouse?

4 letters?

(what do I win?)

[besson3c]

****house ****ola ****ish ****ala blah****


Any word containing the f-word seems to be censored.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by IceEnclosure 

sorry. but what's the diff between shithouse and f√ckhouse?

One is an outside convenience, one is an inside convenience.

[marden]

Originally Posted by Monique 

I do not always agree with Republicans but Oprah forgets we are talking about Africa where families are even closer than anywhere else in the world. And to seperate the girls from their families is stupid. I am for a close relationships between parents and school personnel. This is often how a school can be successful with the involvement of everyone concerned.

Well, it seems that we now get a chance to see the true nature of things. It's true that Republicans come in all stripes. And while you may agree with someone who CALLS himself a Republican, how many Republicans on this board do you know who seek to form divisions within their own ranks?

Someone like that who is internally divisive and elitist (would anyone even think, 'racist?') reminds me of an old Southern segregationist Democrat otherwise known as a Dixiecrat.

The Dixiecrats were a segregationist splinter-party of the Democratic Party in the mid-20th century who were determined to protect what they saw as the southern way of life against an oppressive United States federal government...

The proclamation by President Harry S. Truman and Senator Hubert Humphrey of support for a Negro civil rights plank in the Democratic Party platform of 1948 led to a walkout of 35 delegates from Mississippi and Alabama. These southern delegations nominated their own "States Rights Democratic Party" (aka Dixiecrat) nominees with Senator Strom Thurmond leading the ticket...

This person goes, like a heat seeking missile, directly to the issue of race...as if it matters. But it plainly DOES matter to him. And he sees my response as "ghetto" and he sees these girls in South Africa through his hateful racist blinders.

Very ghetto fabulous response. "you'd better get out my face". I don't know many Republicans who play the Ebonics card. BTW, don't worry about hurting my feelings. It doesn't happen much in my world.

Sure, kids are spoiled, but I hardly think that allowing them to see their parents for more than two hours a month is going to turn them into ghetto wannabes with no sense of decency or rules. These aren't college kids. They're not adults. They're children, and it's pretty shitty for a parent who desperately wants their kids to have a good education to have to weigh that against having very minimal contact with their own children.

Unfortunately, BET.com is websensed at my job, so I can't read Oprah's response. Anyone care to post it?

Monique, you aren't agreeing with a Republican as much as a Dixiecrat at worst or, to be charitable, a blue dog Democrat.

Blue Dog Democrats are a group of 44 conservative to moderate Democratic Party members of the United States House of Representatives[1]. The Blue Dogs are a coalition of like-minded Democrats whose primary mission is to promote fiscally responsible budget reforms and accountability for taxpayer dollars. Many members hail from conservative-leaning districts, where liberal Democrats and liberal values are a decided minority. Therefore, the Democratic Party has become more supportive of Blue Dog candidates in recent times. This was especially true in the 2006 election, when Blue Dog candidates such as Heath Shuler and Brad Ellsworth were elected in conservative-leaning districts, upending years of Republican dominance in these districts. Blue Dog Democrats often hold conservative values.

But when I mention the word charitable he would probably see it as being connected to welfare and the ghetto. So maybe we should think of him as a blue DOG Democrat...and give him that ghetto association to wallow around in for his pleasure.



He's like no Republican I've ever known.

And a note to him, that really is being charitable.

[besson3c]

Marden, are you a Dixiecrat?

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

****house ****ola ****ish ****ala blah****


Any word containing the f-word seems to be censored.

Or perhaps it's just censoring **** regardless of what letter are before or after it.

[marden]

Originally Posted by Monique 

Oprah forgets we are talking about Africa where families are even closer than anywhere else in the world. And to seperate the girls from their families is stupid. I am for a close relationships between parents and school personnel. This is often how a school can be successful with the involvement of everyone concerned.

Oprah has BEEN to the region many times. Oprah has investigated the culture and society. Oprah has consulted with, contracted and employed people from the area who are the best at this sort of thing as well as tapping the expertise of acknowledged experts in the field of education and psychology around the world to make this school the finest it can be.

And she has sunk MILLIONS OF HER OWN DOLLARS into this venture without expectation of financial gain.

And you think she hasn't maybe ONCE given thought to the considerations you mention?

[earthlings]

She traveled back and forth from filming her show in Chicago to check up on the school in Africa. I wonder how many times she did that.

[stevesnj]

She is a very sexist person....why was this school only offered to African girls? Are the African boys not worthy of an education also?

[marden]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Marden, are you a Dixiecrat?

Get back, honky cat!

1. Honky Cat
2. Mellow
3. I Think I'm Going To Kill Myself
4. Susie (Dramas)
5. Rocket Man (I Think It's Going To Be A Long, Long Time)
6. Salvation
7. Slave
8. Amy
9. Mona Lisas And Mad Hatters
10. Hercules
11. Slave (Alternate Version)

You better get back honky cat
Living in the city ain't where it's at
It's like trying to find gold in a silver mine
It's like trying to drink whisky from a bottle of wine