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Dee and Dee Nerds Unite!
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Clinically Insane
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Jan 22, 2013, 06:00 PM
 
Hasbro, Wizards, whoever... has finally seen the errors of their ways. Looks like most of the catalog.

Dungeons & Dragons Classics - Every edition available again
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 22, 2013, 06:07 PM
 
Whoops. Massive gaps. Guess I got a little caught up in all the excitement.
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 22, 2013, 06:28 PM
 
Easier to talk about what's there rather than what's missing. About 90 PDFs so far. Scraping the bottom of the barrel I was only able to blow $200.

Not a garbage selection though, by any means. Saltmarsh series is there. The B series is there, but missing B10. WTF? GDQ series and the Temple of Elemental Evil too, with Hommlet the meat grinder available separately.

Very thin on core books. Pre 3e there's only Moldavay Basic, 1e Fiend Folio and 1e Manual of the Planes. Though it should be said you can do a lot with Moldavay Basic IMO.

I'll report back on the quality of the PDFs.


As an aside, they (very wisely) licensed the DTRPG/RPGNOW storefront, so if you already have an account, you can use it.
     
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Jan 22, 2013, 07:23 PM
 
TEE is one of my favorites, by far. In fact we ran that ~2 years ago, still has a suitably epic feel for an intermediate setting/module. With occasional stoppages due to life circumstances, we've been running the same game, a massively tweaked 1.5Ed rule-set, for >18 years (same 5 people, with new folks added and dropped along the way). In fact, the ranger/MU I play now is the gr-gr-grandson of one of my first characters (who has passed on into myth and is now a demigod in that realm). We've tinkered with 4th Ed rules, but always fallback to the tried and tested game. For us it simply flows better. The supplements and modifications we've incorporated span ~1500 pages in pdf format, and occupy 12 binders.

Word is they'll eventually release it all, but it will be a gradual process.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
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Jan 22, 2013, 07:32 PM
 
Wow, that brings back memories.

I got the first or second (not sure which- it was blue and black duotone) boxed set for Christmas back in the '70s, and for the next decade, at least one of those hardcovers was on every birthday and Christmas list I wrote. I might still have a few of those crappy original dice, too- you had to rub a crayon over the numbers to be able to read them, and the corners flaked off until the d12 and d20 turned into spheres.

Fiend Folio was awesome, but my friends hated it- said the monsters were too hard. I even had Deities and Demigods, which was awesome because there were a couple of bare-breasted goddesses in there, although one had a crab head or something like that.
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 22, 2013, 07:38 PM
 
Didn't matter. Saw boobs.
     
Clinically Insane
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Jan 22, 2013, 07:48 PM
 
You weren't a real "playa" unless you had the Deities and Demigods 1st print, w/ the Cthulhu mythos, and the ever contentious Oriental Adventures, which destroyed all semblance of game balance in a traditional campaign. "Oh, you want to play a wu-jen/monk?" [DM adjusts module difficulty up 5 levels to compensate]
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Jan 22, 2013, 07:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
Didn't matter. Saw boobs.
Yep.
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 22, 2013, 07:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
TEE is one of my favorites, by far. In fact we ran that ~2 years ago, still has a suitably epic feel for an intermediate setting/module. With occasional stoppages due to life circumstances, we've been running the same game, a massively tweaked 1.5Ed rule-set, for >18 years (same 5 people, with new folks added and dropped along the way). In fact, the ranger/MU I play now is the gr-gr-grandson of one of my first characters (who has passed on into myth and is now a demigod in that realm). We've tinkered with 4th Ed rules, but always fallback to the tried and tested game. For us it simply flows better. The supplements and modifications we've incorporated span ~1500 pages in pdf format, and occupy 12 binders.

Word is they'll eventually release it all, but it will be a gradual process.
I've never read TToE, but I have it buried somewhere. Hommlet on the other hand, holds a special place in my heart.

We were far too young to realize the point was to build a strike team of villagers, and just throw a first level party at the "abandoned" keep and watch them get shredded.

