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mattyb · Sep 5, 2010, 07:33 AM

Mafia cash in on lucrative EU wind farm handouts.

The EU hasn't had it accounts signed off by external auditors in over 10 years.

olePigeon · Sep 5, 2010, 11:39 AM

I'm trying to see how any of it is different than what politicians do, but I can't. Oh, I get it. The mafia bribes officials, politicians lobby. It's completely different.

turtle777 · Sep 5, 2010, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by olePigeon

I'm trying to see how any of it is different than what politicians do, but I can't. Oh, I get it. The mafia bribes officials, politicians lobby. It's completely different.

Another example of why the governments need to stay the fuçk out of businesses and the economy.

As soon as you have a big pot of honey (i.e. subsidies, grants etc...), there'll be criminals defrauding the governments hand over fist.

It's just so laughable to think that governments could do ANYTHING more efficiently than private sector companies. Any- and everything governments do will be more inefficient; the fraud, waste and abuse, on top of incompetent administrators and ignorant politicians will make sure that for every $1 spent, you get the economic effect of 10 cents.

-t

brassplayersrock² · Sep 5, 2010, 04:57 PM

I thought this thread would be about farting.

iMOTOR · Sep 5, 2010, 05:09 PM

Originally Posted by turtle777

Another example of why the governments need to stay the fuçk out of businesses and the economy.

word

mattyb · Sep 6, 2010, 10:12 AM

The Panama Canal was pretty well done don't you think Turtle?

turtle777 · Sep 6, 2010, 10:41 AM

Originally Posted by mattyb

The Panama Canal was pretty well done don't you think Turtle?

I don't know enough details. Was it as good of a deal for Panama as it was for the US ?

-t

mattyb · Sep 6, 2010, 02:49 PM

Digressing from my original post, but there is also inefficiency, fraud, waste and abuse, on top of incompetent administrators and ignorant managers in the private sector. Government does not have a monopoly on these traits. I have worked with some very competent government workers and I have worked with very incompetent people in very large multi-nationals.

turtle777 · Sep 6, 2010, 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by mattyb

Digressing from my original post, but there is also inefficiency, fraud, waste and abuse, on top of incompetent administrators and ignorant managers in the private sector.

So what ? Shareholders can vote with their feet. If the company continues, it should go bankrupt. The free market has wonderful mechanisms to deal with inefficiencies. The problem is, government has no freaking accountability and pressure to be efficient. If they waste money, they just collect more taxes. It's a horribly broken system.

-t

The Final Dakar · Sep 6, 2010, 05:02 PM

Originally Posted by turtle777

Shareholders can vote with their feet.

So can citizens, or so I'm repeatedly told in the PL.

besson3c · Sep 6, 2010, 11:47 PM

Originally Posted by turtle777

So what ? Shareholders can vote with their feet. If the company continues, it should go bankrupt. The free market has wonderful mechanisms to deal with inefficiencies. The problem is, government has no freaking accountability and pressure to be efficient. If they waste money, they just collect more taxes. It's a horribly broken system.

-t

Why do politicians bother with re-elections then?

turtle777 · Sep 7, 2010, 12:23 AM

Originally Posted by besson3c

Why do politicians bother with re-elections then?

They clearly don't, because you have the same losers on both sides, Dems as well as Reps.

Right now, the American people have the choice between pest and cholera when it comes to politicians. The government, i.e. the political elite, has gained so much power that they will do whatever it takes to stay in power. They don't care about the people nor the country.

-t

besson3c · Sep 7, 2010, 12:36 AM

Originally Posted by turtle777

They clearly don't, because you have the same losers on both sides, Dems as well as Reps.

Right now, the American people have the choice between pest and cholera when it comes to politicians. The government, i.e. the political elite, has gained so much power that they will do whatever it takes to stay in power. They don't care about the people nor the country.

-t

Do you support limits on campaign donations?

mattyb · Sep 7, 2010, 04:42 AM

Originally Posted by turtle777

So what ? Shareholders can vote with their feet. If the company continues, it should go bankrupt. The free market has wonderful mechanisms to deal with inefficiencies. The problem is, government has no freaking accountability and pressure to be efficient. If they waste money, they just collect more taxes. It's a horribly broken system.

You just refuse to see any good in gov and any bad in free markets. You do understand that a market is only free because some entity, usually a government, has 'interferred' in some way to make it free don't you? You seem to think that free markets are near perfect. You seem to forget that humans are far from perfect, in a free market or not.

And sometimes shareholders cannot always vote with their feet, tracker type funds for example have obligations to invest in the top 10 oil companies or the top 100 companies on a certain exchange. They cannot always sell. And you only brought up shareholders, what about the clients of those companies? I recall a matra about 15 years ago that the customer was always right. We have long forgotten the customer. now the shareholders (and senior management) are more important. In well run companies, that think about the customer first, you don't have unhappy shareholders, and you often find that senior management haven't given themselves large bonuses or stock options.