[Tiresias]

I am not a designer. But I can see that this is bad. Real bad.

The colours are ugly. The layout is appalling. It is more crowded than a Tokyo subway at rush hour. The tautology of detail is almost metastatic.

Microsoft is one of the biggest corporations in the world. Why don't they hire a freaking designer?

If I can see how bad it is, how did whoever pitched this monstrosity get it approved?

I just don't get it.

[64stang06]

Don't forget to mention that "Server Edition" is a serif font which sticks out like a sore thumb in the sans-serif boot image.

[design219]

How did this happen?

Well, often this kind of thing happens when committees are involved in the design process. And with committees, you often have at least one person who thinks they are not contributing unless they find fault.

I don't know how these two company manage their design process, but I would imagine that Apple let's their designers do their job, and Microsoft's designers get the end-run by suits from the accounting/engineering/production/etc., etc. departments to assure they have full company input.

But that's just a guess.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Designed by lawyers, probably.

I'm surprised they didn't add that to the screen too.

[Oisín]

Originally Posted by 64stang06 

Don't forget to mention that "Server Edition" is a serif font which sticks out like a sore thumb in the sans-serif boot image.

Not only is it a serif (a serif among sans* can give a nice contrast and look good, if used well), it’s Times New bloody Roman!



(* What’s the plural of «sans»? «Sanses»? «Sanss»? Just «sans»?)

[Tiresias]

Originally Posted by Dakar the Fourth 

Designed by lawyers, probably.

Designed by Microsoft© Lawyers™ for Microsoft© by its Lawyers™.

And while we're at it, isn't "Copyright©" like saying "copyright copyright"? Or are they copyrighting their copyright?

[angelmb]

Poll time !!

Can Microsoft's brand fight back


Some things are just less likely than others.

[rozwado1]

it seems likethe serif text isn't even center-aligned properly. The balance is way off. Think they could make the colorful windows any bigger?

[MacosNerd]

I'm not surprised and to be honest, I cannot blame MS for trying to protect their trademarks and copyrights. In this litigious society those extreme steps are the norm. It is a breath of fresh air in how Apple handles things, but don't take that as complacency as we all know how zealous they are of their brand.

[analogue SPRINKLES]

Weird. I was talking to my friend about the exact same thing a month ago how they crammed as many trademarks, copyrights and "MICROSOFT" in there as they could.

This is what happens when the company is run by programmers and marketing.

[Jawbone54]

Good luck to you guys trying to determine why Microsoft's design is so bad.

I'll use my time this morning to try to unravel a mystery that is actually solvable. Like who really killed JFK.

[olePigeon]

The ironic part is that Microsoft knows how bad they are at it, they even went as far as to make a joke video about Microsoft designing the iPod packaging. They just don't care.

[64stang06]

Originally Posted by Oisín 

Not only is it a serif (a serif among sans* can give a nice contrast and look good, if used well), it’s Times New bloody Roman!



(* What’s the plural of «sans»? «Sanses»? «Sanss»? Just «sans»?)

I agree, but this sticks out like a fat chick in a strip club. *shudders*

[::maroma::]

Having worked with Microsoft in the past on design projects, I can tell you they definitely design by committee, and that committee is usually made up of marketing people. And there are a TON of them. And they will inevitably take a clean, well thought out design and turn it into a cluttered, confusing mess. My coworkers and I often try to figure out their thinking when doing this, but we can't seem to put our fingers on it exactly. Personally, I think there are a lot of people at MS that feel a great need to justify their jobs, so they wind up insisting on making changes to a design that doesn't need to be changed.

Either way we've come to the conclusion that MS will never change in this regard (unless they have a complete philosophy change as a company). Its best to just point and laugh, rather than try to figure out how and why.

[olePigeon]

Needs more red.

[Tiresias]

Originally Posted by olePigeon 

The ironic part is that Microsoft knows how bad they are at it, they even went as far as to make a joke video about Microsoft designing the iPod packaging. They just don't care.

That just makes it all the more disgusting. What a crude and despicable corporation, a whore to filthy pelf.

It is not going to far to say that Microsoft stands against the progress of beauty and design.

[Dakar the Fourth]

It's not going too far to say that Microsoft stands against progress.

[Atheist]

Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES 

This is what happens when the company is run by programmers and marketing.

