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Gene Wilder Charlie and the Chocolate Factory movie review
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Clinically Insane
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Jul 5, 2013, 10:43 PM
 
Here is my movie review:

This movie was a stinker. There was nothing realistic about it at all, it encourages kids to get diabetes (it is no wonder there is a diabetes epidemic in this country), all of the kids and parents except for Charlie and his grandpa were complete d-bags, and the oompa loompas were not funny and silly, they were as creepy as hell.

Not only does this movie encourage eating lots of candy and in thinking that people that make candy might be wizards, but it also encourages gambling, and if you just want to win badly enough you can win at the lottery.

There were also plot holes. For instance, that Augusta Gloop guy was told not to put his hands in the chocolate river because it would contaminate the chocolate yet there is a damn boat in the river that made people go on LSD trips! None of the candy looked tasty anyway, it all looked scary and creepy.
     
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Jul 5, 2013, 11:31 PM
 


-t
     
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Jul 5, 2013, 11:48 PM
 
Turtle, I think you should be nice to me or else I will hurt your feelings.
     
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Jul 6, 2013, 12:00 AM
 
F&*%, that *was* me being nice. Man up.

-t
     
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Jul 6, 2013, 03:24 AM
 
You get nothing.

You lose.

1776 will commence again.
     
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Jul 6, 2013, 08:46 AM
 
I appreciate your review, but I take issue with your conclusions.

First, besson, it was something called a "fantasy," so realism would have slowed it down. Second, it was full of Parables and Life Lessons, such as how avarice and gluttony are Bad Things.

I haven't managed to get a copy of the book, but I'm informed that the Gene Wilder version wasn't as close as it could have been. Whether that is a good thing or a bad thing, I enjoyed it when it came out, and I could watch it again today and enjoy it.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
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Jul 6, 2013, 12:46 PM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
I appreciate your review, but I take issue with your conclusions.

First, besson, it was something called a "fantasy," so realism would have slowed it down. Second, it was full of Parables and Life Lessons, such as how avarice and gluttony are Bad Things.

I haven't managed to get a copy of the book, but I'm informed that the Gene Wilder version wasn't as close as it could have been. Whether that is a good thing or a bad thing, I enjoyed it when it came out, and I could watch it again today and enjoy it.

Yeah but those good life lessons were cancelled out by the bad ones.

I will need to restrain myself from the gluttony of making Turtle look bad in this thread.
     
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Jul 6, 2013, 12:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
You get nothing.

You lose.

1776 will commence again.

Yeah Turtle, you lose.
     
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Jul 6, 2013, 01:14 PM
 
Ghporter: for an example of what I'm talking about, do you remember where everybody was sprayed with the soda fizzy stuff while they were in that car thing?

First of all, this was probably the soda lobby trying to make Americans feel better about what is put into soda, but this scene didn't fool me at all. It wasn't soda fizzy stuff that was being sprayed over everybody, it was soap. Unappetizing suds. Their mouths were being washed out for their verbal sins.
( Last edited by Demonhood; Jul 8, 2013 at 02:28 PM. Reason: language)
     
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Jul 6, 2013, 01:15 PM
 
Maybe this movie is 1776 all over again. Was there any diabetes before this movie?
     
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Jul 6, 2013, 03:47 PM
 
Compared to the more recent remake, this movie is orders of magnitude better.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 09:22 AM
 
You know 'NN is getting slow again when Besson starts making multiple posts about the most random crap ever.
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 11:22 AM
 
Shif: are you saying that you'd prefer that this thread was about how much turtle sucks?
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 11:54 AM
 
Nah I like Turtle. I could name a few others, but we're not supposed to talk about other members in the forums.
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 01:17 PM
 
I like turtle too, but I have no infractions right now so I feel like I can do a little spending. This boring thread needs some hot besson3c on turtle action...
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 03:20 PM
 
You sound like you'd get more than a kick out of an infraction. To each his own.

-t
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 04:04 PM
 
Can a mod rename this thread to "Battle of the MacNN Attention Whores"?

     
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Jul 8, 2013, 05:05 PM
 
Turtle is a whore.
     
Clinically Insane
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Jul 8, 2013, 05:09 PM
 
Are Canadian whores better than American or German whores?
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 05:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
Are Canadian whores better than American or German whores?
Do you like your whores to be polite?
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 06:04 PM
 
Is that a Canuck of the night speciality?
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 07:30 PM
 
Turtle: you should know that the mods here are not interested in protecting you from my wrath. I received an infraction for bringing up bukk-ke (and I've cleverly disguised the word to avoid getting another infraction), but not for calling you names.
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 07:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
Is that a Canuck of the night speciality?

No, you can expect many "pleases" and "thank yous" and "excuse mes" all through the night while being serviced.
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 07:53 PM
 
No soory?
     