Good times.
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 22, 2013, 07:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
You weren't a real "playa" unless you had the Deities and Demigods 1st print, w/ the Cthulhu mythos, and the ever contentious Oriental Adventures, which destroyed all semblance of game balance in a traditional campaign. "Oh, you want to play a wu-jen/monk?" [DM adjusts module difficulty up 5 levels to compensate]
Had 'em both. Commence everyone wanting Stormbringer and ninjas.
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 22, 2013, 08:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by raleur View Post
Wow, that brings back memories.

I got the first or second (not sure which- it was blue and black duotone) boxed set for Christmas back in the '70s, and for the next decade, at least one of those hardcovers was on every birthday and Christmas list I wrote. I might still have a few of those crappy original dice, too- you had to rub a crayon over the numbers to be able to read them, and the corners flaked off until the d12 and d20 turned into spheres.

Fiend Folio was awesome, but my friends hated it- said the monsters were too hard. I even had Deities and Demigods, which was awesome because there were a couple of bare-breasted goddesses in there, although one had a crab head or something like that.
We hated the Fiend Folio too, but more because it was so weird, and the Russ Nicholson art.

I have since realized Nicholson is a genius, but it was too gritty for my young mind.

Even if you don't buy "genius", his (and Dave Trampier's) technical skill is pretty astounding.

Erol Otus too, but that mother****er was clearly on something.

I mean, it was the 70s, everybody was, but he must have had some extra special stash going on.
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 22, 2013, 08:09 PM
 
Here's some Nicholson from the Fiend Folio:

     
subego  (op)
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Jan 22, 2013, 08:11 PM
 
And some classic Tramp:

     
subego  (op)
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Jan 22, 2013, 08:15 PM
 
And Otu... AHHHH! WTF?!?

     
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Jan 22, 2013, 08:43 PM
 
Thanks for the pics! Haven't seen those in ages.

Yes, Nicholson was (is?) awesome- I loved the darker touch, and spent untold hours trying to duplicate the style.

I also remember staring at the cover of the first Monster Manual, and wondering how that ever got to print.
     
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Jan 22, 2013, 11:20 PM
 
I loved the Fiend Folio. it introduced the Githyanki, the best inter-planar shock troops that gold can buy.

"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
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subego  (op)
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Jan 23, 2013, 06:46 AM
 
One of my faves, if not my fave. Created by Charlie "Accelerando" Stross BTW.
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 23, 2013, 09:12 AM
 
The scans... arent bad from my quick perusal. I had a very small collection when the PDFs originally got yanked, so I can't make a direct comparison.

I just may have torrented a zip file with everything TSR ever printed, but I have no idea where those scans came from.


See Hasbro? Pirates your shit because you're a **** up, still gives you money when you stop.
     
Clinically Insane
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Jan 24, 2013, 02:16 PM
 
Awesome. They're charging retail value for PDFs that don't cost any money to publish, and they're now charging $5 to $20 for 2nd edition modules that they previously had up for free on their website just a couple years ago.

Way to stick it to your customers, Hasbro! You're well on your way to learning the errors of your ways. I'm sure 5th Edition D&D won't have DRMed retail priced PDFs without free updates, either. Pfft. What does Paizo know with their low priced PDFs with unlimited free updates. It's not like they've become the leading D20 gaming system... oh wait.
"…I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
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Clinically Insane
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Jan 24, 2013, 02:17 PM
 
Incidentally, these are my desktop pics for my iphone if anyone wants them:

http://forums.macnn.com/103/ipod-iph...n/#post4213596

Scanned in from my Artwork of D&D book, then touched up with Photoshop to remove printing artifacts.
"…I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods,
you will understand why I dismiss yours." - Stephen F. Roberts
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 24, 2013, 02:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
Awesome. They're charging retail value for PDFs that don't cost any money to publish, and they're now charging $5 to $20 for 2nd edition modules that they previously had up for free on their website just a couple years ago.

Way to stick it to your customers, Hasbro! You're well on your way to learning the errors of your ways. I'm sure 5th Edition D&D won't have DRMed retail priced PDFs without free updates, either. Pfft. What does Paizo know with their low priced PDFs with unlimited free updates. It's not like they've become the leading D20 gaming system... oh wait.
Which ones are you talking about?

I have the entire pre-yank free collection. Which are they doubling on?

$5 may have been retail in 1982, but there's been a touch of inflation since then.
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 24, 2013, 03:11 PM
 
Also, got the first set of free updates yesterday, and anything you purchased pre-yank you get back for free when it's released.

