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App Store doesn't offer Paypal option.
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Dec 6, 2010, 09:11 PM
 
Anyone know why?

(cut my credit cards)
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Dec 6, 2010, 09:14 PM
 
Because PayPal are a bunch of dicks?
Been inclined to wander... off the beaten track.
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Dec 6, 2010, 09:16 PM
 
Because Paypal sucks.
     
dzp111  (op)
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Dec 6, 2010, 09:25 PM
 
Is there then a better option? As far as I know, the credit cards companies rob me blind on an hourly basis.
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Dec 6, 2010, 09:37 PM
 
Because PayPal is not a real bank, is not regulated like a bank, and has arbitrary rules on conflict resolution.

This is why Apple and other real businesses don't accept PayPal.

You should have kept one credit card and learned to control your spending. Or, go get a card with a zero dollar limit and add funds to it.
     
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Dec 6, 2010, 10:04 PM
 
Originally Posted by dzp111 View Post
Is there then a better option? As far as I know, the credit cards companies rob me blind on an hourly basis.
Then use an iTunes prepaid card.
     
dzp111  (op)
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Dec 6, 2010, 10:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by hayesk View Post
Because PayPal is not a real bank, is not regulated like a bank, and has arbitrary rules on conflict resolution.

This is why Apple and other real businesses don't accept PayPal.

You should have kept one credit card and learned to control your spending. Or, go get a card with a zero dollar limit and add funds to it.
Thanks hayesk, that sounds like a plan. Although, who suggested that I had spending control issues? My issue is purely with overblown interest rates.

: )
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Dec 6, 2010, 10:19 PM
 
Apple has a commitment and partnership with iTunes, Apps and Music are paid with a Credit Card listed/assigned to your iTunes account used to purchase songs/etc. Yes, Apple and itunes are two separate companies, having one option (credit card) makes purchasing through iTunes part of a user friendly smooth experience...
     
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Dec 6, 2010, 10:23 PM
 
I don’t know what it’s like up there, but almost all banks down here offer a Visa/MC linked to your checking account.
     
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Dec 6, 2010, 10:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by dzp111 View Post
Thanks hayesk, that sounds like a plan. Although, who suggested that I had spending control issues? My issue is purely with overblown interest rates.
How do overblown interest rates affect you if you zero every month?
Been inclined to wander... off the beaten track.
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dzp111  (op)
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Dec 6, 2010, 11:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
How do overblown interest rates affect you if you zero every month?
Touché.

Thanks guys.
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Dec 7, 2010, 12:47 AM
 
Yeah, I have my iTunes account linked to a debit card. No interest to worry about.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 01:27 AM
 
Originally Posted by aepple View Post
Yes, Apple and itunes are two separate companies.
Huh?

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Dec 7, 2010, 02:02 AM
 
Because when Paypal charges a small fee per charge and you're having millions of purchases a day, it adds up quickly.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 02:42 AM
 
Visa AMEX MC and Discover charge a small fee to merchants too.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 02:45 AM
 
Obviously, that's how they make money from vendors. But it's not as large per purchase as Paypal (although AMEX is close).
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 02:49 AM
 
AMEX is pretty high unless you’re Costco.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 02:57 AM
 
You people are a joke. You have no idea why Apple doesn't have PayPal setup. PayPal is becoming more and more prominent all the time, and MANY (the majority?) of the largest retailers offer PayPal as a payment option. It is getting less and less frequent that PayPal *isn't* given as an option for making a purchase. Their processing fee's are bit larger than a normal merchant account for small retailers, but big companies doing big business get to negotiate their rates down.

My own guess as to why they don't allow it? Well, it is for the exact same reason that they do everything else: they want total control. When you accept PayPal payments you lose some control (you don't get the actual cc numbers, you don't have access to the actual authorization code, and you can't see your customers' other private information). I can't see Apple letting something like that happen anytime soon.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 03:04 AM
 
If we're such a joke, why do you just come in here with your "own guess?"
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 03:07 AM
 
If you don't like credit card interest try paying it off every month... or do what I do, always over pay. I always buy EVERYTHING on my Visa and I make sure generally that there is over a hundred dollars extra on it because it'll eventually get spent.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 04:48 AM
 
I just tried purchasing 2 books through Amazon.ca and they don't do the Paypal thing neither.

