[phobos]

It's amazing how awful the dvd player runs under 10.2.3.
I was very proud how well dvd player was running on previous versions. Now when I open some menus even switching languages makes the movie stutter. It is awful. Also has anybody noticed how on fast scenes the screen gets choppy? And has anybody noticed that the wide info window doesn't work anymore??
Man I hope they'll fix all these problems in the future version and very soon cause the results are very bad.
Any comments from you??

[Angus_D]

It seems to work OK here on my 1Ghz MDD...

[Technicolor]

Working fine on my Quicksilver 867.

[RMXO]

works fine on my 800DVI....

[workerbee]

Just watched The Fellowship of the Ring Extended Edition on my Ti800/10.2.3 and have not (yet) noticed any of the problems you describe... but I'll check again tomorrow.

(Color gradients seemed to have more banding than I remember, though)

[:XI:]

i've noticed that i get large blocks of colour (like over compression on a jpeg) on my mac, but not on my PS2.

you'd think £2000 worth of computer would be at least equal to a £160 PS2!

[Millennium]

The only difference I've noticed on my Ti/400 is that menus seem to require double-clicks now; the first click selects an item and the second click opens it. It does more accurately reflect the Finder, but on the other hand it's a bit less convenient.

This said, my machine does seem to have a lot more trouble mounting DVD's in the first place. To be fair, though, I wonder if that might not be due to a faulty drive; I suspect that it may have damaged some of my discs.

[Cellery]

I posted this in another thread, but I'm getting similar results to Phobos with a Ti667 (VGA). Using the F-keys to adjust volume and brightness also cause choppiness, and replacing the Radeon.kext from 10.2.2 makes the problem go away but breaks a bunch of other stuff. My SD TiBook isn't showing any problems though.

[phobos]

I think you all misunderstood my post. When the movie plays it's alright.
No problems there. When I'm accessing the top menu bar the problems start to appear. The video start to stutter and if I keep the menu on the video will continue to stutter. That's the main problem that ruins everything. So nobody has this except me and cellery? I find it harrd to bellieve....
Also now that someone mentioned it color banding is more noticable than anything and so is the artifacts.
Does DVD player use the graphics cards enhancements for DVD playing? I guess not. Cause especially the artifacts would be gone...

[Technicolor]

I think we understood your post fine. I can pull down menus, fast forward, change the volume, change the brightness, anything...and the DVD plays on unaffected.

[juanvaldes]

what is your system and graphics card?

[Socially Awkward Solo]

Seems to work the same for me on my iBook snow 500MHz.

[Don Pickett]

No problems on a 500 MHz G3.

System specs, please.

[workerbee]

Originally posted by phobos:
I think you all misunderstood my post. When the movie plays it's alright.
No problems there. When I'm accessing the top menu bar the problems start to appear. The video start to stutter and if I keep the menu on the video will continue to stutter. That's the main problem that ruins everything. So nobody has this except me and cellery? I find it harrd to bellieve....
Also now that someone mentioned it color banding is more noticable than anything and so is the artifacts.

Works nicely here. Just tested with Gladiator. Full size, half size, Full screen, change sound, change volume (keyboard with the transparent thingy), access top menu, have player window open, accessing long menus in BBedit in front of it. No stutter, no problem. Even browsing this forum in OW, and answering your post works beautifully. TiBook 800, 1GB RAM, 10.2.3.

And the banding: it was my impression that software player image quality has never been quite as good (sharpness especially) as it was using the hardware decoder in old macs anyway.

[Cellery]

TiBook 667 (VGA) (Radeon): Problem
DP 1GHz Quicksilver (GeForce4 MX): Fine
1GHz SD TiBook (Radeon 9000): Fine

All have 1GB RAM and are running 10.2.3. I tried the LOTR DVD on a work machine (VGA TiBook 550) running 10.2.2 (fresh install) and it worked fine, but immediately upon updating to 10.2.3 this problem popped up.