I think you hit then nail right on the head. I would wager the original design came from a programmer and then the marketing people got involved and plastered it with trademark symbols.

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

[Luca Rescigno]

I don't think most people will see the Server Edition boot screen much, though. Servers usually stay up for months at a time.

Not that it excuses the bad design, but it's not as big a deal as with the consumer versions.

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by Luca Rescigno 

I don't think most people will see the Server Edition boot screen much, though. Servers usually stay up for months at a time.

Reminds me of those Microsoft commercials. Bunch of IT guys celebrating because they didn't have to manage the server over the weekend. Microsoft pulled it pretty quick. A server managing to stay up for 2 days without rebooting is not an accomplishment.

[ort888]

If you were a designer you would understand how a screen like that came into be.

Your job as a designer is not to make good design, but to rather make the best design you can given whatever horrible limitations are placed on you.

Or rather, that has been my experience.

[boy8cookie]

Originally Posted by ort888 

If you were a designer you would understand how a screen like that came into be.

Your job as a designer is not to make good design, but to rather make the best design you can given whatever horrible limitations are placed on you.

Or rather, that has been my experience.

is that your excuse for your sig image

[driven]

Originally Posted by ::maroma:: 

Either way we've come to the conclusion that MS will never change in this regard (unless they have a complete philosophy change as a company). Its best to just point and laugh, rather than try to figure out how and why.

[analogue SPRINKLES]

Originally Posted by Atheist 

I think you hit then nail right on the head. I would wager the original design came from a programmer and then the marketing people got involved and plastered it with trademark symbols.

Bingo. I did work for MS in 2000 and they always put marketing first and branding first.

I just finished designing a Windows mobile App for MS and they way they work is the create almost the entire program in code FIRST and then at the last minute they realize they have to bring in a designer to put some lipstick on it. The design, user experience and feel of the app are all the least important and the last step, and are usually lead by a programmer that has been assigned creative director.

Then a large group of people all give their opinions on what colours they like and they decide by majority vote.

[Eug]

A friend of mine was getting a site done for his business. I told him to hire a designer and a programmer right from the beginning. He told me no, cuz it would cost 3X as much as the freshly-graduated coder he got. So I told him to get a young designer cuz at least he'd be way better at design than some coder-geek. Or in the very least, just get someone to periodically degeekify his work as it progressed. He refused. I said fine, as it was his money not mine.

3 weeks later I got an email from him with the URL. I went to the site... and told him the site sucked. He then showed me all the neat gadgetry on the site. I then told him that's fine but useless - too gimmicky and repetitive, and more importantly I couldn't actually find the content I'd be looking for, and it suffered from serious problems such as basic page element alignments being totally off if you just happened to just change browsers.

Anyways, fast forward one month later... A new ad exec type became a board member in the company... and told him the site sucked. They didn't have a lot of money to play with so they couldn't hire a good designer, but at least the ad exec knew some design basics, and helped the coder revamp the site. Now it's a boring but functional site, with no coder geek crap mucking it up. As basic as it became, it was a heluvalot more functional than the first site.

[analogue SPRINKLES]

Ya that is a rather typical story as I see that happen all the time.

[Tomchu]

I'm surprised no one has brought this up ...

There's no such thing as "Windows XP Server Edition". That screenshot is a fake -- and a bad one at that.

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by Tomchu 

I'm surprised no one has brought this up ...

There's no such thing as "Windows XP Server Edition". That screenshot is a fake -- and a bad one at that.

It's just some kid's homemade boot screen for Windows XP. (You can use any image for the boot screen in Windows). But let's face it, the default Windows XP boot screen looks exactly the same.

For anyone that actually expends even a second of their life giving a flying F what the boot screen looks like, that is.

[Tiresias]

Originally Posted by Tomchu 

I'm surprised no one has brought this up ...

There's no such thing as "Windows XP Server Edition". That screenshot is a fake -- and a bad one at that.

Huh? There's not? All I know is that this is what I see on the startup screen on my PC at work.

But if you're right, I guess all those copyrights were to no avail.

[Tomchu]

The "Home" and "Professional" text under the "Windows XP" label hasn't been there since SP1 or SP2 (I can't remember). And when it was there, the font did match. :-P

But yeah, the rest of it is just plain ridiculous.

[ironknee]

i hope i don't piss anyone off but to me it's a classic case of tech people design.

i run into programmers all the time that think they can design. it's really sad.