I emailed them, I said: "I wish you'd do the Paypal thing"
To which they replied: "sorry, but we don't"
To which I re-replied: "Your loss".

So today I was geared up to affordably buy 1 app and 2 books but couldn't because, essentially, the companies in question do not favour the way I present them my money in my bank account.

Certainly not my loss..
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Dec 7, 2010, 06:21 AM
 
Not your loss if you've bought them elsewhere, of course.

I'm sure they're not exactly crying themselves to sleep over not having to deal with PayPal either, though.

I'm also not sure how you figure that a service that bills by percentage PLUS a flat $0.30 fee on every transaction is of ANY interest to anybody routinely dealing with transactions smaller than $10.

You want to pay for a $0.99 app with PayPal? Apple will be happy to oblige - that'll be $1.30, please. Let's hear you whining then.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 06:46 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
Not your loss if you've bought them elsewhere, of course.

I'm sure they're not exactly crying themselves to sleep over not having to deal with PayPal either, though. I'm also not sure how you figure that a service that bills by percentage PLUS a flat $0.30 fee on every transaction is of ANY interest to anybody routinely dealing with transactions smaller than $10.
See, now I didn't know that (my brain tends to avoid fine print)

You want to pay for a $0.99 app with PayPal? Apple will be happy to oblige - that'll be $1.30, please.
Plus 13% Canadian tax.. But, a same (book) costs $10.00 more at Chapters than it does at Amazon, so I won't be going there. My best price is with Amazon, so to compare Paypal's fees with retail store price, for me well that's a no-brainer (where books are concerned).

Let's hear you whining then.
Not whining. But if I do sound whiny, it's probably because that I can't seem to spend my money, making someone else money from it, the way I choose to do so. That's what sucks a little.

At the end of the day though, I will find the best deal that offers what I want for how much I want it for. No Visa-no purchase? No Amazon-no purchase? No prob. But I will find a way to spend my money the way I want to. Eventually..Hopefully.
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Dec 7, 2010, 07:41 AM
 
Don't bank accounts exist in your country?

I can enable companies to automatically deduct billable amounts from my account, if I don't want to use a CC (we don't actually *have* credit cards over here, since cards are generally zeroed automatically at the end of the month, with a flat yearly fee rather than interest, but whatever), or I can transfer the money in advance. That adds a couple days to the order, but for the paranoid, it keeps their minds at rest.

Also, I see that it IS your loss, as you're resigned to either spending $10 more, or not getting it at all, right?

Originally Posted by dzp111 View Post
See, now I didn't know that (my brain tends to avoid fine print)
Minimal common sense ("hmm, I wonder why they don't accept PayPal? Money, perhaps?") and five seconds of googling ("Paypal transaction fees").
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 08:17 AM
 
PayPal sucks. You may not get burned as a casual user of it for occasional purchases, but the company isn't to be trusted. Just look online at their practices and you'll find plenty of reasons to ditch it and plenty of sites dedicated to singing its demerits.

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Dec 7, 2010, 02:17 PM
 
Aren't you paying fees to Paypal when money gets put into your Paypal account? I would imagine it costs more to maintain a Paypal accoutn then it does to have a credit card that you use intelligently.

