[hexstar]

Vintage Computing Files Archive

It is my belief that archives like this one should be provided without any limitation to the end users ability to utilize the archive. These archives are getting harder and harder to find and because of that we all should do what we can to let those who want to mirror our archives do so. As such I am now bringing this archive to the vintage computing community. I have not and will not put any limitations on how users can utilize the archive provided here. Users can freely download as much or as little of the archive as they want. Users can also freely contribute as much or as little to the archive as they want. This way people will be able to mirror the archive easily which will help ensure the files contained in this archive have a nice long life span. This will also allow this archive to grow freely and become an ever increasingly useful resource to fellow vintage computing hobbyists. It is my hope that people will take advantage of the great disk space and bandwidth provided here and both contribute to and download from this archive. This will allow users to have a good solid place to go whenever they are in need of a file for their vintage computing hobby. With the resources provided here it is my hope that with others contributions and utilization of this archive that this will become a great resource for all vintage computer hobbyists. That's right, there is no certain vintage computing era this archive is limited to (except the 2000+ computers and their related files), as it is my hope that this becomes a great central archive of everything vintage computing. A resource that makes the vintage computing hobby easier and less intimidating by not requiring hobbyists to go all over the internet for the files they need. Hopefully someday this goal will be met for the benefit of everyone who enjoys vintage computing as a hobby. Enjoy! :-)

You can get to my archive via the following url: Vintage Computing Files Archive

FAQ

How can I contribute to the archive?

To contribute to the archive use your favorite ftp client with the following connection information:

FTP Server: pepsi.dreamhost.com
Username: hexpubup
Password: hexupload

To expedite the sorting of uploads please do the following when uploading files to the archive:

* Look for a folder corresponding to the type of computer your files are related to (Apple, DEC, Commodore, etc)

* If one exists go in it and place it in the correct category sub folder (e.g. Utilities, Multimedia, Office, etc)

* If the folder corresponding to the type of computer your files are related to doesn't exist or the correct category subfolder doesn't exist create it and place your files inside of the folder (if you create a category subfolder for a category that doesn't exist publicly and your files are determined to be able to be legally hostable, the new category will be created publicly with your files inside of the new category)

This will help speed up the sorting of the uploads by avoiding mess and clutter as much as possible. Thanks! :-)

Uploaded files are not instantly made publicly available as it is necessary to review the files for possible legal issues which could prevent them from being able to be shared publicly on the server, the upload folder is checked daily and any newly uploaded content that is deemed legally sharable ( e.g. abandonware and/or software which was made by a company that no longer exists or still exists but has long since abandoned the software and does not care if the software is shared) will be sorted in the appropriate publicly accessible folders.



What era or type of vintage computer related files are allowed in this archive?

There is no specific era or vintage computer that this archive is restricted to as long as the file(s) don't relate to any computer made in 2000+. It is my hope that this becomes a great central archive of everything vintage computing. A resource that makes the vintage computing hobby easier and less intimidating by not requiring hobbyists to go all over the internet for the files they need. Hopefully someday this goal will be met for the benefit of everyone who enjoys vintage computing as a hobby.



Why should I contribute to/download from this archive?

This archive is unique in that it is maintained with the belief that there should be no limitations in place for how one can utilize this archive. This archive is hosted on a server with 200GB of disk space and 2.8TB of monthly bandwidth, this ensures that everyone can enjoy the archive equally. In addition this archive is hosted in a state of the art data center in the USA, this means that the server has high upload and download speeds, something not every vintage computing archive has unfortunately. The high bandwidth and disk space available for everyone's use ensures that everyone can equally enjoy this archive with nice fast speeds both up and down. This in turn makes it easy for people to download the files they need and for people to contribute to this archive without spending a lot of time doing either. In addition every file uploaded is backed up locally so that if the hard drive in the server goes bad the files will not be gone and can easily be reuploaded (and they would be as soon as the hard drive got replaced). Not only that but because I encourage people to mirror this archive you can rest assured that I will not be the only person with a backup of this archive so that these files will have a good, long life span.



Do you backup the archive?

Yes I sure do. Every time I check for new uploads I backup the uploaded content locally onto two hard drives.


Can I download the entire archive?