I think they're doing a pretty decent job so far.
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 24, 2013, 04:39 PM
 
I mean, they probably will charge for the stuff they had for free, but I assume the scans will be better, and they're offering different stuff for free.

Grab it while it stays that way!

B1 In Search of the Unknown (Basic) - Wizards of the Coast | D&D Basic | Adventure Modules | D&D Basic | Dungeons & Dragons Classics
     
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Jan 24, 2013, 05:31 PM
 
Wow. It's been AGES since I've seen one of those.

OAW
     
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Jan 25, 2013, 12:27 PM
 
Here's what I was working on. I had started to make my own archives because Hasbro was only providing crappy scans. The new books are marginally better than the free books. I'm kinda proud of my take on it. I tracked down all the original fonts, OCRed the original sheets, combed through fixing mistakes (found a few original printed mistakes, left them in for posterity), scanned in the artwork and touched it up in Photoshop, made the AD&D logo from scratch (also have Oriental Adventures and Forgotten Realms, but I haven't finished the spell sheets so they're not in there yet), and even remade the barcode and stuff. Tried to make it as complete as possible.

http://www.wreckcenter.com/dnd/REF29028.pdf
"…I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods,
you will understand why I dismiss yours." - Stephen F. Roberts
     
subego  (op)
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Jan 25, 2013, 01:12 PM
 
That is highly illegal, and highly awesome!

I did the same thing with the front page of a BD&D character sheet (tracked down the fonts, etc.) but made slight modifications so it's AD&D compatible (field for race, and unarmored AC is 10 instead of 9). Also bought a ream of that thick cyan colored paper they printed it on.

I shall dig it up and join in on the festivities.
     
Clinically Insane
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Jan 25, 2013, 03:50 PM
 
If it's illegal, they didn't seem to care. I posted it on the Hasbro forums quite a while back for feedback.
"…I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods,
you will understand why I dismiss yours." - Stephen F. Roberts
     
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Feb 7, 2013, 10:47 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
Here's some Nicholson from the Fiend Folio:

It's mental that you can not see an image for over 20 (maybe nearly 30) years and suddenly it's "oh yeah I SO remember that.

So many sunny saturdays lost to sitting in a darkened room with several other socially challenged friends, having fun.
     
subego  (op)
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Feb 8, 2013, 08:55 AM
 
I think one of the things which resonates with that drawing (beyond Nicholson's style) is the monster is merely irritated by having its arm shredded off.
     
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Feb 8, 2013, 12:39 PM
 
It's a good point. His look is the same one you'd get if you grabbed his beer at a party.
     
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Feb 8, 2013, 04:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
I think one of the things which resonates with that drawing (beyond Nicholson's style) is the monster is merely irritated by having its arm shredded off.
Isn't that a revenant? They're nasty buggers, ie. Jason and Michael Myers are revenants.
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subego  (op)
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Feb 9, 2013, 06:44 PM
 
Party time! Excellent!

I was too lazy to look it up. I was thinking crypt thing, but revenant sounds closer.
     
subego  (op)
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Feb 9, 2013, 07:11 PM
 
Yup. Revenant. 8HD, paralyzation, and as depicted, severed limbs which continue the fight.

Also, neutral, which is odd for willful undead.
     
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Feb 12, 2013, 02:34 PM
 
The Revenant only exists until their mission is complete. The nature of the mission could be anything, including helping people (like if it was a nanny that failed to protect a child, she could become a Revenant protecting the family or other children.) So neutral is pretty appropriate in this case.
"…I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods,
you will understand why I dismiss yours." - Stephen F. Roberts
     
subego  (op)
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Feb 12, 2013, 09:19 PM
 
Shouldn't the revenant's alignment be any then?
     
subego  (op)
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Feb 13, 2013, 07:47 AM
 
I guess neutral isn't a bad fit for someone(thing) willing to use evil means by which to accomplish a good end.
     