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Dec 7, 2010, 02:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by torsoboy View Post
You people are a joke. You have no idea why Apple doesn't have PayPal setup. PayPal is becoming more and more prominent all the time, and MANY (the majority?) of the largest retailers offer PayPal as a payment option.
We're a joke? Are you a merchant? Are you familiar with the regulations surrounding credit card processing companies as compared to Paypal? I'll repeat - credit card processing companies are bound by banking regulations and there are strict rules to deal with conflict resolution. Paypal is not subject to these regulations and arbitrarily applies decisions when there are conflicts.
It is getting less and less frequent that PayPal *isn't* given as an option for making a purchase. Their processing fee's are bit larger than a normal merchant account for small retailers, but big companies doing big business get to negotiate their rates down.
I don't think the fees are the problem.
My own guess as to why they don't allow it? Well, it is for the exact same reason that they do everything else: they want total control. When you accept PayPal payments you lose some control (you don't get the actual cc numbers, you don't have access to the actual authorization code, and you can't see your customers' other private information). I can't see Apple letting something like that happen anytime soon.
Your tinfoil hat is loose. You use your AppleID to make purchases - they have your information anyway. And there's an option to not allow Apple to store your credit card information - it's illegal for them to keep it secretly.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 02:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by dzp111 View Post
I just tried purchasing 2 books through Amazon.ca and they don't do the Paypal thing neither.

I emailed them, I said: "I wish you'd do the Paypal thing"
To which they replied: "sorry, but we don't"
To which I re-replied: "Your loss".

So today I was geared up to affordably buy 1 app and 2 books but couldn't because, essentially, the companies in question do not favour the way I present them my money in my bank account.

Certainly not my loss..
Not really the vendors either. Picture this scenario:
10 people come to my store to buy something using Paypal. If I don't accept Paypal, 9 people will say "OK, I'll just use my VISA" and one person will buy elsewhere. So, is it worth it to sacrifice one sale to not have to deal with Paypal for the other 9, I'd say yes.

At my place of business, we don't accept American Express for a similar reason. If 10 people bought with AMEX, we'd pay 10 transaction fees that are much higher than VISA or MC. But since we don't accept AMEX, 9 people just use their VISA, and we lose one sale. The profit lost from the one sale is less than the difference in 10 transaction fees.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 04:09 PM
 
Get a PayPal debit card and use that?
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 04:30 PM
 
I think I'm missing the point of not using a debit card? It's not like Paypal offers much in the way of consumer protection policies either...
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 04:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by dzp111 View Post
My issue is purely with overblown interest rates.

: )
Don't keep a balance. Is that so hard?

-t
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 04:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
Don't bank accounts exist in your country?

I can enable companies to automatically deduct billable amounts from my account, if I don't want to use a CC (we don't actually *have* credit cards over here, since cards are generally zeroed automatically at the end of the month, with a flat yearly fee rather than interest, but whatever), or I can transfer the money in advance. That adds a couple days to the order, but for the paranoid, it keeps their minds at rest.
[
Merchants in the US don't offer direct debit.
I wouldn't give them my bank account information anyways.

The banking system in the US is very different from Germany. MAny things that work in Germany don't work at all in the US.

You are also wrong about true credit cards in Germany. They do exist, but are not common. Credit Cards in Germany is mostly what a standard American Express no balance card is in the US.

-t
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 05:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
How do overblown interest rates affect you if you zero every month?
If you zero every month it hurts your credit score.
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Dec 7, 2010, 06:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
If you zero every month it hurts your credit score.
Total BS.
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Dec 7, 2010, 06:51 PM
 
Art is right.

-t
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 06:52 PM
 
I have two credit cards that I zero every month, never had a late payment for either credit, rent, or bills, and my credit score still keeps going down. I have zero collections, no canceled cards, no unused cards. My pickup is completely payed off without a single late payment. I used to be at 820 and over the past 3 or 4 years it's dropped to 730 and still dropping.

The reason, I was told (by my card issuer and my realtor), is that maintaining a zero balance on a card hurts your credit score. Your credit score goes up based on how much of your available credit is used in relation to how much is available, and maintaining a zero balance indicates you are not utilizing the credit, and therefor, hurts yours core.
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Dec 7, 2010, 06:55 PM
 
That makes absolutely no sense at all.

It's not the first time I've heard that perpetuated though.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 06:55 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
and maintaining a zero balance indicates you are not utilizing the credit, and therefor, hurts yours core.
This is simply not true.

The exact day when your credit card balance is communicated to the credit rating agencies can vary.
It is DEFINITELY not the day you just paid off your card. Or if it is, it's a one-time coincidence.