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Jul 8, 2013, 08:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
No soory?
Only from those that serviced Turtle.
     
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Jul 9, 2013, 02:55 AM
 
What always bugged me was that Charlie did nothing to deserve getting the factory. He spent the families last money on a chocolate bar! A chocolate bar!!!
Then he cheated and drank the lemonade stuff!

Moreover, while he was probably the best of what was a particularly bad bunch, at no point in the movie did he show the slightest signs that he had any experience/aptitude for running what is I assume an international confectionary business.

He took over the factory, but did absolutely NO due diligence. I mean he didn't even ask Wonka for a copy of the last years accounts. Frankly he could be inheriting a mess.

Wonka was frankly a bit weird. I can imagine him having all sorts of problems. Outstanding tax liabilities, maybe pollution violations, certainly work permit issues. It's actually no surprise he wanted to offload legal liability for the whole mess onto someone else as fast as possible.
     
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Jul 9, 2013, 03:51 AM
 
We can add British professional porpoise pullers too.

Some are more polite than Canadians.
     
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Jul 9, 2013, 03:55 AM
 
Originally Posted by Doc HM View Post
What always bugged me was that Charlie did nothing to deserve getting the factory. He spent the families last money on a chocolate bar! A chocolate bar!!!
Then he cheated and drank the lemonade stuff!

Moreover, while he was probably the best of what was a particularly bad bunch, at no point in the movie did he show the slightest signs that he had any experience/aptitude for running what is I assume an international confectionary business.

He took over the factory, but did absolutely NO due diligence. I mean he didn't even ask Wonka for a copy of the last years accounts. Frankly he could be inheriting a mess.

Wonka was frankly a bit weird. I can imagine him having all sorts of problems. Outstanding tax liabilities, maybe pollution violations, certainly work permit issues. It's actually no surprise he wanted to offload legal liability for the whole mess onto someone else as fast as possible.

Preach on brother Doc HM!

You guys should listen to this guy more often, he's a smart lad.
     
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Jul 10, 2013, 06:36 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
I like turtle too, but I have no infractions right now so I feel like I can do a little spending. This boring thread needs some hot besson3c on turtle action...
In that case maybe I should PM you my shitlist.
     
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Jul 10, 2013, 06:54 PM
 
Do I look like your lapdog?

I will only be your lapdog if you give me jellybeans.
     
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Jul 10, 2013, 07:18 PM
 
Will coffee beans work? All I have are coffee beans.
     
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Jul 10, 2013, 07:25 PM
 
Will you shove them up turtle's ass?
     
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Jul 11, 2013, 01:57 AM
 
     
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Jul 11, 2013, 12:54 PM
 
TIL: turtles are mostly turd machines.
     
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Jul 12, 2013, 02:57 AM
 
Besson, still trying to get an infraction ?

Seems like another FAIL. Can't even get that done, LOL.

-t
     
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Jul 13, 2013, 11:24 PM
 
I think it's possible to overanalyze anything. Hollywood took a nice little story without a huge moral centered on Charlie, and made it an even simpler story. Did Charley deserve to get in? Compared to all the others who did, he was the most deserving, having neither been coddled nor indulged his whole life like the rest. Didn't his grandfather tell him to buy that bar? (My memory of this detail is a little dim.)

The real message to me (then and remembering the story now) was that greed of any kind is a Bad Thing, whether gluttony (the kids) or looking for inside information to profit from (the parents), and that it isn't a good idea to think you can pull the wool over someone's eyes just because he seems silly or eccentric, because he may catch you in a silly, but very effective way.

How about not trying to examine the soul molecules of these characters and looking at their character instead? Charlie was loyal, honest, thoughtful, and genuine, while the other kids were spoiled in various ways, but all of them very badly spoiled. Charlie's family was very poor but he turned out to be a decent person, while all the rich kids started out as snots and got worse when presented with temptations. Not Charlie though; he stayed true. That was the message I got.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
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Jul 14, 2013, 02:58 AM
 
So, it's a good place to start teaching your children class warfare.
     
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Jul 14, 2013, 09:07 AM
 
besson3c, do your snozzberries really taste like snozzberries?
     
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Jul 14, 2013, 03:23 PM
 
My snozzberries kind of taste like boogers.
     
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Jul 14, 2013, 09:11 PM
 
Children don't learn classism unless it's forced onto them. The Britain displayed in Willie Wonka was a parody of the straight-jacketed social classism that also led to such works as "The Wall." You have to be looking for it and know what it is to identify it. Dahl used class disparities as a mechanism to portray Charlie as a person who did not have lots of external advantages, but who had to depend on his own internal advantages (not being a snot, for one) to get ahead.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
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Jul 14, 2013, 10:14 PM
 
ghporter: would you eat any of the candy depicted in this movie? It looked gross, kind of like the green sludge from Troll 2.
     