More TiBook users are reporting choppy playback in this thread.

Edit: System specs

[arekkusu]

Originally posted by Cellery:
TiBook 667 (VGA) (Radeon): Problem

More TiBook users are reporting choppy playback in this thread.

Actually, that thread is about tearing, not slow DVD Player performance. On certain PowerBooks with 10.2.3, _everything_ is being drawn out of sync with the screen refresh so there are a lot of horizontal tears.

That problem affects the fluidity of screen updates, but not speed. In fact many things (scrolling, Zoom In mode) appear faster than in 10.2.2. They just look worse.

It affects DVD Player also, but I have not seen the slow performance you describe with menus/F-key overlays, on my DVI800 TiBook.

[sushiism]

Your noticing jpeg marks on your mac and not on a crappy ps2 because your mac will most liekly have an lcd screen or at least a ecent monitor and thus its better quality than the tv screen your ps2 (which has actually awful dvd playback and has sound out of sync on most films) is using and thus you wont notice the compression marks. Don't tell me you seriously think the mac can somehow magically put compression marks onto a dvd playback

[Avon]

No problems here. G4/400 AGP, Radeon 8500 (PC Flashed)

Just watched Enemy at the Gates....

[brainchild2b]

To all the persons having DVD problems:

First I'm guessin at one point you had a beta installed.

The updated didn't cleanly install.

or you have a pirated or copy of OS X 10.2 from carracho that was modified to appear to be final version when really it was the last beta.

Your problems will be gone with a brand spanking new install if you start with an ORIGINAL OS X 10.2 disk and then do the 10.2.3 upgrade.

[voth]

No problems on G4/450 Cube w/ ATI 16mb video or on my G4/2x1.0Ghz

[Eug]

I haven't tested it a lot, but I do get some choppiness with menus on my GHz TiBook.

However, of more concern to me is "pulsing" with QuickTime slideshows converted to MPEG-2. See here.

[phobos]

Brainchild I don't know how you've drawn to that conclusion. My version of jaguar is legal. It can't get any more legal. I bought my machine when I was supposed to have the jaguar version of OSX and even though jaguar wasn't included and I could easily download it from the net I bought it. So don't make any assumptions like this.

The only problem I'm thinking that it might cause all the problems might be the ati drivers I downloaded a while ago. It was the second version of the october update. Maybe this is causing it??
I can't even think of anything else and I'm getting very upset with the performance. The playback is good as always (except the tearing part on fast scenes) the only problem is when accessing menus.

Almost forgot it. My machine's specs Powerbook DVI 667 with 512 MB of memory.

[sandsl]

I've got a Tibook DVI 800.
The quality of DVDs on my TiBook are 'ok', but I always get errors in the DVD player when I leave dvds on pause for a while (>15 minutes).

Sometimes after this error, the DVD 'disappears' and can't be accessed from the finder or the dvd player, so can't be ejected. Which means I have to restart to get my DVD out.

Also, if I'm watching a dvd, stop it but leave DVD Player open and then put the powerbook to sleep when I wake the machine up again DVD Player gives me a "Fatal Error...etc"

My Solution: Don't Pause for more than about 15 minutes and don't put the Tibook to sleep while dvd player is open.

[Cipher13]

The responsiveness is terrible, yes, but the movie doesn't skip.

I find the 10.2.3 player as good as any other version, if not better...

[msuper69]

Works fine on my TiBook 500. Full Screen, Windowed. No difference. Almost makes me wish I had a trip scheduled.

[Cellery]

Originally posted by brainchild2b:
To all the persons having DVD problems:

First I'm guessin at one point you had a beta installed.

The updated didn't cleanly install.

or you have a pirated or copy of OS X 10.2 from carracho that was modified to appear to be final version when really it was the last beta.

Your problems will be gone with a brand spanking new install if you start with an ORIGINAL OS X 10.2 disk and then do the 10.2.3 upgrade.