I pay off my credit cards every month, and my credit reports ALWAYS show those cards with a balance. Because there was a intra-month balance at the point in time when they got the data.

-t
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 07:20 PM
 
^ This.

There are a lot of ways for your credit score to fall even if you always pay in full and on time. If you made a big purchase one month that uses up most of your available credit lines, and your balance gets reported by the card company before you pay it, then you might get dinged for using up so much of your available credit.

If the credit limit on one of your cards gets lowered (as was happening to some people at the height of the financial crisis), it could hurt your score, since the report will show you using more of your available credit.

Also, if you have recently applied for new lines of credit, your score may be temporarily hit.

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Dec 7, 2010, 07:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
My pickup is completely payed off without a single late payment.
That will lower your score since you no longer have a current loan in good standing.

Your credit score goes up based on how much of your available credit is used in relation to how much is available
The opposite is what's true.
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Dec 7, 2010, 07:32 PM
 
I need to see a few links to articles in peer-reviewed scientific journals before I'll believe this hokey scheme you guys are trying to pull on olePigeon.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 07:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
That will lower your score since you no longer have a current loan in good standing.
Uh, what are you on? Unless you think that OldPigeon is a 14 year old with his first credit card, that won't be true.
     
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Dec 7, 2010, 07:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Uh, what are you on? Unless you think that OldPigeon is a 14 year old with his first credit card, that won't be true.
Of course it is true. If your ONLY non-revolving loan goes away, your score will take a hit. Because in that category, you will get a 0 score for the lack of information.

-t
     
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Dec 8, 2010, 01:50 AM
 
Art said olePigeon doesn't have a current loan, which seems to be awfully assuming of him. And it won't LOWER your score, you just won't have information for that part.
     
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Dec 8, 2010, 04:00 AM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
If we're such a joke, why do you just come in here with your "own guess?"
Well, the primary difference between my answer and the ones before mine (including yours specifically) was that the ones before mine answered as if they had the inside information from Apple as to why they don't accept PayPal. Mine was clearly an opinion/guess.

Originally Posted by hayesk View Post
We're a joke? Are you a merchant? Are you familiar with the regulations surrounding credit card processing companies as compared to Paypal? I'll repeat - credit card processing companies are bound by banking regulations and there are strict rules to deal with conflict resolution. Paypal is not subject to these regulations and arbitrarily applies decisions when there are conflicts.
Yes, I am a merchant, and yes I am very familiar with the regulations surrounding credit card processing. And, yes, I am very familiar with the credit card conflict resolution process (and let me tell you, it is very arbitrary). Do you *really* think that you know more about this than retailers such as Walmart, Sports Authority, Barnes & Noble, Calvin Klein, Timberland, Newegg, Sears, American Eagle, Nike, Best Buy, etc. that all accept PayPal as a payment option?

But, guess what? I just checked iTunes, and they also accept PayPal as a payment option. With iTunes accepting PayPal as a payment option now, I do not think it will be much longer before the Apple.com store does too.

I am shocked that iTunes allows you to fund your purchases with PayPal, but I'm willing to accept the fact that my guess was wrong about them wanting control. Maybe the rest of you can admit that your PayPal knowledge is a bit out of date now?
     
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Dec 8, 2010, 04:25 AM
 
Originally Posted by hayesk View Post
Paypal is not subject to these regulations and arbitrarily applies decisions when there are conflicts.
Let me tell you about a situation that happened to us recently, and then you can decide just how arbitrary credit card conflict resolutions are:

We ran a transaction for some personal photographs for a customer. The photographs were shipped to the supplied address. The customer submitted a chargeback request to their credit card provider claiming they never received the order. After we received notice of the chargeback, the customer was contacted about this and they realized that they had given an incorrect shipping address, and that is why they didn't receive the order. So a new set of photographs was sent out to their correct address (at no additional charge to them), and they called up their credit card provider and told them that they wanted them to disregard the chargeback. In the meantime, our company was required to respond to the chargeback, and we answered it honestly and said that the customer had provided an incorrect address and that they had already contacted their cc provider and asked them to stop the chargeback process. A few week later we got a letter stating that our rebuttal was denied. So the customer was called again, and they called their cc provider again, and their provider said that they already had stopped the chargeback weeks ago and that all we needed to do was request the money again. So we submitted our second set of dispute documentation to the processing bank and we laid out the facts again and even included a note from the customer saying that the chargeback should be reversed, and that if they would call the cc provider they would confirm that the chargeback had been stopped. Two weeks later we received a second letter stating that our request was denied and that they are very sorry but there are no additional steps that can be taken on the chargeback.