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Jul 14, 2013, 11:21 PM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
Children don't learn classism unless it's forced onto them.
Like, in a book about candy? I'm trolling you, BTW
     
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Jul 15, 2013, 06:28 AM
 
No, like mom and dad telling them they're better than other people because X (or the converse - others are better than them because X).

Developmentally, until a child is about 11 or so, the distinctions between economic and social classes are completely meaningless - unless they are made concrete by parents and peers. A story about candy that is on its surface a tale of "behave badly and bad things happen" stays on its surface to small children. Today's so-called adults tend to attribute far too much abstract thinking to small children, and that makes a lot of us react to children differently (i.e. the way elementary schools have rules about "sexual harassment" between students). Let's not help them take away the magic and wonder of childhood by thinking that the way young adults see children's movies is the way children see them.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
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Jul 15, 2013, 02:36 PM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
No, like mom and dad telling them they're better than other people because X (or the converse - others are better than them because X).

Developmentally, until a child is about 11 or so, the distinctions between economic and social classes are completely meaningless - unless they are made concrete by parents and peers. A story about candy that is on its surface a tale of "behave badly and bad things happen" stays on its surface to small children. Today's so-called adults tend to attribute far too much abstract thinking to small children, and that makes a lot of us react to children differently (i.e. the way elementary schools have rules about "sexual harassment" between students). Let's not help them take away the magic and wonder of childhood by thinking that the way young adults see children's movies is the way children see them.

Like a former mod here that refused to let his kids see Wall-E because of some sort of Republican environmental ideology?

I always thought that was a hoot. The kids probably just saw cute robots doing interesting things while the father was getting all huffy about American politics.
     
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Jul 15, 2013, 03:00 PM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
No, like mom and dad telling them they're better than other people because X (or the converse - others are better than them because X).
You know, this started out as a troll (and has the white text to prove it), but I have to object to your analysis.

This isn't some subtle commentary. It's the common and key defining characteristic of all the children except Charlie.

This isn't some subtle thing. Dahl made it so obvious, even a six-year-old could get it. What a six-year-old isn't ready to understand yet is just because you make every child other than the hero a rich antagonist, it doesn't mean all rich kids are antagonists.
     
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Jul 15, 2013, 06:09 PM
 
Has anyone read any of Dahl's more adult books? My Uncle Oswald was very amusing.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Jul 15, 2013, 07:34 PM
 
I saw the other children not as members of another class so much as being horribly spoiled. Either their parent gave them everything they asked for, or anticipated the requests and gave them everything. This is about boundaries, a major issue with today's so-called parents who don't know how to say no because they never heard the word when they were growing up.

Every child knows someone who seems to get everything they want, no matter what social stratum they are on, yet the interpretation of that largesse as a marker of class distinction comes later - when we realize that "Bob, the annoying kid who had everything" was actually just part of a big family, or "Jane, who always wore the latest styles" happened to be the niece of a seamstress, while the people who really are of a different socioeconomic class are completely foreign to us.

Again, for a small child (as in Charlie's age group), the assigned meaning of class membership has to be taught.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
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Jul 15, 2013, 08:28 PM
 
veruca salt was the only one whose parents seemed rich enough to just buy her things, the other kids were spoiled in other ways. Violet, Augustus and TV kid could have been any class.
     
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Jul 15, 2013, 08:58 PM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
I saw the other children not as members of another class so much as being horribly spoiled. Either their parent gave them everything they asked for, or anticipated the requests and gave them everything. This is about boundaries, a major issue with today's so-called parents who don't know how to say no because they never heard the word when they were growing up.

Every child knows someone who seems to get everything they want, no matter what social stratum they are on, yet the interpretation of that largesse as a marker of class distinction comes later - when we realize that "Bob, the annoying kid who had everything" was actually just part of a big family, or "Jane, who always wore the latest styles" happened to be the niece of a seamstress, while the people who really are of a different socioeconomic class are completely foreign to us.

Again, for a small child (as in Charlie's age group), the assigned meaning of class membership has to be taught.
I feel like you are making my point.

The "message" is being spoiled is bad regardless of class.

That message is taught in the book by having all the spoiled kids be of a single social class.
     
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Jul 16, 2013, 03:52 AM
 
The book/film is SO not about class. Yes Charlie is poor while the others are rich, but those are just the mechanism by which Dahl creates Charlie's character and those of the "rich" kids. The message about being spoilt and selfish is the thing and yes it's simple because Dahl is talking directly to a bunch of 6 year olds. Something he does better than any other children's author I can think of, apart from maybe Sendak, but he's way more oblique, (I guess WTWTA is the essence of a cathartic children's book while Dahl is master of the Didactic.
     
 
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