This is happening on a brand-new IBM 40GNX drive with an official Apple 10.2 Jaguar CD updated through 10.2.3. The problems started with 10.2.3 and aren't present in prior versions. I've tested this out on two 667 MHz VGA TiBooks with identical results, and my new 1GHz SD TiBook doesn't exhibit this. In any case, I watch enough DVDs on the go that I'm leaving 10.2.2 as is until Apple fixes this. I wonder why only phobos and I are experiencing this.

[phobos]

I need a big favour from all of you guys. Everyone who has posted before and said that there's no problem with DVD player can post back and say if you have the ATI october update or not?
Cause that's the only thing I can think of that might cause some problems.

[msuper69]

Originally posted by phobos:
I need a big favour from all of you guys. Everyone who has posted before and said that there's no problem with DVD player can post back and say if you have the ATI october update or not?
Cause that's the only thing I can think of that might cause some problems.

The only updates I've applied are through Software Update. I don't think that would include the ATI October update.

[Avon]

Originally posted by phobos:
I need a big favour from all of you guys. Everyone who has posted before and said that there's no problem with DVD player can post back and say if you have the ATI october update or not?
Cause that's the only thing I can think of that might cause some problems.

I have the latest ATI update.

Using a flashed PC 8500LE.

[slimpy]

My DVD player stutters like crazy when accessing the menus too!!! The longer they are selected, the worse the video/sound stuttering gets. I've found it is especially bad when the movie is playing in full screen mode, or at maximum window size. This never happened in OS 10.2.1 (which uses the same version of the player)

I have an ATI Radeon card (see specs below for more details), but since it was installed stock by Apple, I haven't used any ATI driver updates.

I've eliminated other possibilities by doing a clean install of OS 10.2.3, but the problem persists. It's starting to remind me of OS 9's DVD performance - Hold the mouse - and the movie screws up...

Anyways, here are my machine's specs:

DP 533 (Digital Audio) Tower, 1.5 GB RAM, 2 X 60 GB Hard Drives, Hitachi GD-7000 DVD-ROM, ATI Radeon 32 MB AGP

Note: DVD stuttered also with LG GDR-8161B DVD-ROM; but I didn't notice any 'normal' playback issues with either drive.

[issa]

Playback is absolutely fine on my 1GHz PowerBook G4, including when accessing menus, changing language settings, etc.

1GHz PBG4/1GB RAM/60GB HD/Combo/OS X 10.2.3
System imstalled ATI drivers only (Have not installed the ATI October update)

[tr]

DVD player works fine here, no skipping or stuttering with menu access, all though the menu's aren't as responsive as they could be.

G4 450 sawtooth
10.2.3
2Gb RAM
Radeon 8500 64mb (flashed PC card)
latest ati update (the 2nd one from october)
Pioneer DVR-A03 (RPC-1 2.00 firmware)
2 IBM 75GXP 45Gb (main OS, internal firewire), 120GXP 60Gb

i have a DVD playing fine in a window as i type this, no stuttering at all.

tr

[yzeater]

I'm having problems here. The movies act like you say in 9.2.1, and they don't work in 10.2.3. I've had apple replace the DVD player, and I've reinstalled jag, but it still doesn't work. The message says the current configuration isn't supported...any ideas?
Powerbook 500-512

[Eriamjh]

OK here, but a few red pixels here and there occasionally.

DP800
10.2.3
Flashed Radeon 8500
A03 DVD-RW drive
Latest ATI Drivers (with Jaguar)

[Eug]

Try this:

Play a DVD, and then enter full screen mode. With the controller still on screen, move the mouse pointer to the top of the screen so that the menubar shows up. Leave the mouse pointer there.

On my TiBook (SuperDrive 1 GHz X.2.3) sometimes the video becomes jerky. This jerkiness stops when the controller disappears, or if you move the mouse pointer away so that the menubar disappears.