[hayesk]

Originally Posted by olePigeon 

The ironic part is that Microsoft knows how bad they are at it, they even went as far as to make a joke video about Microsoft designing the iPod packaging. They just don't care.

Microsoft didn't make that video. Though rumor has it one of their ad agencies did.

[King Bob On The Cob]

Originally Posted by Tiresias 

Huh? There's not? All I know is that this is what I see on the startup screen on my PC at work.

But if you're right, I guess all those copyrights were to no avail.

There's XP Home, Professional, Media Center, Tablet PC edition, plus x64 of Professional (and tablet?) then 2000 Professional, Server, Advanced Server, and Datacenter Server [I did not know about that last one actually, thanks wiki!] and 2003 Server (and several varients on this, mostly matching 2000 along with a clustering server edition). No XP Server.

Microsoft really needs to simplify, jeez. Even I didn't know it was this bad.

[Tiresias]

Originally Posted by King Bob On The Cob 

There's XP Home, Professional, Media Center, Tablet PC edition, plus x64 of Professional (and tablet?) then 2000 Professional, Server, Advanced Server, and Datacenter Server [I did not know about that last one actually, thanks wiki!] and 2003 Server (and several varients on this, mostly matching 2000 along with a clustering server edition). No XP Server.

Microsoft really needs to simplify, jeez. Even I didn't know it was this bad.

It doesn't really make a difference about there being no "Server Edition" (I just grabbed the image off GIS) because everything I said still applies to their logo-thingy below which is (until you customize) everywhere: bootscreen, screen saver, desktop image. And it's f**king disgusting. Just look at that ® crammed between the S and XP and tell me it is not a complete aesthetic abortion.

[MacosNerd]

So you are free to no use it, or ignore the splash screens.

Life is too short to get worked up about a company putting copyright/trademark symbols on a splash screen

[Oisín]

Life is made up of things life is too short for.

[Tiresias]

Originally Posted by MacosNerd 

So you are free to no use it, or ignore the splash screens.

Life is too short to get worked up about a company putting copyright/trademark symbols on a splash screen

In an ideal world I am free to ignore the logo of Microsoft. In this one, it is everywhere.

[Randman]

Thread should say web designers, btw.

[alligator]

Every item on that starting screen, except the copyright notice, is there for trademark protection. Under trademark law, you must "use it or lose it" so they dumped all of their trademarks on that screen to show they were still being used. Pretty bad design if you ask me.

[andreas_g4]

This design has 95% market share. It obviously is the better design.

[adamfishercox]

"This worries me."

[design219]

Sometimes, the unexpected happens. Last week I was asked to sit in on the annual master safety committee meeting for a company we just designed a new logo and identity system for. This was a committee of employees from offices all over the country to discuss ways to improve safety. After a couple hours of hashing out various problems, they decided to go out and look at the prototype truck graphics we designed.

I listened in silence while they talked about all the things that were wrong with the graphics, mostly to do with all the "safety messages" not being big/bold/bright enough. I heard a lot of "I really like it, but do you think 'this' or 'that' stands out enough?" You could just see almost every one of them trying as hard as they could to find something to criticize.

After the meeting, the project leader from our firm talked to the company president to ask if we need to put a hold on the huge fleet graphics order because the safety committee has some concerns. He said ABSOLUTELY NOT!, they are not making those decisions, the design is exactly what it needs to be, what we already approved and completely safe.

I was very impressed.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by design219 

I was very impressed.

Make that two of us.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by andreas_g4 

This design has 95% market share. It obviously is the better design.

Game. Set. Match.

[angelmb]

This design has 95% market share. It obviously works.

Fixinated®©™®©™®©™®©™®©™®© ™®©™®©™®©™®©™®©™®©™

[analogue SPRINKLES]

™

[ironknee]

Originally Posted by andreas_g4 

This design has 95% market share. It obviously is the better design.

i doubt people buy windows because of their design. and just because it has 95% market share doesn't mean it's a better design.

[Dakar the Fourth]

Originally Posted by ironknee 

i doubt people buy windows because of their design. and just because it has 95% market share doesn't mean it's a better design.

i doubt he was serious.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES 

This is what happens when the company is run by programmers and marketing.

LOL, as compared to what at Apple ?

I would have said that Apple is MORE run by Marketing than M$.

-t