Sound non-arbitrary? Hardly. Two sets of images were sent and the customer admitted it was their mistake, but in the end we paid $30 for the chargeback and we lost all of the money from the sale because some ********* decided they didn't want to allow the dispute to go through. Sometimes the process works very smoothly and chargebacks are handled very easily, and sometimes they are not. I have even had a dispute denied by one representative, but then accepted by another when I called in about it. Every single dispute is handled by a live person... if the person is in a bad mood you have to deal with that, and if they are in a helpful mood things get done quickly and easily.
( Last edited by torsoboy; Dec 8, 2010 at 12:34 PM. )
     
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Dec 8, 2010, 04:45 AM
 
Originally Posted by torsoboy View Post
Let me tell you about a situation that happened to us recently, and then you can decide just how arbitrary credit card conflict resolutions are:

We ran a transaction for some personal photographs for a customer. The photographs were shipped to the supplied address. The customer submitted a chargeback request to their credit card provider claiming they never received the order. After we received notice of the chargeback, the customer was contacted about this and they realized that they had given an incorrect shipping address, and that is why they didn't receive the order. So a new set of photographs was sent out to their correct address (at no additional charge to them), and they called up their credit card provider and told them that they wanted them to disregard the chargeback. In the meantime, our company was required to respond to the chargeback, and we answered it honestly and said that the customer had provided an incorrect address and that they had already contacted their cc provider and asked them to stop the chargeback process. A few week later we got a letter stating that our rebuttal was denied. So the customer was called again, and they called their cc provider again, and their provider said that they already had stopped the chargeback weeks ago and that all we needed to do was request the money again. So we submitted our second set of dispute documentation to the processing bank and we laid out the facts again and even included a note from the customer saying that the chargeback should be reversed, and that if they would call the cc provider they would confirm that the chargeback had been stopped. Two weeks later we received a second letter stating that our request was denied and that they are very sorry but there are no additional steps that can be taken on the chargeback.

Sound arbitrary? Hardly. Two sets of images were sent and the customer admitted it was their mistake, but in the end we paid $30 for the chargeback and we lost all of the money from the sale because some ********* decided they didn't want to allow the dispute to go through. Sometimes the process works very smoothly and chargebacks are handled very easily, and sometimes they are not. I have even had a dispute denied by one representative, but then accepted by another when I called in about it. Every single dispute is handled by a live person... if the person is in a bad mood you have to deal with that, and if they are in a helpful mood things get done quickly and easily.
Are we able to compare the above scenario with Paypal's chain of bulls? Do you use it at all?
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Dec 8, 2010, 06:52 AM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Art said olePigeon doesn't have a current loan, which seems to be awfully assuming of him.
Well, olePigeon's post pretty much made it sound like he paid off his only installment loan.

Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
I have two credit cards that I zero every month, never had a late payment for either credit, rent, or bills, and my credit score still keeps going down. I have zero collections, no canceled cards, no unused cards. My pickup is completely payed off without a single late payment. I used to be at 820 and over the past 3 or 4 years it's dropped to 730 and still dropping.
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Dec 8, 2010, 10:31 AM
 
Oh, reading FAIL.
     
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Dec 8, 2010, 01:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Art said olePigeon doesn't have a current loan, which seems to be awfully assuming of him. And it won't LOWER your score, you just won't have information for that part.
If you don't have any current data in one of the categories that is part of the score, then your score will be lower. It won't be as low as someone with negative info but it will be less than someone with positive info.
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