This happens both with a DVD disc in the SuperDrive, or if you run the video off a VIDEO_TS folder off the hard drive.

[slimpy]

Eug:

Those are some good ideas to try. Unfortunately, I can't test things anymore (I ended up reverting to OS 10.2.1).

I do have some additions to my previous post though...

- Not only are menus quite unresponsive, but they can take several seconds to disappear (in which the transparent fading effect is very choppy). This leads me to suspect that Quartz Extreme or my graphics card drivers are the culprits.

- I've tried playing DVD's in the background while browsing the web and viewing pictures in Preview - no stuttering problems.

Can somebody experiencing these problems try the following test: Play DVD in maximum window size (not full screen), switch to Finder or another application and navigate through menus (making sure they overlap the movie window). Does the video still stutter?

Hope this helps narrow down the problem.

slimpy

[Some Guy []]

i have the same problems on my ibook 700mhz/radeon mobility with 10.2.3, it was perfect until the update. i find i mostly get the slow fps when using the apple menu bar and stuff if it's in full screen, if it's half screen or 'normal' it's usually fine...

and YES, i did install the ATI driver update that came out a few months ago..

is there anything else other then kernel extensions/modules that gets installed by the ATI drivers? looking at /System/Library/Extentions , it looks like new ATI drivers got installed in the apple update.

justin@flexo:~$ cd /System/Library/Extensions
justin@flexo:/System/Library/Extensions$ ls -l | grep -i ati
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:36 ATIRadeon.kext
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:36 ATIRadeon8500.kext
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:36 ATIRadeon8500DVDDriver.bundle
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:35 ATIRadeon8500GA.plugin
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:35 ATIRadeon8500GLDriver.bundle
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:35 ATIRadeonDVDDriver.bundle
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:35 ATIRadeonGA.plugin
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:35 ATIRadeonGLDriver.bundle
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:36 ATIRage128.kext
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:35 ATIRage128DVDDriver.bundle
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:35 ATIRage128GA.plugin
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:35 ATIRage128GLDriver.bundle
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:36 ATIRagePro.kext
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Dec 15 01:35 ATIRageProGA.plugin
drwxr-xr-x 3 root wheel 102 Oct 19 22:21 ATITVOut.kext

[Toyin]

Same problem
Dual 500mhz G4 1.5gb of ram. Original Mac OEM Radeon. I did install the October ATI update. DVD is fine at normal size, but double size and full screen causes the stuttering when accessing menus.

Legal copy of Jaguar which had none of these problems in 10.2.2. It's probably a conflict with Open GL 1.4 and the current DVD player. (I'm hoping for an update)

[Burn]

Gladiator, LoTR (just saw Two Towers for the 3rd time today ) DVD's all play fine - tried this step Eug, didn't happen for me.

All was smooth as glass. On the Ti display and on my 17"ASDCRT(main).

Ti550/768/X.2.3

Originally posted by Eug:
Try this:

Play a DVD, and then enter full screen mode. With the controller still on screen, move the mouse pointer to the top of the screen so that the menubar shows up. Leave the mouse pointer there.

On my TiBook (SuperDrive 1 GHz X.2.3) sometimes the video becomes jerky. This jerkiness stops when the controller disappears, or if you move the mouse pointer away so that the menubar disappears.

[slimpy]

Back testing things in OS 10.2.3 again... and found something interesting because of Eug's previous post.

If you force the DVD Player controller to be hidden (Control+C keys) while playing a movie, the menus work perfectly - with no stuttering! This works in both full screen mode & max window size. Show the controller again, and the stuttering returns.

In a related test, switching to another application and accessing menus does not cause any stuttering. I think this is because the controller is automatically hidden when DVD Player is in the background.

Edit: Yet another finding...