Yes! You certainly can using something like wget. I do not believe in limiting the potential of these types of archives as explained above and as such there is nothing stopping you from downloading the entire archive. In fact I encourage people to mirror this archive as it'll help ensure that the files stay around longer. Also note that while we won't stop people from downloading the whole archive for their own personal use ( i.e. they have no intention of later sharing the archive with others) it is preferred instead that in this case files are downloaded individually as needed.



What can I do if I find one or more files that are wrongly categorized?

Please email me at hexstar@gmail.com with the location of the file(s) in question and the location where you believe they should be moved to.



How can I contact you?

You can contact me at hexstar@gmail.com

[Jawbone54]

Lock and ban in 10...9...8...7...

[Buckaroo]

Ibtl

[Railroader]

Ibcr™

[hexstar]

Originally Posted by Buckaroo 

Ibtl

What does that stand for?

[hexstar]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

Ibcr™

what does that stand for?

Do note that my intention is to help this community by pointing out a good resource that has lots of good vintage mac software. This is great for people here who still have macs that run classic Mac OS (Mac OS 9 and below). In addition when time permits I plan to participate in other off topic discussions as well as help with questions/problems where possible.

[Buckaroo]

Originally Posted by hexstar 

What does that stand for?

I'm just kidding.

It stands for "In before the Lock".

We have a hunch that your thread will be locked.

I am not sure, but I suspect that your posts might not be kosher. I don't believe you can post software until the copyright has expired.

[Buckaroo]

Your intentions may be sincere, but they may also be in error.

[Buckaroo]

Nothings happened yet, so you might be safe. Maybe we are wrong.

[hexstar]

I'm sorry if this post appears to be spam, I did not intend it to be. Rather I intended this post to point out to fellow mac users a good resource for vintage mac software which can be of great help to anyone who may still use a mac running classic Mac OS (Mac OS 9 and below), especially since the software for those versions of Mac OS are becoming harder and harder to locate every day.

In addition I do not intend to host any illegal files, I reviewed each file before uploading and feel that every file is within the abandonware category and thus can be publicly hosted based on the success of other abandonware software websites. However if there are any files in particular that you feel should not be being hosted please post the url to the file(s) and I will re-evaluate the file and in most cases remove the file promptly. I'm afraid that in some cases some people do not seem to believe in the software categorization of abandonware and rather prefer the strict interpretation of the US copyright law, this is unfortunate as I am basing the hostability of many of these files based on whether or not they fit under the category of abandonware, and since there are other abandonware software websites such as the-underdogs.info which are running without legal issues it is my hope that I can apply that principal to this archive as well. Unfortunately this is a bit of a legal grey area but I would like to make it clear that if you feel that there is a file that should not be hosted but currently is that you can provide me with the url(s) of the file(s) and I will re-evaluate the file and in many cases remove the file promptly, this applies to any companies that may see one or more files they own being hosted that they want removed as well.

All in all I hope this archive proves to be a success such that fellow mac users freely enjoy the benefits of this archive by downloading as many files as one wants at any time as well as contributing to the archive via the public ftp upload account.

[Buckaroo]

Abondoneware? Hmmm. Maybe it'll work. I hate it when companies quit supporting their programs.

Since M$ is no longer supporting Windows 2000, I wonder if that qualifies.

[hexstar]

Well see, Windows 2000 does not apply as abandonware as far as I'm concerned. The reason why I say that is because many businesses still use Windows 2000 as their choice operating system. I feel that the files I am hosting fall under abandonware because to the best of my knowladge none of these files are under wide usage if any usage at all any longer and at the same time the company has either moved on to a newer version of their product (and the current version is fairly distant from the version of the product being hosted thus ensuring that the company has completely dropped support for the product and thus very likely sees no reason to legally pursue any person who spreads the software in question) and dropped support for it, the company no longer offers the product at all, or the company itself no longer exists. Windows 2000 does not fall under any of those categories and thus is not abandonware and is not able to be hosted in this archive. However to the best of my knowledge the software currently being hosted in the archive does fall under one or more of the above categories thus making it abandonware and publicly hostable. But again if anyone sees some files that they really do not think should be publicly hosted they can send me the url(s) of the file(s) and I'll re-evaluate the file(s) and most likely promptly remove the file(s). Thanks for your interest in my archive and I apologize for the confusion.