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Feb 13, 2013, 04:07 PM
 
Necromancers don't have to be evil, I ran one for a long time that was LN. He was dispassionate about the dead and undead, much like a modern-day coroner or taxidermist. One side-effect was that most of his creations weren't savage monsters and were abnormally docile (which often caused complications). Most of the zombies and ghouls he created were practically vegetarians and would eventually "starve to death", and his golems took on his alignment as well (often championing the weak or enforcing the law). That was his focus, really, golems. In his later career they were so well made that you couldn't differentiate them from the living, except that they couldn't sleep and didn't breathe. He was a really fun character to play, very challenging.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
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Feb 25, 2013, 11:45 AM
 
"…I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods,
you will understand why I dismiss yours." - Stephen F. Roberts
     
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Mar 15, 2013, 06:16 PM
 
Dungeons & Dragons Roleplaying Game Official Home Page - Article (Pole Arm Quiz)

Test your might nerds.

I only managed 7 out of 22.

I'm also an old school D&D nerd. Started playing basic in 3rd grade (1983ish) and played all the way through high school. Not always D&D though, we played a wide swath of RPGs.

My sig is 1 pixel too big.
     
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Mar 15, 2013, 08:11 PM
 
double
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine
     
Clinically Insane
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Mar 15, 2013, 08:12 PM
 
I correctly identified 12 polearms in the D&D Polearm Quiz. I dare you to beat my score! Dungeons & Dragons Roleplaying Game Official Home Page - Article (Pole Arm Quiz)
That was tough.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
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subego  (op)
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Mar 16, 2013, 12:14 PM
 
I somehow got 15.
     
Clinically Insane
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Mar 16, 2013, 08:21 PM
 
We know polearms, which is useless, and mildly alarming, at the same time.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 17, 2013, 03:56 AM
 
The irony is I can't think of anyone who ever went with a polearm other than a halberd.

I'm not counting OA, of course. When that came out all the sudden everyone wants a naginata.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 17, 2013, 08:06 AM
 
Pffft... who needs this spear of, what does it say? Longinus? I'll take the +1 broadsword.
     
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Mar 18, 2013, 11:39 AM
 
It was always just comical that they were even in there, with different stats and everything.

Just call it a freaking polearm, say it does 2D6 damage and call it a day. Leave the rest up to the imagination of the player. There should have been 3 different kinds of pole arms at the most.

The guys who created this game probably all had OCD and/or aspergers.

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subego  (op)
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Mar 18, 2013, 12:14 PM
 
Gygax had a polearm fetish. No question there.

I'm going to guess if you played the full rules as written, there's actually some mechanical differences going on. We always ignored weapon speed, size modifiers, modifiers by AC, and usually reach.

My understanding is the main design goal of AD&D was for tournament play, so the rules needed an extra level of comprehensiveness lest there be arguments over how DM Jack ruled their polearms vs. DM Clyde.

Also, these were all wargamers, so, yeah, OCD and aspies too.
     
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Mar 18, 2013, 12:43 PM
 
( Last edited by olePigeon; Mar 18, 2013 at 01:50 PM. )
"…I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods,
you will understand why I dismiss yours." - Stephen F. Roberts
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 18, 2013, 12:56 PM
 
No image...
     
subego  (op)
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Apr 2, 2013, 01:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by ort888 View Post
It was always just comical that they were even in there, with different stats and everything.

Just call it a freaking polearm, say it does 2D6 damage and call it a day. Leave the rest up to the imagination of the player. There should have been 3 different kinds of pole arms at the most.

The guys who created this game probably all had OCD and/or aspergers.
I was reading an analysis of all the different editions, and what their design goals were.

I thought a good point was despite how the earliest editions seemed to be designed for someone with a spreadsheet fetish, or a desire for some form of rigorous comprehensive simulation, they actually weren't. That's an artifact of everyone putting their own stamp on how they played.

If you take the rules as is, they actually have a "laser-like focus" was the phrase used in the analysis. You're supposed to go into the dungeon, get as much loot as possible, get back out, and repeat.

It's 90% a resource management game.

That's why you track every arrow. Not because you're an aspie, but that's a key consumable upon which how far you can get is dependent. Likewise with the comprehensive rules on tracking time, and the admonishments about how bloody important they were.

The topper of course, is that combat is clearly meant to be avoided as much as possible. It's your biggest resource drain. Your biggest time drain because of recovery, and the experience points you get are paltry compared to what you get from treasure. Successful players stole things. It wasn't an accident the rules were written to reward that play style over the mindless slaughter style.
     
 
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