If the player controller is over top of the movie window (including letterbox black areas), playback stutters when menus are accessed. This is unavoidable in full screen mode, but when playing movies in a window, the controller can be moved outside the playback area - and all stuttering disappears!

Can anyone confirm these findings?

Hopefully Apple will fix the problem in the next update. In the meantime, I guess the player is still usable.

slimpy

[Some Guy []]

so far the only people who seem to be having this problem with the dvd player in 10.2.3 are the ones who installed the ATI driver update back in october.


-justin

[JB72]

I watched Sunset Boulevard the other night on my Ti 500 and it looked great (under 10.2.3.) I'll have to try DVD Player on my MDD tonight to see if I have any problems there.

[Eug]

Originally posted by Some Guy []:
so far the only people who seem to be having this problem with the dvd player in 10.2.3 are the ones who installed the ATI driver update back in october.

Mine is a TiBook purchased in December. ATI Radeon 9000.

[Burn]

I am having none of the problems described and I don't see the update listed in the 'Installed Updates" section of Software Update - is that where it would appear?

[phobos]

Wow slimpy!!! Excellent findings!!!!!!
It's weird how the controller causes so many problems. With the help I guess of the ATI october update. Oh well !!! Now I know not to install stuff outside of apple on hardware that's very important for the machine.
Thanks again slimpy.

[Jedidiah]

When playing a DVD, if I have the controller (by which I mean the little grey rectangle with the play, stop, left arrow, right arrow, eject, title, menu, and other buttons) visible, when I skip chapters or fast forward, the video will stutter for around 10 seconds or so. If I have the controller invisible, the chapter skipping or fast forwarding is seemless–I come out of it and the video is right there playing perfectly. This didn't happen to me under 10.2.2 and before. Any ideas? Is this a flaw with DVD Player or with 10.2.3? Do I need to throw out some preference file? Anyone know what the heck is going on? Thanks, I'd appreciate any help you can give me.

I never installed the ATI update, unless it was something that came up through the Software Update program. If it did, then yes, I installed it.

[slimpy]

Thanks phobos, glad to be of some help.

One minor correction though... I never installed any ATI updates. The problem occurs even with the most basic Apple install (ie. no third party updates or software).

Perhaps the October ATI update and the version that Apple is bundling with OS 10.2.3 are the culprits.

- Are ATI cards (and their drivers) the common thread?

- Any nVidia card owners with these problems out there?

slimpy

[alex_kac]

I did the Combo 10.2.3 update and boom, my DVD is working great now. Wasn't before.

[drjoe]

On a much modified beige DT G3 with:

XLR8 466/G4
768 meg ram
Radeon 7000 [with latest UG flashed]
DVD player 3.2
CDRW/COMBO LG-4120B
OS X 10.2.3
lots of other stuff ;-)

DVD playback works like a charm. No stuttering, no banding, no problems whatsoever.

[Toyin]

Originally posted by slimpy:
Back testing things in OS 10.2.3 again... and found something interesting because of Eug's previous post.

If you force the DVD Player controller to be hidden (Control+C keys) while playing a movie, the menus work perfectly - with no stuttering! This works in both full screen mode & max window size. Show the controller again, and the stuttering returns.

In a related test, switching to another application and accessing menus does not cause any stuttering. I think this is because the controller is automatically hidden when DVD Player is in the background.

Edit: Yet another finding...

If the player controller is over top of the movie window (including letterbox black areas), playback stutters when menus are accessed. This is unavoidable in full screen mode, but when playing movies in a window, the controller can be moved outside the playback area - and all stuttering disappears!

Can anyone confirm these findings?

Hopefully Apple will fix the problem in the next update. In the meantime, I guess the player is still usable.

slimpy

This definitely happens with my machine. Great catch!

Also anyone else loose the shadow from their DVD window? In 10.1 the DVD player window casts a shadow in all windowed modes, it doesn't in 10.2.3. (I'm not sure when the change occurred but I think it was with 10.2.0)