[Buckaroo]

LiveLeak.com - New age pilots

Forgive me for getting off topic, but I thought this link was too funny.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Buckaroo 

Abondoneware? Hmmm. Maybe it'll work. I hate it when companies quit supporting their programs.

Since M$ is no longer supporting Windows 2000, I wonder if that qualifies.

It doesn't. Legally speaking, I believe abandonware is basically software that that just can't reasonably be run on a modern system (e.g., System 6 programs). Archive.org made a post about it a while back.

[hexstar]

When looking at the post it does appear that thanks to Archive.org there now is some real legal backbone to abandonware:

“computer programs and video games distributed in formats that have become obsolete and that require the original media or hardware as a condition of access, when circumvention is accomplished for the purpose of preservation or archival reproduction of published digital works by a library or archive. A format shall be considered obsolete if the machine or system necessary to render perceptible a work stored in that format is no longer manufactured or is no longer reasonably available in the commercial marketplace.”

I feel that the software being hosted does fall under that condition and thus should be safe. But again if anyone sees some files that they really do not think should be publicly hosted they can send me the url(s) of the file(s) and I'll re-evaluate the file(s) and most likely promptly remove the file(s).

[mac128k-1984]

I think you might have legal issue with your collection. I had not looked indepth at your "collection" but for what I did see, apple and others may have issues if they catch wind of it.

an interesting concept though.

Edit:
I just noticed that you have MS office, quicken, acrobat, bbedit. I'm not sure if your collection falls under the umbrella of abandonware or piracy. I'd suspect bare-bones, apple, intuit may call it piracy and since they hold the copyrights to the software they may be right.

From time to time apple (I wonder who else does this) releases the old software like system 7 to the public domain. I'm not sure if appleworks is there or any application software.

[Dakarʒ]

Those are some large paragraphs.

[Mithras]

Yeah, I think tldr applies. But the abandonware discussion is interesting.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by hexstar 

what does that stand for?

Do note that my intention is to help this community by pointing out a good resource that has lots of good vintage mac software. This is great for people here who still have macs that run classic Mac OS (Mac OS 9 and below). In addition when time permits I plan to participate in other off topic discussions as well as help with questions/problems where possible.

In Before Christ Returns™

Hosting and distributing "abandonware" for the most part is still piracy. You are violating someone's copyright. That's called "piracy".

[Railroader]

BTW: A quick tip, get a little bit familiar with people here before you jump on here promoting something. To otherwise is spam.

[Kevin]

What no MacFoxes?

[Aron Peterson]

If there are going to be legal issues he can deal with it as the owner of the site and distributor of the software.

My personal opinion is that there should be an online catalogue of freely available abandonware for those who can't afford modern computing or those in the developing world who need an introduction to computing. Instead of pitching it as a Vintage Archive he should be pitching his site to the lesser well off around the world who are donated abandoned computers and need software.

Looking at the collection of software he amassed so far there is a lot there that could be useful by poor people and doubt the developers of most of those apps will care. He should simply write an email to each developer or company to inform them when he is distributing their wares to OK it with them.

Companies don't seem to mind this site or this one.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

Hosting and distributing "abandonware" for the most part is still piracy. You are violating someone's copyright. That's called "piracy".

Did you read the Archive.org post where they confirmed they were allowed to host and distribute abandonware?

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by Aron Peterson 

If there are going to be legal issues he can deal with it as the owner of the site and distributor of the software.

Actually, one of the rules of MacNN is no promotion of piracy. (It's right after the first rule of MacNN... no need to go into that)

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

Did you read the Archive.org post where they confirmed they were allowed to host and distribute abandonware?

No. Did you read the wikipedia entry I linked to? The one where they point out that "abandonware" is at best "has no legal meaning, and much abandonware is not in the public domain, so it cannot necessarily be legally copied or distributed without the permission of the owner."

[residentEvil]

because wikipedia is the end all and be all of truth?

i never trust anything there. always check with other sources.

[Aron Peterson]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

Actually, one of the rules of MacNN is no promotion of piracy. (It's right after the first rule of MacNN... no need to go into that)

Without knowing what each individual developer or individual thinks of those wares we here don't know what is being pirated and what isn't, therefore any discussion about abandonware, or software that is no longer supported or upgradable at cost, should be freely welcomed on MacNN and elsewhere.

Abandonware needs a repository for preservation's sake and for those who can't afford any software at all, otherwise all that old software will be lost and disappear. There goes a record of human history if not preserved.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by residentEvil 

because wikipedia is the end all and be all of truth?

i never trust anything there. always check with other sources.

I certainly wouldn't check with archive.org

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by Aron Peterson 

Without knowing what each individual developer or individual thinks of those wares we here don't know what is being pirated and what isn't, therefore any discussion about abandonware, or software that is no longer supported or upgradable at cost, should be freely welcomed on MacNN and elsewhere.

Abandonware needs a repository for preservation's sake and for those who can't afford any software at all, otherwise all that old software will be lost and disappear. There goes a record of human history if not preserved.

As long as copyright laws are not violated.

Call it a hunch, I am pretty certain our newest spammer here doesn't know the legal circumstances of each piece of software he is labeling "abandonware" is.

[residentEvil]

but using a source that anyone can spread FUD in is better?

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

I certainly wouldn't check with archive.org

How about you actually read the relevant info before weighing in? A post on Archive.org with citations and links > some unattributed claim on Wikipedia.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by residentEvil 

but using a source that anyone can spread FUD in is better?

As opposed to a person./group with a direct interest in promoting an agenda?

Yes.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

As opposed to a person./group with a direct interest in promoting an agenda?

Like the Register of Copyrights?

Do you see that bit at the top of the article where it says "The neutrality of this article is disputed"? That might be a hint as to which party is more reliable.

[mac128k-1984]

I think having the link to wikipedia is a good start. While it is not the end all and be of truth its usually pretty spot on.

While I'm no lawyer, I'm guessing that copyright law and regulations will take precedence over any perceived freedom from abandonware. I also agree the term abandonware is not a true legal carrying term but one that people have coined. That is there is no case history to show that any software still under copyright law but not actively sold can be considered in the public domain.

Lets view from another angle.
Take 20th century fox and some of the movies it made during the last 50 years. They have a vast inventory of movies that have yet made it to dvd or be sold in any other medium. Do you think they would let a site exist that allowed people to download those movies - of course not.

Just because the copyright holder is not actively selling or even supporting the product does not mean we have the right to then take it for free.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

How about you actually read the relevant info before weighing in? A post on Archive.org with citations and links > some unattributed claim on Wikipedia.

Believe me, I appreciated the link.

But, I think you should reread that article. It argues on behalf of my position concerning the OP more than your side.

Do you really think the OP has the intentions listed there?

[Buckaroo]

Well, since the mods havn't locked this thread yet, maybe it's ok. You know MacNN is cutting edge, they are willing to take chances, just like back during the JC Morris lawsuit issue a couple years ago. . . . oh wait. . . I remember, MacNN killed that thread and deleted it. It was that other forum (FatWallet.com) that went to court to fight till JC Morris (Todd Short) went to jail for fraud.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

Believe me, I appreciated the link.

But, I think you should reread that article. It argues on behalf of my position concerning the OP more than your side.

Do you really think the OP has the intentions listed there?

Preservation in an archive? Yes, it sounds like that is his intention.

[Aron Peterson]

Originally Posted by mac128k-1984 

That is there is no case history to show that any software still under copyright law but not actively sold can be considered in the public domain.

Beneath a Steel Sky was a highly successful game that was given permission to be distributed as abandonware to be used with ScummVM, as well as other titles. That's case history of software still under copyright law but not actively sold that is considered in the public domain.

Mac OS 7 is also distributed freely as abandonware and retains Apple's copyright.

[olePigeon]

There are several other websites that do this. Asimov Apple ][ archive, Macintosh Garden, etc.

I was thinking of doing something similar to Macintosh Garden and Asimov archive, but to a greater extent. I wanted to package programs together with OCR PDFs of the manuals, scans of the box artwork, label artwork, etc.

If you're going to archive software, it should be archived in its inegrity. At least, that's what I think.

[mac128k-1984]

Originally Posted by Aron Peterson 

Beneath a Steel Sky was a highly successful game that was given permission to be distributed as abandonware to be used with ScummVM, as well as other titles. That's case history of software still under copyright law but not actively sold that is considered in the public domain.

Mac OS 7 is also distributed freely as abandonware and retains Apple's copyright.

I cannot comment on the first set of apps that you mentioned since I have no clue what they are, but System 7 from apple was released into the public domain by apple. Not by someone having a download site, that is as the owner of the software they chose the action. Mac OS9 is not actively sold by apple yet I don't think they've allowed it into the public domain and would allow someone to distribute it.

My point is that the author is allowing it to be distribute it. Just because its old and not actively marketed mean that it can be freely distributed w/o the consent of the copyright holder.

To be honest I really don't care, its not a huge deal to me, its an intriguing idea having the archive, but I can see the OP getting into deep weeds very easily. He's reallying on other websites when that really doesn't amount to a hill of beans when he gets a cease and desist letter from some lawyer.

[hexstar]

Wow this topic has grown quickly, I can see abandonware is quite debatable . As olePigeon said there are other websites which also host abandonware: simov Apple ][ archive, Macintosh Garden, the-underdogs.info, etc and they have not been taken down despite many of the programs they host still technically being copyrighted. Abandonware is a bit of an unknown in the legal realm but I feel that with the judgment archive.org got and the success of other abandonware websites that software developers have grown to accept abandonware.

As others have said, and as I feel too, this software is getting harder and harder to get every day as more and more archives close their doors. I for one don't want this software to disappear and thus I created this archive to help keep the software from disappearing. I honestly don't feel that any of this software is going to cause any legal troubles from their creators, but if they do decide to send me a cease and desist letter I will sadly obey the letter and remove whatever software they tell me to remove. Plus as I've said if someone sees some software that they really don't think should be hosted they can provide me with the file(s) url(s) and I'll re-evaluate the software and in most cases quickly delete the software in question, some people say that they're not sure if certain software I'm hosting should be hosted yet none of those people have specified exactly which software they're talking about and thus I can't do anything about it, after all I'm not a mind reader .

It is my hope that people will enjoy this archive by downloading from it and hopefully contributing to the archive via uploads as well, have fun!

[Aron Peterson]

Well said, now if you become a good permy member you won't be called a spammer by some suspicious folk. You also need a good front end to your site and bloody hell the transfer speeds are slow.

[hexstar]

Transfer speeds are slow? Do you mean upload or download?

Good front end? What do you feel could be improved about it? If you look at other vintage computing archive websites they have the same style, just basic text. It's good because it can be viewed on any web enabled computer new and old and represents the good 'ol style of back then. But feel free to suggest changes you think should be made and I'll see what I can do.

[Aron Peterson]

Originally Posted by hexstar 

Transfer speeds are slow? Do you mean upload or download?

Good front end? What do you feel could be improved about it? If you look at other vintage computing archive websites they have the same style, just basic text. It's good because it can be viewed on any web enabled computer new and old and represents the good 'ol style of back then. But feel free to suggest changes you think should be made and I'll see what I can do.

Download speed was plain bad. Less than modem speeds.

Frontend-wise c64.com is the biscuit for retro design and abandonware.

[hexstar]

Hmm, I just tried downloading a file from the archive and got speeds over 1mbps so perhaps you just hit the server when everyone else was downloading from it as well...

[Strix]

You have AppleWorks 6 listed, yet Apple still sell this on their store.....

And could you argue that AppleWorks is a continued development of ClarisWorks, therefore part of the code may still be in use and therefore remain protected by the copyright holder.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by Strix 

You have AppleWorks 6 listed, yet Apple still sell this on their store.....

And could you argue that AppleWorks is a continued development of ClarisWorks, therefore part of the code may still be in use and therefore remain protected by the copyright holder.

But it's "archives". It's "abandonware". It's not piracy. didn't you read the pages and pages of arguments here?

[Chuckit]

Did abandonware kill your mom or something?

[Strix]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

But it's "archives". It's "abandonware". It's not piracy. didn't you read the pages and pages of arguments here?

We made it to the second page yet?

[residentEvil]

soon, very soon.